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A los gringos les parece terrible

A los gringos les parece terrible que las mujeres solteras en Colombia vivan en la casa de sus padres. Esto no es sinonimo de ser una "spoiled brat" pero algunos sujetos creen que si. En Colombia somos amantes a la familia. Amamos a nuestra familia y queremos permanecer cerca de ella mientras sea posible. Porqué no?. No tenemos la misma fria cultura gringa en donde la familia poco importa y hasta a la madre se olvida... (hablando en forma general, porque seguramente no todos los gringos son tan frios en sus sentimientos familiares). En Colombia también las mujeres son economicamente independientes (depronto no desde tan jóvenes como en USA) y nos gusta compartir lo que ganamos y nuestro tiempo con quienes amamos.

By PALEOLITICO on Apr 2, 2008, 22:44 in Friendly Talkzone.

goin_south says on Apr 2, 2008, 23:07:

well.. that also, Paleolitico, is a Generality, of which you speak. Both.
the gringos who think badly, that you would still live with your parents (not me, certainly.)
and,.. that stuff about the 'family matters'... to Colombians and not to gringos... is a very wiiiiidddddeeee sweeping generality.

As so many things/issues discussed here on pbh.. every person/inidividual situation is different,.. not the country, necessarily.

I understand why you are asking, but.... PERHAPS YOU SHOULD ONLY be asking the individual that you have in mind, rather than the entire community, no?

why can't the freakin Chung King Chinese just LEAVE THE FREAKN DOLLY LLAMA and Tibet ... ALONE!

Rubito says on Apr 2, 2008, 23:11:

In North American cultures it IS considered a sign of immaturity if you are past college age (23-25) and still living at home.

I personally don't think people are necessarily immature, I wonder how they can STAND it. I guess that's why Bogota is full of those cheap hotels compared to North American cities :P

---Violence is the price of freedom.---

PALEOLITICO says on Apr 2, 2008, 23:13:

goin_south Tienes toda la razón. No mas pregunta, solo afirmación.

"Amar a la gente y usar las cosas y NO amar a las cosas y usar la gente" www.paleolitico.net

arthur brode says on Apr 2, 2008, 23:22:

No tenemos la misma fria cultura gringa en donde la familia poco importa y hasta a la madre se le olvida...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
i agree with that one.
since when were N.Americans known for their family values??

http://www.calirentals.net/

DodgerDogs says on Apr 2, 2008, 23:39:

arthur brode: what about , Father knows best. Donna Reed show. Mayberry. Happy Days. Brady Bunch. and many more.
Leave it to the Beaver to screw things up

Leave it to Beaver
They hang out in Medellin

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.Martin Luther King:

Buongone says on Apr 3, 2008, 00:19:

Aye me Buckle. Remember the Pee Wee Days?

poco says on Apr 3, 2008, 00:33:

I'd say living at home is an ecomonic necessity plus,, if you're single,, who will cook your food and wash your clothes.

"Violence is the first refuge of the incompetent" - Isaac Asimov

Robert Jorge says on Apr 3, 2008, 00:38:

Eddie Haskell, Beaver, and Wally. I saw that picture a few years ago and it was quite depressing. It just doesn't seem right that those guys are now that old. What a great show 'Leave it to Beaver' was though. Classic.

kat1 (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 01:42:

if you are working, study and you live with your parents and contributing towards a rent or help i don't see what's wrong? you can do your own washing, iron, cook, there not to wait to become independent to do it, that you will take advantage of the situation in another thing,

I think if house prices and oil keep going up in the UK people will have to go back to basis, family helping each other, even now many young people can't afford to live on their own so It seem stupid if they have to go and pay rent when they perfectly can stay at home while they work and save for the future and just help toward his/her up keeping.

My sister and her daughter still lives with my parents, and she is not planing to leave either, she helps at home with housework and her keepings and at the same time my parents who are retires help her with her kid, so she avoids paying childminder when the kids is on holidays or after school.
she said she might have to go to Bogotá if she gets a better job there but she said it is going to be hard with the kid, she already had a bad experience with a childminder when the baby was small and she was base in Bogotá, and she she will have to start paying a rent which it will take a lot of her wages.

which in my opinion if she gets a good job in Villavicencio and stay living with my parents who own a big house and only the two of them lives apart from my sister and kid , she will save a lot and maybe one day and afford an small house.

Medellin Traveler says on Apr 3, 2008, 03:20:

Rubito says, "In North American cultures it IS considered a sign of immaturity if you are past college age (23-25) and still living at home."

Really? That's news to me.

Lo que me da riza es como los gringos llegan a tu pais y te tratan de dicer como viver tu vida, haci son los gringos. Que te compre un apartamento en El Poblado, y luego te encuentras otro novio :O)

Medellin Es Una Chimba! - www.medellintraveler.com

poco says on Apr 3, 2008, 03:31:

Rubito says, "In North American cultures it IS considered a sign of immaturity if you are past college age (23-25) and still living at home."

Quote: Really? That's news to me.

Maybe he should have used the word whoosiefacation instead of immaturity?

"Violence is the first refuge of the incompetent" - Isaac Asimov

PALEOLITICO says on Apr 3, 2008, 05:01:

M.T. "Lo que me da risa es como los gringos llegan a tu pais y te tratan de decir como vivir tu vida, así son los gringos".

Completely in agreement with you. jijiji

"Amar a la gente y usar las cosas y NO amar a las cosas y usar la gente" www.paleolitico.net

Cerealkiller says on Apr 3, 2008, 05:10:

I don't see anything wrong in kids living with parents, as long as they're unmarried and childless. Also, I don't think moving out at 18 is a sign of lack of family values, at all. Antagonizing different ways of doing things is certainly taking the easy road, but often living with parents at 25 is not due to family values but lack of money or fear of facing the real world, just as moving out at 18 is often just because college is far from home...

Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives -John Stuart Mill

morphus says on Apr 3, 2008, 05:23:

If you are 25 or 26 years old and living with your parents, people will think there is something wrong with you. Especially if you are a guy. Women will think you are a loser. Living with roommates is more acceptable.

PALEOLITICO says on Apr 3, 2008, 05:26:

Cereal... Sabes cuál es el problema?. El problema no es que la gente abandone su casa cuando quiera. Cada uno es libre de decidir en donde quiere estar y por supuesto esto NO es un sintoma de falta de valores. Maravilloso si quieres y tienes los recursos economicos para ser independiente. El probelma es que algunas personas se crean con derecho de juzgar a otros por que han tomado la decisión de vivir cerca de su familia. Con qué derecho?

