In my opinion

rona says on Jan 6, 2006, 14:56:

Nothing "incorrect" about your comment . . . . . . there's nothing wrong with making an observation.

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Wastelandlive says on Jan 6, 2006, 14:57:

It must have felt good... ... to get that off your chest.

Wasteland

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Lucia Rojas says on Jan 6, 2006, 15:17:

Women speak up! I don’t mind some bad mouthing of my country. I am the first to admit that Colombia has huge problems and specially huge behavioral problems. Some people will take advantage of every situation. Its the PAPAYA rule..( all of us on this forum know it) I will be the first to address them... But the way some of you here talk about Colombian women is degrading and the way some of you answer when the girls here try to step up and say something about it is not very nice. So I can understand a relate to what WC is saying. Colombia is country that has been closed off to tourism for long time. (reasons known by all) But this has happened in every underdeveloped country where there s a lot of tourism. It is no surprise that people who haven't had any opportunities or education will take advantage of a situaton like this. Hats off to them! they are smart! Whether they are happy or will be happy is another question. If you guys start coming to Colombia because you are interested in the culture and the country in general, and you try to understand Colombia, really understand, then probably you will be able to find a colombiana ( poor or rich) with whom you will be able to relate. BUT IF YOU ONLY COME FOR THE SEX, IF YOU THINK THIS IS A MEAT MARKET; WHAT ELSE CAN YOU EXPECT?

The phenomena of women sleeping with men for money is as old as la panela.. and it doesn’t only happen in Colombia. ( And I am not talking about open prostitution) I am talking about those implicit exchanges that occur. I worked on a sexual education project in the peruvian jungle and the problem we addressed the most was the fact that young girls in the jungle would sleep with men to get gifts and to be taken out to eat. I called it SEXO POR POLLO y JEANS. Some of them find a good way to make a living like that. and sex with a normal machista peruvian ( and this is a generalization) would normally be worst anyways, because in machista society the man doesnt take the woman's sexual needs into account, so to a lot of women it becomes like a duty they have to fulfill, something they HAVE to do. So it's even better with the gringo and they get gifts on top of that. Sometimes, not always, love has only a small part in the equation. I worked with girls who were 17 and had 72 year old boyfriend because he is better provider. There is even a term in peruvian vocabulary to describe a man or woman who make a sport of finding gringos to give them stuff: it is BRICHERO/A and there’s even a movie about it called UN MARCIANO LLAMADO DESEO. It is not a new discovery that women or men do this and it is probably due to circumstances, lack of opportunities, cultural view of women and machismo among other things. It is up to you guys to be wise about it and dont come back crying saying all colombianas are "prostitutes" and gold diggers. Plus I bet you guys have done your fair amount of hurting too, at some point or another.

Colombiche and WC we should start a band!!! … or a gang.. jejejejejej

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quindioman says on Jan 6, 2006, 15:22:

different strokes for different folks.
Which is why people really shouldn't judge couples on first sight.
You can assume as much but you never really know what drives them to be together. I appreciate your post world citizen, but I have a different take on these topics....let people get together...let them find out if it was meant to be or not....como se dice "nadie muere de amor" and if it happens that one party had alternative reasons for dating the other (ie economic interest) then the person getting fleeced will find out and it will set them in good stead for the future.
I opt for the real poor girl. Why? Well for one it gives me the opportunity to help that family out of poverty...I might not be helping all of the poor but if I helped just one person then I'm a happy bunny....it's given me a real good insight at how some not so well off Colombians get by, from them I strengthen my appreciation for life. I thank God for making my life abundant and have come to appreciate life without the material trappings, I don't whinge and moan as much as I did, and I'm very grateful for the food I have and the clothing etc. for I know there's people out there that get by with 1 and a half pair of jeans a week, yet you don't see them complaining that they don't have a new dress to go out with at the end of the week. It also gives me a chance to actually inform my other half in matters that I have a slight knowledge...like languages for example, or maybe basic geography....all of a sudden you realise that there is a lot more that you have in common than you ever imagined....you bounce off each other and the learning experience is a 2 way avenue in full flow. I just feel that in love you should go with your heart...leave your reasoning for the mensa exams....I'm grateful for all the experiences I've had, both the good and the bad because even the Calena that broke my heart many moons ago taught me a lot and I'm eternally grateful to her and not in a cynical way either.
I don't begrudge the Cuyabra that I bought to London and she done a runner on me within 6 months owing my mother over £2,000. I hope she's doing well...at the very least there's one less family in Armenia struggling to pay the rent thanks to her.

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toneloc24 says on Jan 6, 2006, 15:23:

Thanks for sharing your experience/observation Unfortunately the large majority of these couples were an older (50's-70s) white mullet male and a young (20's) tacky sluty colombiana. It is not very hard to guess what is that that they want from each other."

