Conspiracy theories

kalder says on Mar 20, 2009, 02:34:

Of course the most resilient of conspiracy theories is that a whole bunch of weirdos, losers, practical jokers and the downright mad got together sometime in the late 60s, and hatched a plan to squander an awful lot of time, money and newsprint on the sort of nonsense that would stretch the credulity of a rather dim seven year old.

"A piece of cheese may entrap a mouse, but a bicycle could ensnare the Imperial Chancellor."~~An Bai Kuang

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ujay says on Mar 20, 2009, 03:09:

i got some theories about you ................ja ja ja

http://www.jukelightning.com

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kalder says on Mar 20, 2009, 03:35:

Thanks to the poisonous, malevolent shite you post up, we've got a damn sight more than mere theory about you.

"A piece of cheese may entrap a mouse, but a bicycle could ensnare the Imperial Chancellor."~~An Bai Kuang

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ujay says on Mar 20, 2009, 06:43:

put them down then ,dont keep it to your self ,
get off the fence ,and say what you mean......

http://www.jukelightning.com

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kalder says on Mar 20, 2009, 08:10:

Why bother? Anyone can get your measure from reading your posts.

But if your marathon rants are too much for most people to read in full, how about this for a taster:

"I find it hard to belive that nelson mandela was even alive to be let out ,he was a Terrorist".

Not quite up to your call for a re-run of the Holocaust, but nasty and stupid enough to be considered typical of you.

You do posess a certain low comedic value and your outbursts are quite probably rooted in a sincere sense of grievance. But you really are a horrible old git and should be put down with the minimum of fuss.

"A piece of cheese may entrap a mouse, but a bicycle could ensnare the Imperial Chancellor."~~An Bai Kuang

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dwmte7 says on Mar 20, 2009, 10:28:

i love it when there's a good spat on the floor. DING! ROUND TWO............................

patriarch

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ujay says on Mar 20, 2009, 20:50:

what you saying mandela never left bombs out side in bins ,
you saying mnadela never put a rubber wheel over people and lit it ,
you saying mandela his x winnie and the gang called the football team never beat and robbed any one ,
mandela was a Terrorist"

http://www.jukelightning.com

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billyb says on Mar 20, 2009, 21:00:

Wasn't Mandela locked up in Robben Island when all these fun activities were going on? The football club/street gand known as "Mandela United" was a winnie (the pig) enterprise all the way.

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

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ujay says on Mar 20, 2009, 21:06:

yes ,
but not matter what your case is ,right or wrong ,
you plant bombs ,for any reason ,
you are a Terrorist

http://www.jukelightning.com

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billyb says on Mar 20, 2009, 21:25:

"you plant bombs ,for any reason ,
you are a Terrorist"

I totally agree, would you also include palestinian "freedom fighters"?

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

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ujay says on Mar 20, 2009, 21:34:

whole new ball game there ,
the whole of the isreal goverment ,has at one time or another planted ,and killed ,for power ,thats terrorists work,

but when you have nothing at all to defend your self with ,no tanks ,rockets ,planes ,
and you are fighting for water food a right to meds for your kids ,a right to live ,......any thing ....any thing you do in defenced of this is justifled.

http://www.jukelightning.com

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billyb says on Mar 20, 2009, 21:48:

I get it, so not all that plant bombs are terrorists?

"but when you have nothing at all to defend your self with ,no tanks ,rockets ,planes ,
and you are fighting for water food a right to meds for your kids ,a right to live ,......any thing ....any thing you do in defenced of this is justifled.'

Didn't the blacks in South Africa fall into this category?

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

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ujay says on Mar 21, 2009, 00:02:

no ,and the reason ,mandela ,was targeting blacks not whites,
plus sa was black and white ,they were not being killed bombed at all ,
they had food they had water ,as long as they stayed on the black side ,right or wrong ,that was the way it was it ,

in the gaza it is not .the object here ,is kill them all and take the land .

http://www.jukelightning.com

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billyb says on Mar 21, 2009, 16:51:

GL, I was just agreeing with ujay on his following statement,

"you plant bombs, FOR ANY REASON , you are a Terrorist",

but he seems to be backtracking, hemming, hawing and prevaricating.

