INVESTING IN COLOMBIA - MY EXP....

b bruce says on Jun 10, 2006, 22:15:

Very Interesting? I have spoken to a few Americans that do business in Colombia. They suggested opening an account with the BanColombia branch in Miami. Same bank as the one in Colombia correct! That way you can conduct transactions such as deposits, withdraws, etc. And all your paperwork is completed on this side of the Caribbean so it should be much easier. I have not looked into it yet. But I am moving up to the Miami area within the next thirty days. There is a BanColombia listed in Miami. Viva Colombia!

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calipro says on Jun 11, 2006, 02:51:

I have never stayed in Colombia for more than a few months at a time. I hope BanColombia doesn't just up and close my account.

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JMOON87 says on Jun 11, 2006, 09:41:

Miami is the same The branch in Miami still follows colombian laws as far as new accounts you will need cedula and proof of residence in colombia , i tried that when we went to miami to get my visa so i could apply for my cedula and was told the colombian laws apply for new accounts ,remember as i said the banking laws changed in april of this year.

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Wastelandlive says on Jun 11, 2006, 10:33:

My understanding is that there is... ... a firewall between BanColombia in the US and BanColombia there. I confirmed that with Banco de Bogota as well. While all branches are owned by the same bank, your accounts will not be valid accross national lines. For example, I could not deposit money here in Miami for a Banco de Bogota account in Cartagena.

That's inconvenient, but it makes sense when you think of it from the perspective of national governments trying to fight narco-trafficing and money laundering.

Meanwhile... Jmoon87, I think you need to NOT give up so easily.

Firstly, I don't believe that bank manager, and I don't think you should either. Tell him to pack sand, and go talk to another bank. You may wish to take a quick vacation to Bogota, where you will find a higher level of professionalism.

Bottom line: you CAN bring in your money, file the correct paperwork, and repatriate it later, without paying that 35%. That's Colombian law.

The issue about it being in her name? I don't know whether he is right or wrong about the windfall tax applying, but who cares? Buddy - DON'T put it in her name! He's done you a favor by giving you the perfect rational! "Honey, if we have to pay this 35%, then I can't afford to buy it..."

You can be fair to her by having a will created leaving it to your wife in the event of your demise. If she's not happy with that, than there should be a flashing red light going off in your head. Hell, if she's living with you at the time that you acquire it, she's got grounds for a legal claim anyways...

And finally, the gringo price: ya, sure, you knew it was going to happen. Stick by your guns buddy. Get an agent, and invest the hours. After you've said "no" to enough people, HE will understand that you are not a sucker... and he'll communicate as much to the seller: "Look, you're not going to win the lottery here, but if you really want to sell your condo, he'll pay an honest price."

It'll happen. Of COURSE it's not as easy as it is in the States... think of it this way: if you didn't have to deal with this cultural friction, Colombia wouldn't be as cheap as it is.

Take the bad with the good. Best of luck!

Wasteland

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JMOON87 says on Jun 11, 2006, 10:58:

I did speak to 4 banks .. Wasteland , i did speak to 4 banks =Citibank, Conavi(sp) , banco de bogota and bancolombia was the only one that did not show us the door once they discovered we had not lived in colombia the previous 6 months ..the point i am trying to make on the tax is that with the new law it does not seem likely that i can open a bank account unless i have lived there for 6 months so in turn they would allow me to open one with my wife but she would have to pay the taxes for half the amount according to DIEN .As far as putting it in her name also- that was my idea for her and our child ....as far as an agent we worked with 5 and saw probaly close to 60-70 places , than i had to go thru each agent trying to scare me about the other agents listing being in drug neighborhoods are the builders were being investigated by the government for drugs and if you invest you could lose all your money etc..i have worked in the real estate and finance industry here in florida since 1993 and i think i will just stick with what i know even if business is pretty dead right now lol .

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Wastelandlive says on Jun 11, 2006, 14:06:

Hehehehehehehe... Yep, it DOES suck.

Brokers everywhere are sleezy. And I certainly wouldn't buy pre-construction, myself. Now, in Cartagena? Heavens no... you'd have to have your head examined. Cartagena is SO ready to pop, and I wouldn't be at all surprised to see one or two of those projects fail halfway through...

