Does a Colombiana turn into a Gringa?

morphus says on Dec 29, 2006, 18:07:

I know a guy that married a prepago Colombiana. She hates the U.S. and wants to go back to Colombia. She says people in the U.S are unfriendly. One time she tried to help an old lady get on a bus and the old bag pushed her away. Also, she's used to going out to nightclubs and hoing around every night. The husband can't satisfy her. He told me that he came home from work one day and caught her masturbating with a dildo. I think we have to send Modefoque over the house...lol.

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aztec says on Dec 29, 2006, 18:08:

Married almost 17 years... ...to woman from Colombia.

So, as regards your question "she has acquired some of the characteristics of American Women??", the answer is yes. One cannot expect a person moving into another culture not to assimilate some of the characteristics of that culture. You can hope that she continues to retain the best of her country of origin and inculcates only the better aspects of the American culture.

With regard to your specifics, "not treat you as well, less respectful, preoccupied with fairness, uses sex as a weapon, complains, demands, argues, or developed a narcississtic and/or histrionic disorder", No my Colombian wife has not assumed any of those characteristics.

In summary, you should expect a woman to change over time from the person you first met in Colombia. However, I believe you could expect the same no matter where the person is from. There are inevitable changes in a close relationship like marriage.

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goin_south says on Dec 29, 2006, 19:24:

Morph.. Sounds like a good excuse for a 'Real Life Meet-Up" The husband can't satisfy her. He told me that he came home from work one day and caught her masturbating with a dildo.

real life meetup, de Webmanco!

Where do we go from here?

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Blondie says on Dec 29, 2006, 19:56:

I have been a member of ths site for only 2 days now... and i am starting to think that this site is primarily being used for bashing white women!! Though, it seems no one takes the time to examine the white male behavior and how the white male treats the white female that might contribute to some of the more negative qualities or behaviors from the white female.... In short... if you want to be treated like a King...... Maybe try treating her like a queen... you might be suprised at the change in reaction you get when you actually give some respect!

JMHO!!!!

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Azul says on Dec 29, 2006, 20:19:

Blondie From what you've described of yourself, you are not categorized in the group of American women that we are talking about. Some of the qualities that you've told us that you have are the same kind of qualities that endear us to Colombian women. I don't think we are trying to make blanket statements because there are exceptions such as yourself, but the qualities in a woman that many of us men on this site look for are more often found in Colombian women as apposed to American women. We can only speak from personal experiences, and I think that is what is being represented on this site. Please don't be offended, every woman is different, but overall I think that we are saying that in general there is a huge cultural difference between American women and Colombian women.

las cosas caen por su propio peso

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Gomezman5 says on Dec 29, 2006, 20:20:

gringoloid..... Are you saying that ALL Gringas have these characteristics you have described? I'm no big fan of marraige of any type, but I certainly would not go so far as to say that Gringas have all of these characteristics, or even some of them. There are a lot of great gringas out there.

I think that a lot of Gringos who have had bad experiences think that foreign wives, (Colombian, Russian, Asian) are simply going to be better wives because they are less likely to have the kind of characteristics you described above. But as I so often do, I have to agree with Aztec. When you change cultures, over time, you are going to conduct your affairs, both personal and otherwise, in a manner that is similar to way others do. You know, when you live in Rome, you live like the Romans.

A friend of mine put it another way. He said once the woman learns enough English to understand Oprah, it will only be a matter of time before the woman will be asserting her "rights" in the home....which always will work against the interests of the man.

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Azul says on Dec 29, 2006, 20:22:

G5, I love the Oprah comment

las cosas caen por su propio peso

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elchantajista says on Dec 29, 2006, 20:57:

hey blondie now u getting the hang of it lol seems like everybody start out nice and then they get that mean forum edge, one question what u think about the duke lacross rape trail when one black stripper accused 3 white rich guys in a obvious scam to get money, and they were arrested on such weak evidents, just on her word. my my ; I see a real trend on females accusing male for all kind of things just to get money now granted u may be a good person but this trail does shed the light on what going on between american men and woman; in the work place and in life; so don't take it personnel it's just a few of your country women are really taking advantage of things and the good women like u have suffer for it . and why r u looking outside the USA for a mate not that I blame u lol

anda de parranda en Bogota
"Vicente"

anda de parranda en Juanchito "Vicente"

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elchantajista says on Dec 29, 2006, 21:21:

Now to give respect for the thread, I know this Colombiana for 3 yrs now she's been the EE UU for 10 yrs my girl friend now anyway didn't know her before when she was in Colombian but now she is sweet and mean at the same time; kinda like the song goes she will cut u and watch u bleed use sex for controll and all the games like a gringa but more ruthless,just a drop dead guape chica; so she went back to colombia cause she was tired of the EE UU and i stayed with her couple of times and u couldn't ask for a sweeter and nicer chica but now she wants to come back oh no!! The moral of the story is the more a Colombiana is sweet & beautiful in Colombia , the more trouble they will give u when they become gringalized, cause a women will get away with only what her looks will allow her to and if she is beautiful the gringos will come at her in droves ;just my take on it.

anda de parranda en Bogota
"Vicente"

anda de parranda en Juanchito "Vicente"

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gringoloid says on Dec 29, 2006, 21:24:

Morphus.... You bring up a good point here. I have sought out Colombians living in America and most of them do not like the US and want to go back. These are ONLY the ones I've talked to so it may not be a trend. I knew a guy from Miami that made good money as an electrical engineer and he went back to Colombia. I'm developing this thread because I am trying to decide whether to bring my wife back or to just stay in Colombia and live with her there.

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gringoloid says on Dec 29, 2006, 21:32:

Rufus.... No, your comment is very much a part of this thread; I just wanted to start sweet and simple. From what I've heard, my buddies have spent an average of $30,000 US to bring a wife in. They did make a lot of trips, but think about it, days off work to the embassy and immigration, pre-nup, she is going to need a car and driving lessons, etc. I think your figure is low.
This is why I'm asking because I'm about to spend a lot of money on this. I've already spent 7 grand in November in Bogota, Cartagena, and Baranquilla and i'm returning next month for 90 days in Medellin. This is why I'm trying to find out whether to live in Colombia or to bring her back to the states.

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gringoloid says on Dec 29, 2006, 21:49:

Hey Blondie.... I just returned from South America where I saw nothing but European and American men, tired of modern western woman, looking for foreign wives.
The plane from Rome, Italy to Fortaleza, Brazil is almost entirely filled with men looking for wives.
Here in Southern California, I do not know one man, my age, that is not looking for some kind of a foreign bride.
Honestly, I think modern western woman has priced herself out of the market.
When you talk about this 'bad treatment' that American women get from American men, you're forgetting one thing,--SHE PICKED HIM! She wanted her bad boy, and that is what she got.
Modern western women are not raised with the values/skills to understand how to make a relationship work. As someone mentioned above, for the last 30 years, there has been nothing but white male bashing on television. And at night, it is the sit-coms. Phil Donahue and Oprah Winfrey have destroyed family life as I knew it, being an older man.
Call it what you want, but don't blame me for going to Colombia to find a wife that treats you better, respects you more, does not use sex as a weapon, etc.....and a whole lot more!!!!

