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Property Thoughts Poblado

Morning - just looking for some peoples thoughts on the following property I have found:

Poblado (Patio Bonito). Bedsitter 37 sq metres in building 3 years old, 6th floor. Building hs a small (useless) gym and OK views. Price with furniture is 105 million which is about 60,000 USD and 1621 a sq metre.

Advantages - the location - right near exito, metro, nice strata 6 area close to P lleres more or less.

Disadvantage - the price seems very expensive to me, especially given the sq metre cost.

2. Pobaldo - up above Viscaya (like 2 longgg blocks up that murderous hill). 52 sq metres, 10 year old building 9th floor. No pool gym etc but very nice building surrounds ie gardens. Cost 107 million = 61 000 usd. = 1175 usd a sq mtre.

Advantages - very nice area, close to the supermarket, nice building currently rented 700,000 pesos a month + administration.

Disadvantages - up killer hill.

3. Poblado - Campestre st further above the country club past Oviedo (on the way to envigado). 34 sq metres, 1st level. Building has a small pool with amazing views. 80 million pesos = 46000 usd or 1352 a sq metre.

Disadvantages - far from P lleres so hard to rent to foreigners. is 1st floor. V quiet area.

Advantages - awesome view from pool, price is better. Has two supermarkets within one and two blocks. The secnd has some restaurants. Exclusive area.

I have made some offers and am waiting to hear back. Interested to see what knowledgeable pers on this board have to say about the prices etc. My plan would be to have someone rent them on my behalf to foreigners on short term basis.

My fears are the peso and if it goes down against either the AUD or USD and a possible housing bubble - prices per sq metre seem very expensive compared to other places. One advantage is that new prices are around 1600 a sq metre and for apartment studios are up at around 1800 to 1900 a sq metre.

Also, if I go through with it - anyone with an established business interested on renting on my behalf. I did contact one company I thought may be interested however they have said basically they are too small and is not interested - (IMO they are the perfect size for renting out to one person).

Thanks for any input.

By bickerss on May 21, 2008, 11:41 in Friendly Talkzone.

lpdiver says on May 21, 2008, 12:37:

Man those are some killer small apartments.

t

"cook some rice!"

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Cheers Terry says on May 21, 2008, 15:22:

I'm blown away how high the prices are for such seriously small apartments.

Good luck.

Cheers,
Terry

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bickerss says on May 21, 2008, 15:35:

Poblado is very high at the moment, especially when converting from peso to dollars etc.

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bickerss says on May 21, 2008, 16:31:

poorbuthappy - thanks for the post.

I solicit advice because I am very careful about my investments and get information from many different sources, including from this board, where some great info can be found. There are may people on this board with far more knowledge of Medellin than me; especially relating to property.

Its the same as I extensively used Panama forums for investigation before investing there in 05; and saved my self a bunch of hassle, money and time - people have some great ideas and input about things ones may never have thought of / considered.

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durito says on May 21, 2008, 17:11:

My experience has been that most real estate agents hardly know anything about real estate.

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aztec says on May 21, 2008, 17:13:

'My experience has been that most real estate agents hardly know anything about real estate."

Especially in Colombia.

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larryrn says on May 21, 2008, 17:33:

Medellin - El Poblado is very expensive - and has increased to almost 3 mil sq meter over the last 2 years.. There are building the largest apartment building in Colombia in Sabineta according to an article I read last week. Sabineta is outside of Envigado and very nice, but until recently very unknown. The point is they will be asking premium prices for this building in Sabineta.

Unlike America, real estate in Medellin's nicer neighborhoods is increasing in value. There still are lots of construction projects here and I am amazed at how fast they are selling.

Larry

--- Larry Snyder - http://www.rn.org - Your Source for Online Nursing Education!

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durito says on May 21, 2008, 17:39:

The alleged building in Sabaneta is a hotel/apt/offices. It's supposed to be the tallest building, not biggest. In terms of the # of apartments the won't be that many. This supposes it is actually built and they keep delaying the start of construction.

The boom will stop one day soon, they will realize they've overbuilt and prices will come down.

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bickerss says on May 21, 2008, 20:54:

poorbuthappy - respect your position, but I have no problem what-so-ever with soliciting opinions from the internet - there are many people who provide excellent advice. It is quite easy to cross check that against what i already know, or with other sources. It is ONE of MANY sources from where I gain info.