"Amar a la gente y usar las cosas y NO amar a las cosas y usar la gente" www.paleolitico.net

capt_j says on Apr 3, 2008, 05:36:

I don't think Americans think single women living with their parents is bad. I think in general it is appreciated as a cultural difference, to some extent good, to some extent not so good.

It's good to be close to your family, as long as you're not *too* close.

morphus says on Apr 3, 2008, 05:44:

Being close to family is'nt all that great. The truth is, most families don't get along. I know lots of Colombians that wish they can move away from their families because they don't get along.

manINred says on Apr 3, 2008, 05:55:

"The truth is, most families don't get along"

It's true! I know a family psychologist, he'll be the first to tell you that.

And yeah, in North America, well at least in Canada, it's not cool to live at home past 23. It is considered either odd, or, as Rubito puts, immature.

nine inch nails says on Apr 3, 2008, 06:13:

Even 50ish boomer children are now moving back in with their late 70s/early 80s parents due to the recent economic prolems.

"Bank owned" (www.foreclosurebyowner.com)

Cerealkiller says on Apr 3, 2008, 06:24:

Paleolitico, es definitivamente un problema cuando otros se creen con derecho a juzgar tu cultura y acciones. Sin embargo me parece que decir que la "cultura gringa en donde la familia poco importa y hasta a la madre se olvida" es un juicio sumamente negativo. Lo unico que digo es que hay que matizar, uno no puede ir por ahi generalizando y acusando a otros de hacer lo mismo que uno hace. Pero si tienes toda la razon, que un extranjero venga a tu casa a decir como tienes que hacer las cosas nunca es bien recibido.

Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives -John Stuart Mill

kat1 (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 06:31:

Nineinch, that was i said too, here in the UK many banks at the moment are not lending money for mortgages to new customer or newbies and They face having to find a much bigger deposit or if you are lucky and have great parents who can help you with at least a good deposit or paying half of the property, that mean that lots of young people won't be able to get into the property ladder so that mean staying longer at the parent's house while they save.

SiV says on Apr 3, 2008, 06:43:

Who was is that said all generalisations were bad?

An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind. Mahatma Gandhi

Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 06:55:

Sorry Paleo, but I find that "No tenemos la misma fria cultura gringa en donde la familia poco importa y hasta a la madre se olvida... (hablando en forma general, porque seguramente no todos los gringos son tan frios en sus sentimientos familiares)" kind of bigoted. I've heard it before, many times, it sounds wrong every time. I don't believe there is one culture (in this case Latin) that has a monopoly on FEELINGS. It's just a matter of expressing them in a different way.

Take for example...say, my daughter's husband and his family. (They are Swedes, very cold, very independent). The kids are EXPECTED to move out of their parent's home after they graduate fromhigh school. at 19, or latest intheir early 20's. It's fine to live with your parents for shorter intervals, even after that, at separations, divorces, unemployment, economic problems, but only temporarily. Everything else would be consideres lack of initiative, maturity, selfishness and ingeneral, very UN-cool.

So, he moved out at 19, got a job. Mother, Father, Grandma, Uncle and buddies helped him to move and carry the stuff. He lived alone until he met my beautiful daughter (lucky guy) and after that they became a couple it's been the extended family that gets together for everybody's birthdays, Christmas, Midsummer, Easter, Crawfish Party, Barbecue season, etc.etc. Living in a nice house and with a baby, they have a busy life of their own but family and kin drop by, call daily, help with baby-sitting, my son is his best friend and hangs out with his sister and her hubby almost every weekend. My daughter's mother-in-law is also one of my best friends, we take trips together, have lunch and dinner, have a couple of glasses together...this 'cold, uncaring' Swedish woman is as good as gold and I would trust my life in her hands. The caring, the trust, the deep commitment that family members feel for each other IS NOT expressed with so many words, so many gestures, so many hugs and kisses, but it's there, right under the surface, for those who can see it.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

bamacellist says on Apr 3, 2008, 07:17:

That's good SiV :)

In the three years I spent living in Caracas well over 100 north americans cycled through the orchestra and of course I knew countless expats in other spheres, but I never heard anyone say anything deeply condemning or condescending about this. It seems dubious that most Americans would bother having feelings about it much deeper than it isn't something they would be all that comfortable doing themselves.

In thinking about establishing a relationship, these cultural differences may raise issues that need to be addressed, but that's a whole different thing because it's about two individual people, not about cultures.

"The great thing about human language is that it prevents us from sticking to the matter at hand."

Albatross says on Apr 3, 2008, 07:22:

Desi, you're right on the mark, my mother is a first-generation American of 100% Swedish descent... if I hadn't moved out at 20 on my own, I've no doubt that at some point, I would have arrived home to find my stuff out on the porch and the locks changed.

I seemed to have inherited many of her Swedish traits... I've got an independent streak a mile long. So for me, I would rather live in the streets than move back in with my parents... I would actually feel less like a loser.

I think my Swedish ancestry is part of the reason I'm attracted to Latinas... they are in many respects, opposites.

But it is also true, that the same ancestry that may appear cold or uncaring on the surface often hides the potential for commitment that is virtually unshakable.

“Democracy - a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H.L. Mencken

tejasmarcos says on Apr 3, 2008, 07:34:

i was out of the house at 15, paid my own college and never had a maid.

god is in your head

mranderson says on Apr 3, 2008, 07:38:

inheritance?? lottery??

morphus says on Apr 3, 2008, 07:39:

Me too! I left home at 15 and was very happy to be alone. I became more disciplined.

kat1 (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 07:50:

If you want to move out that''s fine but i don't think needs to feel the pressure of by the age of 20 they have to be out, with a job and sorted, specially in this time where everything it's more difficult, i don't see the reason, you can be discipline, responsible while living with your parents, the problem is if you become a concha and live at their expenses.

