Dating site

Gomezman5 says on Feb 6, 2005, 13:14:

Tinto, I just can't figure something out "Denegrating women". That is a fairly strong two words to be applying in this instance. Why is it that Peter and the moderators of this site are trying to impose certain types of standards that are as far away from a Colombian reality as you can get on this site?

The Colombian women that are involved in the sex industry in Colommbia do not view themselves as denegrating women. They engage in this industry by their own free will. It is their choice,and I don't think that they think that they are denegrating themselves, or they would not do it. The sex industry is as big a part of Colombia as any other area that I can think of. Sexual promiscuiity and the proliferation of it, cannot be something thay anyone can deny.

What puzzles me even more so is why you, Lionheart and Peter are adopting this rather puritanical approach to the matter, because of your interest in not offending a few women that may be hypersensitive to the issue as a whole. Colombian thinking in EVERY way, is as far away from Puritanical thought as you can get. I don't think that these people's interests should be deciding factor as to what is and not valid points of discussion.

I am not saying that you should open a room that talks about the sexual exploits/and or related interests. I am saying that we need to take a step back, and loosen the ropes a little bit, so that if a man opens a discussion mentioning how he is arriving in Bogota for a week, and ask where the popular night life is where single women hang out, he should not immediately be accused of being a sex tourist.

If we are going to talk about the real Colombia, == the food, the culture, the country side, the costal and amazon areas, the music, if someone want to ask for factual info about the success of dating services or where single women hangout, the censors should not do a bee line to his post for the purpose of cutting him off

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Gomezman5 says on Feb 6, 2005, 14:47:

Tinto....excuse me but you have over read what I have said. I need not be told about where I can find dating sites and I even said I am not suggesting that you add one.

I am not a fan of political correctness. I know the rules. Nobody on this site knows better than myself that rules are subject to multiple interpretations. That is what us lawyers do every day. So you siting the rules only means that is how you choose to interpret and presumably enforce it. With the exception of the most obvious instances of a violation, (I have reported such to you myself), there often is room for multiple interpretations

All I tried to say is, don't close down or warn about discussions just like the example I sited above. The majority of members are predominantly Latin males, and I don't think that the men always have to "walk on thin ice" for fear of offending a few females males that happen to be hypersensitve as to a particular posting. This site should not be used to further any particular feminst agenda.

Enjoy the game!! And, ....... My best. G5

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Peter (Moderator) (Trustee board) (Dev team) (☼Travelguide writer) says on Feb 6, 2005, 14:57:

kernow62 says on Feb 26, 2005, 07:03:

To all those folks that would like to see Peter's site altered to something that suits them better than it suits Peter, its creator.

Start your own forum. Until then live and play by Peter's rules and be thankful he has given us this forum to share. I think Peter is pretty clear on what he wants and doesn't want on his forum.

PS: I need more bandwidth for my site if anyone has any suggestions, surprisingly I am getting an average of 1200 hits a day! My free webspace has started to exceed my monthly bandwidth.

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Desideria (Moderator) (Trustee board) says on Feb 26, 2005, 10:25:

this one of the very few Colombia boards that does not focus on relationships or dating Colombian women. I might be one of those "hypersensitive females" on this board that greatly appreciates the ground rules set by peter and scrupulously maintained by our good moderators. I have nothing against an open and honest debate about most issues of interest, don't consider myself hypersensitive in any way but feel like this is a safe haven for us non-Colombian women to express our opinions about Colombia, her people, life in general without being labelled, shouted down, ridiculed by people who don't share our opinions.

Cheers,
Desi
(BTW there was something very disturbing about gomezman's post on this thread, but i'm not gettin into it right now.)

A fronte praecipitium a tergo lupi

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kernow62 says on Feb 26, 2005, 12:26:

Oh please do Desi. I would like to see Gomezman have a go at somebody else for a change, I can just sit back and watch.

I also didn't care for Gary posting his commercial website on the forum the other day, especially as his site is completely covered by mailorder bride adverts. However that is up to the moderators to allow or disallow.

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adrimm (Moderator) (☼Travelguide writer) says on Feb 26, 2005, 12:47:

Desideria (Moderator) (Trustee board) says on Feb 26, 2005, 13:02:

ok, here goes "The Colombian women that are involved in the sex industry in Colommbia do not view themselves as denegrating women. They engage in this industry by their own free will. It is their choice,and I don't think that they think that they are denegrating themselves, or they would not do it. The sex industry is as big a part of Colombia as any other area that I can think of. Sexual promiscuiity and the proliferation of it, cannot be something thay anyone can deny."

