Finding management jobs in Colombia?

Wastelandlive says on Mar 20, 2006, 13:10:

Yegads. The arrogance of it all. It's no wonder we sometimes annoy them.

Wasteland

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utopiacowboy says on Mar 20, 2006, 13:12:

You're right, dude. For these high paying management jobs, they need to import gringos because the Colombians themselves are too stupid and badly educated to fill them. There's gold in them thar hills, boys.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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Crazy4Cali says on Mar 20, 2006, 13:28:

I don't know.... I don't know if you've noticed, but there are already thousands, if not millions of Colombians with advanced degrees working well below their education. Underemployed is the economic term.

In Colombia, a [legal] "suit and tie" job at a good Colombian company might pay the equivalent of $20-30K (US) Maybe $50K if you know someone who knows someone. Living like a Colombian, that might be about the same as making $100-150K in the U.S. (depending on the neighborhood).

You don't mention having any network of people in Colombia, so my guess is that, until you get your network of people in Colombia in your field, your chance of any job is slim (assuming you have the appropriate visa status) and your chance of a good job, virtually nil. If you have a network of people, then that would raise your chances back up to slim.

Practically, your best bet is to get a job with an American company that has an office in Colombia, but, again, that's probably not going to be too easy to find.

Happy hunting.

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toneloc24 says on Mar 20, 2006, 15:33:

LOL at UC and Wastelandlive. Pretty funny stuff. Wonder how many more of these we're gonna see in the near future, thanks to CNN.com.

To the OP, it's great that you're making $130k. Good for you. Seriously.

In Colombia, to clue you in, highly-degreed professionals without real connections might make 10-20% of that, and be considered well-off. People making $25-50USD per day are probably in the top 20% of the country's earners. Many people make much less than that. This is the employment pool that employers have to choose from.

And don't for a second think that there aren't educated, qualified Colombians who aren't unemployed or underemployed as well. There are quality universities throughout the country. So I hope you don't think that the job market is anything like the USA's.

Closest you'll find to a Monster.com is probably El Tiempo, the Bogota newspaper. (http://eltiempo.terra.com.co)

"PBH is dead!!!!"

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viewpoint says on Mar 20, 2006, 16:22:

Well I know the president of DEAR JOHN LETTER

Well I know the president of a large "public" company in Colombia that employs 1000s of people in several countries (primarily Colombia) that is US educated with a masters degree in business adminstration receiving a salary including year end bonus totaling $135,000 anually.

The chances of you finding employment anywhere beyond $25,000 per year are slim.

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Brian858 says on Mar 20, 2006, 16:37:

Not even Uribe makes $130k/yr. Maybe there are some positions in import / export that pay that well. But you would need to be willing to swallow a lot of packages.

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Crazy4Cali says on Mar 20, 2006, 16:37:

And don't forget your visa and I don't mean your credit card. The original poster said he was planning to move to Colombia with his girlfriend.

Unless he applies for some sort of investor or retirement visa, and has the money to qualify for that, he'll have to go back to the U.S. before his tourist visa reaches it's max of 180 days/year. AND you can't work (honestly) while visiting on a tourist visa.

But even with a visa that allows working, from what I understand, the best (if not the only) way to find a job that isn't a temporary english teacher is in person. Personal relationships are everything.

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utopiacowboy says on Mar 20, 2006, 16:57:

GringoD, I was being my usual sarcastic wanker self. I have the highest respect for the competence and educational levels of the Colombians. I do not think that they need gringo carpet baggers coming down to show them how it's done.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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Brian858 says on Mar 20, 2006, 17:04:

1000 jobs that pay well in San Diego, California. You may find something comparable in this list:

http://www.sandiegobudget.org/news/Top_1000_CY05_all_earnings.pdf

It's not Colombia but getting hispanic rather rapidly.

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utopiacowboy says on Mar 20, 2006, 21:37:

It's been pretty dull here on PBH lately, I agree. I guess I can't blame a guy for trying.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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caulfield2 says on Mar 21, 2006, 05:12:

Well, having lived down here for 7-8 months, there are many allures.

In particular, as a teacher, the lifestyle you can have teaaching in an American school (bi-lingual, SACS-accredited) is much better than what you would have in the United States. Whereas the average teacher in the US is "Strato 3/4," in Colombia, you're definitely a 5 and maybe even a 6 if you push it and use your credit card, lol.