Albatros said "I've got an independent streak a mile long. So for me, I would rather live in the streets than move back in with my parents... I would actually feel less like a loser."

that's the problem albatros are you doing just for pride? i wouldn't like my son to do that. he is not a loser to me the thing is it's not easy at there, of course if he become lazy, doesn't want to work or help at home then i will try to help him to sort himself out somewhere else and see if he gets responsible

My Sister example she has always live with my mother, she is not married by the way so no husband living there , and she always been in charge of the house as if was her own house , i think my parents have become too dependent on her. none of them do anything for her but they do help each other a lot, no rush for her to leave home.

tejasmarcos says on Apr 3, 2008, 07:54:

i learned how to counterfeit money at an early age....

god is in your head

mranderson says on Apr 3, 2008, 07:55:

Morphus got it right. If you're 25 or over and living at home try getting a date. Your mother might not think you're a loser but the women sure will.

kat1 (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:03:

mranderson, but if you rather stay in the street and not go home we will still think you are a loser, if you live in a little flat with just to enough to keep you going we still think you are a loser..... We women don't think you are a loser when either you have a good career or good job or plenty of dosh no matter if you are living with parents because we know you can leave at any time and get your own place

tejasmarcos says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:08:

kat1 - wish more like you lived in dallas.

god is in your head

Albatross says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:11:

So Kat you really think "if you live in a little flat with just to enough to keep you going we still think you are a loser" ?... that's like just about everybody. I mean, just about everybody these days is just getting by, they may live in a small flat or a $500,000 house in the 'burbs, but most of us don't have much left after all the bills are paid.

But I guess that's where we're different... I've got more respect for the guy living in a little flat than someone living at home, sponging off his parents at 30.

“Democracy - a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H.L. Mencken

morphus says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:14:

My friend bought a house for $700K. He's paying $4000 a month in mortgage and bills. He's barely getting by. I think its better to live in a a little flat and have a $100K in the bank.

robi666 says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:16:

"A los gringos les parece terrible que las mujeres solteras en Colombia vivan en la casa de sus padres."

A me parece que muchos de los gringos ayudan a las familias colombianas de sus "novias".
De pronto no se dan cuenta de hacerlo... pero lo hacen. Y mas pendejos, mas ayudan.

"I am a citizen of the most beautiful nation on earth. A nation whose laws are harsh yet simple, a nation that never cheats, which is immense and without borders, where life is lived in the present."

kat1 (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:18:

I don't mean you have to stay at home and sponge your parents, that will be a loser too me, you can stay at home and help as much as you can.

But in reality many women look for a man who can support them and her future children, it always been the strongest will win... i heard many women saying " no way have you seen where he lives? well if he hasn't has enough to support himself let alone me and a family" yep many lives like that it is not their fault but unfortunately in this materialistic world many NOT ALL i will try not to generalized will think you are a loser.

Or if the woman is very successful she will look for somebody similar to her, and if it happens to be a guy who still lives at home but he is financially independent who can afford a good place them she won't mind.

mranderson says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:21:

A very successful woman won't mind a financially independent man living at home?
Yea right.

tejasmarcos says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:21:

a man needs a maid. a woman needs, well...... everything else.

god is in your head

robi666 says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:22:

Sacred words.

kat1 (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:22:

robi666 that's another story, if you took a poor woman out of her family home, unfortunately you will expect to help her family a lot, to avoid that get a woman whose family is rich and they can help you :)))

Albatross says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:25:

If her family is rich what the hell would she want me for ?

“Democracy - a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H.L. Mencken

tejasmarcos says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:25:

women from well to do homes are spoiled and demanding.

nice setup kat! ever play volleyball?

god is in your head

robi666 says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:28:

Kat, I was referring to the ones who does not know or realize that they are helping... stereotyping is high in this thread.

You nailed it again, Marcus. Go on, you're on a roll.

kat1 (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:28:

yes albatros you will be useless heheheh

nah tejasmarcos, it hurts....

mranderson says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:29:

I dated a girl from a very well off family here in colombia and worst girlfriend I ever had. Worse then any american girlfriend too.

robi666 says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:31:

What do you mean, the worst in bed?

Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:32:

I guess this is where you and I can disagree a little, kat. It doesn't really matter if the guy is making money or able to support himself, the fact that he ISN'T speaks for itself. He may be helping with the bills, buying groceries etc....but I'm pretty sure a 28-year-old Colombian male living at home is getting his laundry done, his breakfast served and his toilet bowl scrubbed by someone else.

I may be a tad bigoted myself, but I don't think a 28-year-old unmarried girl living at home is quite as pathetic as a boy of the same age. Girls also participate in household chores more than boys, in the Colombian families that I know, anyway.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

kat1 (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:33:

Ok forget a rich girl but a girl who has been in college, uni studying something whose family are middle class or should i say working class, whose parents, brothers, sisters has good jobs.

look at the background of the girl before the boobs :))))))

PALEOLITICO says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:34:

Robbi: "A me parece que muchos de los gringos ayudan a las familias colombianas de sus "novias".
De pronto no se dan cuenta de hacerlo... pero lo hacen. Y mas pendejos, mas ayudan.

Es verdad, algunos han tenido malas experiencias con esto y después comienzan a desquitarse con quienes no tienen la culpa y nada tuvieron que ver con sus MALAS EXPERIENCIAS PASADAS.

"Amar a la gente y usar las cosas y NO amar a las cosas y usar la gente" www.paleolitico.net

Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:35:

Another thing...this is soooo cold and heartless: a Swedish young man or woman, living at home after the age of 19....is often given a bill specifying his/her monthly costs that he/she is expected to contribute punctually: Rent, electricity, food, tv-license, Internet, telephone etc.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

tejasmarcos says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:36:

desi - some colombian families have maids that do all those things.

god is in your head

kat1 (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:37:

well desi, yeah I agree unfortunately in Colombia many are like that, but here in the UK i Have seen guys living with their parents but their parents won't put up with doing everything for them, I know some pay them rent, money towards food and other things. and that is what I mean, as long as you don't become a leach, it is alright to live with your parents while you save and can get your own place.

robi666 says on Apr 3, 2008, 08:37:

Paleo, I told you, stereotyping is high on this thread. From the very beginning.
I just help to show it with my nonsense.
So...
"Es verdad, algunos han tenido malas experiencias"
Porque algunos? Los gringos son los gringos, no "algunos" gringos.

tejasmarcos says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:06:

reminds me of a story. when i was 7 or 8, my parents decided it was time for me to learn to swim. well, they took me to a man in town who was almost famous for teaching kids to swim. his name was mr. lewis and he was a real sob. i show up for "lessons" on the first day and he lines up the 5-6 new kids at the deep end and the rest goes something like this;

1) he gets behind the kid and asks the kid "why are you scared"?

* by that time we are all almost crying anyways.

2) he waits for the response which is normally "sniff, sniff, becuz".

3) then he says, "well, if you think that is scary, try drowning"! and commences to push the kid in the pool. he then proceeds to the next child and repeats the excercise.

