If assimilation means "Keeping up with the Jones'," then forget it...

utopiacowboy says on May 29, 2005, 15:10:

There are a lot of subcultures in the United States. Some are materialistic and others are not. Each to his own.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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rona says on May 29, 2005, 15:22:

It can't be all bad "Keeping up with the Jones" may not be such a bad thing depending how it is applied . . . for example, I bought property over 10 years ago in an area that was at best - undesireable. Over the years I've made improvements and guess what? So did my neighbors . . . consequently, all of our properties have more than tripled in value over that timespan and our neighborhood is clean and safe . . . as far as assimilation, we all do, its just a matter to what degree - example: Thanksgiving was the first holiday my family readily accepted. But the Easter Bunny didn't make sense to my folks, although my kids will beg to differ - They'll point out Easter Bunnies saying "Felices Pascuas"

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kernow62 says on May 29, 2005, 17:25:

You must live in my neighnourhood Rona.

I don't mind Thanksgiving, anything for a free turkey!

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miamimike says on May 29, 2005, 19:56:

Aaron-whoever informed you on the Cubans are 90% Correct I live here in Miami and see exactly what you speak of--they are much more materialistic then the American s living amongst them. I don't know where they get this conspicous consumtion lifestyle concept but they have to have the Gold Rings, Chains, the biggest and latest SUVs vehicles, Designer clothes, Huge Houses ect.ect ect. Personally I could care less what kind of clothing, car they drive,jewelry they display, house they live in as it doesn't tell me anything about how they are as a person. There are exceptions and these are the Cubans I count amongst my friends.They are in a very small minority amongst the Miami and Union City, NJ Cubans.

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Colombiche says on May 30, 2005, 09:16:

But wait..... If they are Cubanos, then they are keeping up with the Rodriguezes, the Castros and the Gonzaleses.

:P

No me den trago extranjero, que es caro y no sabe a bueno.... (Rafael Godoy)

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Colombiche says on May 30, 2005, 09:17:

I think it has to do... with the fact that they are in exile and came from a communist regime? A lot of them had to do without a lot of things back home in Cuba, so when they get to Miami, they just want to get all they can get. El sueño Americano chico.

No me den trago extranjero, que es caro y no sabe a bueno.... (Rafael Godoy)

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rona says on May 30, 2005, 13:32:

Not really - I think they were the same arrogant & tacky folks back in Cuba - keep in mind that most the Cubans that fled were the country's elite - upper class professionals, etc. - a good number of them sent their kids through the "Peter Pan" movement where the child is sponsored by a well-to-do family to continue their education outside of Cuba while the family made the necessary arrangements to leave - many of these "Peter Pan" kids today became VERY successful . . .
. . . also they had their refugee checks from the US gov't. waiting for them as well as low-interest business loans and some grants set aside exclusively for the incoming Cubans . . .

so . . .

1. you have a strong financial infrastructure
2. you can be sure that most of their assets were liquidated and set up in offshore accounts - these people were not dumb
3. so now you have refugee checks, some liquid assets and a clean financial slate . . . how can you NOT become successful?

I don't think that as much as they bellyache about modern-day Cuba that they are breaking down the doors to go back

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miamimike says on May 30, 2005, 21:25:

When these Peter Pan Kids got here-that refugee check was really what we now call SSI. They, their parents never paid ONE RED DIME into the Social Security system yet some collected checks for 15-20 years. They also received health Insurance courtesy of the US Government and many poor American Born Children much worse off then they were received nothing. The reason this grates on my mind is that this past Friday I took my Ladyfriend's Bogota niece who is here in Miami on a Tourist visa to a school that hopefully will her get her Florida Nursing License(she graduated from nursing school in Bogota)Anyway this School is owned by a Cubano and he went on and on how if she was Cuban everything would be so much easier-Absolutely NO breaks for other immigrant groups or AMERICAN Citizens I may add but if you are Cuban everything is possible and the American Govt. will even help them with financial aid when they are enrolled in this Miami School.If you are Cuban that is , nothing for Colombians or AMericans. This is the only state and also the only country I have been in(and I have been in Many)where Certain Non-Citizens are entitled to more RIGHTS then Citizens.Unbelievable. I want to add this--as Today was Memorial Day and they day we Honor all our Veterans of wars past and present(many of us patriotic types and ex Vets like myself fly an American Flag Today from our home or Apt. Balconies)--I had reason to drive through some south Miami and Hialeah Neighborhoods which are predominately Cuban--for all the Chest Beating they do about how much they love the USA and how Patriotic they are-=-ASK me how many American Flags I saw displayed in their neighborhoods and think of a Round Singular Figure. We gave them so much yet the one day they could honor our Servicemen by displaying The Flag-this is evedently too much. Don't let the Monthly SS check be late though.......

