At The Gym

morphus says on Jul 16, 2008, 04:45:

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Plato says on Jul 16, 2008, 04:48:

Nice clips Morph. Some basic but effective exercises at the home gym.

Hey Morph, in addition to weight training, I'm a runner. Does running slow down or prevent muscle growth?

Plato

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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morphus says on Jul 16, 2008, 04:58:

Not if you get enough calories.

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morphus says on Jul 16, 2008, 04:59:

Thats at Power House Gym near your house :)

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Plato says on Jul 16, 2008, 05:01:

Thanks Morph! It looks like that guy has TWO 45 pound plates on his back and one 45 Ilb plate on his butt? He looks like a powerlifter.

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 16, 2008, 05:03:

5 chin ups? morphus morphus...
my daughter when she was doing gymnastic she had to do at least 15

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morphus says on Jul 16, 2008, 05:05:

There was 45LBS strapped around my waist. plus I weigh 230LBS. I can easily do 15 with my bodyweight.

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kalder says on Jul 16, 2008, 07:52:

Morphus- 230? That's big for a non-fatty. You must eat a lot to maintain it.

Plato- I read that running for more than 20 minutes activates some hormone that will impede muscle growth. But, the way I look at it, the best thing to aim for is allround fitness. So if you lose a gram of muscle, so what? At least your heart and lungs are working well.

What are the three keys of martial arts? Fitness, aggression and a few simple techniques? A lot of muscle mass is good, but not essential.

"kalder- have you ever had a woman?"--Sam Salmon

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morphus says on Jul 16, 2008, 08:42:

Kalder, I'm only eating 3 regular size meals a day. I was up to 240lbs due to drinking a lot of beer at my uncle's bar 3 or 4 nights a week. One night, while in a drunken haze, I figured how many pints I was drinking...3 pitchers with each pitcher containing 7 pints so about 21 pints. Then there was the stop at the pizzeria on the way home :)

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kalder says on Jul 16, 2008, 10:13:

God Morphus- that intake would/will kill you. I'll drink about 15-20 pints over a weekend. And that's probably more than I should. But I know where you're coming from- I love beer and the conversations you have with your mates when your drinking it, the atmosphere in a good bar. Then the junk food after the session- I usually have a kebab. I prefer beer to women any day.

"kalder- have you ever had a woman?"--Sam Salmon

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Plato says on Jul 16, 2008, 10:58:

Agreed Kalder.

Two things made me modify my personal training for martial arts: age and going through self defense drills with big, powerful guys like Morphus.

On Self-Defense Training:

I trained in Taekwon-Do for over 20 years. In Hapkido, a jointlockng and ground grapple art, I trained for about one year and a half with NYC police officers, bouncers, and military. These guys are physically bigger and stronger than Taekwon-Doists.

Taekwon-Doists are faster and more agile, but if someone like Morph grabs a hold of you and they can take a punch or kick, you have problems. If one of these guys punched me in the face, I’d be knocked out at 210 lbs, 5 feet 10 inches tall. No fat except for a little girth around my middle but you can still see the outline of my abs (which I punish often in training). The rest of my body, legs, chest, and arms, are well-developed. I have good stamina since I’m a mid-distance runner – 5 to 8 miles on my long run days – and I try to run anywhere run 11 to 15 miles per week.

Taekwon-Do requires far less running than I do but I go by the formula of running 2 miles for every one minute in a two minute sparring match. So, my strategy is to outlast my opponent and put the pressure on in the last minute to 45 seconds of the match. But that is sport and now I’m focused on what I can do to improve my self-defense in the street, which is usually at close-quarter or inside-quarter range. Sure, I can still punch and kick but what if an attacker like Morph’s size holds you in a headlock? There’s technique but I find you also need some power to move your attacker.

On Age:

Anyway, now that I’m in my 40s, my muscles don’t hold up as when I was younger. I noticed it in my late 30s. So, I realized I had to add more weight training to my regimen and actually began bodybuilding. I started a few months ago, then stopped and now I’m back to it again for about 3 months consistently and I love it. My muscles are holding up and growing plus I’m incorporating little power lifting too. My overall power has increased plus I can move guys like Morph a little easier than before with proper technique but with added power.

I think most martial artists go this route once they get older. It’s the only way to keep an even playing field with younger martial artists, or big and strong guys that can demolish you out in the street.

