Colombian Devil's Breath

rumronrum says on Jul 28, 2007, 02:12:

Any idea how it was ingested (do you remember that part)? I have been warned about this drug and pulled away from a guy trying to administer it to me. One technique is asking for directions with a piece of paper in their hand and the drug in their palm. When you look at the paper the drug is blow in your face. Interested to hear more for other memebers.

RumRonRum

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lpdiver says on Jul 28, 2007, 02:15:

gum, cigarettes, food, drinks, blown in the face as you mentioned.

t

"cook some rice!"

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goin_south says on Jul 28, 2007, 02:16:

sounds like my sort of fun ;):):)) I'm gonna have to shed mi novia; she takes too good care of me :)

Where do we go from here?

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bartolo_colon says on Jul 28, 2007, 02:34:

I am not sure, It was at La Cuchara in Cartagena across from the University. Kind of like the most confusing blackout in history. I woke up to my Colombian friends pounding on my door, they were asking me questions at a rapid pace and with great concern, and I had no fucking clue what the fuck they where talking about. They are the ones that suggested that I might have been dosed, otherwise I might have just chocked up my empty wallet and swimming head and daylight hallucinations to some weird aguardiente/aguila/coma/zombie/heatstroke/bender type of thing and never thought of it again....I did feel fucking strange for a few days, but, you know, what ever, I usually dont feel quite right after a good weekend either.

Hey, careful, man, there's a beverage here!

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panthdave says on Jul 28, 2007, 05:15:

Will definitely watch out...

panthdave Miami

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LA_MONA says on Jul 28, 2007, 05:26:

BC jajajajijiajajaja que rrrrrrrisa
Sorry I know it's serious but I am laughing so hard.....

Para volar, es preciso tener resistencia. -M.Lin

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RAAAY says on Jul 28, 2007, 05:45:

Sounds like a nice night out.............

.........Its useless to argue with ignorance

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rumronrum says on Jul 28, 2007, 06:38:

gringoinbogota, Yes you are right from what I have heard, they don't put it on their hand but on paper that they ask you to look at and then poof your history.

RumRonRum

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Lostgringo says on Jul 28, 2007, 06:50:

gringoinbogota...... If the drug can be secreted in the palm of the hand then it would make sense that they would use a paper. But what about your prepago scenerio? Wouldn't she secrete the drug through her siliconies (sp)? Just a thought.

Your Home Away from Home www.welovebogota.com and www.apartmentinbogota.com "Luxury apartments and rooms Cheap" Only 2 blocks from the American Embassy! 24/7 hour security.

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panthdave says on Jul 28, 2007, 07:22:

This is some dangerous shit man..Freaking me out...Basically then can mix this with anything......

panthdave Miami

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rumronrum says on Jul 28, 2007, 07:49:

What is?

A substance exists that has the power to suppress the will of the people, makes lose the memory of everything what happens during the time that lasts its effect. It is assimilated to the single contact with the body.

Escopolamina is called and BRUGMANSIA or BELLADONA is obtained from a native tree of Center America, denominated. In Colombia is known it like sabanero or borrachero cacao. Of her a called drug is extracted atropine that has several uses in the classic medicine. There is no a considered specific substance like burundanga, has been denominated thus to any hipnógeno able to control a victim with the purpose of committing illicit.

The alteration of this drug with other drugs
Investigators assure that this drug has been altered and/or manipulated with other drugs to produce the automatism effect. The escopolamina is a medicine of delicate use and is used it under medical prescription.

The enter the body
Once the escopolamina enters the body will cause its maximum effect, with a duration of 1 or 2 hours, later to eliminate itself slowly.

Effects
The victim will be in a state of passivity and “complaciente attitude” that the delinquent takes advantage of to rob to him and to induce to him economically to conduct battles that can injure to him physical, moral or.

Where can be the Escopolamina?
In candies, soda waters, licores, perfumes, paper, tickets, etc. burundanga to victims is administered very frequently who have consumed spirits previously which does more difficult to determine which or which substances are the people in charge of the state of acute poisoning in which the patient arrives at the service of urgencies.

How acts the delinquents?
Burundanga is the favorite drug for the delinquents. Remember that it transitorily alters the cerebral operation in approximately 2 minutes. The victim in such condition, is the ideal prey to abuse her or to physically rob to him voluntarily.

They are generally small organizations formed by more than three delinquents in charge to select to the victim to confuse it, to drug it, to rob it, etc.