I'm not so sure I want to stay in teaching, so I am looking at some of the same scenarios. Starting a non-profit. Teaching at a university full-time. Almost all of the things I REALLY want to do involve financial sacrifice, particularly in comparison to the salary I am making now. However, my quality of life and happiness would be higher, I'm sure of that.

Colombia gets in your blood. I don't dislike the US or Bush anymore now than I did in July of last year, I've grown to appreciate more the everyday things you have in the US, and also the cultural differences between the two countries, especially the importance of family.

I don't know if I would even be able to work for a US corporation down here, because I still have a long ways to go with Spanish fluency and I have never enjoyed the corporate lifestyle. I suppose, I was married and had children to support, I would prefer to work down here for a US corporation than in the US as a public school teacher. Starting small businesses down here seem to be fraught with peril and stories of spectacular obstacles...and, even if I had, say, $500,000, the idea of starting a Blockbuster or McDonald's here in Armenia has pretty much zero appeal to me as a person who wants to make some kind of positive contribution to the world.

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Wastelandlive says on Mar 21, 2006, 07:09:

LOL... Morphus You crack me up. No doubt, this isn't the first time you've contemplated opening a Medallin mansion.

GringoD... if you didn't see the arrogance, then you must be kind of thick. You want gas on the fire? I'll give it to you:

The post that started this thread might simply be considered ingnorant if it were coming from an American who had never travelled. Coming from somebody who claims to have lived in Spain, Argentina, Chile and GUATEMALA (of all places) it's downright assenine.

Clues to the clueless:

1) $130K in Manhattan is not - I'm afraid to say - all that. So you shouldn't be half as impressed with epopuli as he is with himself.

2) "Gente de Area?" This guy thinks he's going to stroll in sight unseen, slap his resume on the table and become a regional manager? (This is where that funny "wa-wa-wa" sound we used to hear on the bloopers shows gets played.) Obviously SOMEBODY really doesn't understand Latin America all that well.

3) "Monster.com?" "Yahoo?" Hmmm... let's see: those jobs aren't posted there because they go directly to friends, family, and proven employees within the organization. Colombia doesn't have the kind of economy where firms have to post job openings on the internet to fill important position. Heeellllooooooo...

4) Dude doesn't even appear to have work authorization. Nuff said.

It's not impossible. But you have to pay your dues, and that involves something like this:

If you're top dog - executive level - you might get placed with an executive headhunter. Maybe.

If not, you get a job with a multinational HERE, in the US, that has operations in Colombia. Something like Goodyear, or P&G. You take a pay cut, and you spend a few years proving yourself to THEM. IF they like you, you throw your hat in the circle to be considered for one of thier coveted positions as a home office transplant to their overseas operations.

If you're lucky, you work hard, and you sell yourself right, you might end up in Colombia making $50K-$80K. Maybe.

You don't freakin move down there with your girlfriend, your resume, and your attitude and blithely ask, "So, where are all the great jobs at?"

Unrepentatively,

WLL

Wasteland

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utopiacowboy says on Mar 21, 2006, 07:12:

Buen dicho, Senor.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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Monpirri says on Mar 21, 2006, 07:53:

Buen dicho what? You are the other individual who antagonize Colombia and Colombians and when you screw up with your derogatory comments, you raise your little French/Guadalupe flag about it’s just my sarcastic, humorous/intellect jokes or behavior.
GringoD, has several great positive comments towards Colombia on PBH and he was not just joking around, or playing marimonda.

The life spam of a taste bud is ten days

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utopiacowboy says on Mar 21, 2006, 08:03:

Te quiero much tambien, Monpi Te quiero mucho tambien, Monpirri.

Does Monpirri speak for you, GringoD?

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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kat1 (Moderator) (Trustee board) says on Mar 21, 2006, 08:29:

Marimonda, its been ages but ages that I haven't heard that word lol. very Costeño

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JMOON87 says on Mar 21, 2006, 08:40:

Might be Better Instead of making 130k you may be better having that in the bank and than try colombia and even than i dont think 130k is that much even in colombia without having any earning power i know i would be lucky to make $500 a month working for someone there....My wife and I have thought about moving there only because here in Florida my commision job has went way down while all my bills have went way up .It has gotten cheaper to rent than to buy in most of Florida now that prices have skyrocketed and interest rates have went up .

