Colombians tell me not to live in Colombia

Greg444 says on Mar 10, 2006, 09:13:

The gringos are getting a bad reputation in Medellin for mongers and rudeness, etc, I seems to me the upper strata Paisas seem to look upon them as fools or a novelty.

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Tinto (Moderator) says on Mar 10, 2006, 09:20:

Boys behaving badly Gringos in Medellin and Cali, Italians and Israelis in Cartagena, Germans in Rio, the list is probably endless. As UtopiaCowboy would say, "Death to them all!"

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Blue says on Mar 10, 2006, 09:38:

Reminds me of the David Bowie song "China Girl" I stumble into town just like a sacred cow
Visions of swastikas in my head
Plans for everyone
It's in the whites of my eyes

My little china girl
You shouldn't mess with me
I'll ruin everything you are
I'll give you television
I'll give you eyes of blue
I'll give you a man who wants to rule the world

And when I get excited
My little china girl says
Oh baby just you shut your mouth
She says ... sh-sh-shhh

Blue

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toneloc24 says on Mar 10, 2006, 09:40:

It's only gonna get worse in MDE Especially as the Medellin Mansion and their minions spread the word on Medellin to their buddies in the USA and Europe. Even though, it's probably only Poblado on which they speak of.

I've never been there (MM), but I know the stories too well, as I've had a few buddies who've stayed there. It ain't for me. The millionaire guys really aren't looking for a real wife, maybe just a trophy, or as UC says, a blow-up doll. Hanging out with prepagos and their friends, is the same as hanging out with putas and their friends. You can't think that they are serious about YOU, can you?

It's funny how these same guys will go to Mango's knowing that they can't touch the girls there, but somehow think the girls in Parque Lleras want anything to do with them. Back to the mansion to dial up a....prepago. Then they rave about these girls as if.....money wasn't their only motivation.

With all the publicity of "rich" gringos in abundance coming to Medellin, it wouldn't shock me to hear of increasing threats to gringo tourists there in the near future. They would be easy targets for petty crime. Someone recently reported that a gringo was targeted (for kidnapping or robbery) coming into the city from the airport by taxi.

"Don't tase me, bro!!!!"

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Mar 10, 2006, 09:43:

Two millionares gringos?, still haven't got girlfriends or wife?. Hmmmmm..........Do they call anyone "honey" including pets.

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utopiacowboy says on Mar 10, 2006, 09:58:

What a hilarious thread. Those poor gringo millionaires stuck with all the prepagos and siliconas in Poblado. Pobrecitos! I wish I knew who they were because I would sell their sorry asses to the FARC in a heartbeat.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Mar 10, 2006, 09:59:

Maybe they find luck with one Maybe they'll find luck with one of those Farc Guerrilleras.A future wife perhaps?

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toneloc24 says on Mar 10, 2006, 11:00:

Hey UC Let's do it. It would be to put together a list of guys going, dates, and probably where they will spend their time there. Places like Loutron (massage+ place), Energy (same), Grill San Diego (strip club/puta bar), Mango's, CC Oviedo, CC San Diego, CC El Tesero, Parque Lleras. They post their itineraries on public websites for the world to see. It's like a routine already. What easy targets!!!

"Don't tase me, bro!!!!"

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caulfield2 says on Mar 10, 2006, 13:17:

This might be one of the most idiotic opening threads ever.

Seriously, if you have money or not, as a gringo, you´re totally clueless if you cannot find a good wife in 2 years, but I am assuming that´s not what they are actually looking for.

They probably want to feel like they´re king of the hill because they´re getting so much attention from the young hotties...maybe a midlife crisis.

And why would young millionaire types need to come to Colombia when they can have the same type of women in the US? Are they just trying to get their rocks off more cheaply in a poorer country?

I am sure they are not meeting any women in churches, malls, coffee shops or grocery stores. The parameters of their search must be among the 5-10% of prepagos-siliconas that SEEM as if they ARE the average Colombian woman that´s posted about here, because this is the limits of their knowledge and interaction. There´s PLENTY of good women here...but is that what they want? I really doubt it. They are probably flashing their money, showing pictures of boats-cars-houses, acting like jackasses and wondering why they keep picking up huge bills at the discotecas and restaurantes every Friday and Saturday night.

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Crazy4Cali says on Mar 10, 2006, 13:30:

I would give them more credit... The don't wonder why they are picking up the tab, they KNOW why they are. To impress las chicas, por supuesto.

On the other hand, if they are shopping in the "prepago" dept and wondering why they aren't finding anyone suitable (or inclined) for marriage, then, yes, they are clueless.

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pedro says on Mar 10, 2006, 13:57:

"The gringos are getting a bad reputation in Medellin for mongers and rudeness, etc, I seems to me the upper strata Paisas seem to look upon them as fools or a novelty."


Dunno, I can tell you I'm looked at as a fool or a novelty by all class of people and all over Colombia. And often as a meal ticket too.

Was it ever any different?

This says more about how Colombians like to see the world than it does about me and my behaviour. I highly doubt it's a flow on from the existence of one guest house in Medellin.

que nota!

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toneloc24 says on Mar 10, 2006, 14:27:

It's one thing to be trying to impress the chicas. It's another to be trying to impress the prepagos.

The rudeness thing? I've seen it. There's a reason I try to travel alone, and frequent as few gringo hangouts as possible in Colombia. No disrespect to any of them, but I can do without them on my trip.

Somehow, I don't think it's just the upper-strata paisas that look upon them as fools or a novelty.

I'd guess that the recent steady increase of single male gringo tourists in the Poblado area would be partly attributable to that guest house.

"Don't tase me, bro!!!!"

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Miguel says on Mar 10, 2006, 14:55:

Pedro If you keep on learning how to dance cumbia like you were in B/Quilla, those colombianas are going to think you are a rolo basketball player that studied in Madrid! Creo que tu tienes mi tarjeta y mi correo...me gustaría saber donde estás y mierda en general.

