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Sweden ask Caracas for sold rockets found in FARC´s camp

http://www.thelocal.se/20930/20090727/

FARC guerillas armed with Swedish weapons
Published: 27 Jul 09 10:42 CET
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The Colombian rebel group the FARC is in possession of advanced weaponry manufactured by the Swedish firm Saab Bofors Dynamics, according to a report in the Colombian weekly newspaper Semana.

The anti-tank AT-4 weapons have been sold to countries such as the USA and a raft of NATO member states, as well Colombian neighbour Venezuela.

It was in connection with Colombian army raids on the FARC guerilla bases in July and October 2008 that the Swedish-made weapons were discovered, the newspaper reports.

The Colombian government then contacted Saab Bofors who could confirm that the weapons had originally been sold to the Venezuelan army.

"It is extremely unfortunate that this has occurred, although this is out of our control. Our client is the Venezuelan army. Saab always acts in accordance with Swedish law and international regulations regarding the sale of defence materials," a representative for the Swedish firm is quoted by the newspaper as saying.

How the state of the art weapons fell into the hands of the FARC remains a mystery as the Venezualan government, despite promising the Colombian government to look into the issue, has not yet been able to shed light on the circumstances.

Semana maintains that there are strong grounds to suspect that two generals, who are part of Venezuelan president Hugo Chavez's inner circle, have provided the Farc with the Swedish weapons.

The AT-4 weapons are described as one of the world's most advanced anti-tank weapons, easy to carry, easy to use and very effective.
TT/Peter Vinthagen Simpson (news at thelocal.se)

By JGD on Jul 27, 2009, 08:55 in Politics & the war.

JGD (☼Travelguide writer) says on Jul 27, 2009, 08:59:

I remember was I in the army, seeing a buch of venezuelan ammo and assault guns (FAL) confiscated to guerrillas. It was seen a normal thing.
What SEMANA claims is heavy infantry weapons

http://www.semana.com/noticias-nacion/rockets-venezolanos/126650.aspx

Globovision has a picture in its website but it doesn´t specify if those are the found ones:
http://www.globovision.com/news.php?nid=122916

You are worried the US is going to invade and take the Venezuelan oil?... you are selling everything to them !!Peruvian Pres. Alan Garcia to Chavez

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makopp5 (☼Travelguide writer) says on Jul 27, 2009, 09:04:

I hope on of these rockets blow up the ass of one of the lefties, that they understand supporting terrorists is not just a ideologial game.

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romy says on Jul 27, 2009, 09:04:

jorge, how many years ago were you in the army?

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Loggi says on Jul 27, 2009, 09:32:

How the state of the art weapons fell into the hands of the FARC remains a mystery

Yea, big frigging mystery

Live for the moments you can't put into words

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ColombianoGringo (Moderator) (Trustee board) (☼Travelguide writer) says on Jul 27, 2009, 09:38:

Some of the blind fools around here will find a way to blame it on Uribe instead of accepting even the "remote possibility" that Chavez and his mutts had anything to do with it.

I'm not talking about you Romy.

I'm so hip, I have difficulty seeing over my pelvis.

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makopp5 (☼Travelguide writer) says on Jul 27, 2009, 09:50:

Loggi
General Carvajal gave it personally to the FARC terrorists.

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romy says on Jul 27, 2009, 09:50:

I have great mistrust of all armed forces (legal or illegal) so I'm very receptive to the possibility of a corrupt Venezuelan military, the involvement of Chavez is further speculation but of course a rational mind needs to be open to all possibilities.

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Loggi says on Jul 27, 2009, 09:58:

The chickens will come home to roost

Farc. and all these other Terrorist organizations will in greater numbers move their operations out of Colombia, as none of these countries have the capabilities to pursue them with such vigor as is the case in Colombia. To them it does not matter under which tree they make their cocaine but under a Venezuelan tree they don't have Uribe and US inelegance on their buts. These very same weapons will be used against their benefactors

Live for the moments you can't put into words

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vinod says on Jul 27, 2009, 10:09:

Loggi...it's no mystery how advanced weapons fell into the hands of FARC. Sweden sold the weapons to FARC's buddies in Venezuela. How the Swedes could have possibly imagined that such a thing was not possible is difficult to understand.

I agree with you about the chickens coming home to roost. Venezuela is already swimming in its own caca. The pile will just get bigger.