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gringoloid says on Dec 29, 2006, 21:57:

G5.... Those qualities are just some of the qualities that American women have. I was engaged just once about 15 years ago and she only had one of those characteristics. She was demanding to a degree that you have never heard of. Also very insecure. That was as close to marriage that I ever got. A very bad experience, that lasted one week until I left. A real babe, a Heather Locklear lookalike, only better; but way too much of a princess.
I can live in Colombia or here, it doesn't matter, I'm retired. A buddy told me she will stay the same way if we live in Colombia, but she will pick up some bad habits here in America.

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goin_south says on Dec 29, 2006, 23:05:

blondie....if you read EVERYTHING ON THIS SITE... ACTUALLY..... there are quite alot of guys on here WHO ALSO BASH COLOMBIAN WOMEN FOR WHATEVER/OTHER REASONS. And, it's stuff you nor I either one really want to hear, as well. So,...makes you wonder what some of the people here are really after. It's not what you're looking for. But, don't spend too much effort raining on their parade. UNLESS YOU HAVE LOTS OF TIME TO KILL.

'tengo no mas compasion para su loro'

Where do we go from here?

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goin_south says on Dec 29, 2006, 23:20:

elchantajista! Cuando regrese a su casa???
I LIKE THAT TERM YOU COINED:
"GRINGALIZED". lol.
a little bit like 'crystalized'?
HARDENED?
OOOOOPS!
Lo Siento....blondie!

Where do we go from here?

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Gomezman5 says on Dec 29, 2006, 23:30:

Gringoloid.....lol "I have sought out Colombians living in America and most of them do not like the US and want to go back"

I like that line of yours. And so what does that mean? Well....the fact is, while many may talk about going back.....most don't. Most can't. Moving to a country is more than just picking up your butt in relocating isn't it? What if you have kids and grand kids? How often do you think you will see them. You think your kids who get one, if luck two vacations a year can just pack up and take the wife and kids to Colombia? You think they want to go there? what about your life long friends? And what if you are in a job working toward a retirement. I'm a perfect example. I have my own practice, but I am also salaried for work that I do. In 7 more years I will have a pension with free health care and drug coverage until I die. At 65, medicare will pickup the medical, and my pesnion will pick up the portion they will not pay. Now why the hell would I move to Colombia and give that up. Only a fool would. OK, you may be healthy today, but that can and DOES change as you age. You understand my point?

Colombia is a great place, but for most Colombian people who moved to the US, this is where their life is. This is where they are established. And packing up and moving back to Colombia is not very feasible.

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goin_south says on Dec 29, 2006, 23:31:

gringoloid, I'm with Rubito on the recommendation: I believe I would stay in Colombia. Unless you just have not seen enough of north America. And, I'll throw in with your ranting above, something I said in other words a few days ago: "So many" American women are 'in competition against us' and it comes down to the end of the day and they want to go 'head-to-head' against a guy. Rather than being 'in it, with us' 'side-by-side'.

Where do we go from here?

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goin_south says on Dec 29, 2006, 23:36:

G5, THE OTHER SIDE: I think gringoloid has enough money to fly the kids and grandkids all down to Colombia for vacation every year! WHO WOULDN'T WANT TO GO??

(And, the American Medics won't be making a fortune on HIS MEDICARE, cuttin and killin him with all those poisons.)

'tengo no mas compasion para su loro'

Where do we go from here?

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scotty says on Dec 30, 2006, 00:31:

ZZZZZZZZZZZ yawn!

Get Rhythm, when you got the blues. Johnny Cash

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scotty says on Dec 30, 2006, 00:33:

almost sounds like alot of money...almost as much as a guy will spend on an american woman to wine and dine and marry...and a whole lot more when she decides to dump him and take everything.

20k doesnt look so bad now does it?

Get Rhythm, when you got the blues. Johnny Cash

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scotty says on Dec 30, 2006, 00:34:

been there done that,,,dont work. its much better to catch a plane south

Get Rhythm, when you got the blues. Johnny Cash

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scotty says on Dec 30, 2006, 00:37:

did you here the one about the blonde in phoenix she decided she wanted to go on a trip to San Diego zoo. she drove for hours across the desert, as she entered San Diego city limits she saw a sign that read SAN DIEGO ZOO LEFT. so she turned around and drove back home

Get Rhythm, when you got the blues. Johnny Cash

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scotty says on Dec 30, 2006, 00:39:

cant trust AW...its better to go south ( Colombia, Brazil, anywhere souh of texas)

Get Rhythm, when you got the blues. Johnny Cash

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scotty says on Dec 30, 2006, 00:40:

you gotta be having fun!

Get Rhythm, when you got the blues. Johnny Cash

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goin_south says on Dec 30, 2006, 00:41:

for a moment, I was starting to think: I was blonde. lol

Where do we go from here?

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scotty says on Dec 30, 2006, 00:42:

everywhere you turn, TV, talk shows, schools, everywhere in USA its bash he guys especially white dudes. some of us have said to hell with that...were going south.why say here and put up with the crap?

Get Rhythm, when you got the blues. Johnny Cash

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goin_south says on Dec 30, 2006, 00:42:

I knew someone was going to set a new record by either myself or, Miguel_Clavo... for most consecutive posts in a row.
I think you just did it.

Where do we go from here?

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goin_south says on Dec 30, 2006, 00:46:

Come on, dude... WHITE MALES STILL RULE. get your tail out from between your legs; flex that testosterone.
AND, HEAD SOUTH!
with a sign on the back of your shirt:
COLOMBIA...LEFT!
lol

Where do we go from here?

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elchantajista says on Dec 30, 2006, 01:19:

hey desi i was trying to post a thread on sweetie G great thread but NO HAY comentario or asunto is there a reason why some one trying to kill the thread before it reaches 351 and a new record

anda de parranda en Bogota
"Vicente"

anda de parranda en Juanchito "Vicente"

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Dec 30, 2006, 01:37:

start a new thread we're more concerned with quality than quantity here at PBH :)
Cheers,
Desi

"Soy el que anda de noche en el vecindario, sé cuando ladra el perro, sé cuando canta el gallo sé cuando estan dormidos los muchachos de mi barrio..." (From a llanero song "El pajarito")

"When shall we three meet again? In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"(First Witch in Macbeth)

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arthur brode says on Dec 30, 2006, 02:20:

G5 Health Insurance is cheap in Colombia.The last time i checked it was like 175,000 pesos per month for full coverage with one of the best health insurance companies.I have the government plan and only pay 49,000 pesos per month for full coverage.So,i dont find the cost and quality of health care a valid reason for not relocating to Colombia.Now,if you have younger children and are working torwards a Pension,then i guess thats a diferent story.Personally,I just picked up my shit and split with my ATM card and Passport and never looked back.

http://www.calirentals.net/

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aztec says on Dec 30, 2006, 05:37:

gringoloid "Stay or GO?" "A buddy told me she will stay the same way if we live in Colombia, but she will pick up some bad habits here in America."

It only stands to reason the woman will change less if she remains in Colombia. Many of us did not have that option at the time.

