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Colombian troops to fight along Spanish troops in Afghanistan (They're probably not needed in Colombia)

President Uribe has expressed interest in making Colombia the first latinamerican nation to join ISAF (Nato's operation in Afghanistan)

Article in Spanish: http://elespectador.com/noticias/judicial/articulo-tropas-colombianas-...
Las tropas colombianos cambiarán la jungla amazónica por los desiertos afganos, la coca por la heroina y los guerrilleros de las Farc por los talibanes. El Gobierno de �?lvaro Uribe ya ha expresado su voluntad de convertirse en el primer país latinoamericano que contribuye a la ISAF (Fuerza Internacional de Asistencia para la Seguridad de Afganistán), la operación de la OTAN en Afganistán. Y en esta operación, de hondo calado estratégico y político, España hace de padrino e intermediario.

Fuentes conocedoras de la operación han confirmado a EL PA�?S que España, Colombia y la OTAN negocian a tres bandas, desde hace meses, la incorporación de tropas colombianas a Afganistán. Aunque aún no se han últimado los detalles, la idea es que Bogotá contribuya con una compañía de unos 100 militares al destacamento español desplegado en Qal-i-Naw, capital de la provincia de Badhis, al noroeste del país.

Para España, la llegada de las tropas colombianas, prevista para la próxima primavera, supondrá una ayuda impagable, pues le permitirá completar un batallón reducido de reacción rápida, con el que hacer frente a los incidentes cada vez más frecuentes en un territorio con 400.000 habitantes y una extensión similar a la de Galicia, cuya seguridad dependía hasta ahora de sólo 200 soldados españoles.

Para la OTAN, la mediación española facilita las cosas, pues España facilitará a las tropas colombianas el entrenamiento, la insfraestructura e incluso los equipos de comunicaciones. El hecho de que compartan el idioma hace que resulte natural la integración de la unidad colombiana, forzosamente reducida, en la española, más amplia. Se da incluso la circustancia de que muchos soldados de las unidades españolas enviadas al exterior son colombianos, como demuestra el hecho de que tuvieran dicha nacionalidad tres de los seis muertos en el atentado contra una patrulla de la Legión en Líbano en junio de 2005. Además, la capacitación del Ejército colombiano en la lucha contrainsurgente está fuera de duda.

Con todo, todas las fuentes consultadas coinciden en que la primera interesada en la operación es la propia Colombia. La participación de Bogotá en el conflicto de Afganistán reforzará su papel como interlocutor privilegiado de los países occidentales en Latinoamércia. Por lo pronto, el permitirá participar en los reuniones periódicas que mantiene la OTAN con los países que contribuyen a la ISAF y no pertenecen a la organización (14 de un total de 40).

A medio plazo, la aspiración de Colombia es incorporarse al grupo formado por Australia, Nueva Zelanda, Japón y Corea del Sur, países que, por razones geográficas, no pueden aspirar a intergrarse en la OTAN, pero que comparten, según fuentes aliadas, sus “preocupaciones estratégicas y sus valores�?.

Salvo Japón, al que su legislación limita la participación en operaciones militares en el exterior, los otros tres “países de contacto�?, como les denomina la Alianza, contribuyen a ISAF. Finalmente, agregan las mismas fuentes, la participación de tropas colombianas en la lucha contra los talibanes abunda en la imagen, perseguida por Bogotá, de que su lucha contra las Farc se inscribe en el combate gobal contra el terrorismo.

El asunto fue abordado el pasado 5 de julio por la ministra de Defensa, Carme Chacón, con su homólogo colombiano, Juan Manuel Santos, a quien recibió en Madrid. Delegaciones militares colombianas han vistado ya las dos bases españolas en Afganistán: Herat y Qal-i-naw. Además, en lo que constituye un primer paso en esta línea, policías afganos han recibido formación antinarcóticos en Colombia.

La incorporación de una compañía colombiana al contingente español en Afganistán no constituye un caso aislado. España está negociando también la integración de una unidad de El Salvador en la que brigada multinacional liderada por España en Líbano. Como en el caso colombiano, está previsto que los militares salvadoreños se entrenen en el campo de maniobras de San Gregorio (Zaragoza) después del verano y que el Ministerio de Defensa español les facilite transporte y equipamiento.