I'm completely assuming that you saw this in Bocagrande/Laguito in Cartagena. Right? If so, this is only the beginning. Those types of dudes are buying up condos down there. Of course, it's possible that she could love him. And he believes it.

LOL!!!

"PBH is dead!!!!"

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Lucia Rojas says on Jan 6, 2006, 15:38:

Thats very altruistc of you Quindioman...rare maybe, but altruistic...and I think alot of men like that position of being the one who teaches, who provides, who shows the world etc. I had a classmate in school who always said he wanted to marry someone really poor so he could show her the world. and as you said to each his own..."different strokes..." anyways I do think people from different backgrounds can fall in love, honestly in love, and if you learn from experiences even better. I just think it is not wise to be sending money to someone you really don't know that much and who is thousands of miles away...maybe the helping should come slowlier...And love does not depend on saving someone... love is just that, love... money or saving shouldnt be the reasons, the causes... but they could be very nice consequences. They shouldnt be the END nor the MEANS. not in love at least.

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quindioman says on Jan 6, 2006, 15:54:

thank you Lucia I'm pretty much like that classmate you had. I do agree with you on the sending money to someone you hardly know issue, fortunately for me I very rarely part with my money unless I've gotten to know the person....even the Cuyabra I mentioned I happened to know for 7 years so it was quite a shock when she did the runner. And of course you are quite right...the saving shouldn't be the love, in my cases I just happen to find love among the lower classes, I don't go out purposefully looking for poor girls to fall in love with...lol :-)....that was a very funny thought however!

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Lucia Rojas says on Jan 6, 2006, 15:58:

jejejejejeje, very funny thought!
Sometimes love ends no?
chao

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platano says on Jan 6, 2006, 16:07:

World citizen, The learning is a two-way street and so is the love and so is the money. My wife has taught me as much as I have taught her. She is a therapist and has worked and paid the bills. A phrase I hear from her is "te invito" to go out to eat or to a movie. Now she says she will continue working when I want to retire. No complaints about Colombian women from here.

plátano

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ws244 says on Jan 6, 2006, 16:35:

Colombia Well i just spent a month in Bogota, and whether in Andino, Unicentro, Hacienda Santa Barbara malls I was about the only gringo in sight. I was probably the only gringo in Candaleria and in the square at city center on the 27th, and Park 93 on the 22nd. Yes one sees gringos at zona rosa at the Bogota Beer Company. After 5 years going to Bogota one sees less white gringos not more. Actually one sees many Colombian men with their girlfriends, wives half their age. If gringos are "white mullets" as stated in a previous post, well then there are many more Colombian "mullets" chasing young skirts.

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Diez Y Siete says on Jan 6, 2006, 18:57:

ws244 You wernt the only one i just spent 2 weeks there aswell and i know what you mean, i didnt see another gringo except for when i visited the hard rock cafe in atlantis, i was also at parque 93 on the 22 too, how ironic, but back to the post, im in a colombiano-gringa relationship and it is very easy to fall in love with someone froma different culture, you have soo much to talk about and learn from each other, but i while i was there any time i went out, my boyfriend and i got the meanist looks from some people, and would purposly run into us sometimes in public places, o well colombia is still fantastic i love it 10 times more than the us!

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Jebediah says on Jan 6, 2006, 19:35:

I agree "I had a classmate in school who always said he wanted to marry someone really poor so he could show her the world"

That sounds a bit like me!, when i travelled through Cambodia, all the poverty and what have you tugged at my heart strings.

I would much rather fall in love with someone from a poor, different background than myself, than fall in love with an average australian girl, but then again you cant predict who you may or may not fall in love with!

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utopiacowboy says on Jan 6, 2006, 22:29:

WorldCitizen wrote: "When I read posters in which guys say "my girlfriend did not know anything about WWI or WWII, who Bill Gates is or has never listened to other music but the latin one"... makes me feel that you may be dating the wrong girl... unless you REALLY don't care. If you want to have a smart conversation find a smart woman. If you have a particular interest find somebody who has the same interest or is willing to learn about it. Do not assume nobody in Colombia has a clue about computers, history or else. For god sake you have to be kidding me if you really think we are THAT backwards!!!!"