If you have the financial and psychological ability, I suggest your moving to Colombia before you marry the woman. Then many of your questions will be resolved.

My wife and I have just gone through the process of moving to Bogotá. Be advised that is not something undertaken with out serious investigation. As G5 mentioned the devil is in the details.

Even the "inexpensive insurance" has caveats you cannot see until you actually apply for it. Your whole medical situation can be turned on it's ear. If you aren't fluent in Spanish you are dependent upon someone else. Do you want to become a ward of your new wife?

Our circumstances were entirely different from many of the Colombian/American marriages. My wife had been in out of the States many times. She had actually worked in LA and Houston for a short period. She was fluent in three languages. Four if you consider Southern English a different language.

Interestingly, my wife refused to allow me to pay off her master card. She even paid herself the cost of a medical operation scheduled before our marriage.

We were successful but if I were to do it again with someone less sophisticated and not bilingual I would probably stay in Bogotá. The demands on a person to assimilate into another culture are too difficult and only increases pressure on a marriage.

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Dec 30, 2006, 08:22:

Of course she is, good for her You would not want to be with a woman who cannot change (adapt) in a new country and a new culture. In my experience about working with immigrant families the women are oftentimes faster to adapt and find a place for themselves in the new society than men. There are countless immigrant families here with the husband who is unemplyed and speaks bad Swedish and will desperately move back "home" while the wife has learned the language, got herself a job, will absolutely not ever move back to the old country. We women are practical creatures; when a door closes behind us we just move on.

Cheers,
Desi


"Soy el que anda de noche en el vecindario, sé cuando ladra el perro, sé cuando canta el gallo sé cuando estan dormidos los muchachos de mi barrio..." (From a llanero song "El pajarito")

"When shall we three meet again? In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"(First Witch in Macbeth)

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Gomezman5 says on Dec 30, 2006, 08:29:

Great Quote Whome:
"sounds like alot of money...almost as much as a guy will spend on an american woman to wine and dine and marry...and a whole lot more when she decides to dump him and take everything."

Yep, that quote has a lot more than a ring of truth.

I agree with Aztec. It is very obvious that he married a special lady. The Colombian woman that he married lived and worked in the US. That represents less than one half of one percent of all the Colombian women people are marrying and bringing here. That's just not the typical situation.

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gringoloid says on Dec 30, 2006, 11:27:

Rufus....you're on.. Take my email address in the profile and the cerveza is on me.....

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goin_south says on Dec 30, 2006, 11:28:

I only know personally, two Colombianas...married and living in the states. I know they BOTH WANT TO RETURN TO COLOMBIA TO LIVE,...ASAP. It's an emotional thing, attachment to their country and to their families that remain there. I completely understand. I don't blame them.

I think it's of great interest that I and maybe others here, know of other people from other countries around the world. NO OTHERS EVER EXPRESS SUCH DESIRE TO RETURN TO THEIR HOMELAND, LIKE THE COLOMBIANS. I think that makes such a positive statement about them and their love for where they have come from,...where their hearts are forever.

Where do we go from here?

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gringoloid says on Dec 30, 2006, 11:35:

G5..... I understand your point and agree.....especially on health care and pensions. I was once 'stuck' in New York City for 17 years. I had a good business, but didn't like living in NY, but couldn't leave because of the good money and what the hell was I going to do somewhere else? It was tough and sacrificial getting out of there.

But what a lot of colombians are telling me is that if they could have the same job and same money in Cali or anywhere else in Colombia, they would go. I know a woman like this.

My grandparents came here temporarily just to make some extra money in 1914, hoping to go back to Croatia asap, and look what happened, we're all still here, almost a 100 years later.

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goin_south says on Dec 30, 2006, 11:36:

...sitting here myself.... listening to some subdued seasonal music, and remembering, exactly a year ago this moment... in Miami, Airport, waiting for the plane to Cali.

What a fantastic trip to Pasto, en carraterra. Popayan, Remolina, Los Andes Montanas...Laguna De La Coche, Vulcan Galeras, Festival Blanco y Negro, Feria de Cali. Hotel Nevada in Cali... poco securidad, G5. The grunt, $30/night hotel. Nothing more was needed. We had one another. :)

Where do we go from here?

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gringoloid says on Dec 30, 2006, 11:41:

Aztec....... By the time I got down to your post......I think you all have convinced me......I knew you guys would help......i'm heading south, amigo.....thanks

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jay1234 says on Dec 30, 2006, 11:49:

Rubito "I have two lovely children who are both very young, and if I leave I'm going to have to leave them behind here. Hopefully I'll be able to visit frequently, but that's part of the risk I'm willing to take.
"
Have you decided to leave the US? Are you going with wife/mother of kids or not? Just curious as it relates to what happens to Colombianas who come here...Did you have a gringalized (jaja) experience?
elchantajista- Not only did sweetg not make a record due to the lockout, but she hasn't been heard from recently, either.

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alleycat says on Dec 30, 2006, 12:06:

blondie that's probably not the issue with most of the guys that go to colombia seeking wives. they want younger and better looking women than they're able to get in their own country. they believe colombianas perceive them as attractive. this is quite an ego-boost for someone who is routinely rejected by their own women. let's also not forget that they also desire a softer more submissive female. the idea of equality is anathema to them. furthermore, there's potentially a huge difference between guys who fall in love with a foreigner in their own country or who spontaneously falls in love while visiting a foreign country and between one who deliberately sets out on a mission to a foreign land for marriage.

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gringoloid says on Dec 30, 2006, 12:12:

Don Gringo....... I'm only describing american women here; I've never been married, so I can't talk from personal experience. Before I retired represented a manufacturer in 500 Home Depots in the western US. I saw nothing but marital problems, grief, and divorce with my 1500 employees.

All of my friends problems probably is what kept me single.

I spent last month in Colombia and it was like going to ANOTHER PLANET! These people were friendly/traditional/family values, etc.etc.

I even became friends with some 'beach tuffs' in Cartagena. (Maybe I got the affection because I was buying the beer, I dunno!)

I don't know where you live, but I've lived and worked all over the USA and latin america. Men here in California are seeking approval rather than respect from women. 67% divorce rate overall, and 85% with young people. No wonder.

They don't know that wherever you 'set the bar' in the beginning of a relationship, that you then have to maintain that level through the length of the relationship. Spending all that money on beginning dates has turned the beautiful women here into 'negotiaters.'

As for using 'sex as a weapon;' my married guy friends have told me all my life that if you don't do as the wife says, they cut off the sex. Many have said that oral stops on the wedding day. To a lot of American wives, sex is used for 'punishment or reward'. That's what I mean by a weapon.

If you don't see these problems that i've mentioned in all my posts above, than you are not dealing with really beautiful, 8's, 9's and 10 type American women. these women, and lets face it, these are the kinds of women we want to become involved with and sleep with, are nothing but evil-little-nazi-douche bag-exploitation queens. (If you don't know how to handle them, which most western american men cannot you become 'de-testicled'!)

I myself stayed single all of my 55 years and treated them as
f--kdolls. There not worth marrying and divorcing and then losing everything.

