Emeralds

bhill says on Jan 25, 2008, 11:46:

Bargaining is definitely expected. Just speaking for me, I'm always a bit hesitant to but a gem that is supposed to be of very high quality (diamond, emerald, whatever) because stones that look the same to the eye can have different values and I'm not smart enough to tell the difference. Shady dealers can make a less expensive emerald look like a more expensive one by soaking it in oil, and who knows what other schemes. So yes, I've bought some emeralds in Colombia, but nothing over a few hundred dollars.
If you do get suckered, well, there is a long line of bigger suckers on eBay waiting to buy your mistake from you.

-Brian

webmanco says on Jan 25, 2008, 11:57:

When buying emeralds at Downtown Bogotá bargaining is not enough.

But, I'm going to start making some assumptions here.... Which means I might actually end up making an ass out of myself ..........Thu 04 17, 2008 11:34 am

Mr. Hollywood says on Jan 25, 2008, 12:11:

Here's a suggestion: Buy something you really like and think is beautiful at a price you feel comfortable paying. Then forget about everything else and be happy.

Almost every week someone is on this board trying to figure out how to a killing buying Colombian emeralds right out of the dragon's lair. You need to be really knowledgeable to do that, and it's an industry in itself. Why do people think they can step into a trade that goes back thousands of years and suddenly outdo the experts?

Just to be clear, that comment isn't directed at the original poster, here, but at the larger phenomenon.

Costa Rica Jones says on Jan 25, 2008, 13:18:

Hollywood,

Very true. But just like you can buy good rum in Nicaragua for pennies compared to what you could buy it for in the States-- I don't think the origan posters question is really THAT naive.

I'm wondering if there aren't retail vendors here that would sell a stone for X, whereas the same stone sold in the U.S. would sell for 3X ?

But I don't know enough about emeralds. Maybe it doesn't work that way and every stone is unique?

webmanco says on Jan 25, 2008, 13:25:

Yes there are several reail vendor who can sell you jelwery and emeralds and you will have a profit, but it is your wisdom and contacts in another country who do really know if the emeralds you bought can be sold x3 times. Todo lo hace el precio.

Also there are several vendors who would sell you a stone whose value on the Colombia market would be let´s say USD 50, but in business they will ask you for the same stone USD 5000, then you bargain and said, I give you USD 3000, once you paid there is not return on your money. And maybe that is what you call taking advantage of other people, I guess it is but still not money back.

But, I'm going to start making some assumptions here.... Which means I might actually end up making an ass out of myself ..........Thu 04 17, 2008 11:34 am

jh816 says on Jan 25, 2008, 14:23:

What about hiring an appraiser or a gem expert to go with you to the sale? Anyone ever try this? Obviously, there'd still be plenty of room to get bent over. Just wondering if anyone had any experience hiring a buyer or appraiser to help or act on their behalf.

joe.

ujay says on Jan 25, 2008, 14:51:

buy from lee wasson ,hes in bogota,hes from the usa,been here in the game more than 30 years,

www.unionjackedfilms.com

Sam Salmon says on Jan 25, 2008, 18:29:

Hiring an appraiser is a good idea in a place where there are professional standards but Colombia is no such place-as you say you'll get bent over for sure.

' a la orden!'

travelingirl says on Jan 25, 2008, 18:44:

If you really don't want to barter and are willing to pay a little bit more I'd check out "Minas de Colombia" near the Universidad de los Andes campus, not far from the base of Monserrate. You won't get swindled here but you might not get the "best" price since all the prices are set (and in US dollars) with no negotiation. The staff is friendly and they always have at least one person that speaks English. When you walk in the store if will look like a regular souvenir shop... just ask for the emeralds and someone will lead the way to the back area. It is a very nice place and I never felt pressured to buy anything. Actually, I didn't buy anything there b/c I wanted to barter elsewhere. I have heard that they will even give you a short demonstration about emeralds and show you the difference between those that are real and fake.

Around her hair she wore a yellow ribbon...

webmanco says on Jan 25, 2008, 20:08:

Colombia has professional standards, and a few not so professional.

