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GREATEST THREAT OF KIDNAP - Colombia #4

GREATEST THREAT OF KIDNAP FOR EXPATRIATE WORKERS
1: Iraq
2: Nigeria
3: Haiti
4: Colombia/Mexico
5: Ecuador
6: Venezuela
7: Philippines
Source: ASI Global

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6278484.stm

I love Colombia but I would never travel to Iraq, Nigeria or Haiti, they are the only counties where you have a greater risk of being kidnapped.

By RussianFred on Aug 21, 2007, 00:27 in Friendly Talkzone.

Dolfi says on Aug 21, 2007, 00:42:

Not only this, I don´t see any of these countries offering the atractions that Colombia has.

scotty says on Aug 21, 2007, 01:02:

do you realize three of those countries are listed as the happiest countries in the world.

Get Rhythm, when you got the blues. Johnny Cash

gringolondinense says on Aug 21, 2007, 01:26:

That list is rubbish. Wheres Afghanistan??

scotty says on Aug 21, 2007, 03:22:

gringoolondinense, you are right its just another one of those rubbish list. like you ask wheres afganistan? Iran? and a few other countries.
Also one has to ask, why would he definetely not go to the first 3 but would go to number 4?

The answer is you look at the women of 1,2 & 3 then look at the women of #4 and all the sudden #4 doesnt look all that dangerous.

Get Rhythm, when you got the blues. Johnny Cash

gringolondinense says on Aug 21, 2007, 03:29:

yes scotty, iran should be on there too. Only a few weeks ago, they captured half of the British Navy. Then we had to endure the TV pictures of sailors playing ping pong and card games on TV for a whole bloody week.

elmodefoque says on Aug 21, 2007, 05:12:

Haiti? what do they request for ransom, fokin headless chickens and platanos? jijijijijj

over 5 million colombianos in USA and only 27 barranquilleros, i'm one.Curramba, el mejor vividero del mundo!

elmodefoque says on Aug 21, 2007, 05:13:

modefoque, you better leave 25 headless chickens and 50 platanos under that tree next to the river or your father dies.

over 5 million colombianos in USA and only 27 barranquilleros, i'm one.Curramba, el mejor vividero del mundo!

miamimike says on Aug 21, 2007, 06:17:

RF-myneighbor's niece, a Dominican, who lives near Puerta Plata on the North Coast(DR) and close to the Haiti /DR border has traveled several times to Haiti on Business also to the nearby Beaches. She usually travels with a Haiian Businessman neighbor. The Beaches are amongst the most beautiful in the Carribbean and used to be a very popular Getaway for US Tourists. The haitian people are amongst the nicest you will meet in the World. A Lot of misconceptions, not based on current real world fact, surrounds Haiti and its people. I remember people in 1994 telling me the same about Colombia when I decided to take a cross country bustrip my first time n the country. What did I do? Not listen to any of the so called "Experts", advisors or naysayers for starters.

"Wait a minute. What did you just say? You're predicting $4-a-gallon gas? ... That's interesting. I hadn't heard that." -- Feb. 28, 2008 --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C.,

gabolicious says on Aug 21, 2007, 06:17:

lol Elmo!!!

"The new land of opportunities: Colombia!" ----- Mr Miguel_Clavo on PBH

miamimike says on Aug 21, 2007, 06:19:

LOL-Mexico ranks with Colombia so thats why Expat Retirees continue to pour into Guadalajara, Largest Expat Retirement in the Americas. At last count, 70,000 Americans are retired there and coninue to do so daily. Thats a Good One! Accurate Stats NOT!

"Wait a minute. What did you just say? You're predicting $4-a-gallon gas? ... That's interesting. I hadn't heard that." -- Feb. 28, 2008 --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C.,

gabolicious says on Aug 21, 2007, 06:25:

althought the "reasons" in Colombia and Mexico for kidnapping might be different... at the end of the day both rank number 4...

sad sad sad

"The new land of opportunities: Colombia!" ----- Mr Miguel_Clavo on PBH

gabolicious says on Aug 21, 2007, 06:33:

GIB let's say that that is called secuestro express is like "el paseo millonario"... but in Mexico you hear about kidnappings all the time related "only" to money... that is to say if you seem to have mucha plata or not...

Maybe in Colombia some other reasons as political can be considered, if so I think Mexico is even more dangerous than Colombia... anyway si vos das mucha papaya pues claro que vos podes correr el riesgo de que te secuestren...

"The new land of opportunities: Colombia!" ----- Mr Miguel_Clavo on PBH

gabolicious says on Aug 21, 2007, 06:42:

"it is better to get kidnapped in Mexico for that reason"...