Con ser importante, la incorporación de la unidad salvadoreña no tiene la transcendencia política de la colombiana, pues la Fuerza Interina de Naciones Unidas para Líbano (FINUL) está adscrita a la ONU, mientras que la ISAF depende de la OTAN y EEUU la considera como si fuera algo propio. La prueba de esto último es que la Embajada de EEUU en Madrid difundió el pasdo día 31 un comunicado en el que elogiaba la decisión del Gobierno español de financiar con 14,5 millones de euros la creación de un batallón del Nuevo Ejército Afgano (ANA), una iniciativa bilateral entre Madrid y Kabul en la que en teoría Washington no tenía nada que ver.

Con 2.500 muertos en lo que va de año (entre ellos, unos 150 militares extranjeros), la guerra de Afganistán ha sobrepasado ya a la Irak en el ránking de preocupaciones del Pentágono.

Las fuerzas internacionales rondan los 70.000 soldados -de los que unos 35.000 son estadounidenses y más de la mitad están al margen de la cadena de mando de la OTAN-, pero los dos candidatos a la Casa Blanca, tanto el demócrara Barack Obama como el republicano John Mccain, han anunciado su propósito de incrementar las tropas y de pedir a los aliados europeos que hagan otro tanto.

España, que mantiene unos 800 efectivos en Afganistán, ha reforzado hasta ahora la seguridad de la provincia de Baghis, bajo su responsabilidad por vía indirecta: financiación de un batallón del Ejército afgano (del que al menos una compañía deberá permanecer en dicha zona) e incorporación de una unidad colombiana. Es probable, sin embargo, que en primavera, cuando se celebren elecciones a la Loya Jirga (Parlamento) se envíe un batallón (500 soldados), al menos con carácter temporal, como se hizo en 2004 y 2005.

**************
As we all know Uribe is a man of peaceful means and gentle manners. I think this is the living proof of his commitment to world peace. I am sure Colombia does not need these troops, afterall, there is no conflict in Colombia, Farc are destroyed, and colombia enjoys a fiscal surplus. So lets kill those heroin producing bastards, how dare they poison our youth with their shit...Viva Uribe!!! (Just in case, that's usually called sarcasm)

By Cerealkiller on Aug 7, 2008, 02:52 in Politics & the war.

dtapia says on Aug 7, 2008, 03:08:

Awesome, I totally agree.

Uribe is definitely a trailblazer and trying to help someone when you have problems of your own is risky albeit courageous. Afghanistan harbored terrorists willfully and paid the price, but now they need help combating corruption. I think it's a losing battle but I'm glad Alvin has at least thought about helping.

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Monpirri says on Aug 7, 2008, 03:20:

We got to be informed on international affairs, Colombia armed forces trains Afghanistan soldiers in Colombia.

"Anyone who still thinks that Colombia is not a gastronomical paradise needs to have their head examined." Darloup

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Cerealkiller says on Aug 7, 2008, 04:06:

Yes but they were 11 afghan citizens training in erradication of illegal crops nothing to do with Colombian troops working hand in hand with Spain in the war against the Taliban. Out of the 11, only 1 Afghan solider finished training, that was the end of the story. We need to be informed on international affairs.

Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives -John Stuart Mill

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tasco66 says on Aug 7, 2008, 04:51:

Now that the Colombian military has almost completely defeated the terrorists in Colombia, their expertise in this field will be very precious abroad

The trouble with free elections is, you never know who is going to win (Leonid Brezhnev)

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webmanco says on Aug 7, 2008, 05:06:

Military personel surplus in Colombia needs to do social work IN COLOMBIA, instead of middling in foreing affairs. Once again problems in Colombia are not only Farc related. The day Colombians don´t do lines at foreign embasies, that day only that day maybe Colombia might be in conditions to send military forces abroad.

The day we don´t have desplazados and corruption, that day we might send some troops, meanwhile many colombians are beggin at embasies to get the fock out Colombia.