But this part is I would try to pin down:

JM:"the point i am trying to make on the tax is that with the new law it does not seem likely that i can open a bank account unless i have lived there for 6 month"

It sounds bogus to me: either you've got a legal cedula and a verifiable address, or you don't. You're making a deposit, not asking for credit. But I'll admit... I don't know about a "new law," so I could be wrong. Especially if you've already checked four different banks...

I wonder who could help? I'm just not current enough, or able to cite Colombian Law.

At the worst... I'll say this: get a commitment from the manager at Banco de Bogota', and get the clock ticking so you can open that account in six months. No harm in renting for awhile. Hell, give it two or three years and it'll be a buyer's market...

Wasteland

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Boatygringo says on Jun 11, 2006, 14:09:

Banking One way to get around the Banking mess in Colombia is to have a GOOD friend open a savings account in their name, they get a bank card and give it to you, you then change the pin number so only you know it, you can then deposit cash into the account over the counter at the bank and also withdraw cash from the ATM. the added benifit is the bank pays interes on your account. Boatygringo

Boatygringo

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calipro says on Jun 11, 2006, 15:25:

Boaty I hope you and your good friend don't have a falling out because all he would have to do is report the ATM card lost or stolen and then take all your money.

If you were wiring money to the account he would have to accept it personally.

Since Conavi merged with BanColombia you now have to accept all wires personally. I used to have a friend go to Conavi and accept my wire transfers. But the last time I sent money they wouldn't let him accept the transfer. They told me that they would hold the money for two weeks to give me a chance to come down or they were going to send the money back to my bank in the states.

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viewpoint says on Jun 11, 2006, 18:24:

I don't have to personally be in Colombia to have a wire transfered or credited into my BanColombia account. I just send the wire and it's credited usually the next day or two at the latest.

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calipro says on Jun 11, 2006, 18:35:

viewpoint When was the last time you wired money to Colombia?

I sent money down to my account in Conavi April. Not only did I have to go down personally they wanted copies of my income tax forms.

They told me the new policy was due to the merger with BanColombia but it might have just been the new bank manager. Who knows...like everything in Colombia....random enforcement is the norm.

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aztec says on Jun 11, 2006, 18:45:

'You can be fair to her by having a will created leaving it to your wife in the event of your demise.'

Not if you have children from a earlier marriage.

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Wastelandlive says on Jun 11, 2006, 18:47:

Hmmmm. OK.

So how's that work under Colombian law Aztec? Seems like something I should know for the future.

Wasteland

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aztec says on Jun 11, 2006, 18:59:

Half your estate will go to your children.

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rikharley says on Jun 11, 2006, 19:25:

AS for bring money down to colombia well if you bring it down in one shot you will have to pay tax on it. but i figured a way to get it down thewre w/o paying any taxes, checked with the banks and they told me i can have as many accounts in any bank that i want. The atm's thats how to get money down there. and its paid at the official RATE. NOT HTE RATE PUT ON BY THE MONEY CHANGING HOUSE WHICH IS USUALLY 20 PESOS LOWER. THE TRICK IT TO OPEN 10 TO 15 ACCOUNTS IN ONE BANK WHICH YOU CAN AND HAVE AN ATM CARD FOR EVERY ACCOUNT. THATS WHAT IAM GOING TO DI WHEN I MOVE TO COLOMBIA.SOUNDS FAR FETCHED BUT TAKE A GOOD LOOK AT THIS. CHECK WIHT BANKS. I LIVED IN COLONBIA FOR 4 MONTHS IN 2004. AND SPENT AROUND 22,000 , ALL I BROUGHT WITH ME WAS 3000 THE REST WAS FROM THE ATMS REMEMBER YOU CAN ONLY WITHDRAW 1,000,000 PESOS A DAY PER ATM CARD
THATS WHERE THE 10 TO 15 ACCOUNT COME IN.10 ACCOUNTS `10MILLIONPESOS A DAY IN 2WEEKS YOU CAN PAY YOUR CONDO/HOUSE OFF W/O PAYING THAT TAX CHECK IT OUT