I dunno....but thanks for the advice..

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gringoloid says on Dec 30, 2006, 12:18:

Alleycat...... Please elaborate; I would be interested to know what Colombian think about your statement:

"one who deliberately sets out on a mission to a foreign land for marriage."

This is what I'm doing. Is the above perceived positive or negative?

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jay1234 says on Dec 30, 2006, 12:26:

Blondie I can see why you could feel that a lot of gringa bashing goes on here. I agree it takes two to salsa. The male is part of the equation. But for me, it is not so much to do with gringas (heck, I have many in my family) but more a statement about the family culture in the US. Among other reasons, I like that many latinas are more focused on the family than gringas (my personal experience). But I think that is the result of our mainstream US culture, not the "fault" of women. Maybe it makes it less confrontational to think of it as an appreciation of Colombian culture than as a rejection of gringas. Also, why not start a thread asking what role white males play in all of this? I know you will get a lot of discussion on the question!
By the way, I get the feeling that for some here it is all about the skirt-chasing. Move the hot women to any country and certain PBHers would like that country the same as Colombia. I think there is another group here who truly appreciate the country. The women are just a part of what to appreciate about Colombian culture. The culture as a whole, includes all the people, not just the hot girls. My Colombian fiancee's cuñado and uncles and cousins are all cool people, very welcoming and friendly. They make me feel like part of the family. If you just want a prepago, that's cool, but Colombia has a great culture (though I feel very much that it is hard to generalize about Colombia as a whole...each region and major city that I have visited has been almost like a different country). It has art, music, food, and a different pace of life, among other things.

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gringoloid says on Dec 30, 2006, 12:32:

Don Gringo...... Let me add a quick story....

I became acquainted with a fine lady in Bogota and told her that when i arrive that I would like to take her to dinner at a nice restaurant. This would be our first date.

She said, "No way, I'm going to make you dinner in my home!"

Now where in the United States has a woman ever uttered such a statement or had this kind of an attitude??????? 8's,9's and 10's!

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Dec 30, 2006, 13:02:

what do Colombians themselves think about men traveling to their country in order to hook up with a potential new bride?

It depends; there is no right or wrong answer to that one. If the society were dead set against that the marriage agencies that cater to gringos wouldn't exist. I believe that they are largely indifferent to this issue; it's not anything they have to deal with every day, it's small in scale and it doesn't really matter.

I think that on a certain level they think it's good: there are a lot of young women in Colombia who have hard time finding a good husband (not being that hot on the local marriage market) and the kind of women that gringos prefer are usually the kind Colombian men themselves reject: lower social class, poor, uneducated, ethnic features, perhaps with babies; yet young, slender, attractive and exotic looking to a gringo. The class society is a bitch for these girls and hooking up with a gringo can be an economic solution to the family's needs.

Cheers,
Desi

"Soy el que anda de noche en el vecindario, sé cuando ladra el perro, sé cuando canta el gallo sé cuando estan dormidos los muchachos de mi barrio..." (From a llanero song "El pajarito")

"When shall we three meet again? In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"(First Witch in Macbeth)

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aztec says on Dec 30, 2006, 13:59:

alleycat., Regarding your assertion... ..."this is quite an ego-boost for someone who is routinely rejected by their own women."

This is not to ridicule your statement but rather help you see more clearly the situation regarding the Colombian wife.

Many if not most of us were burdened with too many American gringa's of all different colors, ages, and financial status. Admittedly, it was fun having 21 year old American girls for a date. Having strange women show up at your door and even have them physically fight over you was strange for someone my age and experience.

This is not to extol our virtues but rather an attempt at rebutting you conviction the men can't get a gringa interested in them. We have no difficulty finding all the gringa's one needs. The point is we don't like what we see. My advice for you is that you reexamine your theory.

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alleycat says on Dec 30, 2006, 14:56:

aztec my theory is far more plausible than yours; to wit:

"Many if not most of us were burdened with too many American gringa's of all different colors, ages, and financial status. Admittedly, it was intoxicating to have 21 year old American girls for a date. Having strange women show up at your door and even have them physically fight over you was unbelievably exilerating for someone my age and experience".

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goin_south says on Dec 30, 2006, 15:09:

that 'upskirt' view is not so bad ;) "have them physically fight over you was unbelievably exilerating"

Where do we go from here?

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arthur brode says on Dec 30, 2006, 16:35:

upskirt view of La Feria

http://www.calirentals.net/

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arthur brode says on Dec 30, 2006, 16:58:

well,she looked good to me.but then i was drinking Aguardiente all night.


Ladyboy??

http://www.calirentals.net/

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arthur brode says on Dec 30, 2006, 17:11:

rufus,take a closer look.are you sure that is better?? jeje

http://www.calirentals.net/

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goin_south says on Dec 30, 2006, 18:17:

tu beber damasiado aguardiente. I knew it. You've done better on both accounts. Much better.
Anoche, A.B.... mas mejor, por favor.
Que pasa? someone stole your phone/camera?

Where do we go from here?

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morphus says on Dec 30, 2006, 19:57:

Variety is the spice of life. Check out the video:

Bootylicious

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morphus says on Dec 30, 2006, 20:00:

Ladyboy? When in doubt bail out :)

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Gomezman5 says on Dec 30, 2006, 20:16:

Yea Arthur..... I have to agree with Rufus. When I first saw that pic, I was trying to figure out how you managed to get YOUR arms in the pic that way. Than I realized it was HER hairy arms. Either you had "too many" or it's time for a vision check.

On the other hand, you redeemed yourself with that subsequent pic of the "not so little" cowgirl.

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gringoloid says on Dec 30, 2006, 20:17:

Desi....... Whenever I strike up a conversation with a Colombian and they ask, "what brings you to Colombia, are you vacationing?, business?, and I answer with, "I'm here looking for a wife!" .......these people then explode with laughter!

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goin_south says on Dec 31, 2006, 01:38:

I hope you guys took a moment to also view: 'Sexy Latina Swimsuit Model Karen' of Barrio 305, on that same page (as Bootylicious). If not, make a u-turn and go find it; you'll be glad you did... all the way to the END.
Okay, for those that do, is she Colombian? Ecuadorian? other?
I am guessing Colombian. Looks? Sounds?

'tengo no mas compasion para su loro'

Where do we go from here?

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goin_south says on Dec 31, 2006, 02:02:

my eyes are better than my ears. that vid with Paula DeAnda-Walk Away is also kinda fun.
The animation with: "Bebe lilly: Allo Papy" is also a little entertaining. en espanol

and, for the soccer/music fanatics: "RIBERY Come with me", is a cool vid with some great moves from this past World Cup, set to some good music. I guess RIBERY is the name of the group; sounds like a remake of some good Zepellin Music.

Okay, I went back. Duhhh. Ribery, must be a great French soccer player, and the music is by Puff Daddy. there are 2 or 3 other pretty good vid's focusing on Ribery, there on google. He's not Colombian,...but they could use him.

Where do we go from here?