Plato

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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Plato says on Jul 16, 2008, 11:11:

By the way, I cut down on drinking. It all goes to the middle. Last December 2007, I polished off several liters of scotch.

Plato

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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CatGirl says on Jul 16, 2008, 12:19:

Plato - Good for you! Alcohol is a very empty calorie. I find if a person can quickly quote how much alcohol they drink, they are probably drinking too much.....;)

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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dwmte7 says on Jul 16, 2008, 15:18:

plato/morph....what is the truth that slim-jims like bruce lee and others can defeat heavy opponents?

dwmte

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Plato says on Jul 16, 2008, 18:47:

Well, there is speed and power, Douglas, and then there is skill, or technique, which allows one to harness the most power with the least effort possible. Then, of course, there is mass. Mass also contributes to power, hence the equation:

Force = Mass X Acceleration.

As one gets older, speed diminishes because the joints can’t sustain the force it once did. That’s why it’s important to build mass to compensate for power as one gets older. As you know, muscles atrophy as one get’s older.

Back to your question about Bruce Lee:

Here we have

(1) Speed
(2) Power
(3) Skill (technique)
(4) Mass
(5) The unforeseen element in the street which always has to be factored in (e.g. uneven sidewalk, broken glass, a sucker punch, weapons, multiple attackers, poor lighting, bad weather, etc.)

Bruce Lee was a little guy - about 5’ 7", 135 pounds, 20% body fat - but was in great shape. He did weight training and had excellent technique plus he harnessed tremendous power. He was a brawler which is what his Jeet Kune Do was about – the forerunner of today’s mixed martial arts (MMA). He was a bad little dude and he did get into real life fights because there were many who challenged him on the set.

Now, if Bruce came up against , say, Morphus, and Morph had the same speed, technique, and he clearly has power and mass, Morph would win. Mass always wins given everything else is the same.

So Douglas, it all depends. Yes, I’m sure there were many that could have beat Bruce, but they would have had to be on top of their game as well. Martial arts combat is all about exploiting an opponent's weaknesses.

Plato

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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Plato says on Jul 16, 2008, 19:06:

I think I hijacked the thread - sorry Morphus.

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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CatGirl says on Jul 16, 2008, 19:12:

Plato says "Martial arts combat is all about exploiting an opponent's weaknesses"

Oh Plato my dear, I am so sorry to see this ;(( - but your Master has failed you. This is a very westernized comment and one of the main reasons my father does not teach anymore.

I was taught an older more eastern philosophy and as I recall it is more about the study of weaknesses yes....but being humble for what you know and only use it as last resort. It is about "genuine" confidence in who you are after learning such weaknesses are in all of us. It is about using the least destructive methods as possible first and only use your knowledge other's weaknesses as an absolute last resort. You can do much in this Art without harming another and be safe.

It is about having the knowledge to crush the world, but you don't...because you can.

Be Humble. If you are not, your Master has failed you ;(

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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Plato says on Jul 16, 2008, 20:12:

CG,

For a person who talks about eastern philosophy and humility in the martial arts, I find your response rude and arrogant. How do you reconcile this?

Second, when women students ask me how to defend themselves from a mugger in a dark parking lot who are far stronger than they are, they don’t want me to tell them to be humble or hear about eastern philosophies.

More on this tomorrow.


Plato

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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CatGirl says on Jul 16, 2008, 20:50:

Plato - Your response was defensive. My intention was not to be offensive.. in a way, your Westernized Version is considered offensive to the way that I was taught. But I do not take it personal at all - I just feel bad when I hear it explained in the manner you explain it. It's considered shameful.....but it exists and I am familiar with the mindset.

Plato I am not and have never presented myself as a Martial Artist, nor do I walk this path. But I can say I have seen such people walk it and be successful with the philosophy. But they would consider your comment as Arrogant and so did I. My intention was not to give you a verbal lashing and demand an explanation from you. Why should I?

Your comment "when women students ask me how to defend themselves from a mugger in a dark parking lot who are far stronger than they are, they don’t want me to tell them to be humble or hear about eastern philosophies."

About teaching women to defend themselves? Even Westernized versions of the Marial Arts try to instill enough philosophy behind what they teach to cultivate "Confidence". A self defense course for women is a far cry from being a brown or black belt (even the Westernized versions). I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this one and move forward. I need not reconcile - we just have two different views. Not the end of the world.

