what's goin on here. are we a bunch of morality police, or what?

dwmte7 says on May 22, 2008, 14:38:

quick! flag this madman before he sembrates a contagion................

dwmte

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kat1 (Moderator) says on May 22, 2008, 14:42:

are you angry?

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dwmte7 says on May 22, 2008, 15:10:

hi kat...nope...anger doesn't apply. it's just bull shit and after all these years on pbh, it's sad to see what's happening. it's like a witch hunt and no body wants to take responsibility.

if someone gets deleted, the 'deleater' should have their name posted along with the reason and--if applicable--the name of the person who reported them and their reason. in court, you get to face your accuser. why should it be different here.

dwmte

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CatGirl says on May 22, 2008, 16:06:

So are you proposing that off topic to have a wider range of boundaries. (correct?) I think that since this is new to everyone there is going to be a lot of testing in this area. As you know when there are changes (especially more structure) it usually gets worse before better from people testing others on what they can and cannot do. Also appears some things might be open to interpretation.
I am personally OK with it, again as long as when requests are made by members they are respected and reciprocated. Reciprocation is the key word...it is hard for those that are chronically self absorbed to do this...hard job for the Mods don;t you think?

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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CatGirl says on May 22, 2008, 16:07:

But I am not the person to make this decision.....can only throw in my 23 pesos

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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CatGirl says on May 22, 2008, 16:09:

Either way - looks like you are speaking your mind here. Off topic is the place for that - correct? Don't see why it is not appropriate. You are correct, can't please everyone

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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dwmte7 says on May 22, 2008, 19:01:

frankly, cat, this only remotely relates to me....i'm just not an offensive type guy. i have my own built in restraints which relate to me and others sensitivities. i'm respectful and in general, i receive that in life.

however, and this is the catcher....it relates to all of us. by nature, we folks (humans) have our point of view, our opinions and our feelings. why should these be tethered because others who are just petty and self centered, and who can't find tolerance of others and their opinions.

we're not here to please others....nor are we here, necessarily, to please ourselves, exclusively. it's all give and take. if i want space for my thoughts and feelings, i need to find that same space for yours' and those of others. it's only logical.

i've been on this site for years and folks just spoke their mind. some were clearly on the raw side and still others threatening and offensive. those who really broke the bounds were just simply cast out (i guess) without much ado.

but now, it's like a witch hunt and things which are really mild and no more than personal view points, are cast out and banished. i simply want to know why.

if we can't find tolerance for one another in cyberspace, how can we find it in our own hearts and homes?

dwmte

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CatGirl says on May 22, 2008, 19:10:

You are very interesting Mr.
Maybe you need to give me a better example of an actual event that occurred, which supports this comment. Only cause - I am missing it (not doubting - just missing it)

No different than the comments about GS and Morph. I never saw anything that was mentioned, but I am newer here and I don't necessarily "doubt" it but I see no supporting evidence, your honor (jeje). Otherwise, it is all just circumstantial evidence to a newer person such as me.

Please expand on your comment Mr. Dw ;))

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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dwmte7 says on May 22, 2008, 19:20:

as wit, cg....seems like half of the posts are someone complaining that they've been deleted and the other half are folks complaining about the remarks of this or that poster. enow

dwmte stands for douglas w martin, the elder

dwmte

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CatGirl says on May 22, 2008, 19:27:

Ahhhh...thanks Douglas (can I call you that or will I get demoted? jeje)

YES! I now know what you mean. I have seen this before - but in a much more erratic scale. So this is not too bad..is it? How about complete threads removed after a poster has been terrorized? i think that is worse.