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Dec 31, 2006, 03:15:

I t could be... ""I'm here looking for a wife!" .......these people then explode with laughter!"(gringoloid)

because they think either that you're joking; why would anybody travel to another country just for that; you're just trying to be funny and of course they laugh.

Or the whole idea of you having to go to another country to find a wife is so ludicrous that it just tickles people pink. What's wrong with you that you can't find a woman in your own country?

So, they are either laughing with you or laughing at you. Take your pick.

Cheers,
Desi


"Soy el que anda de noche en el vecindario, sé cuando ladra el perro, sé cuando canta el gallo sé cuando estan dormidos los muchachos de mi barrio..." (From a llanero song "El pajarito")

"When shall we three meet again? In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"(First Witch in Macbeth)

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goin_south says on Dec 31, 2006, 03:22:

Yep, so have fun, gringoloid. and stay focused.
As Gringodiego use to say:
"Whatever it is you are looking for in Colombia, I think you can find it."

Where do we go from here?

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utopiacowboy says on Dec 31, 2006, 06:08:

Have you thought about a high quality inflatable doll? Over the long run, it can be a very worth while investment: http://www.realdoll.com/ Another option is renting instead of buying: http://www.worldsexguide.com

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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David Pristupa says on Dec 31, 2006, 06:55:

Colombianas/American woman I have met some very fine American woman even in Manhattan. The ones I know have an awarness of other peoples wants and needs.They
don't test boundries. I try to make it a habit to avoid people whom
I feel uncomfortable around and give space to people that don't feel comfortable around me......I DO have a weakness for Latinas. They
are more family oriented and less business minded which can be too
much at times. A day at work I leave the stress behind.

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Blondie says on Dec 31, 2006, 07:58:

Marriage~ Sorry... but i thought this was hilarious!!
But first... please... turn around slowly and walk away from the hairy armed man-lady... save yourself while you still can!! hee hee ;) jk

Marriage

Body: You have two choices in life:
You can stay single and be miserable,
or get married and wish you were dead.

At a cocktail party, one woman said to another,
"Aren't you wearing your wedding ring on the wrong finger?"
"Yes, I am. I married the wrong man."

A lady inserted an ad in the classifieds:
"Husband Wanted".
Next day she received a hundred letters.
They all said the same thing:
"You can have mine."

When a woman steals your husband,
there is no better revenge than to let her keep him.

A woman is incomplete until she is married. Then she is finished.

A little boy asked his father,
"Daddy, how much does it cost to get married?"
Father replied, "I don't know son, I'm still paying."

A young son asked,
"Is it true Dad, that in some parts of Africa
a man doesn't know his wife until he marries her?"
Dad replied, "That happens in every country, son."

Then there was a woman who said,
"I never knew what real happiness was until I got married,
and by then, it was too late."

Marriage is the triumph of imagination over intelligence.

If you want your spouse to listen and
pay strict attention to every word you say -- talk in your sleep.

Just think, if it weren't for marriage, men would go through life
thinking they had no faults at all.

First guy says, "My wife's an angel!"
Second guy remarks, "You're lucky, mine's still alive."

"A Woman's Prayer:
Dear Lord, I pray for: Wisdom, To understand a man , to Love and to
forgive him , and for patience, For his moods. Because Lord, if I pray for
Strength I'll just beat him to death"

AND NOW FOR THE FAVORITE!!!


Husband and wife are waiting at the bus stop with their nine children.
A blind man joins them after a few minutes. When the bus arrives, they
find it overloaded and only the wife and the nine kids are able to fit onto
the bus.

So the husband and the blind man decide to walk. After a while, the
husband gets irritated by the ticking of the stick of the blind man as he taps
it on the sidewalk, and says to him, "Why don't you put a piece of rubber
at the end of your stick? That ticking sound is driving me crazy."

The blind man replies, "If you would've put a rubber at the end of
YOUR stick, we'd be riding the bus, so shut the f*ck up."

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Dec 31, 2006, 13:49:

It may not be a surprise but they still think it's funny that you have to go to another country to find a woman.

Oh I'm well familiar with the stereotypes Colombians have about gringos. Some of them have been around for the longest time, like that of the dirty hippie marihuanero.

Cheers,
Desi

"Soy el que anda de noche en el vecindario, sé cuando ladra el perro, sé cuando canta el gallo sé cuando estan dormidos los muchachos de mi barrio..." (From a llanero song "El pajarito")

"When shall we three meet again? In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"(First Witch in Macbeth)

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colombiangirl72 says on Dec 31, 2006, 16:10:

You are all full of it This thread has become the let's bash everyone thread. I am Colombian and I have been married now for 10 years to my gringo husband. I don't want to go back to Colombia and neither do any of my Colombian friends who are also married to gringos. However, no matter who you are or where you are from each relationship has to be defined by the people involved in it. I am very independent, driven, sexy, aging very well, friendly, party and travel alone or with my husband, and well educated. All of these traits came with me but the US gave me the opportunity to develop them and then some. I am married to a wonderful guy who is very secure in his identity and knows from experience that a marriage can only work if both people want it to.

We would never move back to Colombia simply because he would be kidnapped and killed and we would not be able to make a decent living. All my family is still back in Colombia and we visit as able.

Talk to this lady that you have met and figure out first and foremost what are her intentions. Is she in search of a better life or a does she want to be with you? People in Colombia sometimes think that this land is made of gold and that all their problems will be solved by simply coming here. It is really up to the person, if they have the personal tools to be successful in all areas of their lives then they will be, if not, then they will fail no matter where they are or where they come from. There is no prototype to Colombian women and marriage is really a gamble. If you are divorced, sit down and think why the first marriage failed because no matter who you marry it will fail again unless you can break the pattern.

There are many Colombian women already living in the US and there are many gringas who want a man to boss them around. However don't fool yourself into thinking that a woman who is 5 to 10 yrs or more younger or from a poor background may want you forever. Who knows. maybe she does, maybe she does not but the only way you are going to know is if you think she is worth having a relationship with.

Good luck and please quit the all around bashing. We are in all simply people and far from perfect, but this is life. Enjoy it while you can.

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colombiangirl72 says on Dec 31, 2006, 16:22:

Quit fooling yourself There is no such thing by the way as the soft, easy to control Colombiana. We are a matrilineal society. In other words, my mother was the boss, my father simply paid the bills and what each one did not know about the other the better. Do not fool yourself into thinking that women in Colombia are stupid. They simply know how to control and manipulate in a different way.

On the other hand, like in any relationship, it is your responsibility to endear your wife to you in such a way that she will see that you are worth it and that includes taking care of yourself as a person and in your behaviors. Life may be more simple in some ways but you are forgetting that Colombia has media and western values. Colombians are very much driven by appearance, status and wealth. Once the money is available there is an expectation to appear as having wealth. Some of the best plastic surgeons in the world are found in Colombia and being fat is a sin in this country.

By the way are the breast on the girl in the picture real? Too perky to be real so there is your answer. Yes, you get a woman who will always go the extra mile to look good but do not fool yourself into thinking that she will only do it for you. If you do not treat her right, according to her needs, she will walk too, just like any other woman from any other country. She was alone before she met you, she can be alone again if she is not happy.