No hay extremo cierto o verdadero, porque los extremos opacan, enruedan, (lavan cerebros) verdades. Yotas

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tasco66 says on Aug 7, 2008, 05:41:

Maybe now the US will be able to crush Al Quaida and the Taliban

The trouble with free elections is, you never know who is going to win (Leonid Brezhnev)

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pedro (☼Travelguide writer) says on Aug 7, 2008, 07:26:

In tough times, you need powerful allies.

To refuse a token gesture of help would be churlish, and poor strategic thinking. It's quite possible that dedicating 100 soldiers would be justified, depending on what is being offered in return. Since nobody knows what's being offered behind closed doors, this discussion is really just idle speculation.

Web, you should probably say "the day Colombians don't stand in line"... "do lines" means something else completely. :o)

"this may seem a strange post but it is not...when in colombia men need to be aware that colombia women may try to be seductive and entice a travelling gringo to have sex with them..to be forewarned is to be forearmed..." -- pow wow

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quantum says on Aug 7, 2008, 07:45:

I agree with Webmanco also and tasco u just dont get it. U are a prime example of what Fox News Network is trying to accomplish. The brainwashing of the masses. Dont u understand man. They dont want to crush Al Quaida and the Taliban. This war on terrorism is endless, and always offers justification for taking away a bit more of your personal liberties. Im surprised that somebody who is dialed into the internet does not have access to better more reliable information.......

quantum

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tasco66 says on Aug 7, 2008, 07:51:

Quantum,

Can you explain me how sending some Colombian soldiers to Afghanistan has anything to do with fox news and your personal liberties?

Think before you post some nonsense

The trouble with free elections is, you never know who is going to win (Leonid Brezhnev)

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romy says on Aug 7, 2008, 08:18:

funny
imagine that the FARC is done... paras are demobilized... it's a beautiful FANTASY that some are living. Ever heard of plato's allegory of the cave?
Perhaps Colombia wants to take over as #1 poppy grower? I just don't understand the strategy here.

My grandpa jokes that he rode an American army jeep in the Korean war hitting on on the girls in the different towns, which is hilarious because the poor and courageous Colombian souls were put right on the frontline of battle. 213 were killed and 448 injured...I wonder how the Colombian soldier will be treated in Afghanistan?

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droble77 says on Aug 7, 2008, 10:27:

I don't see what the big deal is over just 100 troops.

I'm sure they'll perform fine, as the natl. army has evolved into a more disciplined effective force over the years. Afghan is going to be a bit different though than looking for FARC in the Colombian jungle. But it could be valuable "cross-training" for those troops and they could bring back some of that knowledge to other army special forces when they return from their tour of duty. . .

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joanseb says on Aug 7, 2008, 12:11:

primero 100, luego 200, 300 y asi hasta tener miles combatiendo en algo sin sentido.
Simplemente ridiculo, ya tenemos suficientes problemas aqui, como para ganarnos a enemigos que no les importa volarse en el centro de medellin o bogota.

Que este ministro de defensa no se le suban mucho los sumos, tal vez con estas ideas tan estupidas se le tire el tercer mandato a Uribe.

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Gator says on Aug 7, 2008, 12:55:

COLOMBIAN FORCES

The first of four Colombia Battalions — 1st Battalion Colombia -- to serve in Korea during the war arrived in Jun 1951 and stayed until replaced by the 2nd Battalion Colombia July 1952.

The 2nd Battalion Colombia was replaced by the 3rd Battalion Colombia in Nov 1952. It was replaced by the 4th Battalion Colombia in Jun 1953 and stayed in Korea until Oct 1954.

Each of these units had a field strength of 1,000 men. The 1st Battalion Colombia was assigned to the U.S. 24th Infantry Division on arrival but transferred to the U.S. 7th Infantry Division Jan. 23, 1952 when the U.S. 24th Division returned to Japan. The 2nd & 3rd Battalion Colombia also fought as part of the U.S. 7th Infantry Division. It is worth noting the 3rd Battalion was severely mauled in March 1953 when Chinese forces overran "Old Baldy." In this battle Colombian forces fought well but were overwhelmed when a full Chinese division attacked. Thus the 3rd Battalion had the dubious distinction of suffering the most casualties of any Colombian unit. Over 5,100 Colombian forces took part in the Korean War. On May 8, 1951, the Colombian frigate Almirante Padilla joined the Seventh Fleet's Task Force 95. If any of you who happen to be in Bogotá you might visit the Museo Militar(Military Museum) on Calle 10 in La Candelaria not to far from Plaza de Bolivar There is also a Colombian Korean War Veterans Association.