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Pete E says on Mar 10, 2006, 15:49:

Living in Coilombia,working in Colombia You raise lots of points.
If you have to work in the Colombian economy you will make a whole lot less than in the US,alot more than would be offest by any cost of living factors.So yes,from a $$ standpoint those Colombians are right,it would be stupid to do so,UNLESS YOU HAVE ANOTHER REASON MORE IMPORTANT TO YOU.Like finding the woman you want,the number one reason gringos come here.Those Colombians take for granted what they have in that department.
If you can work for a US company,the US government,have a job like an internet based one where you can make a US salary here,are retired or independently weathy you can live here without financial struggle.Otherwise its going to be tough.Some guys do it,doing something like teaching english,one of the few jobs agringo could even get here.They have to have a reason for the $$ sacrafice.Usually its about women,the number one reason to come here.
Millionare gringos can't find a woman in Medellin?Shows nothing is foolproof.But Medellin is tough,conservative.Throwing money around might work with hookers but not get you a good woman.Speaking spanish and having some class might work better in Medellin.In Cali millionares will find lots of takers,but if you take them to the states they might just put up with you very temporarily.Thats a common problem when a guy gets way over his head in looks and age with a woman then takes her to the states.
Every place has its benefits and downsides.The trick is to pick one that works for you personally.Colombia is not for everyone.Maybe not for you.I thought you were just down on Cali but it sounds like more of a total Colombia issue.You got to figure out why you are here,or come here.Sounds like you are confused about it,you like to sound out the negatives but there has to be some positives for you,or why do it?
And you don't get to put the benefits of one place together with the benefit of another and avoid the downsides.
ALMOST ANY serious guy can find a whole lot more attractive woman in Colombia than in the states,the reason most guys come here.And with a little wisdom can avoid a problem girl in the process.Its not without its risks and issues.And obviously its not foolproof or guaranteed.

Pete

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Greg444 says on Mar 10, 2006, 16:34:

Yes, these millionare gringos are looking for a wife, i saw the same ones two years ago, they even go to marriage agencies in Medellin.
in fact their whole lives appear to revolve around finding a women.

What was really strange was one gringo actually bought and lived with a Paisa for over a year , just to make sure, as soon as they went back to the US , to Orlando, it fell apart.

Unfortunately I mixed two subjects on one post, but what my Colombia friends were trying to get at, was nice discos/eating places are boring after a few months, do not move.
Where I live I can mountain bike, surf, go to the beach, hike, play golf, etc.. any weekend I want, my Colombian friends just shake their heads and don't move.

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pedro says on Mar 10, 2006, 16:43:

Miguel Oops, didn't get your card. That detail must have been forgotten in the drunken haze!

I figured we could be in touch by PM and trade stories, but the PM feature disappeared soon after.

Could you shoot me a message at ( pedro at ozforces dot com dot au ) and we'll go from there?

que nota!

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Rubiazo says on Mar 10, 2006, 20:27:

Not to doubt your experiences BUT
most of the people I know in Colombia who currently live there AND have been to the US don't have any burning desire to go back, EVEN for 14 million! Usually when the subject of the US comes up you get lots of anecdotes about the 64oz sodas and nasty fast food everywhere and not being able to walk anywhere and how Americans think Bogota looks like the movie "romancing the stone."

On the other hand I keep running into people here who are talking of repatriating. I have quite a few friends destined to go back there before the year is out as a matter of fact.

I guess it just depends on which circles you are moving in, and where your tastes and priorities are at.

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kevluvsmedellin says on Mar 10, 2006, 21:32:

nice post pete..... couldn't have said it better myself......
heres my simple minded comment about all this:
I've been saying it for 2 years,the last thing i want is for alot of North -American party/tourist types coming to Medellin and causing problems for low key guys like me and my few north american friends there. pero lo que paso paso........

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juanalejo says on Mar 11, 2006, 06:58:

Rubiazo There is simply no place like home. When I lived in the USA, I was always looking forward to buying and buying and buying, new car, new TV, new stereo, new camara. Sundays off to the mall, and then always watching TV at friends homes. Here I do not feel that urge, so for less money many people like me, like it better here. I have no urge on buying, when I buy I keep for many years regardless of what is new on the market, on the other hand I spend lot of money on going out, dining out, renting fincas for the weekend, holidays when ever possible and hosting lost of dinners and parties. It just feels different to me.

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Gomezman5 says on Mar 11, 2006, 07:13:

Why would Anyone Think that a couple of millionaire gringos living in mde would be looking for wives? First of all, any gringo who has the money to get there, can find a wife in a hell of a lot less than 2 years. Look at all these people that meet on web sites, talk on the phone, go visit, talk on the phone and them....just like that they marry or they are apply for the fiance visa.

A couple of Gringos, assuming they don't have to work, are absolutely elated with their prepegados (putas), what is their incentive to marry? If they ever decide to come back to the States, they may give up their wild ways and find someone to bring back. It's not as if it is that hard. If they live there, they have many opportunities to socialize a whole lot and they therefore they can be finding wicves all day....everyday.

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caulfield2 says on Mar 11, 2006, 07:19:

I´m sure the marriage agencies work for some, but if you start out with the idea that the women is consciously looking to move to the United States, you´re setting yourself up for trouble IMO.

The best girls down here are the ones who love their country and give little thought to the idea that living in the US-Europe etc. is better than Colombia.

As mentioned many times before, you´re going to end up with the Strato 2-4 type of girls, in all likelihood. The best girls in Colombia would never even think of signing up with a marriage agency or broker.

So caveat emptor...maybe I am misreading your comments, but to use the terminology ¨bought¨ a paisa makes me wonder if she was a prostitute that he tried to ¨convert¨ so to speak, or he purchased her contact information through an agency.

What is your impression of these guys, personally? Why do you think they haven´t had success? Are they too addicted to the attention....that they can´t settle down with just one woman? The Colombiana that moved to the US, did she know about his wealth? Or did he try to lead a more ordinary existence down here with her? I´m assuming the woman had a tourist visa and they did not get married. What did he say went wrong with the situation in the US?

I think we all get tired of the same crowds, same discos, same restaurants...this is true in Kansas City or Kathmandu. Everyone needs variety, it´s the reason most foreign teachers move around every year or so to try out different countries and cultures. There is not a perfect culture in the world, and the US is certainly not a place I would HAVE to return to in order to be content in life.