How does it?
Sometimes capably they locate objects in front of the victim so that this one inhales the toxic: for example, they can show a book, portfolio or handkerchief that once opened let save the gas or spray to him in the face.

Taken care of with the taxi drivers who capably shake franelas within the vehicle.

Taken care of with those (ace) friends (ace) who approach to establish conversation in the bus and/or shutdowns.

Routes of absorption
The entrance by via inhalatoria through cigarette or the skin with the application of liniments is feasible.

DANGER - high Doses
In very high doses cause convulsions, severe depression, comma and still the death.

RECOMMENDATIONS
It does not accept (not to touch) papers or flying leaves of strangers in the street or its vehicle.
It does not accept any type of drink, candies or cigarettes of strangers when some social event or bars is in.

It does not leave to his bottle or left glass of licor.

Taken care of when apparently inoffensive people approach you in the street with charity pretexts or pretending to be illiterate so that she reads a direction.

If in the lapse of a minute you suspect to be drugged with any chemical substance and this cornered, she simulates to undergo a faint or an attack (convulsions), the delinquent will know of the danger of the excess in the drug and will decide to leave it.

If still are half-conscious you and you can distinguish if the delinquent has left, she requests aid immediately. ! SOON NOTHING REMEMBERED!

Give instructions in his house (young and employees), not to open to the door to supposed religious, selling groups or employees public.

If the intention is the robbery is its house, the favorite victims are the domestic employees and the children.

She does not accept handkerchiefs of strangers with pretexts of which their face or clothes is stained.

She does not establish conversations with strangers when you this making tail in the bank.

She does not accept product demonstrations (perfume inhalation) that usually are sold in the street or outside Commercial Centers.

RumRonRum

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sweet160 says on Jul 28, 2007, 08:00:

does it happen a lot that people robbed or raped or both using this drug, and is it only in Bogota or in other cities as well?

" its a dog eat dog world, and I will eat your dog! "

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rumronrum says on Jul 28, 2007, 08:04:

Its in Medellin

RumRonRum

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LA_MONA says on Jul 28, 2007, 08:14:

And Cali too..

Para volar, es preciso tener resistencia. -M.Lin

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LA_MONA says on Jul 28, 2007, 08:23:

I was told that it takes around 2 minutes to kick in or something so if you suspect you have been drugged to act like you are having a really bad convulsion/reaction as sometimes this really does happen, so really act and give it all you got before it really does kick in and hopefully they will run as they don't want a dead person on their hands...

Oh and btw I think all prepagos should put it on su teta, take the money and adiossss

Para volar, es preciso tener resistencia. -M.Lin

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sweet160 says on Jul 28, 2007, 08:27:

always let de Prepagos shower themself before....

" its a dog eat dog world, and I will eat your dog! "

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LA_MONA says on Jul 28, 2007, 08:30:

A todo marrano le llega su nochebuena

Para volar, es preciso tener resistencia. -M.Lin

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LA_MONA says on Jul 28, 2007, 08:31:

GIB I think what I had been told, my suggestion of the convulsion is better, you are hardly going to win a fight in 2 minutes are you?

Para volar, es preciso tener resistencia. -M.Lin

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LA_MONA says on Jul 28, 2007, 08:32:

jajaja thanks, was told that by hubby just in case!

Para volar, es preciso tener resistencia. -M.Lin

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LA_MONA says on Jul 28, 2007, 08:41:

He is very street wise and has tought me alot about that kind of stuff....awww

Para volar, es preciso tener resistencia. -M.Lin

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Lostgringo says on Jul 28, 2007, 13:11:

Ok here's the deal. People can use a nicotine patch to help them stop smoking. They can use that patch anywhere on their body. Because the medication is secreted through the pores of the skin...not necessarily through the sweat glands. So while I think this a great story I do believe it is more a Colombian "urban myth." Just my opinion. I don't want to stir this up too much.

Your Home Away from Home www.welovebogota.com and www.apartmentinbogota.com "Luxury apartments and rooms Cheap" Only 2 blocks from the American Embassy! 24/7 hour security.

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rumronrum says on Jul 28, 2007, 13:50:

Myth.................no its real.........................

