Driving and pedestrian discipline in Colombia.

merceytwo says on Aug 31, 2007, 16:00:

i was in cali in july, for the first time. i was with a colombian family. i about lost my mind.
they drive soooo crazy. and blowing their horn . i told them you do that in florida they will put a bullett in you quick. i covered my eyes about the whole time.
they asked me if i wanted to drive and i said HELL NOOOO!!!. they asked if i drove at home i said yes, but its not like this.we obey the traffic laws a little more lol

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Leeroy says on Aug 31, 2007, 16:45:

The way that Colombians drive is the international norm, rather than the exception.

It is little different in Cairo, Rome, Jakarta or Tashkent.

We, the North Americans and North Europeans are the odd-ones-out, so to speak.

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Lowell says on Aug 31, 2007, 16:56:

Yes, It's true my wife is always reminding to be careful who you piss off. That's real hard when you're on the receiving end of some sort of total nonsence. Especially when I'm used to standing up for my space/rights. It's a hard bullet to bite in this way beautiful country.

Alfred E. Newman. "What. Me Worry?"

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fecherklyn says on Aug 31, 2007, 17:42:

Leeroy,

Thats a tough one..."The way that Colombians drive is the international norm, rather than the exception".

On the whole, I think I disagree. Of the examples you cited I have visited or lived in all of them except Tashkent. Cairo is a nightmare I agree...on a par with, say, Medellin (In my opinion, worse than Bogota). Rome (and Italy in general) is special as although many drivers think they are latter day Fangio's, they do drive in a discipled fashion. Jakarta I knew well and always took a pleasure driving there. Enormous traffic congestion and pedestrians everywhere....but consideration and prudence also.

What I fear may single out Colombian drivers is "agression". Why does it always seem to be a matter of life or death to get one further car advanced? Why is it that when you inadvertantly get into a "turn left" lane but wish to go straight on you can almost miss your next meal before someone will let you in? And so on......

And why is it there is not more traffic control? There is massive unemployment in Colombia and a wealth gap seperating the rich and poor. So why not create more traffic police, parking wardens, etc. The fines would pay for the extra employed and perhaps we would all be safer on the roads.

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vicshere says on Aug 31, 2007, 18:40:

hey the driving is just fine in Colombia..don't be trying to change Colombia....you wouldn't succeed....and second of all if you want to drive like an old lady suggest you go drive back up north...or if you cant stand the heat you'd better get of the kitchen

listo

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Leeroy says on Aug 31, 2007, 18:59:

I remember that in Mumbai they had massive electronic signs up counting (live) how many deaths there had been due to traffic accidents that week. I imagine (and hope) that they were quite effective.

That would be a good idea for Bogota, and for a lot of world cities.

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Morrongo says on Aug 31, 2007, 19:17:

The driving here is blatantly not fine,tell that to the number of motorcyclists on see hoping on one leg.Although, it is par for the course for Latin America. I agree though, its not going to change,well not for the foreseeable future.There is nothing quaint about the needless loss of life that occurs daily that needs perserving.

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Lisa Zee says on Aug 31, 2007, 20:06:

The problem with the traffic is TOO MANY DAM CARS!.
Avoid the big cities. We spent most of our time in the mountains, there was no traffic, no rush. We walked 15 mts up hill to get a buseta to go to Rionegro. No car alarms, no police, no ambulance, no craziness. (well, one of the drivers that drove us very frequently, got killed, on a case of mistaken identity! ):. other than that, very quiet!

