'Terror T-shirts' Danes cleared

juancegomez says on Dec 13, 2007, 09:41:

A few more details...seems one of three judges did believe FARC had carried out at least one terrorist attack (Bojayá) and was (more than obviously) destabilizing the country through kidnappings of politicians, such as Ingrid Betancourt. Who knows what the other two thought about those specific events...

It seems an appeal is possible, but who knows if the prosecutors will want to try again...I hope they will.

---------------------------------------
Seven cleared of supporting terrorist groups with T-shirt sales
Posted : Thu, 13 Dec 2007 14:28:05 GMT
Author : DPA

Copenhagen - A Copenhagen court Thursday cleared seven people of supporting terrorist-labelled groups by selling T-shirts. The seven were charged under anti-terrorism laws for using proceeds from the T-shirt sales to fund the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC) and the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP).

The activist group Fighters Lovers said it wanted to fund a FARC radio station and a PFLP printshop.

Based on testimony from various experts, the district court said that FARC and PFLP were mainly active in Colombia and the Palestinian territories, and although they carried out killings and kidnappings, the actions were not terrorist activities under Danish law.

However, one of the three judges believed FARC had conducted terrorist activities in connection with a 2002 grenade attack on a church.

The judge also cited the kidnappings of politicians, including Ingrid Betancourt, as an attempt to destabilize the country.

Prosecutor Lone Damgaard said she would study the ruling before deciding on a possible appeal. She had called for prison sentences of between three and nine months.

One of the seven, who identified himself as Bobby Schultz told Danish news agency Ritzau that the ruling was a "massive defeat" for Justice Minister Lene Espersen.

Both FARC and PFLP have been labelled by the European Union as terrorist groups.

The activist group began selling the T-shirts over the internet in January 2006. A few weeks later, the T-shirts were seized and the bank accounts were frozen likely preventing any funds from being transferred to FARC or PFLP.

Copyright, respective author or news agency

http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/158162.html

robi666 says on Dec 13, 2007, 09:50:

Juan, you may have missed this about a danish union:
http://www.eltiempo.com/conflicto/noticias/ARTICULO-WEB-NOTA_INTERIOR-...

"I am a citizen of the most beautiful nation on earth. A nation whose laws are harsh yet simple, a nation that never cheats, which is immense and without borders, where life is lived in the present."

billyb says on Dec 13, 2007, 09:51:

EFEN morons. I bet if a group was doing in Denmark what the FARC is doing in Colombia, the idiots wouldn't be so sanguine about it.

juancegomez says on Dec 13, 2007, 10:19:

robi666: I read about it today, about the union sending a donation to "Raúl Reyes". Thanks for the link.

gato-bandido says on Dec 13, 2007, 11:13:

It's really remarkable that all they could come up with is just one terrorist attack. But not surprising. If you try to find real information on FARC activities (as opposed to propaganda), you know, like dates, circumstances, documents, images of the aftermath, victim and eyewitness testimonies, etc., I doubt you could find much.

To me the main reason is that the victims are usually poor, and there is still a lot of fear. The government is unable or unwilling not only to help the victims, but even to communicate properly to the world all the information on FARC atrocities that I am sure they have aplenty. Finally, the Colombian media are more willing to sing to the FARC tune than to confront them openly; it's hard to tell why, whether it is fear or money or something else.

cassini77 says on Dec 13, 2007, 15:25:

I do not understand. The government speaks and speaks of FARC atrocities and he is not able to show proofs !!
I do not know if you realize what you write, Gato-Bandido but you accuse the government of telling lies !!!
Yes, in fact, often there is no proof. Look at the recent plot against the children of Uribe. loks like an invention of Uribe, no ?

Robert Jorge says on Dec 13, 2007, 17:03:

"No proofs"(sic)? jajajaajaja

Yep, your right Cassi, FARC and their atrocities are just a figment of our imagination. Try saying that there is no proof of FARC activities to somebody who has lost a loved one to the scumbags.

juancegomez says on Dec 13, 2007, 17:12:

cassini77: This isn't necessary...but do you really want me or anyone else to flood this with documents from AI, HRW, UN, etc. in order to prove that there is indeed proof that FARC has committed atrocities?

And that's without considering proof from the government, which would be even more, despite any possible use of propaganda.