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caulfield2 says on Mar 11, 2006, 07:29:

Gomezman,

I´m sure what you said has some validity. I am sure that if I wasn´t working and was on a ¨permanent vacation,¨ I might be inclined to just have fun, have lots of casual relationships and be a gringo perro. They´re probably scared to death of going back to the US, because nothing would be the same for them...especially if they married and went through the K-3 visa process.

They´re probably spending $200-300 mil a day, having the time of their lives and just enjoying the Colombian culture and lifestyle.

However, that lifestyle gets VERY OLD for anyone after a while, and you cannot help but start feeling used or taken advantage of, especially if you put yourself in that position. Sure, you can hook up with a new woman every night, but what´s the point? All you´re left with is the idea that nobody knows you or really likes you, they just care about your money or the fact that you´re their ticket to the US. No gringo can be foolish enough to think the women love him for who he is after one week, I don´t care if he´s 25, Brad Pitt-looking and am Amnesty International Human Rights worker!

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morphus says on Mar 11, 2006, 09:20:

Loser Medellin Mansion I have'nt been there either but I heard all about the Medellin Mansion. The owner is an ugly, fat bald guy from Australia. He recruits girls that work at brothels and stripclubs to hang around the house. He samples the goods. Then he charges loser gringos that can't speak Spanish and are afraid to go to Medellin alone thousands of dollars a week to stay at the house. They get his leftovers and at the same time pay way more. Its disgusting!

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Pete E says on Mar 11, 2006, 09:23:

Possible cause for millionares dilema One thing I have noticed,particularly with older guys with money coming to Colombia is what I will call getting addicted to hooker
attractiveness.They can get georgeous hookers for 100,000 pesos.And even if they say they want a real relationship they are not going to get anywhere near the attractiveness of what they can buy.Unless off course they get a smart chica with patience who plays them for the long haul,sort of a hooker with a long term benefit plan.
So its hard to get real about what they can get in a real relationship.Even if they have money a hot young chica isn't going to be interested unless she is going right for the money.
AND I think the other issue is they may be wrestling with is do they really want a real long term relationship or would they rather just play?
I have said if a guy can't find a woman in Colombia he is hopeless.
BUT it depends on his expectations.There are limits even here even though those limits are MUCH higher than in the states.With halfway reasonable expectastions and a sincere desire to find a long term mate I think its pretty hard to fail.
And some cities are more difficult.I guess thats why I always recommend Cali,there are just lots of women here who want to meet a gringo.And many are not afraid to join an agency or whatever they have to do to meet him.I never would have met my novia,39 year old nurse,if she had not joined an agency.Our paths just would have never crossed otherwise.I am the only gringo she ever met in her effort,although several wrote her but never came here.I certainly don't fault her for joining an agency.I think it was smart.HMM,I never asked if her family knows thats how we met but she tells her co workers right away how she found me.
In Medellin I think there is much more of a stigma for a girl joining an agency.And there is more opportunity in general I think,making finding a gringo not the sole solution to a better life.
So its tougher.Yes,nice city,lots of beautifull women,but less available to a gringo I think.Lots less.

Pete

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caulfield2 says on Mar 11, 2006, 11:12:

Ah, yes, I like to call it the Studio F crowd. The girls who play it for the longer-term, they probably have sex with you whenever you want...but at an indirect cost. Not a direct exchange of money, per se, but still a financially based relationship.

If you start talking about women that are 24-25 and older, or women with a kid or two, then your odds increase exponentially of success, if you are indeed looking for a wife. Otherwise, you are just another night´s negotiation or business, if you limit yourself to the 18-24 year old ¨hottie¨ crowd that these men would not be able to touch in the States.

I had a lot of friends in Cali and Cartagena. You´re right, Cali is best, because the Cartagena scene is pretty jaded and cynical IMO.

Another thing to keep in mind is that 85-90% of the men who write women NEVER even show up, as they are fascinated by the idea of an international relationship but afraid to actually get on a plane. The type that prefer to buy addresses instead of going directly to an agency. This is a reason the agency girls get a little antsy...they meet too many keyboard romeos with empty promises...and they´ve learned not to abandon their real life boyfriends and jobs until the guy AT LEAST shows up, and many times, they string the guy along to get money to use to maintain their Colombian boyfriend they might care more about. Not always, but it does happen often enough.

90% of the girls I met in Cali were genuine and legit in their desires to have a ¨real¨ relationship...there are, of course, plenty who want you to take them shopping or to pay for a nice lunch or dinner at Lenos y Carbon, but the majority (even those that I met who had ads in agencies) are decent people that anyone would be lucky to date or marry.

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Greg444 says on Mar 11, 2006, 18:17:

Well these gringos are trying hard , but cannot find a women in Medellin that is interesed in them. They seem like nice guys, maybe they have to worry about protecting their money.
Its seems like a party city to me.
I did not see Pablo, so maybe he found a woman or just left.

Huge disparity in economics, you just go about 5 to 10 minutes in the Metro and people are living in shacks along the river and mountain side. I am surprised there has not been a revolution or more violence with such a huge wealth disparity. At least in Bogota the economics are more level and the women are more open internationally and sophisticated.

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webmanco says on Mar 11, 2006, 19:41:

"Parque Lleras", "Parque de la 93" or Avenida Sexta
caulfield2
"They´re probably spending $200-300 mil a day, having the time of their lives and just enjoying the Colombian culture and lifestyle"


Many foreigners are far from "learning" and enjoying the Colombian culture and lifestyle, specially if the only places they visit are "Parque Lleras", "Parque de la 93" or Avenida Sexta and Chipichape in Cali" also if they only travel by plane. And most (not all) women they meet are the so called prepago or the easy ones. I believe from what I have read the ones who have somehow really tested the water are Rubiazo, Caslug, Caulfield and GIB.


COLOMBIA

...A yo, déjenme queto y no me jodan má! ...

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Greg444 says on Mar 11, 2006, 20:23:

The two millionare gringos I know in Medellin , are not doing prepagos, they are just not getting anything lasting in Medellin, even though they are trying. How many 44, 47 year old men want to be alone? They are trying , but after they screen out the prepagos they are not getting any kind of longterm relationship going.