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caslug says on Mar 21, 2006, 08:43:

WORK FOR WALMART! There was an article recently about Walmart strategy of expanding overseas faster than US. Another article yesterday stated that they expect to hire 250,000 workers in china next 5 yrs and they're already having opening stores in Central America. Start working for walmart as a greeter today in anytown, USA then couple years later when they open up in Colombia, apply for a slot as a greeter-trainer!

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mariasman says on Mar 21, 2006, 08:49:

Hey Slug How is the Job hunting going? Did you even get a job teaching yet? Just curious if that school was even worth it. I am living here in Cali and will be forever.

mariasman

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mariasman says on Mar 21, 2006, 08:50:

Mariasman

mariasman

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caslug says on Mar 21, 2006, 08:58:

MM..i'm back in the states since Dec.. BUT all the fellow students did get decent jobs, but not till january. Are you married yet? does that allow you to work in COL? If it does then you can go apply at many places and have a decent shot of getting work. Contact colombo americano and other schools.

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mariasman says on Mar 21, 2006, 09:05:

Thanks dude. Yes, I am married and actually, we are going to Bogota this next week to make me a legal alien here in Cali. I will then be able to work here legally in Colombia and if I don't like this whole English teaching Situation, my wife has contacts with other types of possible work with other foriegns. I wont make a tone but oh well. Why did you go back? Are you coming back? just curious. Take care slug.

mariasman

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caslug says on Mar 21, 2006, 09:40:

MM.. w/ your background.. you should think about advertising as english teacher to medical professional(on top of regular teaching). And if you have work visa thru marriage, that opens LOTS of doors. LOTS of schools will consider taking you on, even if it's just part time. Then you can get exp(so less need to take a class).

My problem was the lack of work visa, without that, my options was VERY LIMITED, however, if i stuck around couple of more months OR return in may. Then i probably could find a job that pay decently and provide work visa. A met a nurse from tampa in cali, his plan is to work in the US 6 mos and spend 6 mos in COL(has a serious GF in cali), guess because nursing allows you to work on/off like that.

I hope to return to COL later this year if some things work out work wise.

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utopiacowboy says on Mar 21, 2006, 09:56:

Je pense que je dois écrire en français pour un homme ici ainsi il pense que je dis de mauvaises choses au sujet de lui.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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JMOON87 says on Mar 21, 2006, 10:13:

MARIASMAN ? Mariasman, how do you like living in Cali and what made you decide there over the other possible citys in colombia ? that is where my wife is from and i spent about 3 months there last year but i have told her if i was gonna live in colombia i would rather try cartagena and be near the beach but i know the cost of living is alot more there .

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caulfield2 says on Mar 21, 2006, 10:15:

I don't know where you are going to make $50,000 like that....maybe Bogota or Medellin, but, aside from illegal endeavors, I couldn't imagine it.

And I don't think $130,000 in NYC is the equivalent of $50K USD here. I would imagine you would have only $60-70,000 after all your various taxes...but I would argue that living on $30-35,000 USD in Colombia (with the exceptions of Strato 6 in Bogota, CTG and Medellin) would be like $130K in New York.

Maybe Armenia is too far removed from reality...or Caicedonia/Sevilla, where I visited this past weekend, but those numbers are incomprehensible in dollars or pesos for most of us.

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mariasman says on Mar 21, 2006, 11:36:

Hey Moon!!! To be quite honest with you, Its not like Cali was my first choice. Its just that this is where my wife lives and has a house and honestly, I have not really tried some of the other cities except for some of the surrounding towns and Bogota twice. I really didn't care for Bogota all that much because it is just that. It is a big major city( beautiful city) and Unless you can find a kickbutt job there, I would rather be here in Cali. I have since fallen in love with Cali and the people here and I guess that after living here so long as a resident and not a tourist, I am just starting to become accustomed to the Cali surroundings. I am also starting to get used to all the streets here and how to get to the south( By myself without instructions) and back to the north and how to fight all the crazy taxi's. I guess the thing that really attracts me about Cali is first and foremost, MY WIFE and then just the way of life here. Calm and happy and for me peaceful. I love the little cafeterias here especially some of the Cafe Mulatto's here in Cali as me and my wife are starting to become super coffee date addicts. Cali is trully one of the treasures of Colombia. It is very safe here( Besides the taxi Drivers and common crime that you can find in any city). You know, I spent most of my life near the beaches in Cali(Fornia) and after a while, you can become a little tired of them( Except mission beach in Sandiego and South beach in Miami,,, gotta love those beaches). I say just live wherever makes you happy and wherever is affordable. Live happily and visit the beaches or live at the beaches and live penny by penny. You really can't go wrong in Cali.