You're making this even easier because you are using the word "atrocity" and not "terrorism", by the way. Unless you want to argue FARC has made no atrocities, which would be absolutely stupid (sorry, there's no other way to describe it...kidnapping itself is an atrocity, for a start, as are murders, child recruitment, displacement, etc).

Remember that this was a case handled by Danish prosecutors, not by the Colombian government, and which ended up in a practically moronic discussion about how organizations on the European Union terror list aren't necessarily terrorists (which would make such a list useless, and the consequences of that aren't so good for Europe as a whole).

As for the plot against the children of Uribe being a lie, that is something I do not know. If you know better, then speak.

But I do know this. I still see people saying on message boards in Spanish that such a thing should happen in order to "force" Uribe to make the exchange, so that should at least make you curious...if people on boards can say that so easily, what would real kidnappers be capable of?

scotty says on Dec 14, 2007, 01:09:

Cassini, stop smoking the funny little cigarettes before you post.

Get Rhythm, when you got the blues. Johnny Cash

cassini77 says on Dec 14, 2007, 02:51:

Dogman, I remember that several nazis were employed by USA after the 2nd world war to fight USSR or to develop space activities. Their antisemitism was tolerated by USA and they were not punished.
And regarding the atrocities in the world, USA is certainly the first country and the main terrorist organisation.: attacking countries and their civilian people without declaration of war is terrorism.
France is not always clean but you American are the last people allowed to give lessons on human rights.
Scotty, the first consumer of drugs in the world is USA.

billyb says on Dec 14, 2007, 06:52:

Cassini, at least the USA didn't have half of its population coraborating with the Nazis in WWII, they actually fought the Nazis and beat them, not surrendered after only 40 days and then became their bitches like the french did. How can you tell a french tank in battle? They are the only ones with backup lights.

Robert Jorge says on Dec 14, 2007, 08:41:

Cassi - name ONE Nazi that was employed by the US. I am talking, a card carrying political party member of the Nazi Party. Don't confuse German soldiers or German scientists with Nazis. Two different things, apples and oranges.

Robert Jorge says on Dec 14, 2007, 08:47:

For example, my great uncle, a PHD in physics was a German rocket scientist at Peenemunde. My Grandfather was a German soldier. Both were ANTI Nazi. Both were pretty much forced to do the work they did. My Grandad was actually a Lutheran minister, was persecuted by the Nazis, and then forced to be a messenger for the army and was killed outside of Stalingrad (perhaps your favorite city name).

cassini77 says on Dec 14, 2007, 13:45:

Billyb does not know the history of France. He does not know who were Jean Moulin, André Malraux, Chaban Delmas, Germaine Tillon, Manouchian, Colonel Fabien. He does not know all those patriots who were called terrorists by the Nazis.
He does not know that, without Pearl Harbour, America would have probably remained out of the war.

Jorge, I know there were antinazi Germans. They were the first victims of Hitler. Some fighted with the Resistance in France.

billyb says on Dec 14, 2007, 13:56:

"Billyb does not know the history of France"

Billyb does not care. Six patriots, is that all France had in WWII? BTW, how many days did France hold out against Germany in 1940? Before they became Bitchy France, errr, I mean Vichy France.

cassini77 says on Dec 14, 2007, 14:47:

billyb, you are a very small personage

cassini77 says on Dec 14, 2007, 14:48:

and France fucks you

scotty says on Dec 14, 2007, 15:39:

cassini do really know what you are talking about? first everyone knows that France is famous for surrender. they are just as bad as the USA if not worse going all around the world sticking their noses where they dont belong, France first ones to surrender,FRance first ones to stab their friends in the back, France first ones to let their own country be run over by islamic radicals, the muslems rule in France now.
What did you say about the US being the first to consume drugs??? and where did you find that information? cassini use common sense think about what you just said, the US has only been a country for a couple of centuries and you think we were the first to consume drugs??? have you ever heard of China that has been consuming drugs for centuries long before there ever was a USA.
France would be speaking German if it werent for the US. you are typical French, snobs, ungrateful, useless.

Get Rhythm, when you got the blues. Johnny Cash

cassini77 says on Dec 14, 2007, 16:55:

and further more you are racist, scotty ! pitiful ...

billyb says on Dec 14, 2007, 17:45:

"billyb, you are a very small personage"

It sure beats being a small "person". Cassini, I guess the weight of history got to you, huh??

billyb says on Dec 14, 2007, 17:48:

"and France fucks you"

Well, at least a couple of your female relatives have.

