Colombian Investor's Visa - What is an investment?

tomtom33 says on May 28, 2008, 11:37:

You would have to actually buy something like an apartment or house. Just moving the money into Colombia doesn't count.

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rhydewithdis says on May 28, 2008, 14:37:

Some links with good information for you:
http://www.medellininfo.com/visa/index.html
http://www.colombianblog.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2915
http://www.proexport.com.co/VBeContent/newsdetail.asp?id=5520&idcompan...
http://www.cancilleria.gov.co/wps/portal/!ut/p/.cmd/cs/.ce/7_0_A/.s/7_...

They said I couldn't play football I was too small / They say I couldn't play basketball I wasn't tall / They say I couldn't play baseball at all / And now everyday of my life I ball.

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guacharaca says on May 28, 2008, 15:53:

Usually the money has to be "at risk".....but with your own home, the risk is minimal. For an exact answer, one needs to see how "investments" are defined in the "statutes and regulations of the international investments".

Colombianos: Las armas os han dado independencia, las leyes os daran libertad. (Santander)

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twmcm says on May 29, 2008, 11:54:

Okay . . . Suppose I create a Colombian company and put the money in an bank account belonging to that company - with the intention of using the money as seed/operating capital.

Is that an investment under applicable guidelines?

I can't seem to find this document . . . Internantional Investments Statute. More time with Google will hopefully uncover it.

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tomtom33 says on May 29, 2008, 15:20:

You have to actually spend the money. Bank accounts and intentions mean squat.

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twmcm says on May 29, 2008, 16:04:

Tomtom . . . this doesn't entirely make sense. A company needs operating capital.

I'm really trying to find the law or the specific definition of investment insofar as the visa is concerned. Presumably "investment" is defined within the law or in the International Investment Statutes - which I have not been able to find.

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pedro says on May 29, 2008, 16:42:

I'm pretty sure that cash used to buy shares in a company would count as an investment... no matter if the company was your own.

I remember seeing an extensive list somewhere of qualifying investments... I was just in Bogota recently to renew my visa. Unfortunately, I can't remember exactly where I saw it. I'll review my papers sometime soon and post if I find it.

que nota!

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pedro says on May 29, 2008, 18:59:

After some reflection... I realise that list of investments was on a sheet stuck on the noticeboard, in the MRE visas office on Bogota.

I remember thinking "this is good shit, must get a copy of that". It may be some kind of decree or circular released by MRE or Banco de la Republica. Unfortunately I didn't take any notes.

Gator is PBH's oracle on questions like this. Maybe he knows where this info can be found. Otherwise someone who happens to be passing by MRE in Chico, Bogota can photograph or note down a reference for the info.

que nota!

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robi666 says on May 29, 2008, 21:21:

You can find everything you need in CIRCULAR REGLAMENTARIA EXTERNA DCIN-83.
http://www.banrep.gov.co/documentos/reglamentacion/cambiaria/Numerales...

Chapter 7 defines the different kind of investments.

Excerpt:

a. Inversiones directas:
- AdquisicioÌ?n de participaciones, acciones, cuotas sociales, aportes representativos del capital de
una empresa, incluidas las destinadas al capital asignado de sucursales de sociedades extranjeras
del reÌ?gimen general o especial;
- Bonos obligatoriamente convertibles en acciones;
- Inversiones suplementarias al capital asignado de las sucursales de sociedades extranjeras del
reÌ?gimen general
- AdquisicioÌ?n de participaciones en fondos de capital privado.

b. Inversiones de portafolio:
- AdquisicioÌ?n de acciones y bonos obligatoriamente convertibles en acciones, y
- AdquisicioÌ?n de otros valores inscritos en el registro nacional de valores, de acuerdo con lo
establecido en el tiÌ?tulo III, capiÌ?tulo III del Decreto 2080 de 2000 y sus modificaciones

"I am a citizen of the most beautiful nation on earth. A nation whose laws are harsh yet simple, a nation that never cheats, which is immense and without borders, where life is lived in the present."