RumRonRum

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Man Tequila says on Jul 28, 2007, 16:18:

Urban myth? Scopolamine poisioning is well documented in Colombia and the medical literature.

http://www.emedicine.com/EMERG/topic36.htm

Aunque no me creas/ si me lo propongo/ lograre olvidarte/ porque a fin de cuentas/ no soy tan cobarde./ Y termino todo una de estas tardes/ no sera dificil buscar algún sitio donde refugiarme/ donde nunca mas vuelvas a encontrarme. (Polo Montañez)

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fecherklyn says on Jul 28, 2007, 17:18:

Lostgringo,

Nope, you had better believe it.

My cousin's best friend (in Medellin) "lost" a night after drinks with friends in Poblado. The friend's did not see her leave and she will never know how she lost her virginity.

In a way we are lucky in Colombia. This, and similar drugs, are used in othe more sophisticated locations for more imaginative thefts.....your vital organs.

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Lostgringo says on Jul 28, 2007, 19:13:

Please read my post more closely. I am saying that the idea of a prepago using her breast or nipple with this drug..........is an urban myth! Geeeeesh.

Your Home Away from Home www.welovebogota.com and www.apartmentinbogota.com "Luxury apartments and rooms Cheap" Only 2 blocks from the American Embassy! 24/7 hour security.

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Man Tequila says on Jul 28, 2007, 19:34:

Well, then I might agree with you, Lostgringo. But after re-reading your first post, I still don't think you make it very clear you're referring to slippery nipples. I'd agree someone who put a big dose of scopolamine on their breasts might end up looking like a boob -- but it is also possible that an oral dose is much more bioactive than a topical dose (my limited experience is more with scopolamine injections). Scopolamine is also available as a patch, but at a dose possibly less useful to criminals. The patch would be an expensive way of getting it in Colombia.

Aunque no me creas/ si me lo propongo/ lograre olvidarte/ porque a fin de cuentas/ no soy tan cobarde./ Y termino todo una de estas tardes/ no sera dificil buscar algún sitio donde refugiarme/ donde nunca mas vuelvas a encontrarme. (Polo Montañez)

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droble77 says on Jul 28, 2007, 20:29:

This scares me more than the paseo millonario. I never carry credit cards or a lot of cash at night, but there's nothing much you can do if you're hit with this s***. Your life is completely out of your hands, with almost no time to react or get away. Really, it's up to the doorman and/or concerned friends to save your ass or minimize the damage.

I've heard about this being used in Bogotá, but Medellín and Cali too? Yikes! The golden rule for me is to never go out alone at night, taxi is always called for with the # or code verified if I'm going to meet someone at night, etc. Next visit, I will talk with the portero de noche of the place I'm staying at and have some kind of "everything OK" passphrase with him as well.

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Mr. Hollywood says on Jul 28, 2007, 22:04:

It's not just Colombia.

I knew a guy who got dosed with the stuff in Costa Rica ages ago. And anyone who doesn't think this kind of shit happens in the US should google the name "Andrew Luster".

In truth, I think it's overhyped as a danger in Colombia, unless you're hanging out in some sleazy places. You're much more likely to get a brick to the side of the head or a gun in your face at the stop light.

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goin_south says on Jul 28, 2007, 22:15:

I don't think anything here is over-hyped.... jus as in the states. As for all the talk of VIOLENCIA.. HELL... go read on www.foxsports.net... and read about all the VIOLENCIA in the sporting world...of and to do with high-profile sporting figures... OUTSIDE THE LINES.

Where ever you are in the world... you can pretty much tell,...and FEEL,... if your in THE CLEAR... or .. in a DANGER ZONE.

Colombia... USA... Timbuktu... wherever.

Where do we go from here?

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jinksmiester says on Jul 29, 2007, 07:44:

Sounds like some bad stuff this drug.It would,nt take much for someone to slip it into a drink.Im wondering if everyone reacts the same to it though as manny people react differently to different drugs.Some people drink and become a happy drunk...others want to fight...
Im guessing a person would not have to inhale a lot to be affected...although some people on a reflex reaction might blow it away from there face rather than take a deep breath and avoid at least some of it...hell they might blow some of it right back into the face of the person trying to adminster it...but then that would be poetic justice...don,t imagine that happens to often.

A man is not old until regret takes the place of dreams

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droble77 says on Jul 29, 2007, 07:52:

That's just stupid GIB. I don't want the portero to take on 2 or 3 strange guys who are possibly armed as well. I want him to play dumb and have him call for backup, police, my friends, whatever.