Robert Jorge says on Dec 14, 2007, 18:47:

Actually, France did have a rather robust amount of citizens resisting the Germans during WWII. Let's just say you wouldn't have wanted to be a German soldier walking through the 750 year old narrow alley-ways in Lyon in 1943. France had their share of sympathisers and supporters of Germany also. But to say all French during WWII were complacent is not historically accurate either. The French resistance was infamous, as was the Polish partisans and other occupied people. The amount of Germans taken out by citizens resisting occupation in France and the rest of German occupied Europe during WWII would dwarf the amount of US casualties in Iraq.

billyb says on Dec 14, 2007, 19:03:

Many are unaware that France had the largest standing army in Europe at the start of WWII, they had a larger tank force than Germany, they had the Maginot Line, they were fighting from defensive positions, but the difference was that Germany had German soldiers and France was stuck with french soldiers, so they lasted all of 40 days before they switched sides. That is why the British sank the french fleet of the north african coast, because they knew the french were going to turn it over to Germany.

Robert Jorge says on Dec 14, 2007, 19:15:

If all things are equal as far as numbers, and one army decisively beats another, it is a leadership issue. The brass from the colonial level and above are probably to blame. I would have to do some research for specific examples, but the Germans possessed much superior weapons and tactics than the French. They also had much more effective leadership and the troops were highly motivated.

billyb says on Dec 14, 2007, 19:20:

It also boils down to the most elemental level, the average German soldier was tough and proud, their opponent, well, the less said....BTW, if soldiers are not highly motivated when defending their motherland, well what can you say? See dei's post about what the Finns did to a far far superior Russian force that invaded their homeland.

Robert Jorge says on Dec 14, 2007, 19:23:

Billyb, not trying to argue but rather learn a little; I remember learning somewhere that of all countries, INDIA had the largest standing army during WWII. 2.5 million I believe.

billyb says on Dec 14, 2007, 19:32:

"Many are unaware that France had the largest standing army in Europe at the start of WWII"

That could very well be RJ, that's why I restricted my statement to Europe. I remember France had a standing army of 600,000 at the start and was thinking that maybe China's or Japan's might be larger. hadn't thought of India i must admit.

Robert Jorge says on Dec 14, 2007, 19:43:

Ah, I wasn't being "Eurocentric" jajajaja. I actually Googled the topic for the last 15 minutes. I can't find any stats. (That I believe or disbelieve) But I totally believe that in Europe, France had the largest army - pre-WWII. I would have guessed the Soviet Union, but I'll buy France for $200 until proven wrong.

manINred says on Dec 14, 2007, 19:46:

"The judges ruled that while the groups took part in murders and kidnappings, they were not guilty of terrorism."

Wow, my respect for Denmark diminishes a bit. Unbelievable.

Robert Jorge says on Dec 14, 2007, 20:13:

Jesus dogman, do you have to so bitterly rub it in? I almost feel bad for the guy. And I still have a big problem with you lumping "Europeans" into the same bucket. Europe is a small but very diverse continent. If you don't personally like France for example, don't be foolish and assume all Euros are just like France. Have you traveled France, and then traveled Germany ... or a country much farther away like Bulgaria or the Ukraine? Culturally, politically, socially, the countries are quite diverse and different. Do you think a person from Lisbon is identical to a person from Estonia?

billyb says on Dec 14, 2007, 20:27:

RJ, remember also that I said "standing", all those countries, specially Russia quickly ramped up their manpower.

Sr Tertius says on Dec 14, 2007, 20:31:

I haven't followed this thing at all, but just wanted to clarify one point raised by maninred:

"The judges ruled that while the groups took part in murders and kidnappings, they were not guilty of terrorism."

The distinction is not outrageous at all. I don't know how the European define terrorism--in itself a very contentious issue. But by most definitions, terrorism may imply murders and kidnappings and other criminal activity, but not the other way around: You can be a murderer and a kidnapper and not a terrorist. If the Danish legislation says "it is a crime to provide support to terrorists overseas... murderers and kidnappers are okay" then, I'm afraid that if you can't demonstrate specifically terrorist activity from FARC, these guys are free to go.