* meanwhile the child is floundering in the water and manages to find the edge of the pool, normally screaming and crying.

suffice it to say, i learned how to swim in 1 day - que milagro! i of course perfected my techniques over the next 2-3 months.

* every time a child was scared, mr. lewis took the child to the deep end and basically pushed the kid into the pool. harsh, but very, very effective.

god is in your head

Simon says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:13:

"If you are 25 or 26 years old and living with your parents, people will think there is something wrong with you. Especially if you are a guy. Women will think you are a loser. Living with roommates is more acceptable."

"But I guess that's where we're different... I've got more respect for the guy living in a little flat than someone living at home, sponging off his parents at 30."

That's your anglo mentality, but not our latin one! Don't try to impose your shitty family values on us!

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:15:

Tejas, we used to have a couple of maids too plus a nanny. I had re-programme my kids after we moved away from Colombia and I BECAME THE MAID.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

tejasmarcos says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:17:

big diff between shitty family values and fierce independence, self reliance, confidence, drive and determination.

- kinda like your moniker simon.

- desi, i am the maid too. it is not mandatory, but i kinda like doing some things for myself.

god is in your head

kat1 (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:21:

tejas i know where are you going with your swimming story, but some need a little guidance or push, that why the teacher is the for. ... otherwise we wouldn't have need him in the first pace and we'll just pray make a cross, crossed our fingers and jump.....:))))))

Simon says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:22:

I don't see those 'qualities' as being mutually exclusive with someone who lives with their family.

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

kat1 (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:24:

Desi, when i was living at home we had a maid too ahhhh those little luxuries are gone now...

even now my mum got rid off the maid, she had enough, many of them are "desagradecidas" so her and my sister only call them when they need ironing and washing, the housework theydo it themselves :))

tejasmarcos says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:24:

precisely my point simon, or were you trying to say the opposite?

god is in your head

dwr says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:26:

I love my parents and we are very close. However, having to move back home with my parents is a nightmare that gives me the cold sweats once every couple of months.

kat1 (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:28:

well this is different dwr, if your parents are a nightmare then move out... hehehe

Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:30:

Oh, I loved having a maid, there's nothing better than getting up in the morning when breakfast is already served and the house mopped and the sidewalk swept. Downside: I never learned how to make them damn buñuelos.....

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

morphus says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:31:

Thats why I don't want children. Its a waste of time unless you own a farm and need extra workers. Why waste your best years and money if you don't want the children around as adults? Thats the problem. Most people just want to see what comes out of there. They don't realize that the children will grow to be adults. They will have to work, suffer and die. They did'nt ask to be born. Its all a waste.

kat1 (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:36:

Desi, me too!!!! i don't care about learning to do buñuelos the maid can do it for me hehe

Morphus, i kind of agree with you, but you do help them and hope that one day they will be able to look after themselves because you are not going to be around all the time, I want my kids to learn to survive without me, I will help them, i will as far as i can and if i see they aren't doing anything and just sponging me after i gave them education and skills i have to start doing something for their own good. like maybe helping him to get a place and find a job

dwr says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:36:

I haven't lived with my parents in 24 year Kat. I did move out. And you misread my post.

bamacellist says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:37:

Wasn't the question about how American men feel about Colombian women living with their parents, not about how American men (or women) feel about American men doing the same? So, does it make you leery of their intentions towards you? Make you doubt their sincerity because it seems to you they are possibly looking for a ticket out? Maybe it scares you because you think they might want to bring their entire family with them to the States and you'll have to support them as they settle (or longer, gasp!)? Maybe it makes you nervous your prospective new mother-in-law is going to be far too intrusive a presence in your household?

You all realize their are other, more pernicious, cultural issues which discourage many Latin women from leaving the safety and support of the family nest or cause them trouble when they do, don't you?

"The great thing about human language is that it prevents us from sticking to the matter at hand."

dwr says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:39:

And I do agree that the Colombian family is much closer in general than the gringo family. I also think it is a better thing to be close to the family. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZkYdFRRbpuY
By the way, what this video. I thought it was good.

kat1 (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:40:

I did dwr, I just saying In general "if your parents are a nightmare move out"

Colombiche says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:41:

Sometimes parents who didn't fare too well in life become somewhat dependent on their successful offspring, it happens in colombian families in Colombia and it happens to immigrants families in North America. It doesn't mean that the son/daughter can't leave home, but when you leave not only do you have to pay your own expenses, but your lifestyle is cramped because you also have to look out for los viejos on the side, no self respecting colombian would ever let their parents go needy.... I have friends who have an empty fridge at the end of the month because they are giving mom and dad money...... sometimes the kids opt for staying at home, WTF, why pay two rents and eat crappy..... didn't you ever hear that vallenato Los Caminos de La Vida..... we always end up working to help mom and dad, the old aunts back home... the nurse for abuelita, the poor cousin who can't pay her english classes......... la vida del hp inmigrante.

No me den trago extranjero, que es caro y no sabe a bueno.... (Rafael Godoy)

dwr says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:44:

ahhh. agreed Kat. watch that video.

Swinn88 says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:52:

I agree with Goin South. The original post is a huge sweeping generalization. I have heard it before but I still dont understand why people, many of them here at PBH think that Hispanoparlantes have a manopoly on feelings for ones family or family tightness as I like to say. It is simply not True. There many horror stories in the latin community with regard to family bonds. I know of many of them personally. The statement

"Lo que me da riza es como los gringos llegan a tu pais y te tratan de dicer como viver tu vida, haci son los gringos. Que te compre un apartamento en El Poblado, y luego te encuentras otro novio :O)"

Is also a grand generalization. I don't really think ( I could be wrong) that any of us know people that actually do this. and anyone that makes the statement that "Asi son los gringos" doesn't really know anything outside of the community that they are in. The so called Gringos that you mention are you, latino americans, Italian americans, Irish americans, and more that would say that they are close to their loved ones, and that Americans are generally family oriented. My friends certainly are. I'm sure most of your friends are. Yes there are some that are not but that is the same in Colombia. You have all heard of brothers killing each other or cousins etc. in colombia. Many could use that as an argument of being not very family orientated. Many kids in the U.S. live with their Parents and it is not a problem. Many don't. But it has nothing to do with how close you are to your family.

