foreign student beaten by Armed forces

juancegomez says on Jan 20, 2006, 11:06:

An unfortunate instance of abuse... ...sadly, it's very probably not the first nor the last time that some of those guys take advantage of their uniform in order to do such things.

Seems like that Marine unit was made up of some quite undisciplined and even potentially corrupt personnel, from the commanding officer downward, from what the guy's story can tell us. He should file all the necessary complaints, both here and abroad.

Thankfully, at least he does mention that one friendly policeman intervened and helped him (not every person in uniform is automatically a potential abuser).

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cali373 says on Jan 20, 2006, 11:27:

National Police It is true to say that this kind of abuse happens less with the National Police? They seem to have a better overall record than the Army.

Smile if you are a thinker!

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007CA says on Jan 20, 2006, 12:19:

GIB What protest? Did you read the article?
My friend was not protesting, nor did he stop traffic, nor did he create a "heck of a mess". Where are you getting that info from? And by the way, he's not a "kid".

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007CA says on Jan 20, 2006, 12:31:

GIB just don't go around making assumptions from out of nowhere. Also, are you saying that senseless beatings don't happen in Colombia, even if from the military? if so, that is quite ignorant.

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Wastelandlive says on Jan 20, 2006, 12:39:

Doesn't sound senseless Sounds like it was a robbery.

But there sure is a lot missing from the story. This is a personal friend of yours? Can you tell us how he ended up in a barracks with them - for crying out loud - on a military base? He's an American ethnomusicologist doing research for his thesis, right?

And what a policeman was doing in earshot of the barracks... on a military base? A policeman who happened to be a friend of his?

Don't get me wrong - I'm not defending undisciplined soldiers. They're human, and fully capable of evil, and if this happened, they simply need to be severely punished, and their unit commander sacked.

But frankly... there's a lot to the story that does not ring true. Why?

Wasteland

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007CA says on Jan 20, 2006, 12:50:

Yes, he's a personal friend of mine. I haven't spoken directly to him yet, but from the article it sounds like it was a routine check, probably a military checkpoint. He ended up in the barracks because they brought him there and enclosed him in a cuartel. (Did you read the article?)
It sounds like they would have tried to rob him if they had continued.
Yes, he has many friends in the area since that is where he frequents while doing his cultural, ethnomusicology research. (When he's out of the city and in rural areas, he interviews local musicians)
Don't know what else to tell you at this point.

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Wastelandlive says on Jan 20, 2006, 13:00:

Ya... I read the article. Ya - I got it. A routine stop, now we're off to the barracks.

That's kind of... abnormal.

Yes he has many friends in the area? They happen to hang out in earshot of a barracks?

You do realize that military bases are normally restricted to the military, right? That even a police officer would have to pass a sentry, and have permission and reason to be there?

Sorry, again... fishy. But I'll have to admit - at least he's signed a name. If Michael Birambaum actually exists, that lends some credibility to the story. And he's made a detailed accusation of the particular unit involved.

I'm guessing something happened, and its not quite what it seems. What's novel here is somebody making it public. I hope he's handling his media campaign from NYC. Keep us posted.

Wasteland

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007CA says on Jan 20, 2006, 13:05:

wasteland what are you suggesting happened then?
Yes, he really does exist, a great guy.

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silviat says on Jan 20, 2006, 15:00:

However this happen, or whatever this guy was doing there is not excuse for such abuse of authority. If the guy was doing something bad he must have been taken to the police or an authority, not beated like he was.

... sin palabras

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007CA says on Jan 20, 2006, 15:32:

gracias, silvia exacto.
no matter what happened, beating was not justified.

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Wastelandlive says on Jan 21, 2006, 09:20:

What am I suggesting happened then? I'm not suggesting anything. I'm telling you that the story stinks.

I'm noting that the details don't add up, and I've learned from life experience that when something doesn't make a lot of sense, it's because I'm missing information.

I'd love to hear how this one ends.

Wasteland

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Sr Tertius says on Jan 21, 2006, 09:35:

007CA: Thanks for sharing I'm surprised of how open and detailed the accusations are, and that they are made public. Takes some courage to do that. I'm sure Michael is well aware of possible consequences.

And, please, ignore the sad display of ignorance (arbitrary detentions? collaboration between a militarized national police and navy? In Colombia? UNHEARD OF!) They don't even have the decency of apologizing after their stupidity.

"When the finger points to the moon, the fool looks at the finger" (Chinese proverb)

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