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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dwmte7 says on May 22, 2008, 19:37:

well, cat girl can i call you that or is their another name more associated with your birth?

i think that we've got all fuzzy-haired over a bunch of nothing. good grief, look at the posts and comments. some of my old friends on site here have even gotten in the fray, criticizing others and seeking fault. no home-runs there. just a lot of mean prattle. to what gain?

damn, i'd rather make love than war. it's easier. someone said once that its harder to frown than it is to smile, because it takes 13 muscles to frown and only 3 to smile...something like that. do you get my drift?

i'm not trying to reform anyone or save souls. i just like to see folks lend a hand, give a smile and seek the welfare and comfort of others over that of themself. it just makes life and living nicer. at least on my planet.

dwmte

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CatGirl says on May 22, 2008, 20:00:

Douglas...my name is Christina

I can only address this from my personal experiences since I have been here. And I have had some problems with some shady and heartless people on this site. They are on the periphery and lurking et al. But I was encouraged to stick around. Excuse me if I appear a bit reticent and stand offish. It was because I was trying to
"lend a hand, give a smile and seek the welfare and comfort of others over that of themself."

I was advised that this was a bad idea (the above). If I would have been more reserved in the begining maybe I would not have had the problems I had.

Please advise Oh Douglas the Elder

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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Man Tequila says on May 22, 2008, 20:12:

Is it possible, Doug, that we don't get the full picture on PBH?

I mean, say you've been on this site for five years. And that you are given many warnings, say you are told not to attack other posters, or talk about prostitiution, or spam a business you might have in Colombia. You may think you have the right to do these things since speech is free, but ultimately the owner of the site has a right to set rules, as you do in your own home.

Say after 20 warnings you delete someone, and the next day "he" is back under a different name. Say he sends you thirty e-mails each day. Or sends harrassing e-mails to other posters. Is there something compulsive about such behaviour? If, after being as fair as you could, such a poster called you a fascist or a racist, would this behaviour be endearing?

I believe in free speech. But what you see on PBH is not necesarily the full story, so I thin it is hard to judge the mods. I do know that on many sites for much milder reasons one is banned for life. People take routine administrative decisions here very seriously. If this is you, perhaps other things in your life need reflection.

Aunque no me creas/ si me lo propongo/ lograre olvidarte/ porque a fin de cuentas/ no soy tan cobarde./ Y termino todo una de estas tardes/ no sera dificil buscar algún sitio donde refugiarme/ donde nunca mas vuelvas a encontrarme. (Polo Montañez)

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CatGirl says on May 22, 2008, 20:21:

MT - very, very well stated. I also think that you are pretty close on the mark. If what happened to me could only be a taste of what a Moderator would get - eh? Very Probable

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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dwmte7 says on May 22, 2008, 20:28:

tequila....i made the point that those who are cronic and seriously offensive must bear the weight of their conduct. no contest.

they reap their own rewards. it's just that there seems to be--at least to me--a dirth of posts about what appears to me trifles. ie the logo/avatar of a certain poster. to me--once again--utter rubbish. enough about all this.

my point is that no body sees life the same as another, simply because all vantage points are different. tolerance and openmindedness make for a far more tolerable life.

dwmte

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CatGirl says on May 22, 2008, 20:35:

Yes I wish it were all true Douglas. I like your theory. But for me the reality is.....once bitten, twice shy. I hope you can understand when someone walks over the line out of cyber world and gets really personal in an inappropriate way. Correct?

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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Man Tequila says on May 22, 2008, 20:44:

I agree with you, dwmte(7). It's just that what we see is just a piece of the puzzle. I agree some of the stuff that upsets folks is pretty trivial here, as it is elsewhere.

Aunque no me creas/ si me lo propongo/ lograre olvidarte/ porque a fin de cuentas/ no soy tan cobarde./ Y termino todo una de estas tardes/ no sera dificil buscar algún sitio donde refugiarme/ donde nunca mas vuelvas a encontrarme. (Polo Montañez)

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Peter (Moderator) says on May 23, 2008, 03:23:

When someone gets deleted, we send them a personal email with the reason. The reason is usually repeated breaking of the rules and trolling.