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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morphus says on Jul 17, 2008, 04:16:

Flys with 125lb dumbbells

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morphus says on Jul 17, 2008, 04:18:

300lb bench press

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kalder says on Jul 17, 2008, 04:50:

CGirl- Krav Maga is a 'Western' combat system and it leaves all that Eastern prayers 'n' pyjamas stuff trailing in the dust ;)

"kalder- have you ever had a woman?"--Sam Salmon

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dwmte7 says on Jul 17, 2008, 05:21:

an old friend of mine studied aikido (hope i spelled that right) under a very old man in japan, named uishiba ( i know i spelled that wrong) and was taught that one's first line of defense is a smile.

is that what you sought to convey kitty? just curious.

i'm not part of this discention in the ranks.

dwmte

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dwmte7 says on Jul 17, 2008, 05:23:

kalder....watching these great shorts, i'm led to think that you must eat a couple of them "bells" for breakfast. thanks for sharing your gym time.
douglas

dwmte

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webmanco says on Jul 17, 2008, 05:56:

Good input CatGirl, been humbled is wise.


Here is Elmo at the right in the Gym

...A yo, déjenme queto y no me jodan má! ...

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Plato says on Jul 17, 2008, 06:16:

CG,

You’re comment above was inappropriate and disrespectful for the following reasons:

1. It was out of context.

This thread is about physical training, hence the title “At the Gym." I wrote about the relation of physical training to self-defense in martial arts.

2. You dismissed my training in a cavalier manner without first asking me to address other aspects martial arts such as its eastern philosophies. Where was YOUR humility there?

Since you seem to embrace the eastern martial art philosophy, I offer you an opportunity to modify your response above since PBH has a timed edit feature.

Or, you can just choose to say “Whateveeeeeerr, this is the internet! Who cares?"

If you don’t modify your response, I will create another thread specifically on Martial Arts and take your comments to task.

I have deadlines to meet and vacation starting Saturday, so it may be awhile before I get back to this matter.

CG, I consider your comment without modification a serious affront from someone who doesn’t follow the martial way yet makes disparaging-out-of-context remarks about my training and eastern martial philosophy. That seems like a pretty “Western" thing to do.

Plato

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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morphus says on Jul 17, 2008, 06:28:

Theres a way to kill a guy instantly by pinning him down on the ground. You grip your left wrist with your right hand and press the right fist into his throat. This crushes the wind pipe and kills him instantly. Skull crushers for the triceps help develop more power in the tricep

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morphus says on Jul 17, 2008, 06:31:

Close grip bench press is good too

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Plato says on Jul 17, 2008, 06:34:

That's a pretty scary technique, Morphus. Being confident, humble, and eastern philosophy will not save a person's life from that one - not even a smile while you're dying. This is what one is faced with in the street - without provocation - when attacked or mugged.

Recall that young lady getting hit in the head with a brick while crossing the street a couple of years ago in Manhattan? She was a very "confident" lawyer I believe.

Plato

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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paulr says on Jul 17, 2008, 06:42:

I hope i never meet Plato in a pub.

"2. You dismissed my training in a cavalier manner without first asking me to address other aspects martial arts such as its eastern philosophies. Where was YOUR humility there?

Since you seem to embrace the eastern martial art philosophy, I offer you an opportunity to modify your response above since PBH has a timed edit feature."

"CG, I consider your comment without modification a serious affront from someone who doesn’t follow the martial way yet makes disparaging-out-of-context remarks about my training and eastern martial philosophy. That seems like a pretty “Western" thing to do.
"

WHAT A DICK!

Life is like a ten-speed bicycle. Most of us have gears we never use.

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morphus says on Jul 17, 2008, 06:46:

Plato, you weigh 210? Thats not small but here in NYC an in-shape 210 pounder can feel skinny. Even at 230 I feel small when I am riding the subway in the Bronx with all those large people. There are a few "naturals" but most of them are just fat. They appear strong though. Must be all the fast food :)

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Plato says on Jul 17, 2008, 06:52:

Yes, 210, but I don't look it. Best training weight is 195 - but that's when I was doing the tournament circuit. I see alot of naturals while riding on the 2 train through the South Bronx that look intimidating. Some of them are probably ex-cons. Still, can't underestimate anyone, especially those Micky Ds food junkies. They don't play by any "rules."