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ferran says on Jul 27, 2009, 10:13:

Rumsfeld and Cheney gave them to Raul Reyes as a Christmas present, these boys are aces in the game, pure and simple, the finger points at Chavez and now they can sell more war toys to the war toy hungry Uribe. BRILLIANT!!!

All truth goes through three phases. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self evident.

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vinod says on Jul 27, 2009, 10:16:

If that were true, it would not surprise me.

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makopp5 (☼Travelguide writer) says on Jul 27, 2009, 10:18:

ferran

let´s hope that you ass will not blown up with one of these toys.

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ferran says on Jul 27, 2009, 10:34:

Just curious of how a german got in on the deal.................hmmmm afterall Rumsfeld and Cheney are the good ol boys from Brazil.

All truth goes through three phases. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self evident.

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somedumbguy says on Jul 27, 2009, 10:40:

Does any of this really matter? So WHAT if Venezuela get busted giving illegal arms to FARC? Other countries do this EVERYDAY. Toys for boys....and soon to be forgotten.

The REAL problems demanding attention are in the MIDDLE EAST. Nuclear warheads tend to be a little more disruptive than anti-tank AT4's. If FARC gets a nuclear weapon from another country, then you'll see some shit hit the fan...

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ferran says on Jul 27, 2009, 10:44:

Hey, dumbguy, you got some of those nukes you want to sell?

All truth goes through three phases. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self evident.

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Cheers Terry says on Jul 27, 2009, 11:30:

"... How the state of the art weapons fell into the hands of the FARC remains a mystery as the Venezualan government, despite promising the Colombian government to look into the issue, has not yet been able to shed light on the circumstances..."

==========================================================================

That's the funniest/dumbest thing I've read on here for days...

Cheers,
Terry

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billyb says on Jul 27, 2009, 11:33:

"Farc. and all these other Terrorist organizations will in greater numbers move their operations out of Colombia, as none of these countries have the capabilities to pursue them with such vigor as is the case in Colombia. To them it does not matter under which tree they make their cocaine but under a Venezuelan tree they don't have Uribe and US inelegance on their buts. These very same weapons will be used against their benefactors"

Good observation Loggi, their chickens are going to come home to roost, and I for one will share their pain.....not.

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

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JGD (☼Travelguide writer) says on Jul 27, 2009, 12:56:

romy, in 1990

dumbguy: you really you honor your screename, dont you?

You are worried the US is going to invade and take the Venezuelan oil?... you are selling everything to them !!Peruvian Pres. Alan Garcia to Chavez

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pobrecito says on Jul 27, 2009, 13:07:

I dream of triolism : makopp5, jorgegdiaz, billyb ...

No mas Tasco66 !

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makopp5 (☼Travelguide writer) says on Jul 27, 2009, 13:10:

pobrecito
Chavez is a good friend of you, so can you explainb why YOUR friend is selling arm to terrorists?

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JGD (☼Travelguide writer) says on Jul 27, 2009, 13:25:

so all your problems come down to a s*x problem pobrecito ?... Freud was always right then !!

I don`t know who is dumber buggy; you who don`t understand what a serial number is, or Chavez who didn´t think of erasing them (at least with a file !!!!)

In your apologist mind cassini77, please tell me how the col army got those numbers ?

You are worried the US is going to invade and take the Venezuelan oil?... you are selling everything to them !!Peruvian Pres. Alan Garcia to Chavez

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billyb says on Jul 27, 2009, 14:38:

"I dream of triolism : makopp5, jorgegdiaz, billyb ..."

Dude, homey don't play that game, better you find some chicks for your fantasies.

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

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makopp5 (☼Travelguide writer) says on Jul 27, 2009, 15:39:

pobrecito has no real aruments why his friend sold arms to terrorists, and now he is using the same stupid "arguments" like his friend Chavez.

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ferran says on Jul 27, 2009, 15:49:

Divided, that is the goal, to divide the people like you guys, its infantile, good guys, bad guys, you are being manipulated and you dont even know it, your thoughts and what you think and say is controlled, Chavez is an idiotic puppet and so is Uribe, two sides of the same coin, dont you get it by now? the farc are also pawns in the game, STOP feeding into this game and you will see how easy it dies.

All truth goes through three phases. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self evident.

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Haddeman says on Jul 27, 2009, 17:11:

Surely Desidera is involved in this.She has extensive Swedish and Colombian connections.We should be told!