The myth of the "happy hooker" lives on in minds of men who think like gomezman. How did you ever come to this conclusion? That women who work in the sex industry in Colombia or anywhere else in the world for that matter would not rather do something else if they were given a decent choice? Granted, there are a few that like the easy money and are not overly bright or ambitious to pursue a career, but overall, I would seriously doubt that any/most women given a choice would not rather do something else than hook up with men who can't get sex without having to pay for it.
As you all know, I live in Sweden and these countries have been spared for a long time from the social and judicial problem of prostitution. While there have always been a a tiny number of women that rather sell their bodies than do a honest day's of work prostitution was largely unknown up here. Until the Berlin wall broke down, and suddenly, there were hordes of Eastern European working girls flooding our capitols. In Sweden engaging the services of a prostitute is illegal, however, the girls are not criminalized, since many of them are being lured here on false pretenses of finding an honest job in industry or service. Some girls are kept locked up in apartments and their "owners" have confiscated their identity papers. I read about these sad cases in the papers every day. There's a Swedish movie made on the subject called "Lilja, forever" of a Russian prostitute that is the saddest story a person can imagine.

Women that work in the sex industry of their free will are just as much victims as the ones forced to prostitution by the circumstances. Human beings are very resilient and it may take years for these girls to discover what a waste their lives have been. Many continue to hook up, even if they are disgusted by what they do to support their addictions and because they don't have any skills or education to give them many options in life. But as a preferred lifestyle? Give me a break!

Cheers,
Desi

A fronte praecipitium a tergo lupi

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kat1 (Moderator) (Trustee board) (☼Travelguide writer) says on Feb 26, 2005, 13:06:

Desideria (Moderator) (Trustee board) says on Feb 26, 2005, 13:08:

yeah, kat and not only calipro, but morgus, sorry morphus, rufus...and greenday! I'm really looking forward to it!

Cheers,
Desi

A fronte praecipitium a tergo lupi

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kat1 (Moderator) (Trustee board) (☼Travelguide writer) says on Feb 26, 2005, 13:09:

Desideria (Moderator) (Trustee board) says on Feb 26, 2005, 13:13:

too little, too late I had plenty more to say but I'll save it later ...hoping this thread doesn't get locked first.
Cheers,
Desi

A fronte praecipitium a tergo lupi

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Hunter says on Feb 26, 2005, 14:31:

Guys you can live in the real world or you can live in your dream world.

As to this site not focusing on relationships and dating, wake up its seems like every other thread is asking about marriage, dating, relationships on the general discussion board. If somebody bothered to count them and compare them to other more general threads say over the last month, you will see that this general discussion board in reality has more of the content than any other that you don't want.

Personally I find it pretty sad that people can't see that for themselves, but there are just so many blinkered people out, it fits.

Hence the reason for the thread, because I am mostly not interested in reading about K1 marriage visa, or how I my English boyfriend doesn't appreciate me, or dating sites.

As regularly happens Desi will come along and try and stir some s... up, so:

As to the happy hooker, its VERY EASY money thats why they do it, as many Colombian women (not hookers) I know say, why work somewhere cleaning 10 hours a day or in a factory etc, when they can earn a days pay in a few minutes on your back, presuming they have the face or the body to do it. So they decide to take the easy option in Colombia as in many other Countries, I suppose there are no hookers in Europe and other Countries, or are they not also taking the easy money.

As to girls being lured, that is some mithical media story, do you honestly believe that the vast majority of girls don't know what they are getting into, they just use it as easy excuse when caught. There has been some studies done on this, looking into women who were caught, claimed they were ignorant and duped. The studies checked to see what the women were doing a short while later, all the ones they could find were guess what back as hookers.

Don't you think that the Eastern European Countries have magazines, radio, television, the stories are well circulated in the media over there since the fall of the iron curtain, its only been 15 years.

It pays in life to take an un-biased view and think thinks through logically, then you will be far closer to the true answer, than if you start off with a biased view.

Just so many people in the world live with their head up their a..

Hunter

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Desideria (Moderator) (Trustee board) says on Feb 26, 2005, 14:59:

I didn't expect you, hunter, to share my views either, as I recall, you do use the services of the working girls on regular basis, since you can't be bothered with the "normal" girls who'd want some kind of commitment from you. You live in your bubble, I live in mine, that's all.
Yes, many young Rumanian and Albanian girls that have been lured to Sweden had no idea that they would be working as prostitutes. Their stories are really heart-breaking. Living in an apartment in Stockholm, with no documents of id, no working permits and being watched like hawks all the time by the men who "imported" them. Media hype? I think not. Most of them have since then returned to their home country, deported or of their own free will.
I stir up some s...? It was gomezman who started talking about prostitution. I had a good mind of not answering his post even though I found it very disturbing. I don't understand why some men find any redeeming qualities in the life of hookers. Certainly most women (having the body and the face for it) would rather either/or get married and pursue a career even if they were well-endowed by nature.