Poor but snappy

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dwmte7 says on May 23, 2008, 04:03:

hi peter...sorry to stir up such a fuss...not my intent. it just seems that after all these years, so many of the posts and comments are about 'who said what, to, and or about, whom' etc.

when i wrote, "is it you" that was simply a general querie to everyone who, all of a sudden seems to feel it necessary to find fault with others. i'm just curious, why?

if there aint enough b.s. in the world, why must we shit where we sleep, or for that matter, sling it?

sure, over the years, i've seen offensiveness and threat...even received a wierd e from some mal content, threatening me!!! i just let it slide off and didn't report it to anyone nor respond to the ailing sender.

can't we all just try and get along and tolerate each other and each others' opinions. seems to be a easy, workable solution to the problem of the day....

peace to all of you in the pbh family.

dwmte

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CatGirl says on May 23, 2008, 05:41:

Again- nice words. You are not seeing all the peices of the puzzle. There is more going on under the surface - but you know that, right? Come on. Maybe I should send you a link to an interactive game sponsored by Homeland Security - meant to teach people how to use blogs and Be Safe?

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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dwmte7 says on May 23, 2008, 07:45:

common cat....do i really have the appearance of one who woke up with the prunes, and rode to work this a.m. on the turnip truck?

dwmte

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slguy says on May 23, 2008, 08:51:

people tend to forget....it's only the friggin internet. i'm damned if i understand taking personal attacks here (online) so seriously. some time back, someone apparently was very upset with a person they thought was me. incredible stuff they wrote, including MY home address.

just made me giggle at the pathetic nature of his life - but apparently womenfolk take it very seriously.

Before you throw me out, make sure I pay my bar tab

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dwmte7 says on May 23, 2008, 10:28:

hey, guy...what ever happened to the sea adventure? never heard any more about it?

dwmte

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slguy says on May 23, 2008, 11:03:

i got an unsolicited offer for Querencia, too good to refuse. sold her. bought another, somewhat smaller, but better sailing, boat. am putting her in shape now.

Before you throw me out, make sure I pay my bar tab

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CatGirl says on May 23, 2008, 12:43:

Slygy "it's only the friggin internet. i'm damned if i understand taking personal attacks here (online) so seriously. some time back, someone apparently was very upset with a person they thought was me. incredible stuff they wrote, including MY home address. "

Sounds a bit benign. So, what would you do if someone contacted a family member of yours?

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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tasco66 says on May 23, 2008, 13:26:

Yep, PBH is turning into a Stalinist board, where views contrary to the party line are deleted, people are wrongly accused of saying things they never said and members are encourage to report their neighbours for deviant behaviour from party line, I mean flag other member posts

Bravo, Presidente Uribe for the perfect operation!

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CatGirl says on May 23, 2008, 13:34:

Can someone answer a question for me? I am sorry if I sound dense here, but I keep seeing comments from other members about things I have not seen. I see diversity on this board. I even see negative comments towards the Mods...left to be read by anyone....NOT deleted.

Then I see comments like what Tasco just put up and slygy and Dw and others, but I see nothing to support it.

So what the ^&()* are people talking about? Are we planting seeds or fishing here?

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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CatGirl says on May 23, 2008, 13:41:

BTW I have better than 20/20 vision without glasses and do not suffer from a substance abuse problem, nor delusional or visual psychosis - So help me out here.

What exactly "is" the partyline - geez- can someone pleeez throw kitty a bone? what are you talking about

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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Desideria (Moderator) says on May 23, 2008, 13:45:

CatGirl, it depends. Some people plants seeds, some others fish. Some people have an agenda and some others don't. I don't delete any posts just because they are about me or my moderating; I believe intransparency and I'm capable of handling criticism.

Tasco66 has made some virulent attacks at buggy and I have defended B's right to post according to his beliefs, how communist they now might be. I have no fear of communism or communists, I have a lot of friends here with rather "communist" world-view, that I don't share myself. To me "communist" is not a dirty word per se, it's just as clean or dirty as "neoliberalist", "laissez-faire capitalist", "social democrat", "classical liberal" or whatever. They're just political ideologies and they neither qualify or disqualify the person who believes in them. This is what some people have a hard time in believing.

"When shall we three meet again? In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"(First Witch in Macbeth)

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CatGirl says on May 23, 2008, 13:53:

Thanks Desi....as far as I have seen your function requires a good dose of objectivity and considering the fact that you and other Mods take some personal blows I think you have done a damn good job of trying to balance that with diversity. You are human and you show it on the board. It takes a strong person to do that - even if it is a cyber persona, jje


Although i am sure that Peter has given you some guidelines - this is a unique board - heck, there are several posters here that are really lucky they are still here if you ask me.