I know you never said so GIB, but at the end of the day... they will kill you no matter if they got what they wanted or not... whatever the reasons might be, call it money or for political issues...the possibility of being alive after being kidnapped are almost ZERO....

"The new land of opportunities: Colombia!" ----- Mr Miguel_Clavo on PBH

elmodefoque says on Aug 21, 2007, 06:47:

chit, if i had a choice, i rather get kidnapped in Haiti, I think my kids in NYC could easily pay for the chickens and platanos

over 5 million colombianos in USA and only 27 barranquilleros, i'm one.Curramba, el mejor vividero del mundo!

gabolicious says on Aug 21, 2007, 06:47:

you will be released.... to be buried....

I had a friend who got killed his family and friends paid the ransom note and he got killed, because the police is involved... if they let you live will be worse for them.

Only if you are a celeb they may let you live, otherwise... you are f*****

"The new land of opportunities: Colombia!" ----- Mr Miguel_Clavo on PBH

gabolicious says on Aug 21, 2007, 06:48:

Only if it's a secuestro express they "kidnapped" you for a couple of hours and then let you go...

"The new land of opportunities: Colombia!" ----- Mr Miguel_Clavo on PBH

elmodefoque says on Aug 21, 2007, 06:51:

you guys are scaring the crap outta many gringos here jijjjjji

over 5 million colombianos in USA and only 27 barranquilleros, i'm one.Curramba, el mejor vividero del mundo!

JChrisusa says on Aug 21, 2007, 06:53:

Afghanistan I could understand but Iran is certainly not a dangerous country for kidnapping. You might be executed for breaking their laws or just being Catholic for that matter but it is their civil system that is messed up. The country itself is pretty safe from Crime, it is just not safe from the government who abuse its power.

gabolicious says on Aug 21, 2007, 06:54:

ssssshhhhh Elmo de eso se trata jajajajaja

just kidding....

"The new land of opportunities: Colombia!" ----- Mr Miguel_Clavo on PBH

miamimike says on Aug 21, 2007, 07:02:

Lets see the Kidnapping Stats for Jalisco State(Guadalajara)Mexico. Funny I follow the Daily News in Guadalajara and have friends who live there. There may be Kidnappings and Muggings in Mexico's Border towns but then for that matter, Border towns(mexico) have always been unsafe. Show me the Stats in Guadalajara where those 70,000 Northamericans are retired.Show me all those Kidnapped Americans; how come the Americans living there haven't yet heard about all the Danger you are talking about! Show Me The Numbers!

"Wait a minute. What did you just say? You're predicting $4-a-gallon gas? ... That's interesting. I hadn't heard that." -- Feb. 28, 2008 --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C.,

gabolicious says on Aug 21, 2007, 07:07:

maybe because I live in Mexico City.... and if it's an american who is being kidnapped, the American Embassy will negotiate not the mexican government... maybe... because they live in Guadalajara, mexican government takes care of them more than they take care of mexicans...

"The new land of opportunities: Colombia!" ----- Mr Miguel_Clavo on PBH

RussianFred says on Aug 21, 2007, 07:12:

I agree with gringoinbo.. take my ATM money no problem. And take my ex-wife too! USA doesn't negotiate therefore Colombia is a big problem.

Annual Drug Deaths: Tobacco: 395,000, Alcohol: 125,000, 'Legal' Drugs: 38,000, Illegal Drug Overdoses: 5,200, Marijuana: 0. Considering government subsidies of tobacco, just what is our government protecting us from in the drug war?--Ralph Nader

webmanco says on Aug 21, 2007, 07:39:

MiamiMike
A Lot of misconceptions, not based on current real world fact, surrounds Haiti and its people. I remember people in 1994 telling me the same about Colombia when I decided to take a cross country bustrip my first time n the country. What did I do? Not listen to any of the so called "Experts", advisors or naysayers for starters

_________

Nice way to put it, there are lots of scaremongers, experts on Security and Finance, sounds familiar??

But, I'm going to start making some assumptions here.... Which means I might actually end up making an ass out of myself ..........Thu 04 17, 2008 11:34 am

gabolicious says on Aug 21, 2007, 07:48:

GIB I though the same: "In other words no one is going to pay if they kill all the kidnapped victims....." but when is a friend of yours or a relative the kidnapped, you hope and pray for they release the victim once you've paid... unfortunately sometimes money is not enough for them...

