Those friendly Latin Americans

(Jesus, this got really long. A quick post turned a PhD thesis... Well, screw it, I have nothing else to do today...)

Years ago I taught ESL classes in London. Pretty much the only good thing about it was that mix of nationalities (and cultures) that you got to experience - we had students from everywhere - Japan, Mongolia, Colombia, you name it.

We all learnt (teachers and students) to stereotype students into nationalities fairly quickly - it was unavoidable, and as much as liberals like to bleat "we're all the same the world over!", and "We're united more by cultural similarities than differences!", anyone who has been in the same room as a bunch of Russians and a bunch of Japanese people at the same time will testify that culture does indeed affect "who you are" and "how you are" in a profound way. Stereotypes, we normally found, were true.

Japanese people are quiet, Russians seem moody and abrupt, the French are, well, French, the Italians are playful, Iranians are weird, (the list goes on...).

Generally, we (the teachers) liked having Latin Americans in our classes - compared to the Asians they were like a breath of fresh air. They spoke up in class, told jokes, had fun and were energetic. Not only that, they said what they thought about things (something which Asian culture prevents - it is rude, apparently, to say your opinion about something). The Latin Americans as a cultural group (Chileans and Argentinians aside) were the teachers' favourties.

"Latin America must be a cool place" the teachers all decided, "Everyone's friendly and funny and sexy and energetic there, I bet....".

I'm going to try to relate this theory we had then to my experiences now.

"Colombians are so friendly!" is a cliche among the backpackers who visit Colombia (try the Lonely Planet discussion forum - backpackers regularly wax lyrical about Colombia there). Are they?

Colombians in service positions are (normally) very courteous, polite and helpful - more so than their English and Spanish counterparts. This is nice - but it is not friendliness per se. Nor is complete strangers approaching and being super-friendly to tourists/backpackers - this is sucking up for money, something which happens in a lot of countries, but that naive backpackers often confuse for genuine amiability.

Some Colombians, coping with the recent shock of meeting a foreigner, will be very impressed and interested in that person for approximately 10 minutes. The brief bout of enthusiastic interviewing (Where are you from? How long have you been in Colombia? Do you like it? You play tejo? Ha ha ha!) quickly fizzles out, however. "Excited to be in a foreigner's presence" does not equate to "friendliness" either. (To be fair, this happens here a lot less than other countries I have been to).

So what about the Colombians who do not see dollar signs in their eyes when they meet a foreigner, and are not dazzled by the fact of being with one? And how about Colombians with each other, if we take foreigners out of the equation?. I observe that they are very chummy with the people that they already know - their close group of friends since childhood is rock solid, and romantic relationships intense. Groups of Colombian friends will often have a raucous time - with themselves, they are (indeed) very friendly, just like the stereotype.

I do not see this same social energy with desconocidos in Colombia, however. Seeing two Bogotanos meet for the first time can be just as quiet and awkward as two upper-class English people meeting. I have never seen two strangers strike up a conversation in any of the "pubs" here, and it is fairly common for all 500,000 people crammed onto one Transmilenio bus to never say a word to each other, aside from muffled "perdon"s when trying to leave. I do not really know who our neighbours are, I have bought cigarettes from the same woman on an almost daily basis for a year but we have never really spoken, I have been to parties where people are too shy to introduce themsevles to each other, our old flatmate has lived in Bogota for 4 years (she is from Cartagena) and doesn't have any friends aside from work colleagues.

When dealing with strangers, Colombians are about as friendly as the British, if not less. Indeed, the only strangers to approach me and make conversation have been alcoholics and beggars. In social situations where I have met people for the first time, it has been me who has initiated "getting to know you" type conversations more than anyone else. Of the friends I have now, nearly all of them came about through association with my girlfriend, people I knew in London/Spain, or through work.

(It might be worth adding at this point that I am not exactly a stiff-upper lipped staunchy Brit - I am a fairly friendly guy!)

In fact, I would go so far as to say that there is a mistrust of strangers ingrained in the cultural psyche of the people here. The paranoia over taxi drivers, refusal to sit on a pre-warmed bus seat, "domicilio" for everything and waiter service in "pubs", preference for fincas over hotels, this all seems to contribute (in little ways) to avoiding spontaneous contact, not making it.

Colombians are very good friends, but not very good at making friends, perhaps.