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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webmanco says on Jul 17, 2008, 07:26:

Plato

It is clear you know what you talk about in relation to marital arts and selfdefense, most of us the average person who do not know the Phylosohphy behind of what you practice and teach, at any given point could do err in a conversation with you, which is not a sin but reading at your rude reaction over a comment over the internet just gives me a tough of your reaction to people who do contradict you in person. I am sure you don`t want people to fear you but to respect you, just what parents want from their silbings.

I always tought in marital arts and selfdefene one of the first things taught was to self control under different dangerous situations, like people badmouthing you, picking on you, contradicting you and esle. That said even if you are right and the attacker is wrong, (specially if are kids or women) you having the knoweled won`t do anything until physically attacked.


but to get all build up over comments gives the point of somehow lack of humbledles , god forgives those who without any intetion to offend you do the mistake of contradict you with or without solid foundations.

I don´t believe there is anything to edit even if time does not expire, it would be interesting to see your new thread on marital arts.

...A yo, déjenme queto y no me jodan má! ...

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CatGirl says on Jul 17, 2008, 08:06:

jeje.......it appears Plato you are Bruce Lee and Kitty is Kung Fu (Television series). The only thing I can say is that if I was walking the path I was taught as a child and around all my life, I would not have responded to your comment at all. I would not even have told you as much as I have about my knowledge of Martial Arts...so in that respect I have err
But I respect people that walk that path - no offense to your path intended ;)))

Si, I would love for you to start a new thread and learn your path Grasshopper;))

Puuurr

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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CatGirl says on Jul 17, 2008, 08:12:

Web, jeje - i just saw your picture of Elmo at the gym ja!

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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morphus says on Jul 17, 2008, 08:16:

Elmo is much bigger than that guy...he's big black and scary :)

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Plato says on Jul 17, 2008, 08:18:

Webmanco,

Thank you for your comments. I’m just calling CG out to explain her response and I did find it disrespectful. Didn’t you? I failed my master or my master failed me? My comments on self-defense were arrogant? How? Where? Why? Don’t you think that was a tad too presumptuous? What is the basis of her comment? We’re talking about a serious thing here: Training and self-defense. Why is it when some one is called out on the carpet and given a chance to explain, it’s taken as something other that what it is?

I’ve been training in martial arts for 24 years and have taught hundreds of students, and sexual harassment and rape prevention courses for women. I’ve trained with police officers, green berets, and bouncers and have been certified by an organization that trains FBI and CIA on self-defense. If I ask a serious question, I’m rude? I’m arrogant? How is this so? CG is a professional and she shouldn’t, or anyone else, take my query other than to merely account for her comments.

I wasn’t going to get into this now, but here’s the deal:

CG is right about the eastern martial art philosophy, humility, and confidence – this is all very much apart of the martial arts tradition. But one can’t look at things in vacuum by ignoring the history of martial arts.

At one time, Ancient China, Japan, and Korea were war countries. Warriors paid with their own lives if they made mistakes on the battlefield. It was “Kill or be Killed."

After the wars ended, warriors were unemployed and so they went into the personal security business. During peacetime, they cultivated philosophy and art and many are known to have produced beautiful poetry and art work. Out of this came the rise of martial arts. Bushi became Bushi-Do, Karate - Karate-do, Hapki – Hapkido, Taekwon – Taekwon-Do, etc. etc. Do means “the way" of a martial artist. It became a martial code much like the chivalry of the medieval knights in Europe. But when it came time for war, they had to be fit and depend on their martial technique to prevent being killed on the battlefield. So, we have several things that encompass martial arts:

1. Physical Training in preparation for combat like running, weight training, drills, sparring - you name it.
2. Skill or techinique
3. Sports such as tournaments - which is what I think CG refers to when talks about the westernization of martial arts. Tournaments have very little relation to real self-defense out in the street except for the conditioning.
4. Eastern philosophical principles that developed during peacetime.

You see, there is a lot here. CG mentioned only a part of martial arts and disregarded these other aspects. Thus her comment was out of context since I was addressing Kalder and Douglas on training/ combat issues in martial arts.

So, given what I’ve just written , did I failed my master or did my master failed me?

If you asked me about self-defense, martial arts training, or eastern philosophical principles, I would respond to all of them because that is what is needed to be a whole martial artist. But if I ask you to account for something, the same as I would expect anyone to ask me to account for anything, why is that wrong? You see, being accountable is also a core martial art principle. It is deeply embedded in the eastern philosophy that CG espouses.