mariasman

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mariasman says on Mar 21, 2006, 11:39:

Hey Slug!!! Let me know when you are back. We can go get a beer

mariasman

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mariasman says on Mar 21, 2006, 11:40:

Hey Moon Let me know if you make it to Cali and we can go get a beer too.

mariasman

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Monpirri says on Mar 21, 2006, 11:49:

Marimonda Sí, ese amigo tuyo es un marimonda, solo se pasa diciendote piropos y despues perjudica la imagen de Colombia con su ignorancia sobre nuestro país.
Palabras como marimonda y muchas más, yo las capto de las televisión colombiana. Esta ultima estuvo de moda en las noticias sobre en el carnaval de Barranquilla.

Si sigue jodiendo lo voy a guisar, no se donde oí esto, lol.

The life spam of a taste bud is ten days

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JMOON87 says on Mar 21, 2006, 11:58:

Will be there april or may Mariasman, i will look you up - we will be there end of april or May as we are waiting for my wifes Travel document and she is pregnant so she wants to see her Mom -trust me if it were up to my wife we would live in Cali close to her family-i live in florida so used to the beaches but we have to investgate both cali and cartagena as far as where is best for us to possibly live i just thought cartagena may be better because of the tourist factor if we could come up with a small business idea but probaly dreaming lol-i just feel as a long term investment the closer to the beach the better but i am ignorant as far as living expenses etc there ..... in cali We hang out at Unicentro most of the time(about a 15 minute walk) eating at Leno's or having a few drinks at one of the outdoor bars ..I love every city i have visited so far and have had no problems .

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Monpirri says on Mar 21, 2006, 11:58:

Je t'adore tambien, UTC Just don't put me down in front of the world, nor compare me with your planet.

The life spam of a taste bud is ten days

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utopiacowboy says on Mar 21, 2006, 12:56:

Le monde est ici? Je ne le crois pas.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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caslug says on Mar 21, 2006, 13:32:

mm..take blanco & negro bus line.. or la quinta route.. they north/south. when i lived in cali, i get from all the major mall on bus. Cosmocentro was easist all blanco/negro pass it. there's a neat little coffee/eatery across from colombo americano near avienda sexta(in san fernando area), it's an orange building.

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Pete E says on Mar 21, 2006, 15:12:

If you WORKED in Chile/Argentina/Mexico/Guatemala/Spain you might have some idea what you are up against trying to get a high level job here.Even if you happened to be the most qualified person,highly unlikely going up against people with experience here,you would never get the job without connections.Big connections.Top level jobs do not go to outsiders at all I think in Colombia.
You are right getting the job beforehand from the US is the way,you7 basically wouldn't have a prayer getting one here.So if you find a US company with a presence in Colombia you might want to try getting hired by them.You might have to work for them in the US then convince them to transfer you.Probably very difficult to do but probably your only option to get employed in your area of expertise.
But,think outside the box a little.Can you work from here doing a job that pays a US Salary?One of my friends is a software engineer,makes 6 figures working in Colombia.Its all computer web based so it really doesn't matter where he is living or doing the work from.
How about starting a business from Colombia using cheap Colombian labor to do work in the US market?Like telemarketing.I know 3 guys working on this,the jury is still out if it will make any money.Best if you already have an operation going you can just move here.
Business?I think there are opportunities here,so many things are done so badly.But if you are going to sell in to the relatively poor Colombian market its difficult.
Some sort of investment skeme might be your best chance.Not that they are likely to work but thats more likely than getting a good job here.
So $130,000 salary in New York City equals what here?
There are 2 ways of looking at it.Doing the same job you would probably be real lucky to make $30,000.
The other way is how much money do you need for a comparable lifestle?Probably half that.You would be higher up in status but things are not so cheap here.Again yesterday at the grocery store I estimate I probably payed about 50% MORE than I would have for the same stuff in the US.Cars are alot more.Anything electronic is alot more.So whats so cheap?Rent,especially compared to NYC,but you might do about as well in a southern US city.Eating ouit and intertainment.
At good restaurants its not cheap but maybe half what it could be in the US at expensive restaurants.Fast food there is cheaper.
Story about the job market.A colombian I know has gone to lots of job interviews.He grew up in the US,perfect english and spanish,Colobian University grad,smart guy.Usually he considers himself the best qualified candidate.He never gets the job.That is always someones relative or friend.One job he had he worked his way up to a position setting up exports to the US.Once the process was in place the bosses sister in law jot the job,he got layed off.
I don't mean to discourage you.But you are not going to just waltz in to a high level job in Colombia.It would be easier to start a company than get hired by one,not that thats easy.
But if you think creatively there might be a way to live here.You will probably have to live here at lowered expaectations while you are figuring it out.