"The new land of opportunities: Colombia!" ----- Mr Miguel_Clavo on PBH

gabolicious says on Aug 21, 2007, 07:50:

BTW GIB... I didn't know that about the car... if you pay they will find your car?? I didn't know about it...

"The new land of opportunities: Colombia!" ----- Mr Miguel_Clavo on PBH

gabolicious says on Aug 21, 2007, 08:04:

LOL got you!!!!

"The new land of opportunities: Colombia!" ----- Mr Miguel_Clavo on PBH

gabolicious says on Aug 21, 2007, 08:45:

let's say I don't consider myself an expert just giving my point of view according to what I've lived here... Mexico City not Guadalajara...

BTW some american friends of mine have been to Colombia and Mexico and they return home alive and kicking...

;)

"The new land of opportunities: Colombia!" ----- Mr Miguel_Clavo on PBH

RussianFred says on Aug 21, 2007, 09:16:

I would like to see the 26 page report.

RussianFred says on Aug 21, 2007, 09:23:

Here is the link. Wow, I did know so many people are being kidnapped in the world. God bless America!

http://www.claytonconsultants.com/newsletter.asp

http://www.asiglobalresponse.com/

RussianFred says on Aug 21, 2007, 09:36:

Good news Colombian murders and kidnappings are down.

Colombia, 23 April 2007: A Spain-based center for the study of violence issued a report, which stated that
murders in Colombia have dropped by 34.95% and kidnappings by 74.07% in the past five years. Investigators
at the center compiled statistics issued by at least 15 Colombian organizations in order to conduct the study.
The success in reducing violent crime rates is attributed to prevention and early intervention programs, as well
as to the fight against drug trafficking and poverty. (caracol.com.co, 23 April 2007)

Chelesupercono says on Aug 21, 2007, 10:46:

This topic of conversation is like beating a dead horse........the extranjeros that actually live in Colombia or frequently go there are well aware of the security issues......the people that are afraid should not go to Colombia....end of story. This constant exchange of statistics and articles really doesn't change the minds of anyone that is afraid to come to Colombia.....NEVER! Especially Americans that know nothing about the outside world that is not told to them by the GESTAPO PRESS of America......except for what GHB tells them after his conversations with GOD.....

never go to bed with someone crazier then you are, you will do it and you will regret it.......

Mr. Hollywood says on Aug 21, 2007, 11:15:

I have a relative who was in the K&R insurance business for a long time. His take on the Mexico vs. Colombia situation was that kidnappings in Mexico tended to be more brutal and violent, resulting in a lot of victims missing an ear or a finger or something that was sent along with a ransom note, and they were usually resolved within days. Whereas the Colombian kidnappings took place with a much more relaxed pace and tended to involve months of waiting for the next contact, long marches through the jungle, etc.

I also think the Clayton ratings are based on raw numbers not per capita. So given that Mexico has about 3 times as many people as Colombia you need to take that into account, too.

Either way, like GIB said above, the vast majority of these things go unreported so any source based on public domain information is likely to be skewed.

RussianFred says on Aug 21, 2007, 12:17:

The bottom line is that we live in a new and crazy world. Whether you live in America or Colombia you should always be aware of your environment. The terrorist attacks in America are not over. Nor is the kidnapping and murder in Colombia. You can not live your life in fear. I will continue exploring Colombia but with my eyes open.

Chelesupercono says on Aug 21, 2007, 14:03:

Sorry I meant G.W.B.

never go to bed with someone crazier then you are, you will do it and you will regret it.......

Chelesupercono says on Aug 21, 2007, 14:16:

Probably talking to God again......

never go to bed with someone crazier then you are, you will do it and you will regret it.......

Rubito says on Aug 21, 2007, 20:37:

I heard exactly what Mr Hollywood said from my Mexican friends. You are much more likely to end up dead or maimed in Mexico. Not that it matters to me personally, I'd either kill people and escape, die trying or just kill myself.

I'm planning on spending a few weeks in Nigeria next year actually. I've always wanted to visit that place. Think of all the great music from this part of the world that has roots there!

---Violence is the price of freedom.---

Robert Jorge says on Aug 21, 2007, 21:14:

I betcha there is no hot water in Nigeria.

--"I believe in making the world safe for our children. But not for our children's children, because I don't think that children should be having sex." - Jack Handy

john_stark says on Aug 21, 2007, 21:28:

They say there's no hot water in Colombia either. Of course there is hot water everywhere I go but then I'm among the hoi polloi of Colombian hot water users.

RussianFred says on Aug 21, 2007, 21:39:

Rubito you are either very brave or crazy.

scotty says on Aug 21, 2007, 22:35:

Rubito are you gonna ride your bike in Nigeria to?