For me, the problem is the concept of terrorism itself. It's vague and pretty much useless, except for bumperstickers.

"When the finger points to the moon, the fool looks at the finger" (Chinese proverb)

billyb says on Dec 14, 2007, 20:35:

How about lobbing gas cylinders at a church full of women and children, does that qualify as an act of terrorism? Or how about killing 39 innocent people with a car bomb at Club El Nogal?

Robert Jorge says on Dec 14, 2007, 20:53:

How about setting a small bomb off on a roundabout in Villavicencio, to lure the disco's patrons out, and then setting off a bigger bomb? 12 dead, 2002.

Robert Jorge says on Dec 14, 2007, 20:54:

Most, if not all the dead were children and adults selling chicklets and cigarettes to bar-hoppers.

manINred says on Dec 14, 2007, 21:05:

Ahh thank you for clarification senor Tertius. That adds some legal logic. I still think it is outrageous. As such, my respect is still demeaned for Denmark because if they are allowed to contribute financially to an armed and mobilized group of kidnappers and drug-runners, what does that say about Danish law? Absolutely shocking.

billyb says on Dec 14, 2007, 21:19:

Don't tell me the Danish judges were not aware of the examples given above of FARC handywork. What qualifies as an act of terrorism in their mind then?

Sr Tertius says on Dec 15, 2007, 06:44:

Billyb, RJ: I don't know what constitutes terrorism for the EU or the danes. If it depended on me, the examples you cite would qualify as mass murder, with its legal consequences. "Terrorism" is an equivocal term that leave a lot of murderers off the hook, and innocent people in places like Gitmo.

"what does that say about Danish law?" I'm not sure, because with the possible exception of the US and maybe Belgium (Peter will correct me on this), most countries do not claim extraterritoriality of their legislation. So if I lived in Colombia and donated money to a Danish insurgency, it's likely that I can't be touched by Colombian law. What would that say about Colombian law? Or, pretty much of laws anywhere? I think what it says is that we need better judicial cooperation, so that these guys selling shirts for FARC would have had to face Colombian justice. I bet you then, they'd be happy to be jailed in Copenhaguen.

"When the finger points to the moon, the fool looks at the finger" (Chinese proverb)

Sr Tertius says on Dec 15, 2007, 06:49:

Wait, extraterritoriality is not the word I'm looking for. I forgot what it is, maybe a lawyer here can give me a hand. It's the concept that your law applies anywhere, so if I'm caught in NJ, I may be judged there for a murder I committed in Choconta. I think only the US and Belgium (were Kissinger is awaiting trial) have this kind of legislation.

"When the finger points to the moon, the fool looks at the finger" (Chinese proverb)

juancegomez says on Dec 15, 2007, 08:10:

The thing is, even if you leave the entire "terrorism" issue and its vague implications out of this for the sake of simplicity, providing (significant or symbolic amounts of) money to kidnappers and murderers is hardly any better... it's still quite repugnant even in the absence of "universal jurisdiction", if that's the concept SrTertius is looking for.

Indeed, there's a need for better judicial cooperation, but I believe we still have the right to be angry in the meanwhile, at the verdict, the defendants and even the prosecution or the Colombian embassy for that matter.

Sr Tertius says on Dec 15, 2007, 08:54:

Aha! I think that's the term. Thanks Juance.
I'm fundamentally a pragmatist. I don't see what difference it makes to be angry about a verdict. For me what matters is how do we make sure that if someone is selling something more substantial for FARC (say weapons) in a foreign country (say Estonia), that guy ends up in jail. Has Colombian diplomacy worked in that direction at all? If something can be said about Pastrana is that his government had an efficacious diplomacy in that sense. Uribe's efforts, instead, get all spent in providing BJs to members of US Congress and Pachito flying to London to inform people that drugs are bad.

"When the finger points to the moon, the fool looks at the finger" (Chinese proverb)

Tinto (Moderator) says on Dec 15, 2007, 09:21:

For the people trading insults above: I don't have all morning to edit or delete the numerous comments that break the rules. If you want to continue the discussion, stay on topic and play by the rules or this entire thread will be deleted.

vladimiro says on Dec 15, 2007, 10:37:

EU terror list is politically motivated. They take the same orgs on and off the list regularly depending on the negotiations with the governments the opp orgs oppose, and pressure from the US. The FARC toured Europe during the Pastrana regime just a few years ago. They were well received in Europe and made many connections with political orgs there.

manINred says on Dec 15, 2007, 21:18:

"My point is Europeans are full of spite and envy when confronting the power of the United States..."