I have been to a great deal of real estate agencies in medellin (ie that is how I have the information regarding the apartments above) and have seen many apartments. I have also walked the streets looking for ''se vende'' signs and ringing the owners and checked out god knows how many new construction sites. Most of them (real estate agencies) are an absolute waste of time; full of ''oxygen bandits'' working in them - I would not rely on most of them if you paid me too.

Try and have a look at the one located in p lleres as an example. One would think that given its location, and up-market office, that would have a clue (and maybe try and tap into the potentially more lucrative expat market). Instead there is some disinterested numpty working there who can barely spare the time to get out of her seat!!

There are however two or three I have found, who have professional people working for them, who dont adhere to the ''latin time'' manana .......etc. They are the ones I have stuck with.

Larry - I have had a good look around Sabeneta - not my cup of tea to live in but I can see the attraction for many people, and the possibility growth there.

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Frank Rizzo says on May 22, 2008, 00:09:

There are so many guys and gals here that know the stock market....thank god there still is a way for us poor/ignorant saps to make money......like buying an holding property. I'll take large land and home holdings any day....but then i'm one of the poor ignorant saps.....

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slguy says on May 22, 2008, 00:24:

i'm with you, frank. those finance whizkids and their secret lingo give me a friggin headache. ;)

i don't know the medelln market at all...but i know enough to recognize serious bubbles when i see them.

Before you throw me out, make sure I pay my bar tab

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robi666 says on May 22, 2008, 03:33:

bick... I'd take the bigger one, but we already talked about that...
Reasons:
Price per sqm.
Better location for renting it.
Even if I think the Campestre area is the best to live, it won't be easy to rent on short term basis.
I do not like Patio Bonito, it would be my last choice in El Poblado.
I prefer to buy older apartments, for many reason.
30 - 40 sqm is too small.

"I am a citizen of the most beautiful nation on earth. A nation whose laws are harsh yet simple, a nation that never cheats, which is immense and without borders, where life is lived in the present."

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huskie says on May 22, 2008, 03:41:

Bickerss says:

"There are however two or three I have found, who have professional people working for them..."

Would you mind sharing the information about this people? I am thinking of coming to Medellin soon. I am looking to buy either a house/finca or a good size flat. Thanks
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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robi666 says on May 22, 2008, 03:52:

huskie,
Mauricio Uribe of Uribienes is an hard working and honest agent.
I bought my properties with him. I trust him 100%.
I believe bickerss can testify it.

For fincas, the best you can do is to begin your research with Luis H Londono (http://www.luish.com/)

Large flats: you can still buy at something near to 1 million per sqm.

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huskie says on May 22, 2008, 03:58:

Thanks a lot robbi. In what area are you talking about ( 1mil per sqm)? I would like some thing in Llano Grande, Rionegro area, (oriente Antioqueno) but not too far from MDE.
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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robi666 says on May 22, 2008, 04:02:

Llanogrande is the best for a finca. Also... the most expensive.

You can still find large flats at near 1 million per sqm. in El Poblado. Older buildings, to renew.
A couple of example of properties I visited last month:
I saw a lovely house in San Lucas, being sold by an English guy. Something like 350 sqm built on a 400 sqm lot, asking price was 400 millions.
A penthouse on the Loma of Alejandria, not far from Lleras, 170 sqm, high ceilings, asking price was 185 millions.

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tomtom33 says on May 22, 2008, 04:03:

I bought an older, good-sized house in estrato 4 in January for a little over 830K per meter. The house had been completely remodeled and was in great shape. Of course this was not Poblado.

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huskie says on May 22, 2008, 04:08:

I was in Medellin in 2004 and almost bought a great flat (170 sqm) at a building near Viscaya mall, beautiful place and I even gave a down payment for it, but my husband was dead against it and told me not to do it, so the deal went down the tubes. (Got my deposit back) which was very nice of the agent to do that, the cost....US 60.000.00, well needless to say, that was the worst mistake I have ever done, to this date, I kick my ass for listening to my dear husband who now realizes the mistake also. I believe that place will now cost 3x as much.
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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jaramillo says on May 22, 2008, 05:36:

There is a bubble in real estate in el poblado. A 30 year bubble! LOL.

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bickerss says on May 22, 2008, 07:04:

Huskie - I second what Robbie said regarding the real estate agent. Mauricio is good value and one of the ones I use.

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gringoloid says on May 22, 2008, 07:33:

huskie............i third what Robbie and bikerss said about Mauricio. I just did business with this outfit and got a really good deal.