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vinod says on Jul 27, 2009, 17:19:

Sweden selling supplies to the bad guys is nothing new.

Hitler would not have been able to wage war to the extent that he did if Sweden didn't supply him with essential war materials.

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somedumbguy says on Jul 27, 2009, 17:40:

The Rothschild's finance wars and terrorists all the time. This story is making the news in Sweden because Hockey Season doesn't start for another month.

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davidslc46 says on Jul 27, 2009, 17:42:

http://www.colombiareports.com/colombia-news/news/5182-farc-allegedly-...

FARC allegedly financed supporters of ousted Honduras President

No wonder there are alot of people rethinking the necessity of the military coup.

David

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theflatline says on Jul 27, 2009, 18:53:

here is a swedish conspiracy that i have found amusing for years.

Legaleez for Complete Morons - A book for gringos in Colombia for who think they understand the nature of the law in a country where they cannot speak the language.

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JGD (☼Travelguide writer) says on Jul 28, 2009, 12:18:

Did a little digging and found this "pearl" from 1997

I know the govtm MUST be completely different and if things are proved, I bet Sweden will be embarrased like hell. They did, however, stop selling arms to Venezuela around 2002 due to suspicios activities. Hugo claims that he buy Russians arms now and is so proud of his brand new Sukhois. BS, nobody in the western world would sell them a pellet gun.

I went to grad school with a guy who worked for Lockeed Martin and was on one of the many teams that designed and built the raptor F-22. One day talking about the potential enemies (raffalle and suhkois) he said, "they are good, indeed seem to be very fast, however, if I were a pilot, I wouldn´t trust Russian electronics ! ".

I do hope we don`t end up at war with the nutzo next door. But that statement is on my mind...

http://www.nytimes.com/1987/05/17/world/the-swedish-quandry-arms-deals...

THE SWEDISH QUANDRY: ARMS DEALS OR PACIFISM?
By STEVE LOHR, Special to the New York Times
Published: Sunday, May 17, 1987

For years, the Swedish Government has been a vocal champion of peace and disarmament, a stand that is a source of national pride. But today Sweden finds itself embroiled in an arms-trading scandal that raises questions about its adherence to its stated principles and underlines the ''Swedish paradox'' of a pacifist country with a thriving weapons industry dependent on exports....

...Politically, the most sensitive issue is whether Swedish Government officials were aware of illegal arms shipments and chose to ignore violations to help Swedish weapons makers. Another possibility, nearly as damaging for the Government, would be if inquiries showed that there was little effort to enforce Sweden's strict arms export-control regulations. Either conclusion would mean Sweden's laws were no more than empty political posturing. Inquiry 3 Years Ago...

You are worried the US is going to invade and take the Venezuelan oil?... you are selling everything to them !!Peruvian Pres. Alan Garcia to Chavez

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vinod says on Jul 28, 2009, 12:39:

somedumbguy....quote...."The Rothschild's finance wars and terrorists all the time. This story is making the news in Sweden because Hockey Season doesn't start for another month."

More conspiracy stuff? I wonder if the Rothschilds financed the muslim conquest of India.

And I suppose that when Sweden was selling war materials to Hitler, it didn't make the news during hockey season either.

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vinod says on Jul 28, 2009, 12:42:

STEVE LOHE..NEW YORK TIMES..."For years, the Swedish Government has been a vocal champion of peace and disarmament, a stand that is a source of national pride. But today Sweden finds itself embroiled in an arms-trading scandal that raises questions about its adherence to its stated principles and underlines the ''Swedish paradox'' of a pacifist country with a thriving weapons industry dependent on exports...."

Just take a look at Swedish history. Their hypocrisy is nothing new.

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JohnEvans says on Jul 28, 2009, 13:24:

Whats with all the Sweden bashing? They didn't provide weapons to the Farc. Lots of countries sold weapons to Venezuela. The USA were selling tons of weapons to Venezuela as recently as 2003. The US arms embargo was enacted in 2006. The weapons in question were sold to Venezuela in the 1980s by Saab, not Sweden.

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theflatline says on Jul 28, 2009, 13:34:

Isn't Saab in Sweden? So by that logic we can say that General General Dynamics sold weapons to Venezuela, not the US?

Legaleez for Complete Morons - A book for gringos in Colombia for who think they understand the nature of the law in a country where they cannot speak the language.