I'll be back.

tejasmarcos says on Apr 3, 2008, 09:54:

well put, swinn.

in short,

the problem with well to do kids is the sense of entitlement.

the problem with bums is laziness, another form of entitlement.

god is in your head

El Polo says on Apr 3, 2008, 10:01:

My uncle who has about 5 years here in the US currently lives with my mother (his sister) both are 55 and 48. My older cousin living in Colombia is currently employed living with unemployed parents. I think being a sponger and an active participant in a household are 2 completely different things I currently live with a roommate not too far from my mothers house, and yes I eat at my mothers when I dont feel like cooking and I do take food to work but I do help out whenever needed. Just my 2 cents

PALEOLITICO says on Apr 3, 2008, 10:04:

Swinn88: Vuelvo y repito: No es que yo piense que la frialdad hacia la familia es un asunto de todos los gringos. Porsupuesto que no!!. Lo que me molesta es escuchar sus frases autosuficientes y arrogantes diciendo que si tu vives aún con tus padres en edad madura, tu eres una "spoiled brat",. Es eso lo que me parece TERRIBLE! . Cómo puede alguien atraverse a decir algo así sin conocer las razones por las que esa persona aún vive con su familia o sin saber como es realmente su relacion con ellos?.

Y si tienes mucha razón: el vivir o no con la familia nada tiene que ver con la proximidad que se tiene con la misma. Cierto.

"Amar a la gente y usar las cosas y NO amar a las cosas y usar la gente" www.paleolitico.net

PALEOLITICO says on Apr 3, 2008, 10:07:

Asegurar que hundir a un niño en una piscina para que aprenda a nadar es el mejor método, me parece una brutalidad y un absoluto error. Puede que funcione con algunos chicos, pero les aseguro que muchos podrian sentir despues de esto una absoluta fobia hacia el agua y no querran volver a saber nada acerca de aprender a nadar. No todos los métodos funcionan de igual manera en las personas. ESO LO DEBERIA CONOCER MUY BIEN UNA PERSONA QUE ESTUDIÓ PSICOLOGIA. Deberían de investigar cuantos de los alumnos del profesor que utilizaba ese método quedaron traumatizados con el agua.

"Amar a la gente y usar las cosas y NO amar a las cosas y usar la gente" www.paleolitico.net

miamimike says on Apr 3, 2008, 10:23:

morphus says on Thursday April 3rd, 2008 5:23:

If you are 25 or 26 years old and living with your parents, people will think there is something wrong with you. Especially if you are a guy. Women will think you are a loser. Living with roommates is more acceptable.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Morphus Spot On! It has to do with Independence AND CUTTING MAMA'S UMBELICAL CORD and finding your way in the world. In the Animal Kingdom, the mama pushes the offspring out of the nest into the world so they can get strong and survive. I saw in my family what happens when the Son/daughter, Son esp stays at home 'til he is 40 or better and marries. Disaster. Every other word is "Mama did it this way" bla bla bla. I think with all the cultural diffences between Latinas and North Americans(northern europeans ect) areas being discussed in this post is why the Divorce rate is so high and why many of these cross cultural marriages have little chance for success and why most fail or will fail. The Cultural Chasm is too great to overcome,,,

morphus says on Thursday April 3rd, 2008 9:31:

Thats why I don't want children. Its a waste of time unless you own a farm and need extra workers. Why waste your best years and money if you don't want the children around as adults? Thats the problem. Most people just want to see what comes out of there. They don't realize that the children will grow to be adults. They will have to work, suffer and die. They did'nt ask to be born. Its all a waste
==========================================================

Agree with here also Morphus! Also, In many cases, marriages fail due to the pressure, both emotional and financial the Kids(esp a bad one(s), put on the mother and father. Its obvious with the high rate of juvenile delinquency and child abuse here in the USA that many Parents were never meant to have children nor should they be allowed to even have them.

Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we. They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we." GW Bush

tejasmarcos says on Apr 3, 2008, 10:24:

it's called the school of hard knocks. harsh, but effective. here's another story for you. there is a well known world billionaire that owns a little company called virgin. maybe some of you have heard of him. when he was 5 years old, his mother (a good mom, not abusive in any way), dropped him off 5 miles from their home and said "now, it is up to you to find your way home". suffice it to say, sir richard did indeed find his way home, but it is those "other things" he found that are more important.

now, in this day and age, you cannot do the things that my two stories above described. in fact, you would be taken to jail for both. it just goes to show that coddling and babying can handicap an individual, even when it is done with loving care by one's own family.

by the way, the definition for "spoiled brat" in the usa is when someone of low level maturity (a child most of the time, but not always) has to get what they want or has to always get their way. the kicker is that even when the child gets what they want, they are still not happy and insist on having more, more, more.....

have you "found your way home" yet?

god is in your head

bamacellist says on Apr 3, 2008, 10:27:

Y'all are so busy being defensive about the attack on gringo family values - and by extension yourselves - that you are almost entirely ignoring the frustration that Paleo has expressed and which caused her to lash out. Is it really that hard to understand her real question? Is it that hard to address? Are you really so offended by her broadside on American values? Imagine then her frustration as an individual being dismissed by what she perceives as cultural prejudices. How do YOU feel about adult COLOMBIAN WOMEN who live with their parents. Can you understand the variety of reasons they might do this and accept them and respect them despite this is not so common amongst north americans???

"The great thing about human language is that it prevents us from sticking to the matter at hand."

PALEOLITICO says on Apr 3, 2008, 10:33:

...

"Amar a la gente y usar las cosas y NO amar a las cosas y usar la gente" www.paleolitico.net

miamimike says on Apr 3, 2008, 10:38:

Desi Says-----"Take for example...say, my daughter's husband and his family. (They are Swedes, very cold, very independent). The kids are EXPECTED to move out of their parent's home after they graduate fromhigh school. at 19, or latest intheir early 20's. It's fine to live with your parents for shorter intervals, even after that, at separations, divorces, unemployment, economic problems, but only temporarily. Everything else would be consideres lack of initiative, maturity, selfishness and ingeneral, very UN-cool."

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

My Thoughts exactly, couldn't have expressed it any better myself! At 18 I shipped out to the Military for Active Duty and the Umbilical Cord was snipped and for the better. Actually it was snipped long before 18 as I was working on the street from age 11. So was my Sis! What some here perceive in our culture as Cold(north american/european culture) is what we in the culture see as Northern Practicality.

Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we. They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we." GW Bush

Simon says on Apr 3, 2008, 10:41:

I think it's despicable to kick your kids out at any age and believe they can stay as long as they contribute and are well-behaved.