Webmanco, martial artists have different interests. I’m not a sports guy. I care deeply about self-defense on the street and feel martial arts can give a weaker person the advantage over a big and strong powerful attacker on the street. You would not get this kind of instruction from someone who trains people for sport or who just focuses on the eastern philosophical principles.

By the way, one doesn’t avoid trouble by being confident. Confidence is obtained by doing hard physical training and practicing technique and self–defense scenarios hundreds of times. One avoids trouble by just simply being aware of their surroundings. You will not believe how many people are unaware of their surroundings.

And lastly, no one would ever think I’m a martial artist and I certainly don’t look intimidating.


Plato

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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morphus says on Jul 17, 2008, 08:32:

I don't know what the big deal is. Plato is just looking for the most practical techniques. In a street fight or attack, you have to react very quick or its over for you. Being humble to your opponent is'nt going to work against some big Mcdonald's fed thug who knows a few moves. He will crush you. You also have to be fearless and be able to take a shot to the face and body. Some people get hit in the face and its all over.

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CatGirl says on Jul 17, 2008, 08:35:

Plato - I liked your comments. Again So, I am not repeating myself, I did copy and paste the comment I was addressing in my first reply, maybe that was where the confusion went? I was specifically addressing that comment. I thought that is what you did not this forum, maybe I am wrong, dunno. If it appeared out of text or was out of text, I guess I will have to re-read and be much, much more mindful now before I type anything ..... excluding the feeling one might have of "walking on eggshells", which I get the feeling you dont want to create. My comment about your Master was strong, but it was how I was taught. I will take a few steps back (because I got ahead of myself) and follow the path taught to me. Passion is a good thing, Plato. I am sure you do everything you can to instill that in your students ;)

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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paulr says on Jul 17, 2008, 08:37:

you´re always gunna find someone who can beat you, if not in one way, another. Even the grand master of BS, Plato

Life is like a ten-speed bicycle. Most of us have gears we never use.

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Plato says on Jul 17, 2008, 08:39:

PaulR - you're right. That's why one should always keep training no matter what. It's better to be in shape than not be and hopefully one can avoid those encounters. But what if one cannot? Would you rather be out of shape or in shape?

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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Plato says on Jul 17, 2008, 08:48:

CG - it's squashed.

No need for anyone to walk on eggshells. You know as well as I do that accountability is very much apart of life - and it's a core eastern philosphical principle.

Regards,

Plato

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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webmanco says on Jul 17, 2008, 08:49:

Didn’t you?

No I did not find CG comments disrespectful, but then again I am not in your shoes or got your education backgraund on marital arts to find them the way you see them.

My comments on self-defense were arrogant?

Not at all but the way you addressed the "disrespectful" comment were uncalled for IMHO.

how?
demanding an edit
threatheing to open a new thread

Arrogant well maybe in the expresion "given a chance to explain" very thougfull of you.

Plato my English is not as good as that of many posters here, I wonder if other PBH posters find also offensive what offended you, and that I failed to see it the same way.

I am interested in the subject since I had tried training and yoga but not marital arts.

...A yo, déjenme queto y no me jodan má! ...

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Plato says on Jul 17, 2008, 09:00:

Webmanco,

Thanks again. It's over. I hope you know CG and I are friends in this forum from some time ago. We've had a couple of fun and light hearted conversations before. Sometimes people become uneasy with terse and frank talk, whether spoken or written. Being a New Yorker, I have a thick skin.

If you want to know anything about self-defense and martial arts, let me know. I may not answer right away but I will respond nevertheless.

Regards,

Plato

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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Plato says on Jul 17, 2008, 09:00:

Web, you can write to me in Spanish too if you want.

Plato

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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webmanco says on Jul 17, 2008, 09:01:

Gracias y buen dìa.

...A yo, déjenme queto y no me jodan má! ...

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paulr says on Jul 17, 2008, 09:07:

I do train, 6 days a week, i alternate my training, 1 day cardio 1 day weights. I don´t train because i want to feel as though i can beat someone in a fight, i train because it puts a spring in my step(any look good naked of course ;o))

Many people train just so that they can abuse that power because the fact that they are bigger than the next person. This is a very north american way - I am bigger than that person so that gives me the right to start an argument with him if i don´t like what he is saying because if it comes to blows, i will win. They think that they can talk any way they like to people because of this.

I boxed for 8 years from 18 to 25, i never once abused this power, i would rather talk or laugh my way out of things way before they got out of hand.