Cheers,
Desi

A fronte praecipitium a tergo lupi

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Hunter says on Feb 26, 2005, 15:30:

Regular basis Would not be correct, once and a while yes, but didn't you post on another thread that you believe some people shouldn't get married etc. I am one of those, or would you prefer me to use a girl, lie to her then bin her. I guess you probably would, because you are the sort of two faced person I have long got used to dealing with who loves to stir the shit up.

Deported after they were caught, I don't doubt there is the occasional one who doesn't know what she is getting herself into, but most do, dream on it easy money if they want to do it, many women don't some do.

What made me laugh the most about your post that Sweden never had a problem before the women from Eastern Europe came to your Country, yeah right.

If they have the body and face some of them do get married and what are they providing to marriage, the same thing in another form.

As to me reply, of course I will reply to your threads Desi, because you are a troll. I will keep pointing out once and a while, when I have the time, when you regularly lay yourself open to it, like asking the guy to post a pic of the poor girl in anothr thread.

Going back to the original reason of the post, please count how many threads I would class as relationship based over the last month, you won't be counting the ones that they have deleted and tell me that the General forum is not already based around dating etc.

Hence my reason for the post.

Hunter

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Desideria (Moderator) (Trustee board) says on Feb 26, 2005, 17:07:

some people shouldn't marry, that's what I said and I stand by it. If you, hunter, feel you're one of them then I'm only glad that you've realized that in time before causing any suffering in other people's lives.
You can laugh until you turn blue, but the truth is that prostitution was virtually unknown in Scandinavian countries until the fall of the Iron Curtain. Yes, there was this one street in Stockholm where men with a handicap of some kind could go and find one or two working girls to attend to their needs, but that was that.
I already explained why I changed my mind in the other thread. Now I need you to stop this nonsense of calling me a troll

Cheers,
Desi

A fronte praecipitium a tergo lupi

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greenday says on Feb 26, 2005, 17:28:

Desi, I'm very offended by your above reference to me. Show me one post of mine where I've shown any support for prostitution or the sex industry, either here in the US or abroad. Why would you lump me in with the others?? Just because I'm attracted to younger women, that doesn't mean I'm attracted to prostitutes or sex industry workers. Or are you implying that is the only way for me to get a younger woman?? Maybe you should talk to your friend Lauthra about me so she can set you straight... I'm very offended!!!!! And you wonder why some men here think you are an instigating troll...
An apology is certainly in order!!!!!!!

P.S. one doesn't have to go very far to find websites on dating and foreign marriage agencies, this webpage is still full of ads for them. I STILL think that it is quite hypocritical...

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greenday says on Feb 27, 2005, 11:20:

Desi still waiting for your apology...

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Desideria (Moderator) (Trustee board) says on Feb 27, 2005, 11:59:

oh dear you are? I had forgotten all about you and your wounded pride, greenday.

No, I don't need to start digging up threads to prove that you don't like/need to pay for female attentions. If you say so, so be it. I believe you. I don't have to run a poll on it.

Cheers,
Desi

A fronte praecipitium a tergo lupi

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calipro says on Feb 27, 2005, 12:11:

Sorry Kat1 and Desi I hate to disappoint the two of you but I don't know much about prostitution here in the states let alone in Colombia or god forbid Scandinavian countries.

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greenday says on Feb 27, 2005, 15:09:

Desi was that an apology??? And wounded pride??, my pride is not wounded...I was insulted by you. Now I'm not calling you a troll or anything, however you are behaving like one with your insults to me.
You, accusing me of partaking in the sex industry is akin to me accusing you of being a prostitute, something I would never do. Your behavior on this thread is hardly innocent, and does not parallel the behavior of a well-intended poster.
Now, apologize like a lady who has a little class (as you claim to have), and let's be done with it.

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Hunter says on Feb 27, 2005, 15:31:

greenday & calipro I very much doubt that either of you are getting it free, very few guys do, if you are dating girls in Colombia or any other Country and you are taking them out, buying them drinks food, presents whatever, what are you doing but PAYING FOR IT, if you are lucky enough to go all the way, if that is what you are after.

Very few women go dutch and if they do, it just once and a while.