So dogman, you take it to the next level and instead of 'insulting' the french (what the hell will that achieve?) you insult all europeans?

I suppose this is the same spite and envy and gutlessness that Britain (one of the US's closest allies) had towards the United States as it went to Iraq to 'fight terrorism'...

Don't look a gifthorse in the mouth, mate. And for the record, if you want to prove a point, argue factually inaccuracies such as what I quote below instead of being a bigot and hypocrite by insulting all of Europe.

"Scotty, the first consumer of drugs in the world is USA."

Cassinni, that is clearly not the case. Drugs were consumed long before the USA ever existed.

"Their antisemitism was tolerated by USA and they were not punished"
Questionable of you to single out the USA here Cassini considering that anti-semetism was tolerated by most of Europe too during this time, before Germany took it to the extreme.


There dogman... sound good? Perhaps you'll look a bit less like an ignoramous and have sympathy for your point of view instead of being equally bad if not worse than cassini.

Mr. Hollywood says on Dec 15, 2007, 21:38:

I always said that problem with this case is that it ultimately derives down to prosecuting a bunch of wingnuts for selling T-shirts and saying they were going to make a small donation to the FARC.

I'm all for going after the financiers of terror but let's not kid ourselves that Danish T-shirt sales are a real financial mainstay for the FARC or anyone else.

Take down the big boys of international terror money laundering and finance and then let's talk. Anything else is just a joke. Even in Denmark.

billyb says on Dec 15, 2007, 21:52:

I would really have had no problem if they were not prosecuted in the first place, as you say, they are inconsequential wingnuts, but I have a problem with the judges not finding that the FARC commits terrorist acts, that part is just ludicrous.

Desideria (Moderator) says on Dec 16, 2007, 02:29:

FYI dogman, I'm not a "monitor", I'm a "moderator". What's the difference? A moderator has executive powers, a monitor just reads and comments.

I know you are pissed off at me because I said that The Finnish kid that went on a murderous shooting spree in a high school near Helsinki recently was influenced by the US high school shootings but guess what? I didn't make it up or because of a bias; the killer left behind plenty of evidence of his contacts with well-known US advocaters of violence and people who were involved with similar crimes in USA. Could he have been influenced by high school killings in Finland? NO because this was without prescedent.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

Robert Jorge says on Dec 16, 2007, 02:55:

Self edited and deleted. Since I am under the influence of Bud Light, I will refrain from commenting (much).... but I am with you Desi. I will just add quickly that it is ironic how somebody fiercely patriotic and quick to defend the US for anything, will then openly bash and throw crap around at random at an entire continent. And I now know why some people think of me as an "Ugly American". Appreciate it Dogman. NOT.

Robert Jorge says on Dec 16, 2007, 03:01:

"I have never considered Great Britain part of Europe". Well that's profound. I guess Key West isn't part of the US? Using your brilliant .... I don't even know what to call it? Logic?

Robert Jorge says on Dec 16, 2007, 03:09:

That was actually a bad example. You compared a country to a continent. I compared a island to a country. To accurately show your ignorance, I should have compared country to continent, preferably island so you would better be able to get the point. So, Japan isn't part of Asia? Cuba isn't part of America? Dominican Republic, Haiti aren't part of America? (call it north or south, no importante)

manINred says on Dec 16, 2007, 07:57:

Well said RJ

"hmmm interesting since all we hear from the British media is how stupid americans are? how fat we are? how can 56,000,000 americans be so dumb? How every american carries a gun, or has a gunrack on his pickup truck? Interesting huh mate? "

Well, since you asked for it... how stupid the americans are? Show these purported British media reports.

How fat they are? Well, since the US is the fattest nation per capita in the world, some will ask the question "why"? Actually, these same brits also ask the question "what makes the UK and Germany the fattest European nations in Europe"? In Britain, people like Jaime Oliver read such reports and change the school lunch system in British schools to combat the problem, proving that criticism leads to proaction, a good thing! The US could learn a lesson.