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goin_south says on Aug 31, 2007, 20:58:

wow, now that's a really sucky way to check out of this life:
" KILLED BY MISTAKEN IDENTITY."
I guess I'd be lookin for someone real fast, in my next re-incarnation ;(

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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pilotguy says on Sep 1, 2007, 06:59:

I have a driver. I sent him to driving school. When he finished the private school he got a drivers license. The state does not test him, the school that is paid for the lessons simply gets the license issued without a state test.. After he was "licensed", l spent 3 weeks and 30 hours teaching him to drive. When the state does not test a student driver, there is the potential for bad drivers. Look around. I remember viet nam in 1968, the drivers were much better. This is simply a fact. My insurance rates are very high, no surprise.
Same with motrocycle licenses. Bought my driver a moto, he got his license without driver testing. Watch the Motos, it is really scary. Now let me finish with, "I love this country" and I think safer drivers would obviously make for safer roads. Let's teach it. enough raving. Joe

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mranderson says on Sep 2, 2007, 09:37:

Doesn't everybody want to change the world into the world they escaped from? Isn't that what mexicans are trying to do in the U.S.? Maybe the same with muslims...I don't know though.

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adrimm says on Sep 2, 2007, 09:48:

I think it depends on the city. I found the driving in Bogota in early 2002 far far more civilized than it had been 10 years previous to then...

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adrimm says on Sep 2, 2007, 09:48:

EDIT I meant Bogota in ****2006*** not 2002.

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goin_south says on Sep 2, 2007, 12:02:

I think the driving in Bogota seemed a (lil) bit more organized than in Cali, for sure, and maybe Medellin. In Pasto.. about the same, as Bogota. BUT, AS A PEDESTRIAN.... IT AIN'T CALIFORNIA...NO PEDESTRIANS' RIGHT-OF-WAY.

Doesn't really matter where you're at on the face of the earth,...(other than California, to my knowledge)... if you are on foot, I think the smartest thing is to be yielding to other moving objects. RIGHT?

Didn't your mother teach you?
Then what about your 1st-grade teacher?
You didn't have one?
Lo siento.

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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Lisa Zee says on Sep 2, 2007, 21:06:

Hey GOING SOUTH..... Did you go south? Pasto?, Cali?. I am behind news, update me please(:

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goin_south says on Sep 2, 2007, 23:06:

what does that mean? 'technically?'
you mean 'legally'?
No One would ever believe it.

And, I'm having lots of difficulty believin you're out there taking on speeding cars on the road, by foot or bike.

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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goin_south says on Sep 2, 2007, 23:28:

what does that mean? 'technically?'

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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goin_south says on Sep 2, 2007, 23:44:

Where does one find that information?
I am curious.
(Straight-faced Q.) (sorta)
Did you google : 'pedestrian laws in Colombia'? or what?

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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goin_south says on Sep 3, 2007, 05:42:

so, you get your tehnico & legal info from taxi drivers???
'The Street' is one thing, GIB, and I realize, 'taxi drivers' are a part of 'the street' info... but, I don't think I'd be relying on the 'very educated taxi man' for my technico/lego informacion. lol

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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goin_south says on Sep 3, 2007, 05:49:

well, not sure that's such an easy thing to choose from, from what I've heard... lawyers in Colombia either can't find work, or the one's that do, are less reliable and more crooked than anything in the USA.

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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manINred says on Sep 3, 2007, 09:41:

Colombia's drivers, as poor as they may be, are no worse than in Toronto, where all of the worst drivers in the world reside.

The best drivers I find are in Europe.

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vicshere says on Sep 3, 2007, 09:46:

especially the oriental drivers and the old Jewish driver....ever try to driving up Bahurst around the 401 during rush hour forget it not that I am racist or anything

listo

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manINred says on Sep 3, 2007, 09:48:

hahahaha, neither am I, but it's true!!!!!!!!!!

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Sep 3, 2007, 14:06:

I drove in Bogota and it's a piece of cake compare to Villavo, there you really need to have 4 eyes, specially with those little motorbikes or mopeds they looks like ants, they are everywhere, on your right, left front back. I don't lose my temper but i do get very stress out

engage brain before opening mouth

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Man Tequila says on Sep 3, 2007, 14:12:

Who was it who was talking about the lack of road rage in Colombia? I've thrown the occasional finger but rarely wished I had a gun...