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

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billyb says on Mar 21, 2009, 18:36:

"they had food they had water ,as long as they stayed on the black side'

Actually one can posit that the Palestinians were better off materially (given all the aid they have received from the international community, albeit a lot has been stolen and wasted by those in charge) than were the blacks of Soweto during white control of SA.

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

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billyb says on Mar 21, 2009, 20:46:

Ok GL, have a good one.

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

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ujay says on Mar 22, 2009, 01:35:

Actually one can posit that the Palestinians were better off materially (given all the aid they have received from the international community, albeit a lot has been stolen and wasted by those in charge) than were the blacks of Soweto during white control of SA.

what aid ,

they never needed nothing ,they had their own land ,an airport ,soil for growing ,export,
now they cant take a shit with out isreal say so ,you cant move from one part to the next ,
you wait at a road block 8 hours ,becuase one isrealie is going to drive along it some time ,on his way home to his house with swimming pool ,
all on palstanie land .

they got no aid ,

if they had the money ,give them planes ,tanks ,weapons ,then lets see how it goes .

aid ,dont make me laugh ,

http://www.jukelightning.com

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dwmte7 says on Mar 22, 2009, 15:29:

i've been in israel 5 times, in gaza twice. i always thought of israel or at least in the beginning, a respite from the boredom and 'naked' nature of the middle east. however, after seeing how they treat the palestinians, it's no damn wonder there are terroists. real pissed, murderous terrorists.

patriarch

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billyb says on Mar 22, 2009, 16:07:

"they got no aid ,
if they had the money ,give them planes ,tanks ,weapons ,then lets see how it goes .
aid ,dont make me laugh ,"

After this comment, I realize this argument is not being carried out between two people in full control of their faculties or the facts.

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

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ujay says on Mar 22, 2009, 18:52:

yes blly ,just what i was thinking when you said aid .

I see the wheel is spinning, but the hamster looks dead.

http://www.jukelightning.com

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ujay says on Mar 22, 2009, 18:57:

here is your aid billy,

I arrived in Israel yesterday to work with Mercy Corps, an international aid organization, to assist the Gazans who are suffering from the conflict and over 18 months of harsh blockades that have left their cupboards bare and their banks empty of cash.

All of Gaza is on the verge of collapse: Most people have no electricity, no running water and inadequate food supplies. Fuel is running low. And only a fraction of aid needed to sustain Gaza's 1.5 million residents is getting in.

Getting basic food and medical aid into Gaza from Israel has proved to be extremely frustrating and difficult for aid agencies trying to help the civilians who are literally stranded in a war zone.

The Israeli authorities have refused to allow almost all expatriate aid workers to enter Gaza since November 2008, so we work in Israel, and our national staff who live in Gaza work inside the territory to carry out the projects on the ground. The Israeli authorities have isolated Gaza from the rest of the world -- no people, money or goods can legally enter Gaza from Israel without the approval of the Israeli authorities.

http://www.jukelightning.com

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ujay says on Mar 22, 2009, 19:00:

U.S. officials are opposed to spending any money on reconstruction aid to Gaza that might fall into the hands of Hamas and help strengthen the group's standing among the enclave's 1.5 million residents. Though the Palestinian Authority has declared its intention to help rebuild, Hamas is barring authority personnel from entering to help.

"We cannot funnel money through Hamas," Wood said.

In addition, the Israeli military is preventing the entry into Gaza of materials such as cement and piping that could be used for reconstruction or such military purposes as rockets and security installations. The Israelis allow several kinds of food and medicine to enter Gaza past its blockade.

It is likely that Congress would block any appropriation that might go to Hamas, an Islamic group whose doctrine calls for the destruction of Israel. U.S. officials acknowledge that, in any case, they face serious obstacles in winning approval for a $900-million appropriation at a time of economic distress.

Wood said that the breakdown of the $900 million was: $300 million for "urgent humanitarian needs" in Gaza; $200 million to help the Palestinian Authority meet its budget; and $400 million for the authority's programs to improve governance, security and economic development.