So when desi says, that I said that I am paying for it, this it the way that I class myself as paying for it normally, sometimes in cash for taxi money, for their sick relative etc., but the later is rarer. In fact all of them are rarer now.

Hunter

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greenday says on Feb 27, 2005, 17:03:

Hunter although I agree to some extent, yes, it gets expensive to date any woman, from any country, Desi was quite succinct when she referred to "prostitution" and "the sex industry"...and to be very clear, I don't contribute money to either.

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WidowerfromCanada says on Feb 27, 2005, 20:17:

Desi ,I think you owe greenday and calipro apologies Desi as a third party here I would have been very offended also if you had mentioned my name.

If you re:read your post you are saying that they use hookers or take advantage of poor helpless girls to fulfill their carnal pleasures and pay for it.

Greenday or Calipro would have been banned if they called you the term for a working girl.

I really do think you need to apologize for words and insinuations.

You do not need to agree with them going out with younger women but to throw a low blow like that is quite bad.

This is not personal Desi and I like a lot of your posts. That reminds me that I have to give one of your threads another nudge to get it going again.

Jeff


Love is like a butterfly , if you chase it you will not catch it but you can hope the butterfly of love lands on your shoulder.

Love is like a butterfly , if you chase it you will not catch it but you can hope the butterfly of love lands on your shoulder.

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calipro says on Feb 27, 2005, 22:17:

Hunter or anyone else that wants to read my long post.... Hunter

From what you say it seems like you are just doing the normal dating routine. But, I don't equate buying dinner with buying sex.

Personally I think you should find a woman's company that you enjoy aside from just sex. I mean if you are just sitting there chewing your steak thinking about nailing her when you get her home and letting what she says go in one hear and out the other then I think you should find a woman that REALLY interests you.

I don't want to sound like a hypocrite because I actually take pretty good care of my girlfriends. But before any woman makes it to girlfriend status, we have spent a lot of quality time together;-)

Let me give some Cali specific advise because I have run into so many guys that just do not understand women from Cali.

First caleñas are NOT americanas. They will accept any gift from anyone with very, very little regard as to how they feel about you. If you offered an expensive gift to an americana that didn't have any feelings for you she might actually refuse the gift. If you offer an expensive gift to a caleña that doesn't have any feelings for you what so ever she will gladly accept it no questions asked (99.99% of the time).

After talking to disgruntled gringos and many a confused caleña (when the guy asks for the stuff back), I have come to the conclusion that gift giving is one of the biggest problem areas of american guys dating caleñas. So let me sum it up like this, To a caleña a gift is just that, a gift with no strings attached. Just because she accepts it does not mean that she even likes you let alone loves you. She will not feel anymore obligated to you after you give her the gift than before. So if you are not already in some kind of a committed or intimate relationship with the woman before you gave her the gift you just threw your money away unless of course you like to make women happy that don't necesarily find you all that attractive. And if she does have a renewed interest in you after you give her the gift, well...I hate to break the news to you but I think you have found yourself a real insincere woman to say the least.

This brings us to rule number one when dating a caleña. NEVER EVER buy anything of any real value for a caleña that is not sleeping with you on an unconditional basis. If she is really your girlfriend then she is sleeping with you everyday or when ever you want or she is a virgin and I have dated plenty of women in Cali and not run into one yet.

I have run into some sorry americanos that like to think that they have something going on with a caleña even thought they don't have sex and I'm here to tell them that they are wrong. If she isn't a virgin and she isn't having sex with you, there is a problem. Why was it OK to have sex before but now it's not OK? Some guys just need to get a clue.

The beautiful thing about not having sex with a caleña is that they expect very little. If she asks for anything or makes any kind of demands on you then she has you pegged as a chump. Colombianos do not buy expensive gifts (ie. clothes from Studio F)for women that they don't have sex with and either should you. They do buy women expensive gifts (if they have the money) for women that they are in an intimate relationship with and whose company they value. Some colombianos just bang them and dump them as fast as they can.

So now you have a caleña girlfriend. She comes over on her lunch break in the middle of the day just to take care of you. She calls you up that night to ask what you are doing and you tell her that you are tired and are going to go to sleep early. She comes over the next day on her lunch break just to do you again. Now that is a girlfriend!

Not only is this new girlfriend of yours doing you left and right but guess what you actually like her to boot. You don't want to send any mixed messages by actually buying something for a girl that you don't really and truely have the hots for. You might never get rid of her.

So here are the rules of engagement:

1)If she asks for something say NO! It's not a gift if she asks for it and you give it to her. When she is your wife she will ask for stuff and then you will probably have to buy it for her. But, she is NOT your wife yet.

