How is Spain seen by other EUropean COuntries

Neonovo says on Mar 1, 2005, 13:27:

But the Argentinans think they're superior to Spaniards. And most colombians make fun of Pastusos.

Paz

Neonovo

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juancegomez says on Mar 1, 2005, 18:24:

It's been kind of hard for me to accept this, but after conversations with some people, apparently "sudaca" is a bit like "gringo" or "gallego"...depending on the context and the tone, it can be a neutral or even friendly term.

"Sudaca de m..." would definitely be insulting, obviously.

As for the Spanish...I've been led to believe that most people in Europe, except the French and the English (for historical reasons, ie: Gibraltar, they have old rivalries), usually see them just fine.

About the pastuosos...yes, but the thing is that they're culturally closer to Ecuador and/or Peru, and were very linked to those population centers during most of the colonial period.

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BlondeJamesBond says on Mar 2, 2005, 02:43:

English love Spain *As for the Spanish...I've been led to believe that most people in Europe, except the French and the English (for historical reasons, ie: Gibraltar, they have old rivalries), usually see them just fine.*

I don't think this is strictly true

Aside from Gibraltarians and our fishermen, English people love Spain, any historical differences/problems/hatreds are layed squarely at the feet of the French and Germans.

Brits have colonised large parts of the costal areas. No self respecting British gangster can do without a pad on the "Costa Del Crime".

And, sadly, it appears that budget travel to Spain ensures that the Spanish are now being exposed to the pond life element of the British - my last trip to Barcelona all the Brit lager louts were camped outside McDonalds or packed into the Irish pubs fighting and giving the locals a hard time - makes me ashamed to be English

If you think the Spanish dislike South Americans then I hate to think what they call us!

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juancegomez says on Mar 2, 2005, 21:25:

Didn't know that...thanks for the information I had my doubts, I'm not an expert on this, that's why I mentioned that "I've been led to believe" this and that...the information I had didn't make reference to how the "Englishman on the street" thinks, so I'm surely wrong on that.

I do hang around some other Spanish speaking places on the web and offline (well duh), and I've definitely gotten a sense of some of the "not very good" language directed at you "Brits"..."heretics" is one of the more decent terms, and they seem to blame the English for a few things other than Gibraltar, like apparently being partially responsible for distributing the "Black Legend" about Spanish actions in the New World (that's not what I'm saying, that's what I've been told).

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BlondeJamesBond says on Mar 4, 2005, 03:13:

Britain v Spain and the rest of the world Yes - Britain & in particular England's military and colonial history has probably left a lot of countries with grudges against us - The Spanish Armada was put down after Drake had finished his game of bowls - he also buccaneered away half of the wealth Spain was making after the conquest of the 'new world'. And although I am not familiar with the 'Black Legend' I have no doubt that he played his part in anti-spanish propaganda.

However, England versus Spain in history plays no part in my opinion of Spaniards today - I may say I dislike the French and Germans - but it's all in good fun - when I meet someone (be they French or German) it's not really fair to hold their ancestors past against them in anything other than a light hearted manner - unless you are in Spain and your surname is Drake!

*"not very good" language directed at you "Brits"..."heretics"* - I bet football hooligans is another!

Has Colombia had any historical problems with the UK? I know the Argentinians aren't too fond of us.

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Lionheart says on Mar 4, 2005, 12:02:

Spain and the rest of Europe Spain has become Europe's working class vacationland, not just for the British. The coasts are infested with tourism and hardly anything is truely Spanish anymore. You have to drive deep inland to encounter the original Spain. I wouldn't be surprised if the Spanish hate the rest of Europe, but love their money. I doubt they spend much time thinking about Latin American countries and opinions, aside from using their language abilities to exploit them financially. More Spanish corporations are sucking cheap labor from there (except Colombia) than any other nation.

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juancegomez says on Mar 4, 2005, 15:07:

There's a lot of Colombians in Spain though, but curiously enough, by far most of them seem to be pretty well-behaved on average, according to the Spaniard's own statistics (with the usual and loudly broadcasted bad apples too, evidently ).

http://elpais-cali.terra.com.co/historico/nov112004/INT/A511N1A.html

"Has Colombia had any historical problems with the UK? I know the Argentinians aren't too fond of us."

A few...Drake assaulted Cartagena in 1586 and an attack from Vernon was repelled in 1741 by Blas de Lezo.

And apparently we had some "mutual disagreements" with English bankers/investors in the early 1820s-1830s (during the independence and post-independence period) that horribly damaged our "credit rating" for some time. Those were also the beginnings of our foreign debt, but these things aren't general knowledge (except for the Cartagena stuff, which is common knowledge there) nor really the source of much enmity.

On the positive side, a small but valuable number of British subjects (both voluntarilly and as mercenaries) helped Bolivar & co. during the wars for independence.

And the Argentinians aren't too fond of Colombians either (though that's mostly because we crushed them 5-0 soccer in a 1993 match).

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Neonovo says on Mar 4, 2005, 15:36:

During the Malvinas war, Colombia sent "La Flota" Pero La Flota Magdalena....

Paz

Neonovo

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makhno says on Mar 5, 2005, 11:41:

comment les français voient les espingoins hi all
" except the French and the English (for historical reasons, ie: Gibraltar, they have old rivalries"
well i don't really agree with that :) first historicaly spain and france have nealry always been friends. And even if there are bad events (the invasion of spain by napoleon's amry, etc.) that's not a reason why french would'nt like spanish or why spanish would still hate french, i think we (french) love españa, not only for the fiestas, the sun and the beachs, but for the whole spanish culture.
of course there are always little problems, with the fishermen, the soccer, etc. but our two countries are friends!

"The coasts are infested with tourism and hardly anything is truely Spanish anymore."= come on! this is true only for the mediteranean coast! go and see the savages beaches of galicia, asturias and cantabria!

i'd personaly perhaps make a little critical for spanish people: they're sometimes a bit more racist than us, 'mauros', 'negros' and chinese are not very welcome in some places, (i often eard lot about our french 'blacky'& 'monkey' soccer national team, even from some of my good spanish friends :((()

But spain and france took and still have a great role on UE's building, that's why we feel like brothers!

(sorry for my bad english)

syl.

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Lionheart says on Mar 6, 2005, 00:32:

I stand corrected (partly) I agree about the beaches ... meditereanian beaches are the ones infested.

There are many problems between Southern France and Spain, mainly about agricultural issues. Massive blockages of border crossings by farmers are one example. But the rest of France, especially Paris, tend to ignore Southern France, especially their fight for independence - see the OC letters for example. Listening to locals in the Provence only confirmed what I have seen. On the other hand, I have spoken to people from Colombia in Southern France, and they were not happy ... they felt being tossed in with the Spaniards because of their language.

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