Your shaolin monk way of speaking to CG does sound quite patronising as if you´re talking to a kid student not a nice lady who was just voicing her thoughts.

Life is like a ten-speed bicycle. Most of us have gears we never use.

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CatGirl says on Jul 17, 2008, 09:07:

Plato - agreed - and closed with a bow at the mat and a calm sincere smile as I exit this lesson :)

Web - Your English is just fine. It is better than some people I know that are Native speakers. I like your words.

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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CatGirl says on Jul 17, 2008, 09:30:

Paulr: I am not suprised at this comment "Your shaolin monk way of speaking to CG does sound quite patronising " - this is the one big draw back to the written word, limitations and how things can be read in a manner not intended too. Just like a book - you can read it over several times and get different impression of what the author intended after every read.
If that is the impression from my writings, Kitty hopes that you understand that is not my intended delivery. If it helps, I have learned a lot in this thread about PBH and it's sub-culture. On that note - I will attempt to be more mindful and all I can ask is if anyone feels I am offending them to please clarify and not jump to conclusions. Or if they can identify a better way for me to relay my message, please lead by example. Web just showed me this in his response to Plato. Helps me see the best way to clarify.

Just an example of lost in translation..
I am no creative writer.
The one thing I learned in telephone sales was that you could practically say anything to someone - it is not the actual words, its the delivery.

Love and Time: the only two things that cannot be bought, but only spent

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Plato says on Jul 17, 2008, 10:22:

"Your shaolin monk way of speaking . . ." That's a first. Jajajaja!

Plato

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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Plato says on Jul 17, 2008, 10:23:

CG,

I bow back to you.

Plato

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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dwmte7 says on Jul 17, 2008, 13:31:

i studied ballet-do...learned to keep on my toes and move most agilly mostly in circular motions..........knowing whom to contact--and how--and whom, not. most demanding art.

the philosophy was mostly keep on your toes, always say yes to master, and don't make mistakes in contact.

dwmte

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Plato says on Jul 19, 2008, 21:06:

.

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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goin_south says on Jul 19, 2008, 23:21:

morphus, you were cheating TREMENDOUSLY on the flys.

Ciao! Gustav.

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Plato says on Jul 20, 2008, 04:55:

Morphus is pretty damn strong to be controlling 125 Ibs dumbells in each hand like that. Plus, that fly technique looks like it came out of Arnold Schwarzenegger's play blook. I do them with a fraction of the weight Morphus is moving (40 lbs dumbells in each hand). Damn.

Morph, how long have you been body buliding/ powerlifting? Is your training more centered on power lifting?

Plato

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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morphus says on Jul 21, 2008, 04:31:

Those are power flys. You have to be careful stretching at the bottom or theres a chance of injury. With flys you have to make believe your arms are in a cast.

Plato, I have been training for 20 years. I train mostly for strength and power. Any muscular development is just a side affect. I could do a bodybuilder routine and look a lot more muscular if I wanted but I prefer to be smaller but strong.

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dwmte7 says on Jul 21, 2008, 07:06:

morphus...which were the exercises you called "flys"?

dwmte

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morphus says on Jul 21, 2008, 07:44:

Right here:

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dwmte7 says on Jul 21, 2008, 08:35:

thanks, morph......that gives real meaning to the expression, 'straining one's meat'. ouch!

dwmte

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dwmte7 says on Jul 21, 2008, 08:37:

arnolds santa monica office is right behind the 'rose cafe' in the old gas co building. he owns numerous properties on main street. before becoming governor, he was always around. he's a really friendly person and expresses no fame ego. he's just a really nige guy.

i sat and had coffee on two separate occassions with him, years ago at the rose.

oh....and golds gym is just down the street from the 'rose'.

dwmte

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Plato says on Jul 21, 2008, 10:09:

Ah yes, Arnold. The classic video on doing flies. Notice he doesn't close his arms to the center of his chest but stops at shoulder width and flexes his pecs. Great exercise. I do them and get a pump, especially on an incline bench 30 to 45 degrees.

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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Plato says on Jul 21, 2008, 10:16:

Hey Morphus, I’m doing Arnold presses for shoulders as part of my routine. I understand there are several ways of doing them. I do them like the guy in the last video.

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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Plato says on Jul 21, 2008, 10:27:

Great video. Scenes from the movie "Pumping Iron.' Lou "The Incredible Hulk" Ferrigno is here as well as Frank Colombo, a former boxer, jumping speed rope. Awesome stuff.