Aunque no me creas/ si me lo propongo/ lograre olvidarte/ porque a fin de cuentas/ no soy tan cobarde./ Y termino todo una de estas tardes/ no sera dificil buscar algún sitio donde refugiarme/ donde nunca mas vuelvas a encontrarme. (Polo Montañez)

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Sep 3, 2007, 14:36:

My dad is quite aggressive, we warned him to be more passive because one day he is going to find his match at that would be the end!

engage brain before opening mouth

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Cerealkiller says on Sep 3, 2007, 14:37:

I am used to driving in bogota... I have a bit of a hard time driving in the uk and getting used to the fact that people in london park on the street and it gets extremely narrow.
That said, pedestrians in bogota are suicidal to say the least and it pisses me off...many dont give a shit if there is a pedestrian bridge right on top of their hollow heads...they just run accross the road.
I got one SOB playing daredevil on a major road, under a pedestrian bridge so i obviously hit the shit out of him because well, people drive fast on highways...the front of my car was completely damaged, the guy was bleeding profusely and nobody said anything to me, no cops no anything because this fucker was right under the pedestrian bridge. It was his fault...my lawyer confirmed it so im guessing he didnt have the right of way...
I hope he learned his lesson, stupid idiot.

Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives -John Stuart Mill

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Sep 3, 2007, 14:40:

CK drive in Villavo, pedestrian there think they own the road, and did you know that in villavo there 11,000th cars and 25.000th moppeds, it is crazy there!!! a two lane suddenly become 4, it is a nightmare!!

engage brain before opening mouth

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goin_south says on Sep 3, 2007, 15:19:

"""pedestrian there think they own the road"""
Kat1, according to 'rubito and his "mad taxi drivers on drugs"...(..or, his source of technico and legal information in Colombia)....PEDESTRIANS DO HAVE THE RIGHT OF WAY IN COLOMBIA.

Imagine that!

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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Lowell says on Sep 3, 2007, 17:10:

I accept the "fair game" idea. However, when I hear the mofo accelerate (especially when I'm with my wife and baby) the offenders should have their car or mc shoved up their ass.

Alfred E. Newman. "What. Me Worry?"

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goin_south says on Sep 3, 2007, 18:22:

The only place I have ever been/lived where it was in reality 'PEDESTRIANS' RIGHT-OF-WAY... was in California in the 70's. Back then, it was 'obeyed', 'observed', 'enforced'. But/and so was 'jaywalking' ticketing as an offense (I think.)

A kinder, more gentle effect on society. Maybe some of those who live in California can tell us if it is still as such. I am guessing things have changed in our "24/7 Society of Greed, Rapidity, and Disregard"

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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billyb says on Sep 3, 2007, 20:24:

In SoCal they still live to give jaywalking tickets, no as prevelant in SFBA, but you are right, Calif is the place were drivers respect pedestrians right of way the most i've seen.

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goin_south says on Sep 3, 2007, 21:08:

As it should be,... in a civil society

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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goin_south says on Sep 3, 2007, 21:47:

""TECHNICALLY pedestrians have the right of way in Colombia but I don't see too many people with enough balls to actually take it.""

(Most would agree; it's got nothing to do with how big your balls are, but weather you want to be able to use them again ;) )

""thought Colombia was like some European countries where pedestrians really TECHNICALLY do NOT have the right of way against cars, but when I looked it up I found I was wrong!""

Where does one find that information?
"...when I ... Looked it up...."
""Taxi driver friends of mine.""

lol; billyb.. save me please!

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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goin_south says on Sep 3, 2007, 23:52:

""I've done it on occasion, crossed when I'm supposed to and looked the driver of the oncoming speeding car in the eye, grudgingly they slam the brakes at the last possible second and you pass""

okay, SUPERMAN !

Wow! That deserves to be on YouTube ;)

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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webmanco says on Sep 4, 2007, 05:40:

So why not create more traffic police, parking wardens, etc. The fines would pay for the extra employed and perhaps we would all be safer on the roads

The less police force the better, specially if they do the chicken tickets, driving without one light, instead fo santioning drivers running red lights or speeding, DUI, maybe eve reckless driving.


Lisa Zee
The problem with the traffic is TOO MANY DAM CARS!.
I do agree. but the problem in tows with the motorcicles is that their wait of saying hi is by horning. Mucha pitadera.