The Palestinian Authority faces a budget shortfall of about $1.6 billion. Wood said the authority could spend some of its new U.S. aid on Gaza if it cared to. The donors conference is expected to raise more than $2 billion for Gaza rebuilding, including $1.2 billion from Persian Gulf states.

http://www.jukelightning.com

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ujay says on Mar 22, 2009, 19:02:

hamas is the goverment ,hamas is what the people want ,

this is just another case of the usa ,trying to install who they want ,

http://www.jukelightning.com

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ujay says on Mar 23, 2009, 02:40:

why ,its there land ,
why without the 3 billion they give and more to isreal ,it would stop ,
why they are controling what goes in and out ,

why its not usa money ,its un money ,but the usa and isreal are holding up payment ,
they want to decide where and how its used ,

and dont forget ,it was isreal that paid and set up hamas in the begining .
the usa wants another puppet goverment ,one they think they can control ,

while they go about dropping 100,000 dollars bombs on a fucking mud hut ......

http://www.jukelightning.com

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kalder says on Mar 23, 2009, 06:02:

"...the Hamas leadership has pursued attacks against civilians as a conscious policy. A group that pursues multiple, intentional attacks against civilians as a matter of policy is responsible for crimes against humanity. Hamas political and military leaders alike can be held individually criminally responsible for these acts because of their direct complicity. In addition, in light of their ability to control the use of suicide bombing attacks against civilians in broad terms, they can be held criminally responsible under the doctrine of command responsibility."

Human Rights Watch

http://www.hrw.org/legacy/reports/2002/isrl-pa/ISRAELPA1002-05.htm

"A motto for terrorists since the days of the Baader-Meinhof Gang has been "the worse it gets, the better it is". When fighting against a democracy such as Israel... terrorist organisations benefit hugely from the outrage caused by negative images beamed around the world. That is why Hamas has ordered its rockets to be fired from hospitals, kindergartens and mosques in the hope of Israeli retaliation against civilians. It's foul but it works. The Israeli Defence Force does all in its power to minimise damage to the innocent, knowing the simplistic way in which parts of the media - including the BBC and Channel 4 - react means that Hamas's tactics will not get as much airtime as Israel's response."

Andrew Roberts, Daily Express

Hamas is an evil cabal of brutal, cynical terrorists. Why so many commentators insist on seeing them as a group of noble, selfless folk heroes is beyond me. They are a band of brigands whose 'achievements' don't amount to much more than throwing al-Fatah members off of roofs and stringing up working girls.

Hamas should be hung. As should of the Stern Gang.

I loath Israel's stupid and immoral dependency on violence as a solution to every problem. Their galling macho swagger. And those sickening, sanctimonious illegal settlers. But Israel has every right under the sun to exist and its people have an inalienable right to live in peace. There never was a Palestinian nation. There was a checkerboard of different communities living in the Levant under the Ottoman Empire. Terrible things happened when the external powers allowed these communities to order their own geo-political futures. Palestinians murdered Jews; Jews committed atrocities in their turn. Menachem Begin (for example) should have been tied to a tree and shot- alongside Mohammad Amin al-Husayni! But both Israel and Palestinian have equal right to nationhood. And if the Palestinians hadn't chosen genocidal, totalitarian lunatics like Hamas to serve as their tribunes, than the chance for their own national aspirations to be fulfilled would be that much closer.

"A piece of cheese may entrap a mouse, but a bicycle could ensnare the Imperial Chancellor."~~An Bai Kuang

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billyb says on Mar 23, 2009, 06:40:

This just from the EU for a limited time period, somebody needs to lay off the bazuko, and save what little gray matter is left.

"Between 1993-1997 the PNA faced serious economic and financial problems.[15] International aid prevented the collapse of the local economy, and contributed to the establishment of the Palestinian administration.[16] Donors' pledges continued to increase regularly (their value had risen to approximately $3,420 million as of the end of October 1997)"

"fter 1997, there was a reduction in the use of closure policy by Israel, which led to an employment growth and an expansion of the West Bank and Gaza economy.[24] After the signing of the Wye River Memorandum, a new donors' conference was convened, and over $2 billion was pledged to the PNA for 1999-2003."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_aid_to_Palestinians

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

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billyb says on Mar 23, 2009, 06:44:

Outcome of the Paris Pledging Conference for Palestinian Territories[42]
Type of Assistance USD billion
Budget Support 1.5
Humantitarian Assistance 1.1
Project-based Aid 2.1
Other Aid 0.8
Amounts being allocated 2.2
Total 2008-2010 7.7

With all the aid Palestinians receive, they should be living in the lap of luxury, but alas, so much of it gets stolen and syphoned off by their "leaders" like the PNA, and dare I say it, Hamas.