But, I'm going to start making some assumptions here.... Which means I might actually end up making an ass out of myself ..........Thu 04 17, 2008 11:34 am

houstongal says on Jan 25, 2008, 20:50:

Mr. Hollywood, I like your attitude! I bought my emeralds in Bogota and I loved them because they were unique and beautiful. All were set in 18K gold and I know I won't see anyone wearing something similar. I wear them virtually every day (earrings & pendant).

Mr. Hollywood says on Jan 25, 2008, 21:26:

Thanks, Houstongal.

My wife and I were in Cartagena recently on our anniversary. I wanted to buy her some jewelry to mark the occasion and we spent a wonderful afternoon wandering the various jewelry places in the old city looking at all kinds of stuff. Now, I know for a fact that we didn't get the lowest price possible or anything like that, but we found some really unique and beautiful pieces that we could have never found anywhere but Colombia, pieces that will hopefully someday become family heirlooms for our kids long after we're gone, and while we're here will also always have the memory of that day and that anniversary in Cartagena.

travelingirl says on Jan 25, 2008, 21:58:

I actually bought an emerald ring in Cartagena and even though the clarity isn't all that great, it is still something to remind me of my time on the coast. :)

Around her hair she wore a yellow ribbon...

houstongal says on Jan 25, 2008, 22:09:

I hear ya Mr. Hollywood. How can one put a price on uniqueness? I can tell that my earrings were made by hand, by a person and not a machine. That's worth more to me than any amount an appraiser would give me on the value of the emeralds themselves.

By the way, a colleague bought some loose emeralds while in Cartagena and he got them appraised in the US for 3X more than what he paid. But he hasn't gotten them set for his wife yet so they're locked up. What a pity. I've been enjoying my jewelry everyday and no one can enjoy his!

webmanco says on Jan 25, 2008, 22:12:

If he got that bargain in Cartagena, in Bogotá it would had been better.

But, I'm going to start making some assumptions here.... Which means I might actually end up making an ass out of myself ..........Thu 04 17, 2008 11:34 am

emeralds says on Jan 26, 2008, 00:31:

As far as customs just make sure to declare. Get a receipt. There is no duty on loose emeralds but there is on emerald jewelry. Learn about emeralds before you go on my site or try bogota gringo. He's a member here who should be able to help. Don't buy anything on the street. You can try the emerald trade center downtown. Yes, you can find good buys on emeralds in Bogota but it can take years to really get an eye for what is good or not.

Sam
http://www.azemerald.com/

lpdiver says on Jan 26, 2008, 03:44:

Helvetica,

Do your homework before you go. Get yourself a jewelers loupe and carat scale; learn how to use them, and go shopping. You can learn a hell of a lot in one day. Don't pretend to be an expert, ask questions. A good reputable jeweler will be glad to help you.

Do your homework and learning at home.

I usually buy some gold jewelry each trip and I have caught some stores trying to pull fast ones. If you find yourself in that situation all bets are off. Go elsewhere.

You will know what you like and you will have seen high quality and artificial in you shop a variety of stores.

You will also have a price base to compare with.

Caveat Emptor!

Most of all have fun and enjoy yourself!

T B R

"cook some rice!"

Lostgringo says on Jan 26, 2008, 04:28:

I remember Boatygringo telling me one time he had a vast knowledge of emeralds in Colombia. If my memory is correct. You may be able to pm him.

Your Home Away from Home:http://www.welovebogota.com http://www.apartmentinbogota.com "Luxury apartment and rooms Cheap" Only 2 blocks from the American Embassy!

beisbollover says on Jan 26, 2008, 18:37:

I got news for all potential emerald buyers.....the best stones....the ones that are prized by collectors....they go from mine to New York, Paris or Tokyo....There is no local market for top gems in Colombia. Rich Colombians have to travel abroad to buy the best stones from Muzo or Chivor....The rest of the stones you see are medium to low grade commercial quality. When you walk into a store you will pay retail. There is no way to not pay retail in a store, otherwise it wouldn't be a store. Think of overhead and then you will understand profit margin. As for knowing someone on the inside? someone who has family in Muzo etc....or works in the bourse.....good luck, the only protection you have is your street smarts to know the integrity of the person helping you. And even the best intentioned person can unknowingly hurt you because he/she doesn't have the expertise to protect you.