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tejasmarcos says on May 22, 2008, 07:37:

"Larry - I have had a good look around Sabeneta - not my cup of tea to live in but I can see the attraction for many people, and the possibility growth there"

Sabaneta will mirror Poblado in a few short years. Grupo Monarca will develop the entire area including possibly "El Foro".

trying to walk a straight line on sour mash and cheap wine...

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bickerss says on May 22, 2008, 07:44:

tejasmarcos - ur not the first person to tell me that - you guys might be onto something, ie a decent place to invest. Got to say the place rocks party wise on the week end and I think lost gringo told me the metro is getting extended out there.

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durito says on May 22, 2008, 07:53:

"Sabaneta will mirror Poblado in a few short years"

please no

the metro stop opens in 2010

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Mononoke28 says on May 22, 2008, 08:48:

If anyone is interested, the mother of a friend of mine has her own Agencia de Arrendamientos. They're very honest, patient and I highly recommend her and it's located on La 80. She also works with buyers and sellers:

Agencia Los Colores
Tel: 422-22-99
Medellín, Colombia

Diana

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slguy says on May 22, 2008, 08:48:

" A 30 year bubble! LOL"

this were EXACTLY my words about SW Florida a couple years ago - that would be just before two of my properties devalued for a combined $250,000

Before you throw me out, make sure I pay my bar tab

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jaramillo says on May 22, 2008, 09:12:

slguy, I might have to eat my hat in a few months, but I think the economics in Medellin will sustain the price increases. I'm no expert, though. But land in Medellin is limited, and the demographics are still pushing it.

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robi666 says on May 22, 2008, 09:13:

"this were EXACTLY my words about SW Florida a couple years ago - that would be just before two of my properties devalued for a combined $250,000"

Wow, that is worse than buying a sailboat...

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durito says on May 22, 2008, 09:25:

Medellin has a couple things going for it that weren't present in much of the US where prices are falling fast. As jaramillo said, the land is limited. Most new buildings in the city in the future are going to come from knocking down houses, there's little open land available. Outside the city is another story though.

The other is the boom is not being fueled by dirt cheap money. Mortgages are hard to come by and expensive.

Nevertheless, property is expensive here these days, and I'm really not sure where all the buyers will/are coming from. The average Colombian family certainly doesn't have $200,000 to buy a home.

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tomtom33 says on May 22, 2008, 13:38:

"The average Colombian family certainly doesn't have $200,000 to buy a home."

Certainly not. However, the average Colombian family is going to be buying in estrato 2 or 1. There are no $200K homes there. Actually the average Colombian family probably can't afford to buy anywhere.

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bickerss says on May 22, 2008, 15:40:

did a comparison to australia per sq metre for a similar size apartments in the best area of town - in Australia (Brisbane; not Sydney which is even more) it works out to 6000 dollars per sq metre. Comparing apples with oranges, but interesting difference in prices - wondr what it is in the states in a similar type area.

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huskie says on May 22, 2008, 16:06:

Great info guys thank you! How far is sabaneta from El Poblado? Can you drive in and out easily? How far from Rionegro? BTW I looked at http://www.luish.com and they have very nice fincas at good prices in and around the area we are most interested in, I think. Does Mauricio Uribe work with them or is he a different agent? I guess there is a website for uribienes? I will check it out. I like El Poblado, but it seems it is getting a bit crowded and perhaps a bit noisy with traffic and all..We want a bit more tranquil life style, but yet we (specially me) would like to be able to do city rounds from time to time ( almost all the time) and hubby likes to be home a lot.
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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robi666 says on May 22, 2008, 16:10:

You go from El Poblado, to Envigado, to Sabaneta in 15 minutes driving if there is not much traffic.

Rionegro is up in the mountains, 40 minutes away.

Mauricio works for Uribienes. He is mainly on Poblado and Envigado.

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huskie says on May 22, 2008, 16:28:

Thanks Robi. Is Sabaneta a nice area? Strato?
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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angelcanada says on May 23, 2008, 08:39:

Poblado is a very expensive place to live but a lot of peaple are geting aut of there because te trafic, no strets and to many cars, plus utilitis (Energy, water, telephone ect.) are very expensive. My sugestion, go try Envigado or Sabaneta, best areas as today market..I speak better than write....good luck

MY NAME IS ANGEL. I AM COLOMBIAN AND LIVED IN CANADA AND THE USA FOR 18 YEARS. I RETURNED TO MEDELLIN AND WOULD LIKE TO OFFER SERVICES AS INTERPRETER/ ESCORT AND DRIVER. I CAN ALSO HELP IN FINDING SHORT TERM APT. RENTALS.

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