Pete

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caslug says on Mar 21, 2006, 15:30:

hey pete! good to see your post on pbh.. speaking of adrian, did he ever return the laptop? did you move down to la jardin? or are you still living in the north?

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rmleon says on Mar 22, 2006, 04:19:

One more comment Why don't you try to setup your own business?
If she is from Colombia she can help you, I guess.

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poco says on Mar 22, 2006, 09:06:

Maybe it is solar sun flare activity ? Maybe Armenia is too far removed from reality

I’ve had that exact thought. The cause must be the combined effects of radiation emitted by the computer and mind control from cell phone towers.

I do believe it is too big. You can select English at this website.

Those that think Colombians lack education and/or initiative should put on the aluminum foil hat. Nope,, they need increased opportunities.

The chance of finding ANY MANAGEMENT JOB has a 99.99999 percent chance of failure. Marrying the owners daughter won’t guarantee a high salary but you can’t put a price on the fringe benefits.

"When you men get home and face an anti-war protester, look him in the eyes and shake his hand. Then, wink at his girlfriend, because she knows she's dating a pussy." Quote - General Tommy Franks

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epopuli1 says on Apr 5, 2006, 12:15:

I'm the original poster I have to say I wasn't expecting such vehement responses. Not sure how my response can be considered arrogant? I wasn't saying how much I make to impress anyone. Heck, that salary in New York is probably slighlty above average at best. And I'm obviously not expecting to find anything similar in Colombia. The whole point of my post was to inquire if anyone had any useful suggestions on how to find jobs more at the management level. For those who provided helpful suggestions, thank you. For the others, get a life.

I realize getting a good job anywhere in Latin America is more often than not about who you know. And I'm very aware of the Visa issues. I realize that the second-best way to find a good job is likely through a Colombian head-hunter or of course finding a job through a US company that will let me work there. In fact one of my good friends here in New York did work for one of the top firms there and is currently trying to help me out. Having said that, if anyone could suggest any other firms, methods, etc.. that would be most appreciated.

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Albatross says on Apr 6, 2006, 04:36:

Teaching One thing I can tell you is that you won't get rich teaching.
I talked with a couple of professors in the language department at the Universidad de Antioquia (a well-respected public university in Medellin).
This is what they said:

1) Bachelors Degree required (Masters preferred).
2) WORK Visa required (NOT Tourist Visa).
3) Previous teaching experience required.

Salary: 15,000 - 18,000 Pesos ($6 - $8) per hour. One course is 4 hours per week, therefore even teaching 3 or 4 courses at a time (highly unlikely), one would make less than $150 per week.

They suggested contacting a private institute because the requirements might be less stringent and the pay a little better, but it would still be very difficult to break $10,000 per year teaching.

“Democracy - a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H.L. Mencken

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. says on Apr 6, 2006, 05:37:

Desafortunadamente.... Desafortunadamente, el unico trabajo que un extranjero puede hacer en Colombia es hacer cualquier trabajo que no es gustado por los Colombianos, como limpiar, barrer, profesor de ingles o cosas asi, asi tengas un doctorado en Harvard. "A MENOS" que seas inversionista y decidas colocar tu propia empresa en colombia, el gobierno e dara una visa automatica de negocios. Mejor dicho, aca en colombia finciona de la misma forma en que funciona en Estados Unidos.

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