On the other hand, how do you know you will not turn all pipi loco and shit when you move there just because there will be all this women hitting on you married or not. For some reason my experience with gringos and gringas is that they turn all sluttish when they go to Colombia because they do not get the same attention in gringolandia.

Like I said before, it really comes down to the person you are dealing with and not so much where they are from.

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gringoloid says on Dec 31, 2006, 17:02:

Colombiangirl.... This thread has taken wild turns here......Blondie turned out to be a good sport by making some jokes......Rufus and I are going to down a few brewskis in Medellin in late January....but Colombian girl, I hate to say this, and it is not bashing, just reporting the truth, but ex-pat american gringas living in South America, Russia, Eastern Europe, etc., get ignored by the locals as well as the expat gringos.

All this talk about male bashing; this Donald Trump and Rosie O'donnell fight is not a rarity. This white male bashing has been going on for 30 years on daytime TV. The only reason this fight hit the mainstream media is that Trump has the moxie and the money to fight back. TV has screwed up the women here, big time!

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Dec 31, 2006, 17:14:

Oh I'm so sorry gringoloid but expat gringas are receiveing a lot of attention in Colombia. Sorry to burst your bubble but your sisters and ex girlfriends walking down the Ave Sexta in Cali turn heads and stop the traffic. Even older gringas, the ones that don't have chance in your country are getting plenty of attention in S.A.

Cheers,
Desi

"Soy el que anda de noche en el vecindario, sé cuando ladra el perro, sé cuando canta el gallo sé cuando estan dormidos los muchachos de mi barrio..." (From a llanero song "El pajarito")

"When shall we three meet again? In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"(First Witch in Macbeth)

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Simon says on Dec 31, 2006, 17:41:

"I don't want to go back to Colombia and neither do any of my Colombian friends who are also married to gringos."

colombiangirl72,

Well, good riddance!! Aquí no los extrañamos para nada!

"We would never move back to Colombia simply because he would be kidnapped and killed and we would not be able to make a decent living."

Are you implying that all gringos in Colombia end up kidnapped or killed? You should be ashamed of yourself for talking about your country like that, but that attitude doesn't surprise me coming from someone who obviously thinks she's so 'american' now. And to respond Gringoloid's initial question about whether "a Colombiana turns into a Gringa", after reading exColombiaGirl72 posts, we can clearly see the answer for ourselves.

"Tu vas a ver, llegaras a mi edad y veras que Colombia seguira igual"-----Simon Sr.

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goin_south says on Dec 31, 2006, 22:26:

colombiangirl172.... you sound like: mi fiancee! me gusta! MUY FELIZ, ANO NUEVO! I think it sounds better, "Nuevo Ano!"

Where do we go from here?

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goin_south says on Dec 31, 2006, 23:30:

Interesting.... Desi: Even older gringas, the ones that don't have chance in your country are getting plenty of attention in S.A.

I can believe, but I did not see. But, Even Out.....it seems good.

Otra Vez: opposites attracting complete opposites.

Where do we go from here?

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Jan 1, 2007, 02:28:

There are very few expat gringas living permanently in Colombia and not many female tourists either. Most backpackers there are also guys. I know a couple expat gringas in Cali and they say that they will never live in USA any longer; they visit their kids there and return to Cali, They have a busy social life and plenty of friends, both other expats but mainly local people.

I have seen gringas visiting in Cali, Cartagena and San Andrés and they get plenty of attention. All of them, except maybe the grannies with blue hair and the ones that are grossly overweight.

Blond hair and blue eyes are considered very attractive and Colombian men go just crazy over freckles!

It's not true what gringoloid says that gringa expats are being ignored by both male expats and locals.

Cheers,
Desi

"Soy el que anda de noche en el vecindario, sé cuando ladra el perro, sé cuando canta el gallo sé cuando estan dormidos los muchachos de mi barrio..." (From a llanero song "El pajarito")

"When shall we three meet again? In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"(First Witch in Macbeth)

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goin_south says on Jan 1, 2007, 07:27:

So, this thread has gone full tilt... now the question is: can a gringa turn into a Colombiana? lol

Where do we go from here?

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Jan 1, 2007, 08:41:

I believe it works both ways, gale at least that's what my sisters thought when they first met me after I had lived in Colombia for a number of years. They thought I had become a very strange person; always putting on makeup and wearing ridiculous heels, of course now they say that I've changed back. It's just superficial, however, like adding a new layer on an onion. The core remains the same.

Cheers,
Desi



"Soy el que anda de noche en el vecindario, sé cuando ladra el perro, sé cuando canta el gallo sé cuando estan dormidos los muchachos de mi barrio..." (From a llanero song "El pajarito")

"When shall we three meet again? In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"(First Witch in Macbeth)

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goin_south says on Jan 1, 2007, 15:06:

Colombians stopped coming here in any number in 1996 What happened in or around 1996? What was the cause for this happening? I think everyone I talk to has the impression that immigration controls got tighter after 9-11.

Where do we go from here?

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love2colombia says on Jan 1, 2007, 15:48:

Exudus of the Colombian people in the 80's and 90's

No dejó gobernar a tres presidentes. Transformó el lenguaje, la cultura, la fisonomía y la economía de Medellín y del país. Antes de Pablo Escobar los colombianos desconocían la palabra sicario. Antes de Pablo Escobar Medellín era considerada un paraíso. Antes de Pablo Escobar, el mundo conocía a Colombia como la Tierra del Café. Y antes de Pablo Escobar, nadie pensaba que en Colombia pudiera explotar una bomba en un supermercado o en un avión en vuelo. Por cuenta de Pablo Escobar hay carros blindados en Colombia y las necesidades de seguridad modificaron la arquitectura. Por cuenta de él se cambió el sistema judicial, se replanteó la política penitenciaria y hasta el diseño de las prisiones, y se transformaron las Fuerzas Armadas. Pablo Escobar descubrió, más que ningún antecesor, que la muerte puede ser el mayor instrumento de poder.

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gringoloid says on Jan 1, 2007, 21:02:

Desi..... Are they receiving attention because they have money?

I was speaking very generally, and mostly about Russia and
Eastern Europe.

I cannot imagine a machisto Colombian man really wanting to be with a Southern California woman. After visiting colombia, I don't even want to be with one.

Remember, i'm talking a relationship here.

if you say i'm wrong about all this......why are so many american men going to Russia, Eastern Europe, and Latin America looking for a wife.

Here...take a look..www.loveme.com

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gringoloid says on Jan 1, 2007, 21:06:

Rubito..... Now that you say that you live in NYC, I know you a whole lot better,and where you are coming from.

I spent 12 years in Manhattan, and NY is a tough place. The last seven years, I was trying to get out of there.

But like G5 says, everybody is stuck because of the money and pensions.

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gringoloid says on Jan 1, 2007, 21:18:

Desi...... Lets make sure we understand ourselves....I'm talking relationships and marriage here. A colombiano needing some 'relief', and maybe working on his 'game' a little bit, would surely like a roll in the hay with a blond/blue gringa. (I hate to put this so callously, but boys will be boys.)