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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Plato says on Jul 21, 2008, 10:56:

Morphus, I’ve lifted weights on and off like most people with no set program. My goal was muscle toning and endurance for martial arts.

About a year and a half ago, I began focusing power and strength. Then I got turned on to bodybuilding, but not in the sense of building mass but in trying to develop a proportionate muscularity. It’s quite a science. So, I’m doing strength/power/ bodybuilding with no emphasis on mass unless I attain it as a side benefit.

You look tall Morphus– 6’1", 6’2" ? At 230-240 Ibs, you’re close to Arnold’s body structure (an ecto-mesomorph). And 20 years training is about the time I put into martial arts.

One thing though, I don’t think I can ever gain a lot of mass because of my running – which I’ve done for nearly my whole life. I’m happy with the results I see. Although I'm gaining some mass, I think running saps my body of the energy it needs to build muscle. So, I’m making sure I’m taking in enough calories and protein shakes after I read your suggestion.

Plato

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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morphus says on Jul 21, 2008, 11:39:

I'm 5'11 and 230lbs the last time I weighed myself. I'll probably be going down to 215 soon since I cut out the beer drinking.

Maybe you are running too much. I heard anything more than 30-40 minutes does'nt yield any better results as far as conditioning is concerned.

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Plato says on Jul 21, 2008, 12:20:

Ghetto Workout

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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Plato says on Jul 21, 2008, 12:39:

I have a crazy running routine for martial arts and I benefited much from it in sparring. I run 2 miles for evey one minute of sparring. In a match there are 3 rounds, 2 minutes each. So, I run 6 miles at a ten minute pace, in other words 60 minutes when I'm in my best shape.

Here's my reason for this:

Let' say you have to defend yourself in the street. You're energy levels are at their highest in the first 10 to 15 seconds. I mean full power. So in a boxing or martial arts match, you notice the competitors hit their hardest to let the other know that they are no joke.

If you didn't solve the problem by then, your energy drops drastically between 15 and 45 seconds because now you're using anaerobic energy. Lactic acid begins to build up in your muscles and you begin to get tired fast.

From 45 seconds and beyond, it's all aerobic energy which comes from the mid-distance running. Boxers are well-known for this because their matches are also exhibit aerobic ability. So, I incorporate some boxing training in my martial arts training.

By the way, this is all well-supported research.

Now, if you look at Mike Tyson (from back in the day) and Evander Holyfield (among others), these guys did some bodybuilding/ power training, and yet they must have run quite a few miles several times a week to increase their stamina.

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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webmanco says on Jul 21, 2008, 13:03:

Run and rope jumping

...A yo, déjenme queto y no me jodan má! ...

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dwmte7 says on Jul 21, 2008, 15:24:

that hood training film was interesting.

all the guys in that film above...ferrigno (sp), arnold and others used to hang out at the rose cafe...at workout times, with world gym and golds gym down the street it was like a reunion of leviathons. huge, monsters of men. they had jobs as night bouncers all around main street in santa monica. no body ever fucked with them....and if they did, there was always a dozen more just like em, inside.

there was one football player, body builder from i believe the 49ers, who used to come around all the time in his rolls royce. a giant. meanest looking guy i ever saw in my life.

he ultimately died of steroid poisoning...think that's what they called it. not sure. but he was like all these guys, just add about 6-8 inches in heighth.

dwmte

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dwmte7 says on Jul 21, 2008, 15:26:

i always felt like 'mr. before' around these guys.

dwmte

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Plato says on Jul 21, 2008, 15:44:

Yes, Douglas - the problem with these guys was that they used steriods. But it's good education on how they worked out.

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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tejasmarcos says on Jul 21, 2008, 18:19:

never heard of power flys. try deca, dboll, tess or some growth hormone. 4 hours of sleep a night, more energy than you've ever had in your life, fast as a rabbit, nuts 1/2 the size as normal........... or so they say.

- ever super set? ever work out with spotters?

trying to walk a straight line on sour mash and cheap wine...

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Plato says on Jul 21, 2008, 19:35:

Power flys. Well, has was lifting 125 Ib dumbells in each hand and his exercise motion was controled and slow. So, he concentrated on keeping his pecs fully contracted for the time he lifted those weights.

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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morphus says on Jul 22, 2008, 05:21:

The heavy flys are good for punching power. I got a left and right hook that can knock a guy's head off :)

Tejasmarcos, bad advice! A lot can be accompolished without that crap. Supersets are for pumping up useless muscle. They will hinder strength gains.