If I had to guess, in general Paisas do not really care about gringos, especially in Poblado area.

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poco says on Mar 11, 2006, 20:23:

Maybe they are picky?
Maybe they'll find luck with one of those Farc Guerrilleras. A future wife perhaps.

It should be crystal clear that Burros are preferred to dealing with FARC. Hummm, maybe NOT !!! there was that guy that died having sex with a Horse. Damn: danger is everywhere.

"When you men get home and face an anti-war protester, look him in the eyes and shake his hand. Then, wink at his girlfriend, because she knows she's dating a pussy." Quote - General Tommy Franks

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utopiacowboy says on Mar 11, 2006, 21:33:

Medellin, a party city? Your home planet is calling you and it's Uranus. I can't imagine a city that is less of a party city. Of course if you spend all your time hanging around Parque Lleras, I can see where you'd get that impression. Maybe that's the problem for these guys - most of the decent women are working 6 days a week trying to make a living and are too tired for much partying. There are ways to meet them but hanging around Poblado's bars is NOT the way to do it.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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morphus says on Mar 11, 2006, 21:35:

Why would two millionaire gringos stay in Medellin if they were'nt happy there? Medellin/Colombia is'nt the only place to meet women. The story is just too unbelievable.
I go for mostly 18-22 year old girls and never had a problem in Medellin. The only problem was making time for all of them. Its like being a dog in a meat market.

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poco says on Mar 11, 2006, 22:33:

Different strokes for (blah blah) Its like being a dog in a meat market.

Finding a dog in a meat market is very unlikely in Colombia. Dogs are usually found in Asian meat markets,, Vietnam comes to mind,, they are a sold by the pound,, roast dog is highly prized and makes me think of the Vietnamese unit of currency the dong. Does the innuendo mean you like having your dong in a dog? I can think of others possibilities but this fits.

"When you men get home and face an anti-war protester, look him in the eyes and shake his hand. Then, wink at his girlfriend, because she knows she's dating a pussy." Quote - General Tommy Franks

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Miguel says on Mar 11, 2006, 23:00:

Good one poco Reminded me of being in Honolulu at a Korean restaurant, chowing down on "something" and my then girlfriend (native Hawaiian) asked me if I had ever eaten dog, and I replied, "Hell no"...then she replied, "You wanna bet?"

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morphus says on Mar 12, 2006, 05:23:

I was'nt talking about dog meat. More like a happy dog loose inside a meat market, eating everything in sight. I would'nt eat dog meat if you put a gun to my balls.

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caulfield2 says on Mar 12, 2006, 06:49:

This reminds me of the whole groping thread, lol. I had my students write a response, whether they thought the decision was fair, what they would have done had they been the woman, etc.

Surprisingly, or not surprisingly I guess, most of the women automatically blamed the woman in this situation for provoking the man somehow, either by her behavior or dress, which they assumed was provocative.

The thing that stood out to me was one of my more thoughtful, intelligent Strato 6 students saying, ¨we can´t help it, we´re like dogs after a piece of meat, it´s instinct.¨

I can tell you that there are not very many of these 18-22 year olds that are READY to be married, which most don´t want, because they enjoy their lifestyle too much right now. Why get married when you can travel, eat at great restaurants, go to concerts, party, dance and drink for FREE with new and interesting people every night?

They might LOOK great, but they are not worth the trouble. Whatever floats your boat...if it makes you feel better about yourself to take the 9´s and 10´s instead of the 7´s and 8´s of Colombia, there´s an attendant cost that goes with that, both psychologically and financially. Most of these girls are university students, live at home with their parents, and just want someone to take them out and entertain them (someone who simultaneously pays for almost everything). Yeah, there are some good girls in this group that work 2-3 jobs and will pay approximately 20-30% of the time. If you can find a woman like that, and they DO exist, consider yourself quite fortunate.

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morphus says on Mar 12, 2006, 07:14:

I know a couple of 18 year old girls that would like to marry me. They're ready. They want to get out of their parents house. It must be hell being stuck with your parents. They think its good that they are a lot younger than me because I won't go looking for other young girls. It might work for a while but I will eventually start to dysfunction and stray away.

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caulfield2 says on Mar 12, 2006, 07:33:

You answered your own question, in a way. Why do they want to marry you? Because it´s a better scenario than living at home, not necessarily because they love you (although I suppose that´s a possibility too). Just make sure to get out of the mentality that you´re somehow helping to ¨liberate¨ them from oppressive conditions, lol, or doing them a favor.

I remember when I was 24 and dated a 19 year old (well, that´s one way to put it, I guess) and I felt like a criminal. Well, I am 36 now and I COULD, if I wanted to, date that same 18 or 19 year old girl, except I am 12 years older and know BETTER than that. I know someone will say, well, what about those 40-60 year old Colombian men with a couple of 17 year olds on their arms? Well, just because it´s possible doesn´t make it right. I know the conditions, both economically and culturally, are different here...but why would you do something here you would never think about doing in the US? Well, you wouldn´t be able to date a 9 or 10 model that was 18 or 19 in the US anyway, but you would be completely walled off from that group of women. I´m assuming 24-25 is about as young as you would date in the US, and I have no idea how old you are.

If they think you will be loyal because you´re lucky to have a young hottie and will appreciate them more and not cheat, well, that´s not a fundamental basis for a lasting relationship. It´s also a sad commentary on the mentality of many poorer women here, instead of being full of self-confidence, they worry about keeping a man instead of being the kind of woman a man would never want to leave.

I have really been struggling with this age issue myself, as most of the women I´ve dated are between 21-27. My wife (we´re in the process of separating but still good friends) is 23, a 13 year age difference. It really is making me question what I am looking for...just beauty, or, what I tell myself, a woman that´s beautiful on the inside and out. It´s really a slippery slope, because you can have a ¨model¨ type if you want one, and that´s something that is unavailable, realistically, to an inner city English teacher in the US. The temptation is definitely there...and it´s not easy to be disciplined enough to see the traps, but the signs are there if you WANT to look hard enough to see them ahead of time.