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gringoloid says on Jan 1, 2007, 21:25:

Desi....... would it be too much of a personal question if I asked you what country you live in?

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 1, 2007, 22:11:

Gringoloid...not everybody I would not say that everybody is stuck because of "money and pensions". A person can easily manage his money or even his equities, to the extent he may have invested in the Stock market (American) from Colombia. On the other hand, if you are well on your way to obtaining a pension, and life time health insurance as well as drug coverage, you cannot even think of walking away to go live in Colombia, or any other country for that matter. In 7 years, if I want to leave my job, I'll collect 54% of my pay to stay in bed in the morning if I so choose. I also will not have to pay state income tax or social security, or pay into the pension anymore, so it will really be like a greater amount. I certainly will be able to move to Colombia and live quite well on that pension check alone. But again, I will not have any major medical and drug coverage, so what good would it do me?

I also recognize that there are people that are not sitting on the threshold of benefits of this nature. Maybe they are already financialy independent and therefore have accrued the funds that are requited to live a decent standard of life in Colombia.....a standard that they could not live here in the states with the same amount of funds. That's fine, but they better think long term. Because if you are not earning money during your working years here in the states, and you may move to Colombia, you may not be able to move back to the states even if you wanted to. You may not have paid into social security enough quarters to qualify for medicare for example. You may not have planned for a pension or again paid enough into the social security system to obtain a social security check in your 60s (early or regular payout). In other words, it is NOT as easy as it seems. If you spend 10 years in Colombia, you have lost a lot of work time that you will be looking for down the road when you want to retire.

On the other hand, to some people that is not important. I am being practical. Some people don't think about practicality. They live for the moment and don't worry about what their life is going to need 15 or 20 years from now. To each his own

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goin_south says on Jan 1, 2007, 22:23:

Values... values... a matter of values. Not practicality.

'tengo no mas compasion para su loro'

Where do we go from here?

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elchantajista says on Jan 1, 2007, 22:27:

sweden hey gringloid with a colombiano for a esposo ???? just guessing
anda de parranda en Bogota
"Vicente"

anda de parranda en Juanchito "Vicente"

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Jan 1, 2007, 22:40:

Yes, that's right I live in Sweden and no gringa bashing here either ;) Swedish girls have a marked preference for Brits over any other nationality, except of course other Scandinavians who always top the list of desired mates. Swedish men prefer Swedish and other Nordic girls, other European, especially British and Irish girls.

Cheers,
Desi


Cheers,
Desi

"Soy el que anda de noche en el vecindario, sé cuando ladra el perro, sé cuando canta el gallo sé cuando estan dormidos los muchachos de mi barrio..." (From a llanero song "El pajarito")

"When shall we three meet again? In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"(First Witch in Macbeth)

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 1, 2007, 22:51:

Gale It a little bit of both. The proper balance of values and practicality tranlates to common sense.

I'm not willing to be a poor fool, all in the name of "values." A person who clings to his belief in the name of values, is unwilling to accept compromise. Clinging to one's values and using one's values as the sole criteria in making decisions is a recipiet for failure. That's like saying Money does not buy love. I agree. But if you don't have any money at all, you are going to have a hard time finding a woman or keeping the one you have.

If one insists on clinging to their values, one lives in a dream world. And living in a dream world is no life at all. I think I do a good job of mixing the right amount of values and practicality so that in the end, I make decisions that make sense.

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elchantajista says on Jan 2, 2007, 00:26:

what about spaniards and Italianos Desi I thought the way women talked about italian men they were the most sought after??, and what about thoses women from spain ole!!!!!!!, but a doctor from euro. whose is a expert on sex desfunction said although Italian were thought by women to be the best lovers they had the most problems with E.D.When Asked who had the least problems with E.D surprisingly he said the French,{being part french i really agreed with that}& don't forget us Americans across the pond lol; me! as for as euro.goes i'll make a
B-line for Spain and all them hot chicas over there
"como Paz Vega" OLE!!!!!!!!!!!
anda de parranda en Bogota
"Vicente"

anda de parranda en Juanchito "Vicente"

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elchantajista says on Jan 2, 2007, 01:26:

desi What about gringo bashing in Sweden ????

anda de parranda en Bogota
"Vicente"

anda de parranda en Juanchito "Vicente"

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gringolondinense says on Jan 2, 2007, 03:18:

yep desi youre right... those Swedish chicks cant resist British guys its weird! Last time I was in Stockholm, all I had to go was sit next to the bar and babes would come over to me as soon as they heard me speaking. I dont understand it. Im ok looking but not Tom Cruise or whoever.

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miamimike says on Jan 2, 2007, 03:27:

In Miami, Not many Colombians Moving back, Many More keep coming. I know several who have Divorced their American or Colombian Husbands after a few years of Marriage but rarely do they return home or even speak of it, other then a Vacation.

"Wait a minute. What did you just say? You're predicting $4-a-gallon gas? That's interesting. I hadn't heard that." -- Feb. 28, 2008 --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C.

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aztec says on Jan 2, 2007, 06:09:

Gomezman5 has identified the surprising ... ...difficulty in our first attempt on moving to Colombia. "On the other hand, if you are well on your way to obtaining a pension, and life time health insurance as well as drug coverage, you cannot even think of walking away to go live in Colombia, or any other country for that matter." "...you may not be able to move back to the states even if you wanted to."

We had not given these matters enough attention until we starting the physical move. The actual logistics of changing ones life from one culture to another consumes most of your thinking at first. On the surface it appears simple, just pick up and move. Thing are cheaper and life should be less complicated in a "third world" country.

Bear in mind our situation seems to be much different from many of the people on this site who are planning on moving to Colombia. I am fully retired with a 90% pension plus insurance and also receiving Social Security. My wife has been married to me long enough to qualify for Social Security and Medicare when she's eligible.

As most of you know when you turn 65 your insurance turns upside down with Medicare becoming the primary. Also as you know Medicare will not pay for services outside of the country.(with few exceptions) Therefore, for some time my wife's primary (my secondary) coverage will be the private insurance we both have from our former employer. Any supplemental you purchase in Colombia may be impossible to obtain if you are 65 or older.

As a resident of Colombia I would have some difficulty making direct investments in my current mutual funds. Our pension could not be directly deposited into any bank outside of the country. I would need to maintain a U.S. address for managing many of our banking and other investments.

As you can see this defeats one of my reasons for moving; The avoidance of State taxes. You will never avoid the Federal Tax unless you surrender your U.S.citizenship. You will thus be paying taxes both in Colombia and in the U.S. Again, this assumes your income is sufficient to reach those thresholds.

Because our family has already had the problem of receiving an offer from the mob that could not be refused we were determined to have an escape route if the need arose. To wit, if we received the extortion call we wanted to be able to pick up and return to the States.

Our primary objective for wanting to move to Colombia was to enhance and improve our life styles not to degrade it. We did not want to leave our current life style for the barrios in stratus 2 or 3. That doesn't make sense.

Even with the seemingly impossible logistics we discovered that many of the obstacles can be overcome with sufficient advanced planning. The degree of difficulties depend on the variable unique to the individual. Obviously, a 30 year old will have different needs than someone 60 or above.