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

tejasmarcos says on Apr 3, 2008, 10:45:

simon - you seem to equate the initiation of independence as one of punishment. the real punishment and cruelty comes from coddling. kinda like when parents keep giving their fat little kids sweets because it would upset the child not to have candy and sweets.

cut the cord, stop bitchin, grow up and get on with it.

everything in this life must be earned. if it is given, then it will ultimately be taken back - me

god is in your head

Simon says on Apr 3, 2008, 10:49:

I don't see it as punishment and I don't see anything wrong with people who like to move out early, although I do believe parents who 'kick' their kids out at 18 must be pretty cold-hearted. What I do have a problem with is those who support moving out early imposing their mentality on those who chose to live with their families.

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

PALEOLITICO says on Apr 3, 2008, 10:49:

"by the way, the definition for "spoiled brat" in the usa is when someone of low level maturity (a child most of the time, but not always) has to get what they want or has to always get their way. the kicker is that even when the child gets what they want, they are still not happy and insist on having more, more, more....."

Pregunto: según su definición, cuál es la relación entre "spoiled brat" y que una persona viva con su familia? . Encuentra usted alguna relación entre estas dos cosas?

"Amar a la gente y usar las cosas y NO amar a las cosas y usar la gente" www.paleolitico.net

Simon says on Apr 3, 2008, 10:52:

Muy bueno punto, Paleo.

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

tejasmarcos says on Apr 3, 2008, 10:54:

"they are still not happy and insist on having more, more, more....."

- quieres mas para me?

you guys are confusing social customs with socioeconomic customs. if i had to explain it, you wouldn't understand it. if you understood it, you would not accept it.

the first law of the social sciences is that correlation does not infer causation. think about that for a while as it is something i ofter refer back to in all facets of life.

god is in your head

jorgegdiaz says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:03:

I think it has to do with one`s wallet.

Come on Simon, Paleo et al. don`t you think an 18 y/o, ANYWHERE in the world, would like to live in their own? Think about it. No parents, no rules, own space, can invite friends over, no motels, just to name a few.

Man with hole in pocket feel cocky all day.

bamacellist says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:04:

... speaking sign language in the dark...

"The great thing about human language is that it prevents us from sticking to the matter at hand."

Simon says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:06:

No Jorge, when I was 18, I definitely was not prepared to live on my own yet. And just the thought of coming home from work to an empty home, without anyone to talk to and without a nice, warm meal waiting for me was depressing enough.

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:10:

Simon, what makes you think we have to kick out our children? Every time I try to suggest to my single son that perhaps he should move back home to save money, he makes a face, and says, "Yes, mum, I'm good boy, your little Norman". The kids here can't WAIT to turn 18 and become emancipated. It's part of growing up, a ritual of adulthood. The girls start getting their stuff together when still living at home, cookware, linens, household appliances etc, at Christmas they want a cutlery set, a set of nice dishes...It'll all about becoming a responsible and respected adult, not being a dependent child any longer.

In most cases, the relationship with the parents after moving away continues to be close, perhaps even improved when parents and children meet each other now on more equal terms. I have NEVER been closer to my kids than now when they are young adults, living their own lives of which I'm very much part

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

Albatross says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:11:

Robocop wouldn't have been depressed.

“Democracy - a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H.L. Mencken

muchacho_escondido says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:11:

I think this is not just about culture but also about economy. Probably *mostly* about economy.

Let's face it-- living alone in a half-decent place costs money. Even in North America it is not easy for a young adult to cough up $800-$1300 a month (depending on the city) for a small apartment in a safe neighborhood.

Whereas in Colombia that doesn't have an economy nearly as strong as the US or Canada, that should be extremely challenging. GDP of Colombia per capita is what, like a 10th of that in the US? Even if rents are a third of those in the US, that still makes them 3 times as difficult to pay, relatively speaking.

I strongly suspect that living with parents is not because of profound family values but because there isn't any viable alternative. I also believe that as soon as economy improves, family values erode. Family values exist as a survival mechanism. If people can survive alone, they will because desire for freedom is universal. Give me *one* economically developed country that's known for strong families and I'll admit that I'm wrong.

kat1 (Moderator) says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:12:

I wanted to be independent but my parents wouldn't moved out of the house jijij:))))))

Albatross says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:13:

“Democracy - a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H.L. Mencken

Simon says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:18:

"Give me *one* economically developed country that's known for strong families and I'll admit that I'm wrong."

Italy

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

robi666 says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:20:

"Thats why I don't want children. Its a waste of time unless you own a farm and need extra workers. Why waste your best years and money if you don't want the children around as adults? Thats the problem. Most people just want to see what comes out of there. They don't realize that the children will grow to be adults. They will have to work, suffer and die. They did'nt ask to be born. Its all a waste"

Morphie, if your life is miserable that doesn't mean ours are too.

"I don't see it as punishment and I don't see anything wrong with people who like to move out early, although I do believe parents who 'kick' their kids out at 18 must be pretty cold-hearted. What I do have a problem with is those who support moving out early imposing their mentality on those who chose to live with their families."

Spot on, Simon.

Albatross says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:21:

Italy has the second lowest birthrate in the world... not a good indication of strong families.

“Democracy - a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H.L. Mencken

Swinn88 says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:21:

Paleo, I understand what you are saying. I just saw the Post turning into the usual here at PBH.

Mononoke28 says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:23:

Going back to what the OP said, I think a lot of Colombians still live at home is because it's easy and cheap. Free food, free rent, free maid since their mothers and sisters are the ones who keep the house clean and cook for them. So why get your own apartment and spend your money on stuff you get for free at home? I don't agree with it personally, but I think that's the biggest reason why "children" still live at home. Not necessarily because they're so in love with their families they can't seem to know when to cut the cord.

Diana

PALEOLITICO says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:24:

Jorgegdiaz: "I think it has to do with one`s wallet"

En muchos casos el asunto es de dinero si. Porque acá en Colombia las posibilidades economicas que tienen las personas de ser independientes, están MUY lejos de ser iguales a las de USA (entiendan eso!!!!!!!!!!). Pero en muchos otros casos es cuestión de querer vivir con los padres hasta cierto tiempo. Sobretodo en el caso de las mujeres que desean hacerlo hasta casarse. Creo que con los hombres la cosas funciona diferente y mas aún si son jóvenes: "No parents, no rules, own space, can invite friends over, no motels, just to name a few.". Es lo que cualquier muchachito desea.