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morphus says on Mar 12, 2006, 08:08:

Out of all of the young girls I know in Colombia, I think only one truely loves me. She says "te amo". The other ones only say "te quiero", so i'm on to them. I don't care as long as I get some booty. I think if you are going to go for a younger woman, you may as well go all out. Why bother with a 25 year old when you can get an 18 year old? Either way, its still shallow. Its like if someone offering you a filet mignon or hamburger to eat. The filet mignon would be the better choice. I would do it in the U.S. too if it was more common. I was still getting 18 year old girls up until a few years ago. Now, its just not acceptable for a guy my age to walk up to teenage girls in the mall. They'll just sneer at me and start laughing. Maybe even call the police. A few months ago I was walking in China Town in Manhattan. I saw 2 really pretty girls around 16. All I did was say "hey girls, looking good". Then the mother turns around and gives me a dirty look. She was appalled. My question is why? The girls were dressed in way to attract men. They had tight clothing with their bellies showing and breasts popping out. Thats why I like Colombia culture. Its more conducive to my behavior.

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caulfield2 says on Mar 12, 2006, 08:15:

You´re right, in the sense that you only say ¨te amo¨ to someone you would be interested in marrying. I´ve only said it once, in seven months of dating here, and that was a mistake, as I later learned the serious intentions and implications of such a phrase.

That doesn´t necessarily mean you can believe she loves you, but she said it. I know many men have said the same words in English to get women to buy into the idea they should sleep with a man.

The reason you should go for the 25 year old woman is because she´s more interesting, more formed, more intellectualy, less superficial, more compatible. If it´s just about sex and nothing more, sure, why not 18, 16 or 14..if that´s what you came down here for. Men are going to do what they want to, it has always been that way. Just imagine you had a daughter that was 14 or 16 and if you would approve of that same daughter dating you? If the answer is yes, it would okay, then, by all means, go ahead. Just don´t end up like the 90 year old in the latest Gabriel Garcia Marquez novel falling hopeleslly in love with a 15 year old!!!

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Greg444 says on Mar 12, 2006, 08:21:

Back to my original question, which I poorly posted. My Colombian friends say do not move to Colombia becasue going to the restaurants and nightclubs wears thin after a few months, and say they I have many more things to do in the US on weekends then in Colombia, riding bike on the beach, or though the hills, tennis, golf, easy cheap travel by car,entertainment facilties and parks much larger, etc...

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morphus says on Mar 12, 2006, 08:40:

I met 18 years old girls that were way more interesting than the 25 year old ones. Theres one 18 year old girl and we talk about everything. I like when she finds out something about the U.S. and says "I don't know they do that there". I have another girl around 22 in Bogota. She would be considered smart. She's studying to be a chemical engineer. We have good conversations but she's not as fun. She's seems to be under a lot of pressure from family, friends and peers to succeed. She can be very serious sometimes. She's always asking me about my job and trying to figure how successful I am in the U.S. Then theres another girl in I know. She's 24. The oldest Colombiana I talk to in Colombia. Believe it or not, she has the dullest personality. All she likes to talk about is sex. Sometimes we have cybersex while we are chatting online. After the sex talk gets boring, I run back to the 18 year old for more stimulating conversation.

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morphus says on Mar 12, 2006, 08:51:

Greg444 Of course things will start to get boring. Everything gets boring. Thats reality. Its still better than being dead. Thats why you have to mix things up. I live in New York City and i'm bored as hell. Most people would think there is so much to do here. Its the same everywhere you go. Theres restaurants, nightclubs, movie theaters, ect just like everywhere else. Sometimes I rather sit in the house and get drunk. Thats fun too.

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morphus says on Mar 12, 2006, 09:53:

They go to school. They're going to get cheated anyway. They may as well choose me...ha!

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Gomezman5 says on Mar 12, 2006, 10:33:

Caulfield2 I really have an appreicition for your perpective, and I agree with much that you say. This line of yours rings loudly:

"The best girls down here are the ones who love their country and give little thought to the idea that living in the US-Europe etc. is better than Colombia." (Caulfield)

I don't think there is a line in this entire thread that is more true than the above. I cannot think of one, not one of my friends that are "comfortably situated" that would think of coming to the US for anything more than a vacation, extended stay (legally), or to go to school. Why would they want to do so? How many Colombian that own businesses or that have good jobs are willing to abandon their quality of life over there.

I'll digress a bit to further prove my point. Over and over on this site, all of us recognize the importance placed on "family" that exists in Colombia. I happen to agree with that contention. But, let me say this, you cannot have it both ways. If family is so important, than leaving your parents, siblings, abuelitos, and alike, just to go to the US to make more money. There are obviously some things that money can't buy and I have to believe that a parent who sees their child going to the US only to see them return once twice a year at best, cannot be to pleased. My point is that the concept of family may not be as strong as we think it is when you see dozens of web sites filled with young Colombian scantily dressed hotties looking to go live somewhere else, even though they little about that country or culture or even the language for that matter. When a gringo or European moves to Colombia, he moves to Colombia because he has consiously decided that Colombia is the one and only country that he wants to live in. He goes to every site there is, he buys all the books, and yes, he comes to PBH for a perfectly honest and unbiases opinion. (yea sure).

Caufield2 is correct in another way. He says in a later post:

"that lifestyle gets VERY OLD for anyone after a while, and you cannot help but start feeling used or taken advantage of........"

I think he is correct. No matter how fun and adventurous it may appear for a man to have many conquests, there is still a fundimental need for a person to love and be loved. And when love is based on $$, that is as much of a false love as one can get.

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utopiacowboy says on Mar 12, 2006, 11:22:

"Why bother with a 25 year old when you can get an 18 year old?" With that line of thinking why stop there? Why bother with an 18 year old when you can have a 14 year old? Or a 10 year old. What's with this younger is better thing? Young women bore the shit out of me and as a result I do not find them appealing in any way, shape or form. Give me a real woman like Salma Hayek (40 this year!) than some young nymph.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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Gomezman5 says on Mar 12, 2006, 11:52:

Well Hell UC....I have a better one If a "mature woman is really what you're looking for, than why not go for Cher. She is 20 years Selma's senior. In fact, she is almost legally a "senior." At 60, I'm sure she has plenty of experience that she can
"share" with you.