OK - thanks Desi - I get it now

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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goin_south says on May 23, 2008, 14:04:

"damned if i understand taking personal attacks here (online) so seriously"
Si,.... especially when it's coming from a freakn duck ;-)

Where do we go from here?

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huskie says on May 23, 2008, 15:29:

HAHAHA GS you're funny
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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goin_south says on May 23, 2008, 15:36:

Huskie, sometimes you're pretty funny 2. (considering you're a Biliary Clinton fan...lol)
Hey, when is that thing over??? the decision as to the nominee?

Where do we go from here?

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dwmte7 says on May 23, 2008, 15:46:

cat...as you said....you are possessed of 20/20 vision. well, one need only count the number of threads which either possess or end up cluttered with antagonism and insult. too with comments as to who was deleted and why.

it's not that the past didn't possess a troll or two, but not much adoo was made of it. now, the threads and comments are pregnant with attack and reprisal. i've been here, like desi, for too many years to confess and this is all a boring preoccupation with egotism..."i", "my" "me" "mine" etc. and i, personally, get tired of yawning.

some old friends who've been around as long as me and desi have just pitched in the towel out of boredom and disinterest in conflict.

i, as they, love the community, but the antagonism is becoming far too detracting. i'd hate to see pbh go the way of the whale because of disinterest on the part of it's dedicated, serious posters and contributors. peter's aware of this and i can't help but feel that he hopes it will self correct and 'the children will grow up.'

douglas

dwmte

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dwmte7 says on May 23, 2008, 15:48:

i think i'll just go get a bottle of 'mount and do' and make my self a stiff drink..........

dwmte

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slguy says on May 23, 2008, 18:31:

"So, what would you do if someone contacted a family member of yours?"

laugh at how pathetic they are - and tell my family to do the same. in fact, that's exactly what i DID do.

Before you throw me out, make sure I pay my bar tab

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CatGirl says on May 23, 2008, 20:15:

Dwnte- thanks for the further clarification..again - I did not want to appear uber dense. Words well spoken BTW

Slygy: I guess I misworded my comment...errrr...question. I think I had better re phrase it

"What would you think "of" a person (either a signed in member or a lurker/no matter - correct?) that would step over to those boundaries?"
Would you think maybe they have some serious issues and possibly not of very good character?"

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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webmanco says on May 24, 2008, 01:03:

dwmte7

I do agree, I am not friends of many rules and regulations, I can do without the ignore botton, and might never use the flag link, If I get an issue with someone I will first debate nicely on PBH if things get worse I will PM the person in question, last thing I would do is flag anyone let alone ignore. By the same token if anyone flags me (snicth) :-) o me sapea jejeje I do expect I would be let known by the moderator who took care of the information.

If needed eye to eye contact, (not webcam) to debate personally I am open to meet with the person not agreing with me. Unless the guy/girl wants attention, that you are not getting from me. Case in point at Orange Bar.

There is more freedom here, we don´t need to get mad at PBH but at each other, as a matter of fact don´t get mad get even. :-)

...A yo, déjenme queto y no me jodan má! ...

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dwmte7 says on May 24, 2008, 05:05:

webman...where are you now? in colombia? if so, lucky guy!

i got taken to task because it was construed that i was complaining about the site. on the contrary, i was really complaining about the complaining and fault finding. i'm more than a fond admirer of this site, it's owner and it's managers. they have a horrific task, these days, keeping peace and routing the trouble makers. i'm clueless as to what happened to 'live and let live.' needless to say, quite often, my personal observations/comments/feelings, are wide of the general consensus...however, that isn't cause for war. we're just different folks with differing points of view. nothing more. it doesn't seem necessary to declare a stand off because our feelings, thoughts differ. si o no

dwmte

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CatGirl says on May 24, 2008, 11:19:

Webman..jeje - Get even? Oh my! I pity the poor soul that is on the other end of that wrath, jeje

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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aztec says on May 24, 2008, 14:18:

CatGirl, thanks for sharing with us some of your troubles with the site. Have to agree with you that a woman must be very cautious about placing anything personal on the web. Unfortunately, a woman especially one as attractive as you attract some very dangerous people.