"Amar a la gente y usar las cosas y NO amar a las cosas y usar la gente" www.paleolitico.net

tejasmarcos says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:45:

"the first law of the social sciences is that correlation does not infer causation. think about that for a while as it is something i often refer back to in all facets of life"

I strongly suspect that living with parents is not because of profound family values but because there isn't any viable alternative. I also believe that as soon as economy improves, family values erode. Family values exist as a survival mechanism. If people can survive alone, they will because desire for freedom is universal.

ding! ding! ding! we have a winner folks! tell them what they won johnny!

god is in your head

robi666 says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:46:

"Italy has the second lowest birthrate in the world... not a good indication of strong families."

Yes, it is getting a problem in Italy. Less latin and more gringo everyday.
True values are forgotten. Work and money is the aim of life.

I went out of it, some years ago.

"I am a citizen of the most beautiful nation on earth. A nation whose laws are harsh yet simple, a nation that never cheats, which is immense and without borders, where life is lived in the present. In this limitless nation, this nation of wind, light, and peace, there is no other ruler besides the sea."
Bernard Moitessier

miamimike says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:48:

Simon says on Thursday April 3rd, 2008 11:06:

No Jorge, when I was 18, I definitely was not prepared to live on my own yet
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Simon, with an Attitude like that what would become of you if you had to go off and serve the Military for your Country?? You would be in a world of trouble&hurt! Many of Americans did just that, many of us received our Draft Notices and had no Choice but to go! Had we told our Draft Board "Mama wasn't ready to cut us loose yet" just wouldn't cut it and we would have boarded the Draft Bus at 6am or our Government would have dealt with us in a way not too pleasant. BTW, WW2 was won by many of these 18 year old draftees who also thought they weren't ready to go but to their amazement, found out they were up to the challenge,,,

Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we. They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we." GW Bush

Simon says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:53:

MiamiMike,

Leaving for the military at age 18 to defend my country I would have no problem with at all. But leaving home at that age to go live in some tiny dormroom, eat shitty food, and live with some freaking strangers who probably have vices (i.e drug--use) is not something that appealed to me personally at that age.

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

tejasmarcos says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:55:

what a diatribe. what did we learn from this rant? northamericans are cold and independent? colombians are less economically fortunate and have better family values? women never stop wanting? men never stop giving/taking? people are judged by their domicile? coddling is good? coddling is bad? war is hell? we all want to live in italy with our parents?

god is in your head

muchacho_escondido says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:55:

Italy?

First, someome mentioned the abysmal birthrate-- good point. Can't have much of a family without them kids, can ya?

Second, Italy is very unevenly developed-- South is and has always been in a mediocre shape, where as North isn't much different from France, Germany etc. At the same time, this idea of strong Italian families seems to come precisely from the Italian South. Godfather movies are probably the single biggest contribution to the perception about Italian family values. Of course, that's a movie about Sicilians.

I still think that wealth and family strength don't get along, generally. The lack of the former makes the latter necessary.

tejasmarcos says on Apr 3, 2008, 11:56:

"But leaving home at that age to go live in some tiny dormroom, eat shitty food, and live with some freaking strangers who probably have vices (i.e drug--use) is not something that appealed to me personally at that age"

- weren't you the dude that had the mansion in cali for a while?

god is in your head

Simon says on Apr 3, 2008, 12:00:

No, I stayed with my family in Cali.

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

Rubito says on Apr 3, 2008, 12:05:

I just feel sorry for anybody over 20 who has to live with their parents. I was gone when I was 18. Even being stone-ass poor, there's nothing like the feeling of being able to keep your own schedule, fuck who you want, dress how you want etc. and not answer to anybody for it! I can't imagine your average Colombian not wanting the same thing either!!

---Violence is the price of freedom.---

robi666 says on Apr 3, 2008, 12:08:

That's maybe why you're a pervert Rubito.

If one day i see my child having

www.internationalsexguide.info SENIOR MEMBER
ww.kinkythai.com I DARE YOU TO GO THERE

in his profile on an internet board I will kick his ass hard, 18 or more.

bamacellist says on Apr 3, 2008, 12:13:

The extended family has been the norm for most of history. Industrialization, general prosperity, the expansion of the world, advances in communication and increasing ease of mobility have all played a part in changing this to some extent almost everywhere. However, not every place has adopted leaving home as an urgent goal or measure of personal success or worth in the same way. Living with one's parents is not therefore in some modern cultures something that attracts condemnation.

Paleo's question remains largely ignored, which is: Can we only see this negatively or are we willing to accept that it is something which causes no great anxiety here? Does the idea that an adult woman may live with her parents so offend our own cultural sensibilities that we cannot respect them as individuals with other qualities?

"The great thing about human language is that it prevents us from sticking to the matter at hand."

Rubito says on Apr 3, 2008, 12:15:

Oh you aint fooling anyone, PORCO DIO! I know you went there and had a field day, probably used a whole box of tissues! :P

See thats what I'm talking about, what if you're living in some place with paper thin walls with abuelita on the other side of them. and you cant even properly masturbate, much less bring somebody over for fun! And if (or WHEN) you visit the hotel, there's this GAP in your schedule and everybody knows what went down. Not cool.

Or even worse, you could have happen to you what happened in "Paraiso Travel" in that girl's crowded-ass house in Jackson Heights :P

---Violence is the price of freedom.---

robi666 says on Apr 3, 2008, 12:16:

Paleo's question contains a lot of mistakes.
I know a lot of intelligent gringos that "no le parece terribile".

jonas says on Apr 3, 2008, 12:16:

In Italy there has been a discussion in the media about how many guys in their 30s still live with their mamas these days, which are increasing numbers. They do it for comfort because nobody cooks like mama, does the laundry and cleaning. And they have more money to spend on their mobile phones and cars and party.
Now you say that it is because you (Colombians) maintain a much better relationship with your parents. Somewhat true, most gringos don´t get along too well with their parents, too many discrepancies between the different generations I guess. But my question to you is: Why is it that when Colombianas talk to their moms the most frequent expression is "Si Señora"???? There seems to be a lot more authority from the parents side than in a gringo family, even when you are grown up. I am not saying that this is necessarily bad. But maybe this "distance" keeping also enables you to spend more time living with the family. By the way, in Europe a few generations back it was very common for 3 generations to live under one roof. But while in gringo societies this might be a new trend again, I am sure in Colombia you will first see a trend going towards living on your own at earlier stages in your life.

What I have, I do not want to lose, but Where I am I do not want to stay, but those I love, I do not want to leave, but those I know I no longer want to see, but Where I die, I do not want to go;I want to stay where I have never been

Simon says on Apr 3, 2008, 12:16:

Hey Rubito, that was funny in 'Paraiso Travel' when they got it on with 'abuelita' right there, hehe.