My advice is to buy at a top retailer with all the warranties and service. Don't look at it as an investment but as a loving happy purchase that has some value after you buy it, unlike a mink coat or handbag.

However, if you really want to get serious about buying emeralds, for investment, then get your head examined and don't buy any bridges in Brooklyn, either. Emeralds are not an investment. Dealers lose money everyday in that market and they know what they're doing! How are you going to beat them at it, without dumb luck?

By the way, the latest treatment is a high tech glue that they insert into the feathers when it's in the crystal state so that when they cut the gems they stay together and look more green. Remove the treatment and the stones fall apart into several pieces.

Rushing out to buy yet?

Helvetica says on Jan 27, 2008, 04:53:

Hi everyone,

Thanks so much for all of your comments. I really appreciate the different points of view.

Really, I am just looking for a small piece of jewelry that I can enjoy. I would like not to get completely ripped off, if that's possible. I didn't realize that there were so many people trying to get rich off Colombian emeralds. I'm completely aware that's never going to happen for me. I just think it would be nice if I don't spend $300 on a piece of green glass.

Travelingirl, thanks for the information on Minas de Colombia. If I have a chance I will check that out. I'd still be interested in hearing from someone if the dealers in the duty free at Bogota airport are trustworthy.

Sam, thank you for the information on customs. Can anyone tell me what the duty is on emerald jewelry?

Thanks again, everyone.

lpdiver says on Jan 27, 2008, 09:10:

I never declare jewelry. I just wear it onto the plane. I have purchased emerald earrings for my wife and she just wore them home. The same for our wedding rings and a gold chain and gold ten peso coin.

I believe the first eight hundred dollars is duty free anyway.

t

"cook some rice!"

houstongal says on Jan 27, 2008, 10:42:

I'm bad...I don't declare everything I buy at full value. Just keep the total under $600 (the limit before you start to pay duty). Luckily, I've never got caught either. I guess I have an honest looking face! I was a bit nervous in Shanghai though, b/c I had $1,000 worth of silk rugs in my carry-on.

lpdiver...I'm with you, I usually just wear the jewelry, clothing, etc. on the plane. How are they gonna know you just bought it, especially if you don't carry the receipts.

Helvetica - Any airport shop is gonna gouge you. I rarely buy anything at any airport unless I'm desperate. If you can wait another week, I can PM you with the name of a jeweler I used in Bogota (I'm not at home right now). It's a small place, but there's lots of other shops in the same building if there's nothing that catches your eye. I love my jewelry.

Webmanco - Unfortunately (or fortunately) my colleague was working in Cartagena and couldn't come to Bogota. But he shopped around a lot before buying, just to be able to compare prices. Now let's see how much it'll cost him to set those babies in the US!

travelingirl says on Jan 27, 2008, 11:15:

I've never declared anything, including jewelry or loose stones. I'll usually write something down (souvenirs) on the form for around $500, but that's it.

Oh, and the one jewelry store I went to inside the Bogota airport was just ridiculously overpriced.

Around her hair she wore a yellow ribbon...

emeralds says on Jan 27, 2008, 12:56:

Helvetica, I believe duty for most jewelry is 6.3% but there are exceptions of course. Go to http://www.usitc.gov/tata/hts/bychapter/index.htm if you need more detailed info. Of course in the price range you are looking at you shouldn’t need to pay any duty because it will be exempt if it was purchased for yourself or as a gift.

Sam
http://www.azemerald.com/

Helvetica says on Jan 28, 2008, 06:41:

Hi everyone,

Thanks again! I will definitely buy under $600, so that should not be a problem. I'm not as dense as I sound, but for some reason I couldn't figure out in online searches what the limit should be before I have to pay duty.

Thanks for the feedback about the duty free shops. Gah, now I need to figure out any places in Bogota where I can buy jewelry without really having to bargain. It just makes me so damn uncomfortable. Here is a list from the comments so far:

Lee Wasson- Bogota. More information needed
"Minas de Colombia"- near the Universidad de los Andes campus, not far from the base of Monserrate

Houstongal, if you can send the name of the jeweler you used in Bogota, that would be great. I'm not going until at least April, so I have plenty of time.

Thanks again!

Nora