"How every american carries a gun, or has a gunrack on his pickup truck? Interesting "

Again, show me a report from a British media source asking why americans have gunracks on their pickup trucks. As for guns, well, let's take a look at the homicide rate in United States and compare it to the homicide rate of Britain

Murder Rate
#24 United States: 0.042802 per 1,000 people
#30 Finland: 0.0283362 per 1,000 people
#40 France: 0.0173272 per 1,000 people
#46 United Kingdom: 0.0140633 per 1,000 people

Hmmm, seems like murder rate in the US is not only over 3 times that of the UK, but also 2.5 that of France, and 1.5 times that of Finland (to make it relevant to this debate). So the British media has every right to question the freedom to carry a gun in the United States, especially if it helps explain a high homicide rate.

How you could be offended that the moderator stated facts about Finnish shootings being influenced by Colombine is beyond me. And by the way, Great Britain is a part of Europe, it is part of the EU and has been a part of Europe for centuries, and it is culturally more similar to Europe than North America. But it is still a strong US ally.

Now that you've attempted to justify insulting Great Britain, perhaps you could attempt to justify insulting Germany, Spain, Portugal, Belgium, Holland, etc... all of the countries that you managed to lump into 1 by making 'Europe' the subject of your rants.

If anything, criticize the Danish judicial system for not coming down on the ignorant FARC supporting band.

manINred says on Dec 16, 2007, 08:46:

"Maybe that is why I lump all europeans together, for it is honestly tit for tat, and it got the recation that I was looking for."

I don't think you did. The reaction you get for lumping a CONTINENT together after someone lumped your nation (yes, big difference, lump 'france' or 'finland' as nations to make an adept comparison, otherwise you might as well throw in Asia to the mix) is a reaction that basically states "this dude is an idiot, has no coherency, and incredible nationalistic ignorant streak" so the reaction you get from people like me, and many others who have replied is not favourable to you. Why you'd want to portray yourself in such a light is beyond anyone's logic.

1. In areas where citizens can legally carry firearms, crime rates have dropped dramatically

show proof

2. In big Cities with a combination of a large gang population and where there is massive gun control ( Detroit, Washington DC, Boston for an example), homicide rates have stayed steady

A definition of 'massive gun control' and more proof would be appreciated. If homicide rates have stayed steady, the gun control cannot be that massive or effective.

3. Many european countries do not have a society that is as diverse in race and culture as does the United States.

London is one of the most diverse cities in the world. Britain, as a result, is redifining what it is to be 'British'. As for France, just look at the French national football team, not a white person in the entire starting 11!

"in Los aAngeles County ( a county of 7 million people), 80% of all murder warrants have been issued to Illegal Immigrants, so that to, contributes to our crime rates."
That is unfortunate. Proof would strengthen your argument. Again, it doesn't contribute to most of US crime rate.

I hope homicide rates in the US are falling. I personally wish the best for my American neighbours.

www.nationmaster.com, proof for my murder rate stats. The stats have since changed, since they are a few years outdated.

Colombiche says on Dec 16, 2007, 15:27:

Danish teenagers wearing Farc T-shirt..... arghghgh.

It pissed me off that these pimple faced euro brats walk around glorifying something they don't understand.

I was on the subway a couple of days ago and this suburbian looking white kid was wearing a che Guevara tshirt. He sat there playing videogames the whole time. I couldn't get my eyes of off him, maybe because his face was covered by zits.. but also because I was wondering "que sabe este carajito Smith de Oakville, hijo de papi y mami quien es Che Guevara, que sabe de la pobreza y de los conflictos de Latinoamerica?". I wanted to go up to him and ask him three questions:

1) did you ever read the life of che guevara?
2) Have you ever been anywhere in Latin America outside of a resort you visited with ma and pa?
3) Did you ever hear of Proactive solution?

No me den trago extranjero, que es caro y no sabe a bueno.... (Rafael Godoy)

goin_south says on Dec 16, 2007, 18:28:

Teens and other kids do alot of things they don't understand.
Or, ... alot of things WE don't understand, too.
They are - we were - thoughtless teens.

why can't the freakin Chung King Chinese just LEAVE THE FREAKN DOLLY LLAMA and Tibet ... ALONE!