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Gomezman5 says on May 30, 2005, 21:48:

mike.... Nice talking to ya earlier......it's been a while. Anyway, I agree with your above post. Everyone sees the Cuban vote in Florida as so special, so important because it is a swing state.

But honestly, you make a great point. Why the hell should these people have greater rights than our own citizens? That is appaling. But there are a lot of things in this country that irritate me. Indeed it is Memorial Day, and I along with all my family posted the flag with pride. In my office it is posted every day. Yet, we still don't do enough for our veterans. They recieve second rate medical care. The benefits are mediocre at best, is spite of the big sell you see on the T V commercials that aim at recruiting others. This has been the same story since Viet Nam. Anyway, I forgot to say to you...Thanks Mike for the fine service you gave to our country. You deserve a thank you every time the occasion arrives. You will get another one on Veterans Day.

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miamimike says on May 30, 2005, 22:02:

Thank You Marcos Gomezman for Honoring the Veterans I pay a lot of tribute to my Brother in Law who was in Korea way back when. He was pinned down for 10 days by North Korean Machine Gun Fire in a freezing foxhole and by his own account its a wonder he is here today. They tried to close the VA Medical Center in his town where he goes for treatment -Erie,Pa. last August but Wawshington was unsucessful due the fact all the old Vets from the VFW and American Legion fought them tooth and nail and it remains open. The latest assault on the Vets is that the Powers to be are trying to impose a Yearly $250 Fee to use the VA System.Yet all this Money is around to pay SS Benefits to People who never paid a fricking Dime into the fund but deny the Vets Medical Care.

Avatar Legend: Bush "If any of you Reporters are wondering, it was a Size 10"

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kernow62 says on May 31, 2005, 05:13:

Perhaps they are still pissed off that the US backed invasion of Cuba failed. ja ja

I didn't have a US flag flying either, I'm not much of a flag waver. There was no disrespect intended by my lack of flag waving, it is just not part of my culture. Except at a rugby match.

Unless the Cubans were all flying Cuban flags, or upside down US flags then I don't see any disrespect in their not choosing to fly the US flag.

The additional benefits they get irks me too, but look what the US is doing to their famiies back home. That irks me too. Let the Cubans in the US have the same benefits as other imigrants, stop the blockade, then I will be happy.

You wouldn't believe the crap I had to put up with in school for not standing and pledging allegiance to the flag. Now don't get me wrong if I was called to fight and the US needed me I would have gone, I did register for the draft. In fact I had the wonderful honour of having to possibly fight for either the US or Britain.

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Gomezman5 says on May 31, 2005, 07:21:

"but look what the US is doing to their famiies back home. That irks me too. Let the Cubans in the US have the same benefits as other imigrants, stop the blockade, then I will be happy."

Quote Kernow

What the hell does that mean? The whole reason we have the blockade is BECAUSE of the Cubans in the US. That is exactly MiamiMikes's point. Not only do we give them special status and special treatment that amounts to more than what our own citizens would get, but we also let them influence our foregn policy back home.

I don't think...I know that this Bockade would be history if they would break up the strong voting block that they represent and they suddenly relocated through the US. They are a huge voting block in south Florida. And Florida being the pivotal state that it is, with the huge electoral count, is a prize that the Republicans cannot afford to lose. And you know what Kernow? The Democrats would not do a damn thing to change it either. They would never want to risk angering that important base. In politics, you look to build upon your base, and supporting the removal of the blockage/embargo would not work to either political parties advantage.

Additionally, (you must not have slept last night)Kernow, Mikes point was,, and he is correct, is that Cubans have MORE benefits than not only other immigrants, but more benefits than our own citizens as well. I suggest you reread Mike's post. Nowhere does he suggest that they have less benefits. Look, they are the ONLY immigrant group that only has to make it to land from 90 miles away from our country..no passport...no visa.....no ID of any sort .....and they get to stay here legally. Excuse me but uhhhh.....how much more of a benefit can you get than that? Even you wacky English with your strange diets don't get to come here and stay that easily.