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Blue says on Mar 12, 2006, 12:07:

Younger women are far more sexually attractive than those in their 30's and 40's. Madonna used to be hot but now is nothing more than a caricature of her former self. Women tend to peak at about age 25 and then rapidly decline from there. This is nothing new or earth-shattering but simple biology. Read Darwin..if your own eyes deceive you..lol Younger women are also better lovers despite the rhetoric you hear from those on the other side of 30. They have a fresh view untainted by negative experiences and the inexorable march of time. The best woman to be with is one who is (20-25), physically attractive and in her first love affair. She will love you forever. No guy will ever be able to match a first love.

Blue

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poco says on Mar 12, 2006, 12:23:

I can visualize this
I know a couple of 18 year old girls that would like to marry me. They're ready. They want to get out of their parents house.

Go to google and do an IMAGE search for the words:

Colombia guerilla.

Check out the full sized image to see what comes to mind.

"When you men get home and face an anti-war protester, look him in the eyes and shake his hand. Then, wink at his girlfriend, because she knows she's dating a pussy." Quote - General Tommy Franks

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Rubiazo says on Mar 12, 2006, 12:38:

I'm still shaking my head I sometimes wonder how many of you guys are virgins!!!!
Teenage girls are HORRIBLE lovers. They don't even know how to please themselves properly yet, much less someone else. Half the time they literally can't keep their own bodies properly clean! I'll take a 30+ woman any day, as long as it's not a 30+ VIRGIN!
My gf is about to turn 28 but she's a real fast learner :)))

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caulfield2 says on Mar 12, 2006, 12:46:

I think there´s a big difference between someone that ¨likes to travel¨ and someone who is consciously trying to leave for the US (or fill-in-the-blank).

The agencies tend, on average, to have more the latter type of girl. If you meet girls randomly on your own (streets, coffee houses, internet cafes, bars-discotecas, libraries, malls, theatres), you´re more likely to run into the ¨real¨ Colombian girls.

I know, I know...my university is filled with girls who work as ¨professionals¨ once or twice a week to have nice clothing, pay for surgeries, vacations, etc. These girls supposedly make $300-400 K per hour, but I´m not sure I believe these claims. Then again, Armenia is not like Cartagena or the bigger cities that men consider to be ¨buyer´s markets,¨ so to speak.

This is where we see the divergence between the Colombian and American societies. The assumption in the US is that both husband and wife make as much money as possible to provide the best of opportunities and experiences for their children.

My perception of the average Colombian family (Strato 3-5) is that they would prefer a little less money, but more time at home and ¨free time¨ to spend with their families.

Another assumption, if you make a lot of money, you´re good parents. If you have 13 kids living in one house, you´re unfit.

I understand the motivation for Colombians to make more money in the US and send it to their families...my first girlfriend left for Venezuela for better opportunities there. There is a sense of pride in some men I meet when they tell me their kids are in the US and working-studying. However, they all acknowledge how expensive the US can be and the cultural imperialism that is gradually eroding away distinctions as we gradually become one industrialized world.

For each Wal-Mart and SuperCinema, there is a savings monetarily but an indirect cost in the long-term, IMO. The Colombians in the US would probably tell you that they appreciate Colombia more after they´ve tried to survive their on their own. Of course, there are lots of ¨rich¨ gringos that last for 2-3 years with the young hotties, but most of these 20-30 year age difference relationships simply are doomed to failure, for a number of reasons.

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Mar 12, 2006, 12:48:

Morphus I don't know how old are you, but I think your are in your thirties if I'm not wrong, if you find most stimulating conversation with 18 years old, That said a lot about you and your level of conversation, Not to be horrible but if one day we ever have a conversation , you will bored me to death then.
I am not a brain box, but one thing that bored me is a shallow man, no matter how good looking he is.

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caulfield2 says on Mar 12, 2006, 12:56:

Of course, the other alternative is that these 18 year olds are so experienced because they´ve been with 100 or more different men, whether they were paid directly or received ¨gifts¨ of some kind.

There´s no comparison between a woman of 30 and 18 and how she expresses love and passion for her mate.

If you think the 18 year olds are better, they must be very good actresses at convincing men of their ¨fake¨ pleasures, because they know if their man feels like he´s king of the world, he´s going to be more generous. Are these young girls telling their 30-50 year old boyfriends how to give her more orgasms, where to touch her or what to do? I think not.

Next, there will be a thread from all the women about how they would rather be with an 18 year old boy because he can have sex 4-6 times per day instead of a 30 year old who´s experienced with women and knows exactly what he´s doing. The women I know here in Colombia are more impressed with someone who they know has been successful with other women and is a ¨keeper,¨ instead of the akward-rich guys who trip all over themselves when they receive the first bit of positive attention from a woman.

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Mar 12, 2006, 13:08:

Sometimes I wonder if this older men look for younger women is because they know they can't impressed older women with their BS talk. jejej ;)

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utopiacowboy says on Mar 12, 2006, 13:37:

You got that right, Kat. The young ones will believe anything you tell them. As for being better lovers, they are clueless about lovemaking along with so much else in life. And you know G'man, I bet Cher could teach a young nymph a trick or two in the sack. Todavia, I'll stick with mi Mexicana, Salma.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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Rubiazo says on Mar 12, 2006, 15:38:

A woman would have a lot easier time selling to me that she wants a younger man for the right reasons compared to an older man. If she's not kinky (too bad) and just wants a fountain of energy, going for a younger guy may be just the ticket.

Caulfield I'd take the 18 year old whore over the 18 year old virgin any day. It's not all about chrono age either :)))))

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morphus says on Mar 12, 2006, 16:53:

Kat1, I think we would have good conversations. You are smart and funny. I would rather be with you than those 18 year old girls. I think the problem is that all the good women like you are already married. Thats why I end up with young girls. They're more avaliable in Colombia. Maybe I have brainwashed myself to like them. Who knows? I can still hold it down with older women here in New York though. No problem on dates. I don't think my conversation skills are too bad.

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morphus says on Mar 12, 2006, 17:02:

Hey guys, don't underestimate the 18 year old girls. I think this girl truely loves me. We talk about politics, current events, science, entertainment and all that jazz. What more do I need? I think she would make a good wife. Her mother is teaching her how to cook. Thats a good sign.