Rubito
TECHNICALLY pedestrians have the right of way in Colombia but I don't see too many people with enough balls to actually take it

I usually do give the right of way to pedestrians but this one time a pedestrian walked in front on me and thought I didn´t give him enough time or make him rush, he got mad and kick the tire of the car.

When I am a pedestrian I give the right of way to cars and motorcicles always having into account the speed, time and other facts.

goin south
'very educated taxi man' for my technico/lego informacion
Many taxi drivers are professinals, got a university degree.


Lawyers in Colombia either can't find work
(then start driving taxis o:-)

(I really hate it when women get their panties all bunched up their butt, they can get so cranky!) Poor butt happy

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goin_south says on Sep 4, 2007, 06:03:

thanks webmanco, for expanding the thinking

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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vicshere says on Sep 4, 2007, 06:05:

I always thought that in Canada and the US the pedestrian has the right of way..... I could be wrong

listo

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goin_south says on Sep 4, 2007, 06:06:

Only in California, I think, vic.

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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vicshere says on Sep 4, 2007, 06:10:

man I am going to have to look into this.....I have always drove around Colombia thinking cars have the right of way....I never yield to pedestrians at a traffic light even in front of schools no one ever yields to children or anything

listo

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Lowell says on Sep 4, 2007, 08:11:

Yeild? Does that word even exist in Spanish?

Alfred E. Newman. "What. Me Worry?"

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Miguel says on Sep 4, 2007, 08:28:

Pedestrians with "right of way" in Colombia. You guys don't get out much;-D

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Sep 4, 2007, 09:22:

The taxi driver from Bogotá is right. There seems to be such rule in Colombia, according to a document I've been reading, about giving preference to pedestrians when crossing the streets, but it is neither enforced nor observed.

" la nula o casi nula implementación del principio que ordena conceder la prioridad a los peatones en el cruce de calles y vías, "

www.centrolegalambiental.com/word/cambio_cultural_sostenibilidad.doc

However, it's a jungle out there. I've never been more scared in my life than trying to cross Calle Quinta in Cali, to get to Cosmoscentro from my house. I crossed, finally, at traffic lights, with a policeman directing the traffic, when I thought the ligh was red and I could make it without committing a suicide. I obviously made it, bu the policeman scolded me "Lady, are you trying to kill yoursrelf!" I said, "no that's
why you are standing here, helping people to get across. " He looked like I was talking Chinese to him.

Cheers,
Desi

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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goin_south says on Sep 4, 2007, 11:59:

"....I never yield to pedestrians at a traffic light even in front of schools no one ever yields to children or anything'

that's....pretty considerate vic; but then we'll cut ya some slack, considering you're another fallen maple leaf ;)

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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billyb says on Sep 4, 2007, 14:53:

Yeild? Does that word even exist in Spanish?

Does it even exist in English :) Yield??

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jinksmiester says on Sep 4, 2007, 17:36:

does the word pedestrian exist ...if it does it has no meaning in colombia....lots of asshole drivers who would risk mowing down a person or little kids in the street rather than yield or even slow down....they step on the gas and lay on the horn....no respect for life...no respect for others

A man is not old until regret takes the place of dreams

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billyb says on Sep 4, 2007, 18:10:

Vic, you would think a teacher would at least have consideration for children crossing the street, no?

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vicshere says on Sep 4, 2007, 18:31:

hell no there is a lot of the little rug rats running around anyway.....beside they multiply like rabbits are getting pregnant at 10 -11

listo

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billyb says on Sep 4, 2007, 19:37:

So have you hit one yet?

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goin_south says on Sep 4, 2007, 22:37:

So, what's with this attitude, that they have in Colombia (OR, ELSEWHERE?!), that people think a moving vehicle shouldn't possibly give way to a human life?
Is it simply the way people grow up, learning this behavior?
Or, is it a matter of 'need to rush'... 'need to go'...
Or, is it a matter of 'need to dominate someone, since I can and I'm in control, with this (relative) big machine, if they dare step out into my path'.