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miamimike says on May 31, 2005, 08:38:

Many in Congress want to change the law and many are Farm State Republicans as we as All types of Democrats.The Law may have been valid and served a purpose 30-40 years ago but now has outlived its usefulness.All the Cubans coming here now are Economic Refugees, not political asylum types. As proof of this, many new arrivals from Cuba would and many do return to Cuba in a couple months for Vacation. SO if they are so afraid of Castro-why are they going back to Cuba so soon after they arrive here?? Then there is Pasado Carrilles, the reknown Cuban Terrorist--he was here in Miami wandering around freely without impunity for 2 months. The Police, FBI, CIA, Immigration, all the local politicians,even local school kids, the Fl. Governor and his brother the Prez.----all knew he was here and DID NOTHING because he was Cuban.Yet a Mexican Bracero picking tomatoes would be picked up-what hyprocracy.Our Borders are broken and so is border security(for some)

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N2Aquatix says on May 31, 2005, 08:42:

F#ck The Jones' F#ck the Jones'. I buy my tennis shoes at Wal-mart because I refuse to pay for a name. I drive an SUV, but it's a Jeep Grand Cherokee (that's the one actually designed to go off-road), the rest of the SUV's are just glorified station wagons! LMAO!!! And let's not forget the most ignorant trend these days: putting rims on a car that cost more than the car itself! What's that all about??? Oh, and by the way, putting a giant wing on a Kia does not transform it into a Lamborghini. ;)

Jay

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miamimike says on May 31, 2005, 08:53:

There are a lot of thoser "Pimp My Ride" type Cars here and what a Joke. I saw a an old Police Car that was pimped out with those Spinner Rims(they keep turning when the car stops)-the car was painted like Electric Blue-the rims were worth $1000 each the car was a police auction special-even had a few bullet holes already in it-this Ups the Gangsta Value here in Miami-what a laugh-then a guy hops out with Michael Jordan Air Nikes that light up-cost $300 probably-what a laugh consumerism is here in Miami.

Avatar Legend: Bush "If any of you Reporters are wondering, it was a Size 10"

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Mr. Hollywood says on May 31, 2005, 10:13:

Why are we surprised? Why is anyone surprised that people who come to the USA to pursue the "American Dream" as shown on TV end up tacky and materialistic?

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kernow62 says on May 31, 2005, 15:49:

Gomez, where in my post did I say they receive less benefits. I said additional, that means more not less.

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Gomezman5 says on May 31, 2005, 16:18:

Kernow.....you said Exactly what I quoted. What the heck are you talking about??? I never said that you said that the Cubans recieve less beneifts. Did I? Where did I?

I said that you implied it when you said that the Cubans should have the same benefits as others. The point Miamimike and I are both making is that the Cuban people already receive TOO MANY benefits and therefore, should not be recieving these benefits. You imply that the Cubans get less benefits than others when you said exactly what I quoted...I will post it again:

"LET the Cubans in the US have the same benefits as other imigrants"

Those are your words my man. If that does not imply that you feel that the Cubans are getting less benefits than others, than you and I learned two very different forms of English.

How else would you read that line????


Miamimike's and my point was/is that they already recieve more benefits than any other group of immigrants and worse yet....they recieve more benefits than tax paying, American born US citizens.

By the way, the blockaide is a seperate issue altogether.

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caslug says on May 31, 2005, 17:43:

u r gman.. if cuban-americans moved out of miami, they would lose polictal cloute to... Mexicans-americans. I read recently that Mexican make up over 2/3 of the latino population it the US. Talk about politcal power base.

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Gomezman5 says on May 31, 2005, 17:52:

caslug I have been saying that to everyone for a long time. All the latino groups together, still will not be able to outnumber the power of theMexicans in this country

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Mr. Hollywood says on May 31, 2005, 18:48:

Gomezman let me explain G5, Kernow is from the UK. So, indeed, he and you learned different forms of English (ie. he learned understatement and politeness. Also, how to be snarky).

"Let them have the same benefits" makes perfect sense to my gringo ears as "Everyone should receive the same". But if you know better what he meant to say than he does himself, I'm sure he's anxious to learn more about himself from you.