Get Rhythm, when you got the blues. Johnny Cash

Rubito says on Aug 22, 2007, 23:15:

Nope. No bike. Well, maybe. :P

RussianFred you are either very trollish or very stupid :P

Who gives a damn about hot water? The climate there is pretty much like Barranquilla unless you go north where it gets drier poorer and more and more Islamic. You can count on my ass not going that way. There is less street crime up there but more poverty and more Sharia. No fucking thank you.

I think people who go to the rural areas are the fucking crazy ones. I'll go just about anywhere on the planet as long as it's a CITY!

You can also count on my ass staying in the cities and not going down to the Niger delta region where there IS a terrorist threat. And I will be fine.

---Violence is the price of freedom.---

RussianFred says on Aug 22, 2007, 23:43:

Rubitio, No name calling please!!!!.

Robert Jorge says on Aug 25, 2007, 22:45:

The hot water comment was a joke ... based on several rookie traveler's posts on their experiences when first arriving in Colombia. You said you were going to Nigeria for the first time ... I thought you might have a sense of humor. Sorry; "fucking" sense of humor.

--"I believe in making the world safe for our children. But not for our children's children, because I don't think that children should be having sex." - Jack Handy

goin_south says on Aug 25, 2007, 23:01:

I think if you are in Iraq, it's called 'prisoner/dead meat'.
not kidnapped.

and, thank you.

RussianFred says on Sep 2, 2007, 22:09:

If Colombia is so safe, like any city in America, why do governments advise against going there?

http://www.smartraveller.gov.au/reconsider.html

I bet the brits, canadians, french, etc advise against!

Rubito says on Sep 2, 2007, 22:18:

Yeah, real fucking accurate

Penalties for possession, use, or trafficking in illegal drugs in Colombia are severe and include lengthy imprisonment in local jails.

Possession of up to a certain amount of drugs is LEGAL in Colombia, they glossed over that little fact, just as one example.

I think you should exercise precaution when in Colombia but the security risk isn't enough IMO to reconsider travelling there.

---Violence is the price of freedom.---

goin_south says on Sep 2, 2007, 22:21:

RFred... did someone say Colombia was safe?

and, thank you.

goin_south says on Sep 2, 2007, 22:23:

Hey Fred, I bet if you go to Colombia 50 times, without reservation,... you only get kidnapped one of those times ;)

and, thank you.

RussianFred says on Sep 2, 2007, 23:06:

Most people on PBH will state that Colombia is as safe as any America big city. I lived in the South Bronx for twenty years and never seem a shooting or robbery. I moved to Atlanta 5 years ago. I live in a multi-million dollar neighborhood. I seen a car jacking and shoot in my sub division. Go figure!

I have made about 12 trips to Colombia this year and have not had any problems. This is a great country but it can be dangerous. The funny thing is that during every trip I question myself “what the f… am I doing here�?. Ok, it’s for the Chicas.

Rubito says on Sep 2, 2007, 23:10:

Atlanta is MUCH more violent than NYC. That doesn't surprise me at all. Atlanta is one of the most violent cities in the country.

Here you are safe at night because the KGB, err, sorry, NYPD will accompany you everywhere.

---Violence is the price of freedom.---

RussianFred says on Sep 2, 2007, 23:17:

NYC is now one of the safest cities in the world. I was there when kids were killed for their sheep skin coat or sneakers. Rudy and 911 changed New York. And you are right about Atlanta it's one of the most dangerous cities in America.

Rubito says on Sep 2, 2007, 23:36:

It STILL wasn't THAT bad even when it was bad. People like to exaggerate about NYC like it was ever the most dangerous place on Earth at one time. It never even got its feet wet when it comes to real violence.

You wanna talk REAL violence, Detroit, early 1990s. Now THAT was a violent town! The moment you crossed 8 mile you could hear gunfire in the distance, ANY night after the sun went down, 365 days a year.

NYC's crime was bad from 1988-1992, five years out of its history, the rest of the time it has been a very safe city. And those years were the years where the government was trying to flush Escobar's organization out of NYC and Miami, which accounts for the VAST majority of those murders.

I bet you couldn't find more reports of INNOCENT kids getting killed over their sneakers or clothes in a single year in NYC than I could count on my hands. I'll even give you a hint, start with 1992, that was the year with the most homicides :P

---Violence is the price of freedom.---

goin_south says on Sep 2, 2007, 23:40:

Fred.... I think it's the chicas, and the calculated risks.

and, thank you.