CASUALTIES IN KOREA: KILLED IN ACTION 146, MISSING 69, WOUNDED 448

"Bene, cum Latine nescias, nolo manus meas in te maculare" .

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sanandressi says on Aug 7, 2008, 13:12:

Colombia is a true friend of the United States as is El Salvador. So is England and Canada. Chavez has decided to align himself with Cuba and Iran and Russia. He can't stop crime in Caracas but can buy over $5 billion in Russian military supplies as if Venezuela really needs 24 Mig 30's or whatever in the first place. Colombia and Venezuela at war....for what LOL. Kind of like the Honduran El Salvador soccer war...for what?

100 troops is a small gesture towards the US and the international community to see where Colombia stands on matters. Just like El Salvador in Iraq....but Washington will reward them as they have already.

Why can't senor Chavez spend all those billions on the slums of Caracas? Maybe at least stop the crime in Caracas?

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poco says on Aug 7, 2008, 13:30:

Quote: Military personel surplus in Colombia needs to do social work IN COLOMBIA,
============
I agree this is a worth while endevor and keeping things clean in Colombia is of upmost importance.

Many factions are engaged in keeping the Social Fabric of Colombia clean or,, as they call it,, limpieza social so I see no reason why the military couldn't get involved.

Colombian Chickens are crowing about the new President of the U.S. who will assure that From each according to their ability to each according to their need.

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Lcacique says on Aug 7, 2008, 15:10:

Man, the _ _ _ _ you write amazes me sometimes, poco.

"Es fácil vivir con los ojos cerrados interpretando todo lo que se ve mal..." ~ J. Lennon

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pedro (☼Travelguide writer) says on Aug 7, 2008, 15:59:

Let's take a trip down memory lane.

Not too far, only back to March this year, when Chavez was rattling the sabres and threatening Colombia with a military attack.

The United States announced publicly that they would stand with their ally Colombia. This left Chavez with nowhere to go, and the tension ceased without a shot fired.

It would have been easy for the US to say "sorry, we're fighting two wars already. Colombia, you're on your own". But they didn't.

Now a few months later, NATO comes asking for a favour (to fight a war that is directly tied to the September 11 attacks on the USA). And PBH commentators would have Colombia say in response: "sorry, too busy with our own affairs, won't help you".

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Simon says on Aug 7, 2008, 16:03:

HELL YEAH!!!!

Let's go kick some fundamentalist, islamic Taliban ass!!!

"Just an honest, decent Colombian trying to do the right thing."--Simon

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webmanco says on Aug 7, 2008, 16:45:

España espera decisión de Colombia para reforzar tropas en Afganistán

Foto: Archivo / EL TIEMPO

Policías antinarcóticos de Afganistán recibieron el año pasado entrenamiento de policías colombianos en la base de Pijaos, en Espinal.

http://www.eltiempo.com/colombia/justicia/2008-08-07/espana-espera-dec...

La unidad colombiana se sumaría a las tropas de una coalición internacional que lideran Estados Unidos y Gran Bretaña, y que cuenta con unidades de España y Alemania, entre otros países.

En Afganistán se desarrolla un conflicto entre el gobierno, apoyado por Estados Unidos y la coalición, y la guerrilla islamista de los talibanes, acusados de promover el terrorismo y del tráfico de drogas ilícitas.

El precandidato presidencial Rafael Pardo dijo en Caracol Radio que el el momento en el que se produce este anuncio es inoportuno por el compromiso que adquiere el gobierno colombiano con la administración de George Bush, a la que le restan menos de 5 meses.

Con Afp

Artículo completo

http://www.eltiempo.com/colombia/justicia/2008-08-07/espana-espera-dec...