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

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dwmte7 says on Mar 23, 2009, 10:23:

thank you kalder...sane post.

patriarch

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Tinto (Moderator) (Trustee board) says on Mar 23, 2009, 10:35:

BillyB, Unfortunately, their birth rate is about six per woman (similar to Afghanistan and parts of sub-Saharan Africa), so even if they had better government and found a way to live in peace, they're still going to be poor and living on handouts for a long time to come.

I wanted access to health care, housing and education, but, no, I get potholes, trash and silicone tits instead. -Desi.

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ujay says on Mar 23, 2009, 11:44:

billy ,
this money was what it says a plegde ,but nothing has been paid ,so plege all you want ,
and if it is ,you think they give it to hamas or the other puppet goverment they put in place ,so how can you say hamas can syphone it off ,
also Humantitarian Assistance 1.1
they cant even get in ,to assist ,so how is money being used .....

You read some idiotic report ,and think you know ,
Israel has no claim on this land at all ,fucking bible shit ,
Palestinian people were living here in peace with Jews for 2000 years ,
The British were in Palestinian ,
No one wanted the Jews from Germany ,USA took a hand full ,Canada took more ,aussia took more ,but no one wanted them ,if the USA had let them in ,all could have got out of Germany ,
The British were shooting at the Jews to stop them landing of Dover ,
So they gave away the Palestinian land ,in 48,for just 30,000 Jews ,1.5 million Palestinian were pushed a side ,homes land taken ,

And from then till now Israel has just kept on and on taking more land ,
Bombing ,killing ,destroying, Palestinian is under occupation,

Hamas were not around , Palestinian people were fighting for their homes their land ,a right to live ,

The Israel paid and set up hamas .

But Israelis plan of genocide never sat to well ,with hamas ,they were not going to be a Israel puppet government . So they broke away ,then and only then did Israel say hamas are terrorists.and the USA back them up .
Israel had a deal set up with France to go nuclear ,only then did the USA step in and do it ,Israel is another state of the USA ,

I have been to Gaza ,I have seen what hamas does ,they are trying to get things for hospital ,schools ,
Opening up lines to bring things in across their boarder ,
Hamas are what the people want ,who are we to so no .
They have about 12% of the land they had ,and Israel even want this .
There is only one Terrorist is this and that is Israel,with the USA funding a Terrorist organization.


That is why Hamas has ordered its rockets to be fired from hospitals, kindergartens and mosques in the hope of Israeli retaliation against civilians.

They do not ,have not ,and will not ,this is bollocks ,a reason for Israel for take out the internal works ,and make living harder ,
If you were to see ,the amount of ruins ,houses ,schools ,hospitals ,all demolished,this is the places they fire from ,as they know with the sat nav they get from the USA ,it pin points ,where the rocket came from ,Israel know ,by the time they can response,the rockets have been fired and the guys have left ,
So what they going to do ,hit a ruin ,with no one in it ....no they hit another home ,and hospital ,and say it came from there .

And most of there rockets are no more than fireworks ,most don't reach any where ,a lot don't enough go off ,
Now as for air time and news ,you get nothing of the dead from the Gaza ,it is all repressed ,by fox and the likes ,but one Israeli killed it tops the news ,100 Gaza children dead ,not a word .

http://www.jukelightning.com

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billyb says on Mar 23, 2009, 13:09:

"BillyB, Unfortunately, their birth rate is about six per woman (similar to Afghanistan and parts of sub-Saharan Africa), so even if they had better government and found a way to live in peace, they're still going to be poor and living on handouts for a long time to come"

Something else that can be blamed on the west I suppose.

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

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