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 2, 2007, 08:03:

Aztec...and whoever. You certainly give a perfect example of how just picking up and moving, is not as simple as it seems. Look, for the young ones here (35-40 and under) this is like talking a language from the moon. First of all, they probably don't have many or any health issues, and secondly, they are not thinking about a retirement, especially if they are in their 20s. It's all about balancing of interests. In my case however, there is nothing to balance. I can't leave the US for another country for ANY reason.

This brings me to another point. My God it shocks me how only I pick up these utterly strange thinking patterns. Now Aztec, let me say this. You are a friend and a gentleman. You are probably one of the best members on this site in that you always conduct yourself civilly. But think about your own words:

"Because our family has already had the problem of receiving an offer from the mob that could not be refused we were determined to have an escape route if the need arose. To wit, if we received the extortion call we wanted to be able to pick up and return to the States. Our primary objective for wanting to move to Colombia was to enhance and improve our life styles not to degrade it."

Now.....how the hell....or why in the hell would you want to live in a country where your life, and presumably your wives as well, have already been threatened? I can't help it if people like Juanalejo, and Simon and a host of others on this site are just going to read your above quote, and then it will just sail over their head as if it meant nothing. The likes of these characters do that everyday. They have got to be knowing that I am right. They just can't face it. So then only thing they have left to do is send personal attacks my way in the hope that I may just go away. I found a new strategy though. I'll just dig in deeper until maybe they will go away or just sit silently and let me do my thing.....OK Aztec, explain this to me. How in God's name do you feel that you are living a better life, or as you put in "enhance your lifestyle" when people are threatening to kill you. Maybe there is some new school of logic that I am just not familiar with, but I still think that it is fairly instinctive for any living being puts SURVIVAL at the top of the list of instincts that are important to them. I just can't quite figure it out....Aztec. I know you want to make your wife and who knows who else happy but.....it just does not make sense.

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aztec says on Jan 2, 2007, 08:27:

it just does not make sense. Gomezman5 True, it doesn't. And you are correct the danger there is very real for someone like me. My wife has steadfastly refused to return to Colombia simply because it would place me in greater danger.

She worries about me the whole time we are in Colombia. She says Americans are like babies and walk around in Colombia with their heads in the clouds.

What we are attempting to accomplish is establish a base for my wife when she is left without me. She is much younger and statistically should live some time after my death. She would be better served by living with her Colombian friends and family.

We have now decided to do this by living only a part of the year in Colombia and the remainder in the U.S. As pointed out by viewpoint, staying less than 6 months avoids many of the financial pitfalls in Colombia.

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Jan 2, 2007, 09:35:

south europeans like Spaniards and Italianos are just one notch above the Greeks and the Turks who are just a notch above Arabs, Africans....and Latin Americans:) on the local marriage market. Spaniards and Italians are just fine for a vacation fling, but we think that they are too flighty and unstable (read unfaithful) to marry them.

Gringos? Swedes have this love/hate relationship to jänkare. There's a fragment of population that absolutely idolizes US Americans. There's quite few in the top business people and among the rich people that also like the Gringo lifestyle and admire gringos, but far from all. Yet they say that Sweden is one of the most Americanized countries in Europe. As a potential mate, both Gringo and Gringa rate about the same, below the English, Scots and Irish, above the Russians and the Turks...

(Disclaimer:this is not a scientific study nor can I cite any source other than my own observations on how this society regards immigrants and foreigners in this particular area where I live, which is metropolitan Stockholm)

Cheers,
Desi

"Soy el que anda de noche en el vecindario, sé cuando ladra el perro, sé cuando canta el gallo sé cuando estan dormidos los muchachos de mi barrio..." (From a llanero song "El pajarito")

"When shall we three meet again? In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"(First Witch in Macbeth)

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gringoloid says on Jan 2, 2007, 11:07:

Aztec....... hi.....what does your wife mean by "She says Americans are like babies and walk around in Colombia with their heads in the clouds."

does she mean we had a 'soft' life?

'heads in the clouds', does she find us arrogant?

it's totally ok what she feels; i have my prejudices too.

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gringoloid says on Jan 2, 2007, 11:16:

G5..Desi...Aztec...Miamimike..and more.. You're all making good points here and to each his own...

And thanks for the economic perspective that surrounds a move to colombia.

(BTW, I just turned off my phone service for my move!!) Hope I'm going to like colombia!!!

But take a look at this post on the home page from 'titomachista', ...this is what I'm talking about. it's titled:
"K-1 Wife and K-2 Child going back to Colombia for Sick Mother"

This is kind of a sad post....and I really feel for this guy and his wife. (that is the honest to god truth, Desi)

There is more going on with him and his wife than is posted in this small email.

I don't want to bring a wife back here and have her get really homesick, and that's why I inquired to you all with the original post.

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aztec says on Jan 2, 2007, 12:01:

gringoloid, she just... ...thinks we are oblivious to the dangers surrounding us here. She meant to say we are mostly innocent to the harsh realities of living in Colombia.

Despite the rhetoric from me and others, for the most part, it is much more difficult to move and live in Colombia than we would like to believe. Every thing being equal most of us would be better off to remain where we are.

If things are not going well now for you moving to Colombia is not going to solve your problems. Move to Colombia when you have your life under control not when things around you are falling apart.

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 2, 2007, 12:36:

Rubito I submit, that while YOU may not see "Physical Security as the ultimate goal of our existence". (to use your words)I submit that you are by far and away in the minority in terms of how people think. You cannot for a minute deny that. The proof is empirical. Colombia, in spite of her proximity and beauty, is far less traveled to than just about any country in SA. Is there really any reason (but for the violence and security problems) that Colombia's tourism should not exceed that of Brazil's? That is especially so considering it take twice as long to fly to Rio as it does to any Colombian costal city. Is it just coincidence that in the brochure American airlines gave me the other day, almost every SA country is listed on its 25 day tour, but Colombia is not? Why is that? Because they just decided to overlook the country or that it was a mistake? So you can tell me this nonsense about how security may not be important to some people of which you are a member of that class, you are not going to make me believe, that my suggestion that security is not one of the most important, if not THE most important consideration when deciding to visit or live in that country. I have heard your sentiments over and over again. I'm, just saying that most people do not buy into your line of reasoning. If you want to be an adventurer, that's fine. But let it be known that you are willing to take extraordinary chances in your travels, and that traveling to or living in Colombia is not merely an average degree of risk. You can minimize the importance of reality for your own personal reasons. It does NOT change the situation. It only changes how you choose to interpret or deal with the situation. Do you understand that key difference?

BTW, I have no idea where you are getting this murder rate in Chicago being the same as Bogotá. Please site your sources. Absent any credible sources, such statements are meaningless. Also, if I may add, one cannot define how safe or unsafe a city is based on one statistical standard alone. Don't you think that safety/security concerns go beyond the murder rate. Try this. When is the last time you heard about people living in ANY major city having to worry about getting extortion calls that threatened the spouse or children. Are you suggesting that is common place in the US like it IS commonplace in Colombia? BTW, that is what Aztec is talking about in this thread, so why you wou