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kernow62 says on May 31, 2005, 20:34:

That must be the answer Hollywood. I just assumed Gomez had a mild form of reading disability, but being British I was too polite to bring the subject up. :-)

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Gomezman5 says on May 31, 2005, 20:36:

Hollywood What is your background that you can call yourself an expert on English so that you can distiguish between English from the UK and English from the USA?

As far as the rest of your post and it's related sarcasm, I will not give much creedence to it. Since I can never recall you agreeing with anything I ever posted here, but I can recall a you embarking on path of criticism as to just about what ever I post on this site, I will not really attach much merit to your comments to begin with.

I have to believe there are other troubled waters for you to do your splashing in.

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Gomezman5 says on May 31, 2005, 20:39:

Kernow...... Surely you can find better allies than "Mr. Hollywood" to substantiate your case after accusing me of something that I never said in the first place.

I stand on my explanation and your lack of clarity---UK English or otherwish

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kernow62 says on May 31, 2005, 21:44:

If this quote means to you that I think Cubans are receiving LESS benefits; then there is no hope for your understanding much of anything.

My quote: "The additional benefits they get irks me too, but look what the US is doing to their famiies back home. That irks me too. Let the Cubans in the US have the same benefits as other imigrants, stop the blockade, then I will be happy."

There are two vastly different groups of Cubans in Florida, the first wave who want the blockade because they are pissed that Castro took all their wealth and distributed it. Pissed because Castro gave blacks rights they never had when the white upper class ruled. Then there is the second wave of imigrants, those who suffered because of the blockade. They do not see eye to eye on the blockade with the first group. In fact I discussed this very topic last week at Vega's Cafe, Mr. Vega is an old white Cuban, he is all for the blockade, but some of the younger Cubans, children of the first wave and a couple who came in the 1980s were dead set against it and want to see capitalism flourish in Cuba. I agree with the latter, a taste of capitalism would bring a demise to Castro. Castro knows this too, and he wants the blockade, the old Cubans are unwittingly playing right into sly old Castro's hand. Anytime a US President mentions there might be a lifting or easing of the blockade, Castro does something to throw a spanner into the works.

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Gomezman5 says on May 31, 2005, 22:00:

Kernow, your last post makes some interesting points. I agree with some of it.....maybe evern more than some of it. But then again, it depends on my ability to comprehend your English this evening. Less rights, more rights, too much rights.....Castro's rights, my rights. Let the Cubans, Don't Let the Cubans......

who cares? It's all the same to me. I am just confused. Maybe I should just call Mr. Hollywood?

Anyway Kernow, go to bed. It's past your bed time. I know this because you start posting early in the morning. Sleep man, sleep.

Long live Tony and George.....God bless all conservatives. help the liberals....Act now before it's too late. And steak tacos are better than beef empanadas....as long as they have onion and cilantro.

Get it Kernow? Probably not. Too bad. it will take too long to explain thngs to you. Ask Hollywood again.

hasta la proxima......

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kernow62 says on Jun 1, 2005, 04:51:

I get it, it is attorney speak; it means you admit your lack of English comprehension was the problem. :-)

By the way, I ran this post through a US English [Spelling and Grammar]checker. Just for you.

My post you could not understand did have two errors.

1. - I keep spelling immigrants incorrectly.

2. - I should have also used a semicolon instead of a comma.

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Peter Miami says on Jun 1, 2005, 20:43:

Hey Arron, miamimike and company if you don't like it don't look at it or move to North Dakota. This is the American way which by the way the only true Americans were the "Indians" and we killed them, Not one of you nor I am Americans because we all and I mean "ALL OF US" or our fathers or fathers father come from some other countries. And part of what you are talking about is what made the United States a world power in many areas. Do we have problems, do we make mistakes, do we do things that should not be done, yes we do and we should corrected them. But if you do not like it try to change it or leave this great country of ours! Trust me anybody that does not want to be here please leave, we do not want you!

Peter Miami

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kernow62 says on Jun 2, 2005, 03:54:

PeterMiami Ithink that is why you are finding quite a few Americans moving to other countries, lots in Latin America and Europe and I imagine quite a few in Canada. It is not easy to move though, just because you are from the US does not automatically give you the right to live elsewhere.