1. She is my wife and we've been married for over two years.
2. She has a degree in chemical engineering and worked for many years supervising manufacturing operations in one of the world's largest textile mills.
3. She is 100% pure Colombiana and the outside world never held much allure or interest to her. OTOH, she's travelled everywhere in Colombia and has an encyclopedic knowledge of Colombian folklore, music and literature.
4. I find her lack of knowledge and interest in the world beyond Colombia very amusing. I tease her by telling her she's been living under a rock.
5. She was not by any stretch of the imagination poor. She owns her own large 4 bedroom apartment in a Strata 4 Medellin barrio. Her mother lives in a Strata 5 barrio in Monteria. Her grandmother in a Strata 6 barrio. Her siblings are all either lawyers or engineers.
6. Given a choice between picking my wife or WorldCitizen as more clueless, I know who I'd pick.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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silviat says on Jan 7, 2006, 12:40:

with all due respect for those of your who say you prefer to be with a poorer person so you can show her the world. It seems to me that you may just want someone who sees you as her "savior". I deeply apologize if I am wrong but that's the perception I have of the kind of man that intentionally look for poorer women.

Now even when I agree with part of World Citizen's complain about the "men" that come here to trash colombian women because just because they can't get a decent one, I disagree with the fact that you shouldn't date poor women because very likely they will be gold diggers.

Being poor doens't equal lacking values...

And what dictates if you date or not a person shouldn't be his/her age or socio-economical position but how do you feel about her.

Anyway, if you meet someone you feel attracted to and she happens to be poor that's different than if you are looking for a poor women to start with.

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litost says on Jan 7, 2006, 12:51:

ws244 I think you need glasses, and a hearing aid. There are always bound to be other gringos in these places you mention, it's just impossible to believe that you were the only one. Maybe that was your perception, but as someone who has been a lot longer than a month around northern Bogota, I can tell you there is a significant and growing number of foreigners in the area.

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ws244 says on Jan 7, 2006, 14:14:

gringos Well i have been going to Bogota for 5 years and have an apartment there. I see very very few gringos except in Zona Rosa. Many older Spanish Colombians look like they are anglo, but it is deceiving as they are of European descent. As i visited my Optometrist last week, Dr. Amaya Quijano(Carrera 9/117) said my eyes were no problem.
Remember "mullet gringos" in Colombia miss nothing with their eyes, particularly other gringos and especially the endless Colombian women to look at.

Litost Hard rock is really expensive as you know. El Corral on the other side at Atlantis has better food and a much better price.

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litost says on Jan 7, 2006, 17:37:

Ok granted you probably won't notice another foreigner everytime you go to one of these places, but stick around a while and you can usually observe this slippery species. Heck I've heard people speaking french on several occasions in buses, not to mention the israelian enclave in a part of the Candelaria. There's also a considerable number of foreigners in universities or as interns in international organizations. They sometimes appear in museums too. Depends a lot on your lifestyle I guess.

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ws244 says on Jan 7, 2006, 20:44:

species Yes, soon there will be several different stuffed "mullet gringo species" with eyes of any color other than black or brown in Colombia museums. Seems the Colombia girls have an interest in this phenomena.
As i am pushing 60, my lifestyle is somewhat limited in being just happy to wake up in the morning, and seeing if everything still works to some degree. Candeleria is interesting. Someone in their 70's or later years will tell you 50 years ago it was really a neat area of Bogota.

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bkelly says on Jan 8, 2006, 06:25:

not that my opinion matters... I have been living in Colombia for more than 5 years, mostly in Bucaramanaga. Granted, you don't see too many foreigners in the Buc, but there are some. I have never personally encountered the "gold digger" type of woman that hasa come up on occasion. I have dated girls in strats 2-6, ages 18-30, and honestly can say I have never met a girl like this. Maybe things are different here in Santander. Just thought I would share.

--bkelly

--bkelly

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Crazy Eagle says on Jan 8, 2006, 14:59:

Xpert opinion I have NEVER seen another gringo in Bogota.

But then again, I have never actually been there either.

"Caught between the twisted stars the plotted lines the faulty map that brought Colombus to New York." Lou Reed

"The natural rhythm of life is routine punctuated by orgy" Aldous Huxley

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webmanco says on Mar 3, 2006, 06:53:

73 years old woman and a 38 years old man

San Luis (Boyaca)


Para casar a María del Carmen Martínez y a Jorge Samuel Dueñas, el párroco de San Luis de Gaceno, Héctor Julio López, le pidió asesoría a un abogado.

El sacerdote estaba tan preocupado por la unión que hasta consultó al Obispo de Garagoa sobre si debía casarlos.

Aunque a él, y en general a los habitantes de San Luis, en el oriente boyacense, se les hacía difícil entender esa unión, no había impedimento legal para que se llevara a cabo.

No era sólo la diferencia de edades lo que los inquietaba. María del Carmen no tiene muy buena salud a causa de su diabetes y su hipertensión.

Dos veces, el párroco visitó a los novios para convencerlos de que desistieran del matrimonio. Sin embargo, la pareja insistió en que quería casarse.

...A yo, déjenme queto y no me jodan má! ...

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kat1 (Moderator) (Trustee board) says on Mar 3, 2006, 11:18:

Good post world Citizen

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