Plato,6 miles of running sounds like overkill to me. Especially for a street fight. Just my opinion. For endurance, running faster for 3 minute intervals might be more effective. The fitnes experts had Holyfield doing that before some of his championship fights. A few other boxers tried sprinting instead of jogging (a big no no in the old school boxing training book) and had great results. They reported never being out of breath during the whole fight. If you look at sprinters, they seem to have it all. They can run and still look like a bodybuilder from the pre-steroid days.

Good article:

http://www.thebetterweigh.com/exercise.html

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Plato says on Jul 22, 2008, 05:30:

Morphus, great post and article - thanks again buddy. I do sprints in my routine as well as speed rope jumping like boxers.

Sprinting kicks up one's anaerobic ability I discussed above. It's for power and fast execution of punches and kicking.

Now I certainly don't look like the scrawny dude on the left . Damn.

After running 6 miles, I need two to three days to recover before I train in martial arts otherwise I'm weak as hell. But after three days, I'm nearly unstoppable and I wear my opponents out.

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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Plato says on Jul 22, 2008, 05:48:

Wow. I read the article closely. It's awesome. Here's an excerpt of the article:

"The reason for this is because when a high intensity burst of exercise is performed, the body burns more relative amounts of sugar, but burns more fat and calories after the workout. This effect can last from 16-48 hours, where low or moderate intensity exercise has no after burn effect.

Another important aspect of this type of exercise is the hormonal balance that it creates. Low to moderate intensity exercise produces a lot of unopposed cortisol, leading to a catabolic, muscle burning state. High intensity exercise also produces cortisol, but does so along with growth hormone and testosterone, enhancing fat burning, leading to an anabolic, or muscle building state.

Studies have shown the high intensity method to be more effective at burning fat and maintaining, or building, muscle mass than long duration, lower intensity aerobic workouts."

That's amazing information. That's why I love these internet forums - you learn stuff!

All sprinters are muscular. Just look at football players - wide receivers and running backs.

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those [liberals] who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.--Dante Alighieri, (1265-1321)

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morphus says on Jul 22, 2008, 07:26:

Heres a good exercise if you can't get to the gym:

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dwmte7 says on Jul 22, 2008, 09:04:

i get my workouts just listening to and watching you guys. i'm so exhausted now, i need to go take a shower and wash off the sweat.

dwmte

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morphus says on Jul 22, 2008, 09:11:

You're probably one of those lucky guys who does'nt need exercise and will live to a hundred :)

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MaFe says on Jul 23, 2008, 08:12:

ja ja Douglas...

Morphus in regards to the article you posted, I agree. I run about 5 miles a day, but eat well beyond what normal females eat...but I guess the marathon skinnier portion of the article doesn't apply to me...jaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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morphus says on Jul 23, 2008, 08:57:

MaFe, its definately working for you. I seen you close up and you look great...tall and slim, nice!

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MaFe says on Jul 23, 2008, 09:14:

ja ja Morphus thanks.....you work out a lot huh? I have a girlfriend that would jump on you in an instant..but she's chunky. I have heard she is great!

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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morphus says on Jul 23, 2008, 09:35:

What! A chunky girl Jumping on me? You want me to get crushed...LOL. Are we talking over 200 pounds? 300 pounds?

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MaFe says on Jul 23, 2008, 09:47:

no, no...she's half Peruvian/half Mexican born here. Maybe 170 pounds? (not enough to crush you jaaaaaaaaaa) She is chunky but guys find her sexy!!

With you arms...I see no problem with that!

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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morphus says on Jul 23, 2008, 10:07:

170? How tall?

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MaFe says on Jul 23, 2008, 10:46:

Ja Morphus...I think she might be 5"3?? 5"2?

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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morphus says on Jul 23, 2008, 11:09:

She must be very round and muscular looking :)

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MaFe says on Jul 23, 2008, 11:18:

Not muscular...je je...round yes!

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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dwmte7 says on Jul 23, 2008, 13:14:

well, if she was two inches shorter, she'd be round.

dwmte

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MaFe says on Jul 23, 2008, 13:14:

Ah que malo eres Douglas!! Ha she is round..but curvy

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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dwmte7 says on Jul 24, 2008, 10:24:

you're right, ma fe...noone will disagree that 'round' is curved.

dwmte

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