2) You decide how much you want to spend on her. Do not base your decision on how happy you think she will make you in the future but how much you enjoy her company right now. Remember relationships can end at any moment and we don't want to hear you crying on planet-love about how much money you spent on some girl that you THOUGHT would be around to change your diapers. hehehe !!! Shit Happens !!

3) OK, now you have this girlfriend that you really dig. Hell you think you are falling in love with her. You don't want to lose her but you have to go back to the states. She is crying and you are (almost crying)remember don't be a wimp in front of your caleña. That is that kiss of death.

Anyway she is thinking she is never going to see you again if this the first time you have left. It is very, very important that she not think this. The minute you get back to the states you need to call her and tell her that you miss her. Then you need to tell her when you are coming back.

Now depending on the financial situation of the young women, you are going to decide what to do. If she is in a good finacial situation (she either has a decent job or parents with cash) you won't be sending her cash. Send her flowers, cards and a small gift every other week or so along with regular phone calls. She should be waiting for your calls and you shouldn't be getting any kind of an attitude. Hell I have been know to call my girl up at 3:00 am just to wake her ass up. She should be happy to hear from you because she is just as worried about you as you are about her, right?

Now more likely than not your new girl is not in a good financial situation and this gets very tricky because if you want to keep her you are most likely going to have to help her. Let's face it. She needs help. If it isn't going to be you it will be somebody else. It's just the facts of life and if you don't help her you won't be any better than the broke ass colombianos that have been taking her for a ride.

Personally I recommend that you send her between $150 and $200 a month. A young women can actually live on $200 a month. I have seen them do it.

Now giving her the money will not guarantee that you will not lose this chick if she is as hot as I think she should be but if you don't, you won't even be in the running. I suggest that you even keep closer tabs on this type of girl than the others because they tend to stray. Nothing on this green earth should be more important than talking to you on the phone if she really cares about you and you are helping to support her.

You are going to make two requests of her: 1) She should be easy to get a hold of by phone and 2) she can never tell anybody that you are helping her out. Both points are important but number two is really important. You would not believe the pressure that even a mother will place on her own daughter once she finds out she has a gringo boyfriend sending her cash. She will most likely ask you for more money even if her family is not pressuring her but you will always say "no". What is she going to do? Split up with you and get nothing. If she gets to radical, she told her family about the money and they are making her life a living hell at this point and you will just have to dump her. It happens from time to time.

Disclaimer: This advice is only good for attractive caleñas under the age of 25 because that is all I have experiance with.

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Desideria (Moderator) (Trustee board) says on Feb 27, 2005, 22:44:

jeff, calipro doesn't really care at all, and besides that, what I meant as I added a line to kat's list of people who'd be answering to my post very soon was just that; nothing else. It's a special crowd of people here who are interested in the subject; some users and some opposers. I never said that greenday or calipro engage prostitutes on their trips to Colombia, only that we'll hear from them very soon! It's not the first time we talk about this on a board...
I suspect that greenday is not "really" offended either, only pretending to be. He already got his apology; I wrote that to my knowledge he has never said that he needed to pay for female attentions. I just added his handle to a list of names that usually show up in these discussions.
Anyway, I'm leaving this matter to our good moderators. If tinto, lionheart or peter think I should apologise drop me a p.m. and I'll do it.
Thanks for the "bump" for my Normal Day, Jeff.
Have a nice day,
Desi

A fronte praecipitium a tergo lupi

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Gomezman5 says on Feb 27, 2005, 22:53:

What the hell is going on here?????? GOOD GRIEF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

Who ressurected this stupid thread from three weeks ago. This thread should have been locked by Peter of Feb 6 (yes three weeks ago).

I made my point, and oddly enough, Desi, I was not making reference to you or any other 1 particular female. But, I said what I had to say. I have my perspective and others have theirs. Some hookers like their job...yes I really believe that. And some don't. Some people like working on an assembly line, and some don't. I don't think any woman, man or otherwise can speak on behalf of all involved. Let's let this thread die????? Huh? There is not going to be anything new brought to light. One thing is certain, this is NOT the place to be debating the merits of lack there of, of the world's oldest profession, and I don't think anyone will argue with me about that!!!!

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fzrdan says on Feb 27, 2005, 23:04:

gman, I am bored. Lets not have this thread die. It is very entertaining listening (reading) to people bicker.

I can't believe that Scandanavian countries are the only ones on earth that didn't have prostitution. How did all those desperate college girls pay for school???? ;)

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