In a very delicate and pragmatic way, I tested out the above hypothesis on some people I know. They more or less agreed, at best there is an ambivilence towards strangers in Colombian culture, and at worst an active mistrust/paranoia. I am often witness to this idea being expressed that out in public "there are millions of baddies out to get you". Fine, Colombia may not be (statistically speaking) in the top 10 safest countries in the world, but it is not that bad.

(I am reminded of an anecdote told by a friend of mine where she got drunk in a bar, and was "talking to these people that [she] didn't even know for hours". Why should that be considered outlandish and wild behaviour? Isn't that why we go to bars?)

Where does this come from?

Humans, I have read, have evolved as tribal (read: pack) animals. We evolved to trust those we know and be cautious of those we don't - I'm sure this made sense back in the day. The fact of the matter nowadays is, however, that a stranger is far more likely to be a nice person than a rapist/robber/evil wizard/supervillain. Nonetheless, the "risk" associated with strangers remains.

A shame...

By Leeroy on Jul 17, 2007, 08:10 in Friendly Talkzone.

Cockney Colombian says on Jul 17, 2007, 08:22:

Fascinating post

podborski says on Jul 17, 2007, 08:43:

interesting, and I agree with a lot (especially the stereotypes), but disagree that colombians are not that friendly!

I have met many strangers in pubs in Bogotá, don't recall ever buying one a drink (except the women of course), but they bought me some.

However it does seem true that they are your immediate best friend and then forget who you are the very next day.

Still, a lot more fun to hang out with than your average Canadian.

Now, argentines are another Ph.D. thesis altogether...

Simon says on Jul 17, 2007, 08:55:

When I lived in the US, I have to admit that unfortunetely I did meet several unfriendly Colombians. It seems the Colombians there are not that tight.

HERE'S SIMON!!!!

juanalejo says on Jul 17, 2007, 08:58:

Please do not generalize Colombians, measuring us from a Bogota standpoint. You will have 34 million Colombians coming back at you, and probably a few million of non native Bogota residents also.

Leeroy says on Jul 17, 2007, 09:01:

You are right juanalejo - I am using Bogota as a template for Colombia, which is silly.

Leeroy says on Jul 17, 2007, 09:38:

I hear what you're saying, Rubito, but I do not equate choosing to go a packed club (or bar, or whatever) as necessarily being an indicator of friendliness or being social. Weird, I know, but people want to be surrounded by people. This doesn't necessarily mean communicating with them! For some reason, I prefer to eat in busy restaurants than empty ones - despite the fact that I will never speak to anyone at any other table. Places with lots of people have atmosphere. Oh, and guys stand a higher chance of getting a girl in a busy club - just as girls stand a higher chance of being noticed and hit on by guys.

Generally, I find, lower social classes tend to be more extrovert - I think this is the same the world over (another PhD thesis!).

Sam Salmon says on Jul 17, 2007, 10:48:

IMO judging all 40 million Colombians by the actions of middle class Bogotános is a mistake-Bogotá is a typical Andean city-cool to cold with people who are generally withdrawn serious and sober.

I agree that Colombians with 'less to lose' are more likely to be friendly.

' a la orden!'

goin_south says on Jul 17, 2007, 22:52:

Rubito... It will take more than two years for most of us to forget you ;)
So.... what's up? He's making you pay-to-play???
I guess he was thrilled to hear from ya.

y, un mil gracias.

goin_south says on Jul 17, 2007, 23:26:

Aaaawhhhh..... Offer 'em some $$$ and C what happens.

y, un mil gracias.

goin_south says on Jul 17, 2007, 23:35:

yeah, so....where's the "web" (no pun intended!) site..... for the schedule? Because who knows?? when anyone will be in Colombia again before their time?!

y, un mil gracias.

goin_south says on Jul 18, 2007, 00:11:

not to frighten ya, but....I dont' read ALL OF YOUR posts.
Oh, oh...oh.... how could I forget?
I dont' even read most of em.

But, did you include a website, with schedule?

y, un mil gracias.

goin_south says on Jul 18, 2007, 00:13:

Last Q: do you think I should log into Colombiablog??? jejeee

y, un mil gracias.

goin_south says on Jul 18, 2007, 00:13:

Do you think I want to???

(Think....again.)

y, un mil gracias.