No hay extremo cierto o verdadero, porque los extremos opacan, enruedan, (lavan cerebros) verdades. Yotas

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Lcacique says on Aug 7, 2008, 17:00:

pedro: Colombia has been at war for how many decades? Given that it was not very long ago that US officials were calling the country a failed state, it might be wise for Colombia's troops to be used for providing safety and security for its own citizens...people who freaking deserve it after so many years of violence and instability.

Having said that, I am not staunchly opposed to the idea of sending a few troops if the Colombia can actually afford to do so; however, I have my doubts that all parts of the country are adequately protected.

"Es fácil vivir con los ojos cerrados interpretando todo lo que se ve mal..." ~ J. Lennon

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poco says on Aug 7, 2008, 17:02:

Quote: It would have been easy for the US to say "sorry, we're fighting two wars already. Colombia, you're on your own". But they didn't.
------------------------------
Ever think what would happen if Venezuela decided to take back Colombia ? that's right,,take it back,, because Colombia, Ecuador; Panama and Venezuela were,, at one time, one territory, called Gran Colombia.

Kind of like Iraq took back Kuwait.

Who would stop them if it wasn't the U.S. ?

I can't think of anyone who would be willing to go up against the oil money or the possibility that oil could be used as a weapon except the U.S.

It certaintly wouldn't be Europe with their socialist, appeasement, pacifistic, neutral stance. Nope they might talk it up big,, maybe cut down a forest of digital trees BITCH'N every day on the internet, governments saying,, that’s not right !!! kind of reminds me of Ingrid,, all the bitch'n in the world,,, six years worth and nothing,, zero, zip.

Colombian Chickens are crowing about the new President of the U.S. who will assure that From each according to their ability to each according to their need.

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Simon says on Aug 7, 2008, 17:46:

"Ever think what would happen if Venezuela decided to take back Colombia ? that's right,,take it back,, because Colombia, Ecuador; Panama and Venezuela were,, at one time, one territory, called Gran Colombia."

I think you got that backwards, it would be Colombia "taking back" Venezuela! And that territory was just called 'Colombia' back then. Historians call it 'Gran Colombia' to differentiate it from present-day Colombia.

"Just an honest, decent Colombian trying to do the right thing."--Simon

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Simon says on Aug 7, 2008, 18:17:

What if hispanics decided to take over the USA instead....whoops, it's actually happening, hahaha!

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/southflorida/sfl-flbcensus0807s...

"Just an honest, decent Colombian trying to do the right thing."--Simon

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billyb says on Aug 7, 2008, 18:56:

"hispanics" are a culture........not a country!"

Whoops, there go my vacation plans.

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

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quantum says on Aug 7, 2008, 19:31:

Tasco,
Its not so much Colombia sending a few troops to Afganistan that confounds me so much (although it really is nothing more than a token gesture of support to the Bush Admin) its your perspective on things that truly astound me. How is it possible that anybody who travels and reads and sees can still be so blind and brainwashed. Its been correctly commented upon that Colombia has enuff of its own problems, get it? And the U.S. certainly has more than enuff of its own problems, problems that are not getting fixed cuz all the money and energy is being spent in Afganistan and Iraq. But u take the typical american redneck attitude that "america can do no wrong" and is the answer to all the worlds problems, and that if they dont cooperate we will just beat them into submission. Its gringos like u that give the rest of us a bad name..........

quantum

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webmanco says on Aug 7, 2008, 20:36:

Expertos en minas antipersona y erradicación, no soldados, enviará Colombia a Afganistán: Uribe

http://www.eltiempo.com/colombia/justicia/2008-08-08/expertos-en-minas...

'Colombia ha recibido ayuda y está obligada a ofrecerla'

Contrario a los sucedido en círculos políticos, la posibilidad de enviar tropas colombianas a Afganistán y a Haití no genera tanta resistencia entre analistas.

Incluso, Natalia Springer, Laura Gil y Alfredo Rangel coinciden en que el hecho tiene una connotación positiva.