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slguy says on May 29, 2008, 21:25:

when gator shows up, he'll have a very clear answer. i know he's answered this before...have you done a search here?

Before you throw me out, make sure I pay my bar tab

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robi666 says on May 29, 2008, 21:32:

There is not a simpler answer. You have to study the law or hire a lawyer.

The correct definition is in CIRCULAR REGLAMENTARIA EXTERNA DCIN-83 of Banco de La Republica, which is continuously updated. Last version is dated 29 April 2008.

The circular also contains the correct directives to register the inversion.

"I am a citizen of the most beautiful nation on earth. A nation whose laws are harsh yet simple, a nation that never cheats, which is immense and without borders, where life is lived in the present."

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tomtom33 says on May 30, 2008, 05:31:

If you want things to make sense, leave Colombia immediately and never look back.

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robi666 says on May 30, 2008, 05:47:

Tomtom is right!

A little example of it...

The Circular reports that after 6 months in the country (no matter on which VISA), you cannot file form 4 and 11 registering a foreign investment. But you can ask to be recognized as "Inversionista Residente", resident investor.
Which is the advantage of being a "Inversionista Residente" vs. a normal Colombian? Called by my accountant, at BdlR they could NOT answer this simple question. You loose tax and change benefits. It is just like a "honour medal".

Clearly, the whole fact of the 6 months rule is ridiculous. I mean, Banco de La Republica considers you a resident while DAS and Ministerio de Relaciones Exteriores, which issues Visas, consider you someone on a temporal Visa.

So, someone can come into the country, buy an apartment or anyhow invest 100,000 %USD, register his investment and get a residence investor Visa.
Another guy, after living in the country for 6 months, cannot get his money from abroad and register his inversion as a foreign investor but as a resident investor. And the same guy will have to leave the country, because he won't get a Visa and is not resident for DAS.

But there are other examples of the absurdities contained into the Circular Cambiaria.
For example, a guy, who lived here for more than 6 months, wires some money in from abroad to buy an apartment.
He is wrongly told by the bank to file form 4.
He buys the apartment.
He tries to file form 11 but gets denied by the BdlR and he is told that he was wrong filing form 4.
Now he had only 15 days to change from form 4 to 5 and cannot do it anymore. So he is instructed to wire back the money or he will get a fine because the money are not legalized in Colombia.
He does not have the money anymore because he bought the apartment.

Something really happened to a PBHer...

"I am a citizen of the most beautiful nation on earth. A nation whose laws are harsh yet simple, a nation that never cheats, which is immense and without borders, where life is lived in the present."

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robi666 says on May 30, 2008, 11:03:

http://www.portafolio.com.co/economia/economiahoy/2008-05-30/ARTICULO-...

"I am a citizen of the most beautiful nation on earth. A nation whose laws are harsh yet simple, a nation that never cheats, which is immense and without borders, where life is lived in the present."

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robi666 says on May 30, 2008, 11:31:

Rubito,
you can get an investor Visa buying an apartment, no problems. And many did.
Again, refers to chapter seven of the Circular Cambiaria DCIN 83.

"I am a citizen of the most beautiful nation on earth. A nation whose laws are harsh yet simple, a nation that never cheats, which is immense and without borders, where life is lived in the present."

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twmcm says on May 30, 2008, 13:45:

Rubito . . .

The Colombian investor visa is currently available by purchasing a primary residence as long as the recorded sales contract shows a purchase price of $100,000 USD or higher (if the contract price is lower, you can enter and present a renovation contract to bridge the gap).

The second method to which you refer is probably the rentista visa which requires proof of sustainable monthly income greater than 1.5x minimum wage OR a securities account worth $24,000 USD or more. I have been unable to locate extensive information on the rentista option and lawyers seem unwilling to provide any details at all.

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LDW says on May 30, 2008, 13:57:

To hell with all of that bureaucratic mumbo jumbo. Where is the golf course?

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Alma del Norte says on May 30, 2008, 15:36:

Rentista = 10x minimum wage.

La vida es una rutina

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