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

DodgerDogs says on Apr 3, 2008, 12:17:

Rob: If you raise your kids right, then they will usally not stray. Those that visit ISG should have their IPS tracked, and then others could track them down. The only places in Colombia that accepts
hippies is Taganga and Bogota , and both those places smell bad.

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.Martin Luther King:

jonas says on Apr 3, 2008, 12:19:

Now I´ve got it! It is because of a lack of hourly motels/residencias in gringolandia ;-)

PALEOLITICO says on Apr 3, 2008, 12:29:

"spoiled brat" in the usa is when someone of low level maturity (a child most of the time, but not always) has to get what they want or has to always get their way. the kicker is that even when the child gets what they want, they are still not happy and insist on having more, more, more.....

Me pregunto.. alguno acá en este foro está completamente satisfecho con TODOS los aspectos en su vida?. No hay algo en lo que quieran un poco mas?. No hay algo mas que deseen obtener?

Le pregunto al que dió esta definición: ¿quiere usted algo mas y mas en algun aspecto de su vida? si su respuesta es "si", entonces es usted un "spoiled brat", segun sus propias palabras, claro.

Muchos podrian decir: "basta, lo que tienes es suficiente. Querer mas es malcriado". Pero seguirá queriendo mas y buscando la manera de conseguirlo así hiera a algunos en el proceso.

O por ejemplo, si alguien desea un poco mas de disciplina o de orden en una tarea que desea terminar y trata de conseguirlo presionando un poco entonces eso podría llamarse "spoiled brat" ??.

Creo que todos tenemos algun nivel de inmadurez, que se manifiesta en los adultos de una manera diferente que en los niños.

"Amar a la gente y usar las cosas y NO amar a las cosas y usar la gente" www.paleolitico.net

robi666 says on Apr 3, 2008, 12:32:

DD, but I already see the change coming...
Just wait that Colombia gets better and Colombianos make enough money to stop licking gringo's ass and we'll see some good.

bamacellist says on Apr 3, 2008, 12:39:

robi, So do I, but it seems she has met at least one too many to whom it does.

We have in one hand an apple and the other an orange. It seems some people are only capable of comparing them and saying which they prefer. Someone wants to know if you put them both in one bowl would it be a salad you could eat.

"The great thing about human language is that it prevents us from sticking to the matter at hand."

DodgerDogs says on Apr 3, 2008, 12:44:

Rob: Thats why I do not talk with gente in Cartagena, as I know what I saw there( en La Dolce Vida and in the apartment ) , and know what happened with mi prima 16 anos edad. ..

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.Martin Luther King:

Mononoke28 says on Apr 3, 2008, 13:15:

PALEOLITICO says on Thursday April 3rd, 2008 12:29:
Creo que todos tenemos algun nivel de inmadurez, que se manifiesta en los adultos de una manera diferente que en los niños.

PBH is full of them. =D

Diana

Medellin Traveler says on Apr 3, 2008, 14:00:

mranderson says, "Morphus got it right. If you're 25 or over and living at home try getting a date. Your mother might not think you're a loser but the women sure will."

I disagree with you both. I'm 38 and guarantee I can go out and meet women if I moved back with my parents. It's who you are and how you carry yourself that is more important than where you live. I go out to bars and have women buy me drinks.

I don't remember how old I was when I moved out, but between 12 - 20 I was having too much fun that I would never have considered moving out on my own to pay bills, clean house, and worry about paying the rent. Puh-leeze, I couldn't be bothered with that chit.

Everyday was a holiday for me back in the day, the good o' days.

Medellin Es Una Chimba! - www.medellintraveler.com

Lisa Zee says on Apr 3, 2008, 14:01:

I am Colombian, living in USA, and I want my son living with me; he works and pay his way. (most of it)
ALL his friend (Americans) moved out after they turned 18, they went to school and work.
Well, now most of them had to drop school because living around here is so expensive, their parents don`t want them back in the house, and the kids are struggling to make a living in circumstances that are very sad.

I would never do that to my son, he could be 40, and he still can live with me if he wants.

robi666 says on Apr 3, 2008, 14:11:

Well said Lisa.

Simon says on Apr 3, 2008, 14:11:

That's so sweet and humane, Lisa!

Med Traveller...I think I finally agree with you on something, kudos!

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

Lisa Zee says on Apr 3, 2008, 14:28:

One of my son`s friend, their parents are selling a house in Palos Verdes States, a house worth 3 million dollars!, the father Gringo, ask his son to move out repedidly, because "the house did not look good" (when the realtor shows the house) with him living in it???!!!
The poor guy ended living for free with a `maricon', in exchange for massages??!!. (he did that for like 3 months only) this is just one example, I have many!.

Mononoke28 says on Apr 3, 2008, 14:38:

I'm all for people wanting to live at home because they want to and share ½ of the responsibilities. But in all honesty, I've seen a ton of men and women, this includes cousins of mine in Colombia, who just refuse to work and don't even help to dust and mop every now and then. That's just wrong.

I also like having my family living with me. My mom has her own room in my house here in the States when she's here and knows that it's her house just the same. My friends don't get it and I don't care really.

Diana

Simon says on Apr 3, 2008, 14:40:

"My friends don't get it and I don't care really."

Qué le pasa a esta gente? Será que no tienen madre?

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

Mononoke28 says on Apr 3, 2008, 14:42:

Dude, a lot of them are not from Colorado and they hate, absolutely hate calling their parents even on holidays. I don't get that crap.

Diana

mranderson says on Apr 3, 2008, 14:45:

Medellin traveler I don't doubt you can pick up women if you moved back home. But what about a relationship? What happens when you date a woman a few times and then bring her back to your house where your mother is sitting in the living room watching tv? Then you have to explain to the girl why your living at home and what do you think she is thinking as your explaining this? Especially at 38. Come on.

Aaron21 says on Apr 3, 2008, 14:50:

Mr. A, it seems to me that MT just takes a position opposite to someone in the thread, no matter how illogical, and argues it until he grows tired. I have reduced my perusal of his posts to a scan.

Simon says on Apr 3, 2008, 14:58:

" Then you have to explain to the girl why your living at home and what do you think she is thinking as your explaining this? Especially at 38. Come on."

Once again, it's a cultural divide and it depends, if she's a latina (from Latin America, not raised in the US), she probably might not mind, if she's a gringa she most probably will.

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)