Springer explica que dentro de las relaciones internacionales, la ayuda es necesaria. "Colombia ha recibido mucha cooperación (asistencia de la UE y de los países amigos) y está obligada a ofrecer la misma cooperación en los temas que lo ameriten. Esta no es una relación de una sola vía", manifestó

Artículo completo

http://www.eltiempo.com/colombia/justicia/2008-08-08/expertos-en-minas...

No hay extremo cierto o verdadero, porque los extremos opacan, enruedan, (lavan cerebros) verdades. Yotas

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quantum says on Aug 7, 2008, 22:34:

Kalico, better yet and much more appropriate, how bout a world penance tax that the U.S. páys to the rest of the world for gobbling up its resources, shoring up dictators, and generally bullying its way around the neighborhood wreaking havoc. Do u really think that the U.S. (especially for the last 7 yrs) has been a worthy role mode and shining beacon of democracy for all the world to emulate. The biblical phrase comes to mind "and the whole world shall wonder after the image of the beast"

quantum

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ardhvc says on Aug 7, 2008, 22:36:

La tema centro aqui es de terrorismo del taliban en afghanistan y por todos lados del mundo. Despues de comentar y aclarar esa tema ahora dire que es un problemo para todo el mundo que hay algunos grupos islamicos que tienen crecimientos bien fuertes que promueven las guerras holy. Y como evidencia vemos el vinculo con esas grupos contra los eeuu en 9/11 y en espana donde esos grupos respaldan el grupo teroristico ZTA que se quedan al norte donde fueron capturados grupos reclutando la gente de espana.

The central theme here is that of terrorism from the taliban in afghanistan in all parts of the world. After clearing up the main point now i will say that is is a problem in all the world that some islamic terrorist groups have extremely strong beliefs that promote "holy war", how bout that for a contradiction in terms. And as evidence we see the link with those groups against the US in 9/11 and in Spain where those groups back the main terrorist group ZTA that is to the north where there were recently captured some groups of taliban recruiting spanish people.

And I don't like seeing all this "my country does x" attitude. Listen, we are all brothers, i know it sounds funny, but no one is above another, we have to be fair and fight for justice and goodness.

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romy says on Aug 8, 2008, 01:04:

"we have to be fair and fight for justice and goodness"
Who gets to play God and decide right from wrong?

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tasco66 says on Aug 8, 2008, 04:55:

Quantum,

I am sorry but you are wrong again about me. I have criticized many time the US on this site. I was even against the invasion of Iraq when most Americans supported it.

Get your facts straight before making assumptions about other people.

The trouble with free elections is, you never know who is going to win (Leonid Brezhnev)

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quantum says on Aug 8, 2008, 08:09:

Bueno tasco,
And tell me how do u feel about Patriot Act 1&2 and the Military Enabling Act among others more recent. Once again I ask u, do u really believe the U.S. with this current administration especially. is the shining beacon of democracy that we were all taught to believe that it is? After what has been pepetuated in the last 7 yrs (at least) we no longer have room to talk. We can no longer say, "but in the U.S. we doit this way and it works better". Cuz the way things now work in the good ole U.S. of A. I dont see it working for me........

quantum

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tasco66 says on Aug 8, 2008, 08:26:

quantum,

I don't think anybody can argue that the present administration has been anything else than a complete disaster…

Except on a few issues such as the support of Colombia of course...

The trouble with free elections is, you never know who is going to win (Leonid Brezhnev)

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quantum says on Aug 8, 2008, 17:46:

Okay, then, at least we can agree on that much. Its a start!

quantum

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TioCharlie says on Aug 9, 2008, 00:31:

I think that this is a very good jesture from Colombia. I am a member of the Army and have recently returned from a 15 month tour in Afghanistan. The people there for the most part really do ned help getting bck on thier feet and helping the government spread its aid out to the countryside. The fighting tactics over there are taken right from the North Vietamese handbook. Watch out for black and red "flags in villages, don't travel on the road if you can avoid it, and finally watch out for the crazy suicide bomber. I was in a town in the SE part of the country providing security during a medical visit by USAID workers and a guy with 3 hand grenades blew himself up about 6 meters from me, cost me my eye. "Freedom isn't Free, it cost a buck 'o' five, and if you want pay, who will?" (quoe from Team America : World Police)

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