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Rubiazo says on Mar 12, 2006, 19:15:

Learning how to cook at 18? Damn, I could cook when i was like 11!

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Mar 13, 2006, 00:36:

Morphus, Morphus Morphus.*sight*

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Crazy4Cali says on Mar 13, 2006, 07:02:

Impressing 18-yo girls Maybe they pick 18-yo's because they haven't learned that sex can last longer than 10 seconds.

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Rubiazo says on Mar 13, 2006, 10:11:

HAHAHAHA "Wow, you are the best sex I ever had. I got even closer to coming with you than with my last boyfriend! Now it's time to go SHOPPING!"

Talk about youth being wasted on the young :)))) LOL

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aztec says on Mar 14, 2006, 05:01:

"Why bother with a 25 year old when you can get an 18 year old?"

There is nothing an 18 year old girl can do better than a 25 or 35 year old woman.

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caulfield2 says on Mar 14, 2006, 05:07:

I guess it has something to do, partly at least, with the male ego. Men think that the younger the woman, the bigger the challenge to win her over...who wants to brag about having a 25 year old (well, who couldn't do that, right?), so it's simply a matter of what you can get away with, I guess.

Part of it is also the fact that for anyone over 30 to have a relationship (a real one) with an 18 or 19 year old is almost unheard of, with the few exceptions being relationships between professors or teaching assistants and students. I think this happens a lot, particularly in law schools, where you bring together passionate people with a lot of the same interests and viewpoints.

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morphus says on Mar 14, 2006, 06:35:

I don't see too many men going for women their own age in Colombia. The women are always younger. My logic is to just go for the ones with the youngest and tightest bodies and be honest about it. Its like saying a theif that steals $5 is less of a theif than one that steals $500. They're both still theives. A lot of you guys are in denial.

Also, if you guys don't have any experience with 18 year old girls in Colombia, how would you know what they are like?

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kernow62 says on Mar 14, 2006, 06:58:

This has got to be the stupidest thread on PBH. You can look like Woody Allen on crack and have only a few dollars in the bank back in Podunk USA and still find women who will come to the US with you. These millionarios must be really horrid!!!

Anyway, could I get the contact info on the gal in Orlando. I need a penpal. ;-)

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Blue says on Mar 14, 2006, 07:09:

Morphus I agree it's all about biology. Women quickly lose their sexiness with advancing age. Maybe it's not pc to acknowledge this.

Blue

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morphus says on Mar 14, 2006, 07:22:

When I was a teenager, I use to like older women. As I got older, I started liking younger women. I guess tastes change. A lot of women age bad if they don't take care of themselves. I don't like the ones that smoke, drink coffee and don't exercise. Those are the ones to avoid. Go for the ones that eat healthy and go to the gym.

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Mar 14, 2006, 08:26:

"A lot of women age bad if th Morphus said "A lot of women age bad if they don't take care of themselves." You don't need to be an scientist to know that :) By the way men too. I don't like younger men they bored me to death, and of course vain men too. I think its down to self-steam, some men needs younger women to feel young and still in control, not all 18 year old are fit, slim and looks good. hell some of them smoke and drink like is not tomorrow. We are talking about the hot fit 18 Y/O but then talk about the 30 y/o like Eva Longoria or Jennifer Lopez, they look better that any 18 or 20 y/o, I think they look better now than where they were younger.
Or Halley Berrie. she is 38, but she is too sophisticated,Intelligent, independent a real woman, for some of you guys to handle.

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Miguel says on Mar 14, 2006, 08:36:

jejeje kat1 ¡Buen dicho!

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Blue says on Mar 14, 2006, 08:53:

Well let's see Women reach their peak of fertility between 18-25. To suggest men prefer these women for some other reason is ludicrous. It's biological determinism at its finest. lol Any 40 year old guy who prefers to mount a 40 year old woman is some kind of genetic mutant.
Some things just can't be overcome with ideas and brainwashing. This is one of them.

Blue

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Mar 14, 2006, 09:13:

Blue No my dear, that its an old wife tale, women can have kids even older than 40 now, now i agree with you in the fertility, if what you looking for is a woman to have your kids with "less risk" then you will go for the young ones. like in the old time, men used to like women with big hips because they said that they could have "babies with not problems" now another myth is that women start reaching their real sexual peak at 40, while men are going down by then, maybe that its why they look for younger women. its that true? of course you are a man you will said no.

Now if I start to believe all of this and judge a woman or a man by his age and how he should act or body SHOULD BEHAVE at certain age then I am a very shallow woman am I ;)

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IMorcombe says on Mar 14, 2006, 10:14:

Is it just me? But what do Madonna, first loves and sexual peak have to do with the initial posting....You guys drift quite a bit, like my 12 year-old would say "off subject"...

Maria Ines

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Crazy4Cali says on Mar 14, 2006, 10:32:

Who wants to breed? Jeez, what man at 40 or 50 wants more kids? Except those trying to give their 18-yo trophy something to show off at the mall. (Oh, the vanity!) So, if "breeding" isn't a concern, why would the peak of fertility have anything to do with anything.

This is men looking for some justification to go out with his daughter's friends. Most of the older men I've met dating 18-yo's (and the like) are doing so for one of the following reasons:

a) a trophy or just someone to look good in their Porsche (can you say "compensating?") and show off to their buddies along with the big-screen TV, yacht, house in the Hamptons, etc. (see #C below)

b) because the can now and couldn't when they were 18 (e.g. they were still in the Computer Club and hadn't made their million(s) yet.)

c) they are aging faster then they would like to admit so this is their "fountain of youth"

d) "true love" ?! Yeah right. It's possible, but so is winning the lottery.

Personally, I don't care if someone is going through their fourth or fifth mid-life crisis, but the excuses they make are almost embarrasssing (and the think that nobody notices).

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Miguel says on Mar 14, 2006, 11:05:

kat1 You are as shallow as el Gran Cañón. Si yo podría conquistar cualquier mujer en el mundo, me gustaría una noche con Salma Hayek.

(Porque tú ya estás casada.)