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JohnEvans says on Jul 28, 2009, 14:05:

Correct....if General General Dynamics sold weapons to Venezuela.

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theflatline says on Jul 28, 2009, 14:47:

John,

Saab is a Swedish Company, and if Sweden lets them self weapons over seas, then Sweden allowed the sale.

Legaleez for Complete Morons - A book for gringos in Colombia for who think they understand the nature of the law in a country where they cannot speak the language.

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vinod says on Jul 28, 2009, 14:54:

JohnEvans...."Whats with all the Sweden bashing? They didn't provide weapons to the Farc. Lots of countries sold weapons to Venezuela. The USA were selling tons of weapons to Venezuela as recently as 2003. The US arms embargo was enacted in 2006. The weapons in question were sold to Venezuela in the 1980s by Saab, not Sweden."

John, that is exactly the point. Lots of countries sell weapons to lots of bad people. It's the so "high and mighty" prententious "holier than thou" condescending attitude that so many Swedes have (especially their governments of the last 70 years) that piss a lot of people off.

They wear their badge of "neutrality" with some sort of pride, which really is nothing more than a facade to cover up their shame.

They claim to be pacifist, but will sell war materials to anybody, including Chavez and Hitler. Their hypocrisy is mind boggling.

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JohnEvans says on Jul 28, 2009, 16:03:

I don't see Swedes and Sweden the same way as you do.

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vinod says on Jul 29, 2009, 10:00:

Well John, it is an historical fact that Sweden sold essential supplies to Hitler's war machine that enabled Germany to wage the genocidal war to the extent that she did.

And then Swedes wear the badge of pacifism?

I see that as hypocrisy. Apparently you don't.

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Desideria (Moderator) (Trustee board) says on Jul 29, 2009, 12:29:

In order to sell weapons to other countries, Swedish Saab Bofors Dynamics had to obtain a permission from Security Inspection; it's illegal to provide arms to terrorists and this requirement was met by the Venezuelan government. This was in the eighties. Saab Bofors is in no way responsible for the corruption within the Venezuelan military if there are people who'd deliver these weapons to the Colombian rebels. This possibility always exists.

A fronte praecipitium a tergo lupi

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billyb says on Jul 29, 2009, 13:20:

I don't think Saab is responsible either. It is obvious that the Vennie military handed the weapons over to the FARC, the only question is, was it a rogue operation, or did Chavvie order it.

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

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JGD (☼Travelguide writer) says on Sep 15, 2009, 08:54:

Desi said, "Saab Bofors is in no way responsible for the corruption within the Venezuelan military if there are people who'd deliver these weapons to the Colombian rebels. This possibility always exists."

You are absolutely right. That´s why Western countries don´t sell weapons to Venezuela anymore. Only the Ruskies are willing to take the political cost of selling weapons to a wannabe dictator like Chavez.

You are worried the US is going to invade and take the Venezuelan oil?... you are selling everything to them !!Peruvian Pres. Alan Garcia to Chavez

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tasco66 says on Sep 15, 2009, 09:13:

Yes, don’t blame the Swedes, Chavez assured them that Venezuela would not provide the weapons to the Farc. And we all know that Chavez always stands by his word…

The trouble with free elections is, you never know who is going to win (Leonid Brezhnev)

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Sam Salmon says on Sep 15, 2009, 10:15:

"Venezuela is already swimming in its own caca. The pile will just get bigger."
=====================================================

LOL!!!

' a la orden!'

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Sam Salmon says on Sep 15, 2009, 10:19:

Also I quite agree that the problem of stolen armaments will become larger in South Amercia in the future-we're already seeing this in Peru where Army helicopter was taken down.

http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/284074,two-dead-as-shining-pat...

Does anyone here doubt that FARC will sell on anything to anyone to make a dollar?

The Peruvian terrorist criminal narco goons who murdered those soldiers didn't pull that missile out of their asses they got them from someone they have a lot in common with.

' a la orden!'

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poco says on Sep 15, 2009, 16:07:

Quote: How the Swedes could have possibly imagined that such a thing was not possible is difficult to understand.
===========================================
Good looking bunch,, but,,

How long does it take the Swedish Navy to detemine if a noise is a mink or an enemy submarine ?

Well,, before realising their error, they spent months tracking MINKS, while trying to determine who was sending submarines into THEIR waters.

Really,,

Colombian Chickens are crowing about the new President of the U.S. who will assure that From each according to their ability to each according to their need.

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