I agree if you want to live somewhere else by all means move. I am here only long enough to squeeze every last bit of money I can from this wonderful country; then I am pissing off with my loot. At least that is the plan.

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Gomezman5 says on Jun 2, 2005, 18:29:

It's no so easy for people to just "up and go" If you live a simple life, and you don't have much of anything, I suppose it can be done. But, if you have a lot of assets, like real property, it's not so easy. You cannot trust people to look out for your intersts while you are away. People will always find a way to rob you blind.

In my case, not only do I have real estate, (and I am all to familiar with management companies), but I have a pension just a few years away, and life time health insurance for life. Who in their right mind would just up and walk away from that? In 7-8 years, in addition to my private law practice, I will have a pension that will give me 53% of what I earn and I will not even have to get our of bed in the morning to collect it. So....sometimes people have ties to where they are, it makes moving away to your dreamland, whether it be Mexico or somewhere else, symply not very practical

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miamimike says on Jun 2, 2005, 23:35:

Hey Peter in Miami-I feel I have Earned some Bitching Rights. after serving my country in the military for 4.5 years and then in the US MErchantMarine for close to 8 years(Dept of Defense-military sealife command)so right now I am not going anywhere.And I could care less who does or does not like it. "Trust me anybody that does not want to be here please leave, we do not want you!"

Peter Miami--they liked me enough in 1965 to send me a Draft Notice for VietNam--they wanted me then and got me so they have to want me now. JAJAJAJA.

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utopiacowboy says on Jun 3, 2005, 14:36:

In 2003, 11,350 from Canada to US and 11,980 from the US to Canada. Pretty much an even trade.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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kernow62 says on Jun 3, 2005, 17:58:

Did they count all those illegals from the US who pile into Canada? Do you have a name for them like wetbacks or something? Do they all want to claim welfare while they sit on their fat asses? I think Canadians should sit on horses, backwards, along the border with binoculars and guns waiting for illegal Americans trying to sneak across. Anyone caught saying about instead of aboot should be deported, aye.

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Gomezman5 says on Jun 3, 2005, 18:39:

Yes sir Kernow !! In fact, they should be made to eat kidney and Liver pie topped with Vanilla ice cream !

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Albatross says on Jun 6, 2005, 07:06:

Puerto Rican Pride ? Interesting thread... and to keep the subject from ever getting around to Colombia, I’ll mention that yesterday our city was inundated with both the Puerto Rican and Gay Parade/Festivals. They were supposed to be separate events, but whoever planned on having them on the same day and within a few blocks of each other must have a sense of humor. (It was sarcastically dubbed “Gay Puerto Rican Day”).

Anyway, similar to Cubans, Puerto Ricans enjoy special status here in the U.S.- they've become the de facto 51st state. But while I’ve gone out of my way to learn something of the Latino culture, I found the whole spectacle less than attractive. Essentially, thousands of people gathered in the park and drove around the city with the sole purpose of waving around the Puerto Rican Flag as much as humanly possible. And when the day was over, the streets were full of trash that will be cleaned up at taxpayer expense.

There is nothing wrong with ancestral pride and perhaps assimilation is over-rated, but this is the United States, not Puerto Rico or Cuba or Ireland or Italy, ect. Americans shouldn’t have to learn Spanish just because some immigrants are too damn lazy to learn English. And quite frankly, after witnessing their Puerto Rican flag-waving frenzy yesterday, I have less interest in them or their culture...

“Democracy - a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H.L. Mencken

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N2Aquatix says on Jun 6, 2005, 07:15:

Funny Gay Puerto Rican Day??? That's pretty damn funny.

Jay

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Gomezman5 says on Jun 6, 2005, 07:27:

Albatross, you have a point In fact you make a few good points. People can celebrate their heritage or theri sexual orientation, but it should be done tastefully and also not in a way where the public should be in harms way. The gigantic flags hanging out of the cars is rediculous and dangerous. Although if I may add, the Colombians next month, and the Mexicans in September do the same thing.

And as to Gay pride, they are entitled to celebrate their heritage, but thye too should be limited as to what kind of public conduct they can engage in --PUBLICLY. Walking around nearly naked, and parading down the middle of the street touching and feeling various parts of the body including genitalia is, not only distastefull, it is unlawfull. Free speech has it's limits. Public decency should not be sacrificed in the name of free speech.

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