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webmanco says on May 24, 2008, 14:28:

I am sure CatGirl do attract more angels than devils, am I mistaken CatGirl?

...A yo, déjenme queto y no me jodan má! ...

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CatGirl says on May 24, 2008, 15:03:

Jejeej...how soon was that earthquake in Bogota after I made this last comment??, jeje

Aztec, that is a thoughtful compliment. Never quite looked at it that way.... I have unfortunately had some potentially dangerous (international) situations, but it is usually after the fact that it was found how dangerous it was as it unfolded. That does not mean I am one of those "everything just seems to go my way" person. My pals admit sometimes they hang around just to see what will happen next and I really should write a book (joke)...that's why when someone is with me and it starts I say "Welcome to MY world!" jeje

Webman: I have been told that I "Must" have a Guardian Angel looking over me ...and I have been labeled as being a Guardian Angel , jejeje. I can spot a devil from a mile away...only met 3 in my life and I quickly removed myself ;)) Angels met? I think I meet them everyday...

I think the law of physics takes care of it all when it comes to Karma....I don;t vest energy into revenge (wasted negative stuff, makes people ugly)....instead, I sit back and watch the person destroy themselves - cause that is what happens - period

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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dwmte7 says on May 25, 2008, 05:25:

forest gump said something like 'shit happens to shitty people' maybe not in those words, but with that intent. you're right cat. just sit back and watch, everything will biodegrade as it's merits warrant.

dwmte

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huskie says on May 25, 2008, 06:20:

I agree 200% "What comes around goes around" Love that song by Justin Timberlake
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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webmanco says on May 25, 2008, 07:14:

Nice CatGirl, good thing you keep going without need of hiding or attacking.

Recoges lo que siembras.
You will reap the harvest that you sow

...A yo, déjenme queto y no me jodan má! ...

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miamimike says on May 25, 2008, 07:21:

SLGuy--How did they get your Home Address to post here??

I was somewhat taken back by that recent post someone made about Senor Giletti and his Florida Real estate without a full vetting of the actual facts then when one poster was asked for the Facts to subtantiate a post they made, they dodged the request,,,Now the Thread has disappeared,,,after him and his Buddy stood up and gave a pretty good accounting of what happened from their perspective,,,

"Wait a minute. What did you just say? You're predicting $4-a-gallon gas? That's interesting. I hadn't heard that." -- Feb. 28, 2008 --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C.

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slguy says on May 25, 2008, 09:20:

"SLGuy--How did they get your Home Address to post here??"

huh? here? where"

Before you throw me out, make sure I pay my bar tab

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miamimike says on May 25, 2008, 09:23:

slguy says on May 23, 2008, 08:51: flag

people tend to forget....it's only the friggin internet. i'm damned if i understand taking personal attacks here (online) so seriously. some time back, someone apparently was very upset with a person they thought was me. incredible stuff they wrote, """""including MY home address"""""

"Wait a minute. What did you just say? You're predicting $4-a-gallon gas? That's interesting. I hadn't heard that." -- Feb. 28, 2008 --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C.

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slguy says on May 25, 2008, 09:43:

ahhhhhh. home addresses aren't so difficult to get.

in my experience, the vast majority of stalkers are simply cowards. cyber stalkers even more so. without a doubt, there're serious wingnuts out there - but having dealt both directly and indirectly with several stalkers over the years, i find them far more deserving of ridicule and pity, than fear.