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rikharley says on Jun 11, 2006, 19:33:

one more thing If the banker says that you have to pat the windfall tax at the bank , Don't do it he's gonna rip you off he's a con and kniows you have us dollars. he;s trying to scam how the hell he gonna know how of even if your wife left the country? unless you tell him ; the banker.my mom hasnt' lived in colombia in 25 years. she just got there in medellin and open an account just like that in 15 minutes

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rikharley says on Jun 11, 2006, 19:52:

you have to find way around the system thats the colombian way

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viewpoint says on Jun 11, 2006, 19:55:

calipro Two weeks ago I wired money to my BanColombia account and one week prior to that I sent another wire transfer. I also have two accounts at Conavi and I have to physically be in Colombia to receive those wire transfers but not with my BanColombia account. I know both banks have merged or Conavi was acquired by BC but I have send wire transfers for years to BC without being there to receive them.

Once the funds are credited to my account at BanColombia I just go online and move what I need to the Conavi accounts to pay my bills. All three of my accounts are linked together so that I can move funds back and forth between accounts.

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calipro says on Jun 11, 2006, 22:48:

viewpoint That's one nice thing about Conavi you can pay your gas, electric, phone and other bills on line.

My business visa expires this month and I'm going to go to Bogota to get a residental visa because I'm married now. I have a friend that lives in Cali and he got married a month before I did. He and his wife went to Bogota and he got a visa good for two years.

I hope they give me one for that long.

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JMOON87 says on Jun 12, 2006, 09:03:

IMO The info i am giving here is just what i experienced from may 15th -june 2nd ...i know there are exceptions to the rule but when i get told the same thing by 4 different banks i gotta think there is some truth behind it .as far as how do they know my wife was not in the country the last 6 months they just looked in her passport-remember we were going to open the account to wire the funds to colombia to buy a house and it was too much money for my wife to explain without a job in colombia because we live in the u.s. , but they did make an exception because i gave them so much info on where the money was coming from (exp. bank letter showing i had an account since 1989 with the same bank , my tax forms , copys of huds from investment property sales ,state license ) but it took a week to get the final approval and by than it was too late -like i said it just didnt work out for us but i would never tell anyone to not invest in colombia just do all your homework and still prepared for many unforseen hoops to jump through ...i was told by 2 banks in april all i needed was my cedula to open an account well i got my cedula and they still would not let me open an account without my wife and that took an exception ...as far as the windfall taxes the bank manager did not say to pay him the money , he was actually being nice and warning us as he said many banks will not inform the customer because they are scared they will not open the account once they are informed of the tax laws ..which makes me think when many of the people on here say they do things without a problem maybe there is no problem now but there may be one in the future.My advice would be to contact DIEN like i did and they confirmed what the bank manager said was true .Good Luck !!

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Greg444 says on Jun 12, 2006, 20:13:

You are allowed to bring in up to 10,000 USD , at least according to the customs form.

So why not fly down with $9000 in 100s, then your wife flys down with $9000. then you each make another round trip a week or so later, again at $9000 USD each in 100s.

If you fly back and forth 5 or 6 times, it should give the $75,000 USD to buy the condo in cash, no taxes.

Or am I missing something?

I fly to Colombia every 3 weeks, never been questioned or searched. 50 flights over the past 4 years.

PS- $9000 in 100s is a very small packet, split up it easily fit anywhere on you. I saw many a Colombians, flying back to he US , pull a wad of 100s USD at American Airlines counter checkin in Bogota.

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calipro says on Jun 12, 2006, 22:23:

Gregg444 I thought about what you are saying. But there are a couple of draw backs.

One is just the danger of carry so much cash on you at one time. I go to Cali and the thought of declaring 9000 cash at customs in the airport and trying to make it down that highway to the city at night is something I never want to try.

Then there is the less than desirable exchange rate on cash. BanColombia has a pretty good exchange rate but would never let me exchange more than 3 million 500 thousand pesos in a months time.
And they will never file a form 4 which is necessary if you are going to invest the money in a condo.

Other places will give a worst exchange rate and still won't give you a form 4. If I don't have to have a form 4, I just take the money out of ATMs even if it takes weeks to get all the money out.

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