I'm kinda thinkin it's just a 'learned behavior'....
One that needs to get unlearned.

But, 'driving' and the 'automobile/motorcyle' is a cult of it's own, and I'm kinda thinking it's simply that, together with the 'learned behavior' thing.

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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goin_south says on Sep 4, 2007, 22:37:

Hey, billyb, ... did you mean: 'have you hit one up yet?'

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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vicshere says on Sep 5, 2007, 07:10:

ok let's not blame the bad drive in Colombia.....I put half the blame on the "asswipe" pedestrian....the pedestrians in Colombia have to be the most stupid ....they cross a road right in front of any vehicle with no concern for the distance or speed of the vehicle..you can try honking but don't waste your battery life it wouldn't make a difference....they stand in the middle of the road on or near the lane markings and hope for the best...how about the parent with a 2 year old standing on the center marking waiting for the traffic to go by...sometimes I feel like just bumping one of them to teach them a lesson....but I just cant.
billy I haven't run one down on purpose but 2 years ago I was driving through my barrio very slowly thank god and this 6 year kid comes flying out of house and runs into the side of my car...I was only going like 20 ks at the time...anyway the kid bounce off the car and lands on the sidewalk...I get out check the kid out and he was ok except for a scratch on his hand....I told him I wanted to know where his parents live and the kid wouldn't say and he started to cry after a few attempt to find the information the kid wouldn't talk....he finally got so scared about his parents he ran off...thank god

listo

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Robert Jorge says on Sep 6, 2007, 23:54:

Kat1, I read somewhere - and it was a legit source though it escapes me right now, that Villavicencio had the most traffic related deaths in the entire country of Colombia per capita. That stat is probably a few years old. But I agree with you Villavo is much worse with traffic than Bogota.

I think the best drivers in the world are the Germans. I remember when I was 16, I was with my uncle in a little village outside of Heidelberg, and we got a green light. He took off and a chick out of nowhere rode a bike off a sidewalk right in front of us and we hit her broad-side (no pun intended). The police were there within seconds, and were very quick to ticket her for riding a bike on a sidewalk and not yielding the right of way to a car. Then the ambulance took her away! But anyway, the Germans are downright professional when it comes to driving manners. Where else can you have a highway system that generally doesn't have a speed limit, with minimal accidents? They know what they are doing there. And I love the Autobahn police. They drive Porsches.

--"I believe in making the world safe for our children. But not for our children's children, because I don't think that children should be having sex." - Jack Handy

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Sep 7, 2007, 00:06:

I do believe that RJ, Villavo is a nightmare to drive,and as i said those motorbike don't make it easy,

the worst is that traffic lights sometimes don't work and the one that do people don't respect them specially taxistas...

the motorbikes should be on the right but they don't seem to care. they drive left, right, front, back you name, there have been lots of motorbike related accidents


another thing that doesn't help is the state of the road in Villavo, the potholes are a nightmare specially when it rains. i don't know but I think the next alcalde of villavo have to really sort out that mess, there is like driving in the wild west.

i got used to know at the beginning i used to came home with aches and pains everywhere.


BTW the majority of politicians that are competing for consejo, alcalde etc for Villavo are women....maybe they are the best to sort out tha beautiful city.

engage brain before opening mouth

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goin_south says on Sep 7, 2007, 02:10:

""majority of politicians that are competing for consejo, alcalde etc for Villavo are women""

Well, Kat1,... maybe a new movie, and who knows? it could happen, if they knew how to play ALL THEIR CARDS JUSSSSSSS RIGHT.. COLOMBIA could become the first republic on earht to be RULED BY WOMEN. jjeje.. what a thought... but then,.. the gringos and/or man's version of 'play all their cards just right' is likely jus a bit different than what the woman might be thinking.

Who knows? Colombianitas.... Rule!

'what does it mean, when one of you (colombians) tell another: YOU WERE NOT/ARE NOT. 'COLOMBIAN ENOUGH'?? jejeje..a mixture, I think, of stupidity mixed with a false sense of arrogance.. How 'colombian' do you have to be? to be 'colombian enough

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