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elmodefoque says on Mar 14, 2006, 11:39:

My two cents worth. I aint too picky, of course I love to have Jennifer Lopez on all fours and make her squeal like a pig but that will never happen. My type of women is any type that will say YES, please jump my bones! at this stage of my life I can’t be too picky, I’m more concerned at how disgusting they’ll find me. I did not meet one single girl that was attracted to me in all the time I spent in Colombia. Sure, hookers would say I was the best looking guy they’ve ever seen, but if I believe that, I’ll be the biggest fool in the planet. In my younger days, I preferred blondes and Puerto Rican broads, now I’ll be thrill to do Louise from the Jefferson.

any colombianita willing to date me, IS UP TO NO GOOD

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Blue says on Mar 14, 2006, 11:40:

kat1 I will go for the women who are the most physically attractive. The Salma Hayeks of the world are the exception. Beauty is a young woman's game.


Blue

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Mar 14, 2006, 12:33:

Well, Blue I think beauty is in the eye of the beholder, what is beautiful to you maybe its not to me.
I will go to for the most attractive guys its natural in the human race no?

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aztec says on Mar 14, 2006, 13:59:

Any 40 year old guy who prefers to mount a 40 year old woman is "Any 40 year old guy who prefers to mount a 40 year old woman is some kind of genetic mutant."

There are sophisticated women in Colombia over the age of 40 who are absolutely stunning. When they walk into a room every thing stops.

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Mar 14, 2006, 14:30:

I totally agree with you Aztec.
Talking about shallow men huh!!!

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Blue says on Mar 14, 2006, 14:56:

Yes I believe it’s natural to gravitate to the most attractive. That’s the essence of my argument. My theory is based on scientific knowledge(mainly biology) but I have neither the time nor the inclination to expound on this much further. Physical beauty is not really in the “eye of the beholder�. Other kinds of beauty, yes, absolutely. Biology transcends the ideology, indoctrination, “education� or whatever else you want to call the formation of our beliefs. This thread proves the extent to which socialization is so powerful that true nature becomes distorted.

Blue

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Rikito says on Mar 14, 2006, 15:06:

Elmo, be carfeful You said you would be, "thrilled to do Louise from the Jeffersons". I wouldn't doubt you would Elmo...Isabel Sanford (Louise)died July 9, 2004 in Los Angeles, CA.

It is not life that matters, but the journey.

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Rubiazo says on Mar 14, 2006, 20:08:

jajaj I LOVE THE DEAD! :P

Blue, if i tried to argue that the majority of guys don't think that way, I wouldn't have a leg to stand on. Anybody would have to agree, most men prefer women as close to just past puberty as they think they can get away with!!

All I'm saying is they have no goddamn idea that they are missing out on the best sex. A woman's libido actually peaks around 40. And to me there is nothing more beautiful than a horny woman!!!

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utopiacowboy says on Mar 15, 2006, 15:55:

You're right, Blue. Now that Salma Hayek is turning 40 she definitely is not as sexy as some of those young mall rats. Right.....would you like to buy a bridge I've got for sale?

As for you, Senora Kat, you are living proof of just how delightfully sexy and entertaining a REAL woman can be. How are you even allowed to roam the earth loose as cute as you are?

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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Blue says on Mar 15, 2006, 18:36:

Yea Cowboy but what does she look like in the morning without all the Hollywood makeup and the sun shining in her face? Maybe not such a pretty sight. But yes I would like to give you a first hand report on this. lol

Blue

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morphus says on Mar 15, 2006, 23:13:

Rubiazo, I know what the older women are like; all that moaining and exhausting sex. I'm not missing out. Theres only so much women can do in bed anyway. Sometimes I like when they just lay there like a lump on a log and let me do all the work.

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Mar 16, 2006, 01:32:

Woo hoo, UC I am sorry but you have to report what Salma H, looks like in the morning, I know hard task, but somebody have to do it ;) I wonder if Elmo want to check what Jennifer Lopez looks like?
As for Morphus and Blue aka God Gift to women, I can't be bother to reply I like conversation with real men. Even my son have more interesting thing to say. But they need 18/yo or really young women because they are the only ones that listen to their c***p.

Now I just woke up this morning, check eyes, fine, check nose yep still there, legs, a bit hurtful for the 5km run i did yesterday. overall still in one piece and gorgeous jejej


Excuse now , like Salma I have to go and put in my hollywood make up.;)

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Mar 16, 2006, 01:32:

:)

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morphus says on Mar 16, 2006, 01:54:

Kat1, when are you going to put your picture back up? You're definately my type. I would like to see a pictorial of you starting from the teen years on up.

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Mar 16, 2006, 02:21:

I'm sorry morphus I am too old for you ;)

I am like a good Red Wine the Older the better jejej

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morphus says on Mar 16, 2006, 02:44:

??? Too old for me? I doubt it. I said I date older women too. Don't get me confused with Blue. I'm not a bad guy. Just a little weak for the flesh.

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expatriate says on Mar 16, 2006, 04:27:

Two millionaire gringos? If either of those two millionaire gringos are really sincere about finding a nice wife in Cali, email me at junruh at HotPOP.com and tell me about yourselves. I'll pass on your info.

I have nieces in their 30's who might like to meet them. There is a doctor, and a CEO for example. None of them speak English. These women would probably be millionaires too if they were born in the states. All are very pretty with only European blood. Not pimping, but my nieces deserve a nice man in their lives. John

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Mar 16, 2006, 04:35:

lol, Morphus I know you are not a bad guy :)

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poco says on Mar 16, 2006, 05:12:

whoo whoo

"When you men get home and face an anti-war protester, look him in the eyes and shake his hand. Then, wink at his girlfriend, because she knows she's dating a pussy." Quote - General Tommy Franks

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Mar 16, 2006, 05:19:

Poco!!!! you are an stalker... but that is a good one lol.
And anyway what the hell you are doing keeping my pict, that pict have copyrights.

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poco says on Mar 16, 2006, 05:29:

Youu Youu

"When you men get home and face an anti-war protester, look him in the eyes and shake his hand. Then, wink at his girlfriend, because she knows she's dating a pussy." Quote - General Tommy Franks

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utopiacowboy says on Mar 16, 2006, 06:21:

You crack me up, Poco.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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