Before you throw me out, make sure I pay my bar tab

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CatGirl says on May 25, 2008, 12:56:

Slygy; jajaja - so they are masochists, eh? BTW - what happened in my case was beyond what you are describing. It was unique itself - so to speak. Unfortunately very typical of my life anyways, jajaja. To give you a tip and an attempt at Not being too cryptic: someone contacted my ex = Very BAD idea for the person that has no life.....(hope he does not get hold of them...just watch No country for Old Men, jejeje)

Webman - you are soooo sweet I love "Recoges lo que siembras".
You will reap the harvest that you sow....I would put it as my signature, but I say so many silly things I think I had better leave my signature as it is for now ;)) Beso

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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CatGirl says on May 25, 2008, 13:05:

Webman: One more note - About the attacking and hiding comment? I too have been on the tail end of these problems in my life (stalking). Hiding is not the answer, it is Not disclosing personal info and cutting off the source that leads or connects you to that problematic person. I had one situatuon where I had to cut off a whole geoup of friends because of my bf ex hubby. They have a child together so he is always at her home...he checks her cell and email and gets my # and email address....so I had to end all ties with them ;((( Sad huh? He was problematic for over a decade. He almost came head to head with my ex Colombiano hubby who did not care at all for the BS.
Again, some peole need to get a life.

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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kat1 (Moderator) says on May 26, 2008, 04:24:

i am moderating any personal attacks, or some post that i considered silly, politic try not to intervene unless of course is personal attack in there, i do respect people point of views but in return i want people to respect mine, so if i like Uribe, not need to call me a furibista, cuz i have been respecting others political views.

this is Peter site and we are following his rules..
Mario i am not taking the line from anybody, i deleted what i consider a personal attack or some comments that the user flags and if i am not sure and review with the other mods or leave it for the other mods to decided.

Desi and me have totally different point of view in politics, yet we get on fine, i am Uribista, she is not and as far as i know she has been respecting that.

Another thing i have been in pbh since 2004 and yet i don't expect appreciation form an internet site or support in a critical time, here you are on your own everybody knows that, you might have few friends who can support you, but don't expect much from a bunch of stranger.


I

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CatGirl says on May 26, 2008, 10:42:

Kat - Again kitty continues to be lost ;))...almost like Mario came out of the woodwork. Looks like something happened wilst I was away for a good amount of time. Colombiche? If she was a Mod - it was news to me months later. Whatever happened, it does not appear as if it was her cup of tea. Don't know much about her...Uhhh where was she in Dec 06 when the board was like a friggin swamp you'd find in Lord of the Rings (LOL)?
She also posted a comment somewhere here on PBH about being hacked and personal information was exposed? Hope that had nothing to do with what happened to me. It would be some relief to know that the Mods and Peter were at the least professional and tight security on PM's.
Either way, I wish her the best. I don;t know the details, so I will not judge. I only know what the friggin outcome was...Bad. Mario I wish you the best too.

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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CatGirl says on May 26, 2008, 11:02:

PS - there is a saying....not sure where it stems, but - "the true test of a leader/manager is how his/her followers represent him/her when away".

Kat - I think at this point...and with the changes (always gets worse before better during change) - all will be fine as things move along. I am not sure what the flag and edit button timing thing is about - but I have a feeling it is the result of requests from a certain dedicated and intelligent poster here. So I support it if it makes him happy ;))
I will probably have little need for the flag...with exception to inappropriately placed posts (and I cannot use the flag for that).

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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webmanco says on May 26, 2008, 12:59:

Mario
I chose solidarity with her and decided fuck it.

That is rather a weak stand on showing solidarity, and not reason at all for not participating at PBH, certainly there are real life situations deserving more time than sitting in front of a computer, but again solidarity for anyone is not an excuse for not participating.

Anyway good luck with your life and "good" intentions. That is what friends are for, for good times bad times and to back them up even thougth they too can be wrong.

...A yo, déjenme queto y no me jodan má! ...

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dwmte7 says on May 26, 2008, 16:31:

always count on you to smack the nail, webman, without hitting your thumb. that's why i like you. i like mario, too. always have. so many of my buddies have dropped outta sight. gomezman, colombiano X, viewpoint, hunter, and so many more, like crazy utopia. the gray hairs have all gone the way of the whale.

it should be apparent that i'[m bored shitless, as i have nothing better to do with my time than periodically make noise here, where there's already a fricken dirth of noise.

dwmte

0 funny, 0 helpful.