That's the whole point of the passphrase idea. Even with the mind control capabilities of this drug, it seems unlikely that the bad guys would know they would have to pull a passphrase out of me or command me to tell the portero my secret passphrase. :-)

In any case, I will definitely make sure next trip, me and der nachtwächter are on good terms and that he has a list of two of my friends with their cell #s. And anyway, when I know company is arriving, I ALWAYS go down to greet them and present them to the portero. That way, the portero knows anyone I don't present should be at least questioned.

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Man Tequila says on Jul 29, 2007, 08:58:

Good precautions, but no saying you'd be taken back to your apartment...

There is some evidence intranasal scopolamine works faster than oral --http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/cgi-bin/abstract/72505238/ABSTRACT?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0

There is some evidence a spray below the tongue (sublingual) has better bioavailability than oral -- http://www.informaworld.com/smpp/content~content=a778979240~db=all~jum...

A patch has 1.5mg of scopolamine but is specially micronized, as GIB says, to allow for better absorption. I think putting scopolamine on the skin would be risky for the person doing this but if quickly licked off would be riskier for that person...
http://pt.wkhealth.com/pt/re/cpk/abstract.00003088-200645060-00001.htm...

Aunque no me creas/ si me lo propongo/ lograre olvidarte/ porque a fin de cuentas/ no soy tan cobarde./ Y termino todo una de estas tardes/ no sera dificil buscar algún sitio donde refugiarme/ donde nunca mas vuelvas a encontrarme. (Polo Montañez)

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goin_south says on Jul 29, 2007, 09:24:

Hey... to take a little different twist on the subject of the drug....
I have a friend online who says that ONE OF THE SISTERS of his novia put some sort of drug in her drink recently that put her unconscious for several hours. The story, to me, sounds like this drug....scopolamine...

I have never heard of it.... doing this to family... Anything is imaginable, but.... usually on pbh, we have only read about THUGS AND THIEVES using the drug.

Any comments??

Where do we go from here?

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goin_south says on Jul 29, 2007, 09:47:

On a more serious note....(if we can, gib).... why would a bro or sis do this to a lady of 40 years?

Where do we go from here?

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droble77 says on Jul 29, 2007, 12:36:

GIB, maybe I don't know exactly how the drug works, but the concept probably still holds. The passphrase would be something a little unusual, something I would NOT say if I was out of my mind, unless like I said my captors pull the info out of me. Of course, they would know to ask for my PIN # to an ATM card, but they wouldn't know I have a little passphrase between me and the portero (unless they were casing me, or somehow knew or are in cahoots with the portero, but let's not get that paranoid).

Now if you've got 3 guys in your building who are ex-military, that's cool. The last place I stayed, it was just one guy and he seemed alright to me but I wouldn't expect him to endanger himself to save a colombiano. . . or even my "rich" gringo ass! :-) Just to notify authorities and maybe stall them or psych them out, sheesh. . .

As for the police, yeah I've heard several interesting stories, they're not angels but I doubt they're that inefficient if you're staying at Poblado or some other high estrata place. In any case, having the portero ask me to do silly things is just a DUMB idea, and accomplishes NOTHING in a potentially dangerous situation for BOTH me and the doorman. Even if I did give away the passphrase, the WAY I would say it and the suspicious characters with me should tip him off right away that something is very wrong.

I'm not posting any more on this issue. I REFUSE to live a paranoid life, this is something that is not frequent, and there's not much you can do to avoid it or fight it anyway. Last time I went to MDE, the plane had a missed approach and a scary HARD landing. The time before, I was in a disco and some idiot kid who was fighting someone else grabbed me from behind and pulled me off my chair so I would fall instead of him (I was fine, but the hijueputa ruined my shirt).

I know the dangers of South America and I'll do what I can to minimize the risks (and the damage) without getting paranoid about things I can't control anyway or are not my fault.

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goin_south says on Jul 29, 2007, 19:40:

simply as so many try to say, here, so often.... Uh,.....don't go where the danger is, or might be. THE STEER CLEAR PROGRAM ;')

Where do we go from here?

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Lostgringo says on Jul 30, 2007, 16:17:

Oh well, I guess I will post some information on this drug. We had a man stay in our apartment we rent in Bogota. One night he came home with two strangers. He told me he was really drunk. Who knows for sure. Anyway, the porter would not let these guys up to his room. On another occasion, the same guy was drinking in a bar. All of a sudden he got a little out of it. He said he became weak. He made it out of the bar and some guy was trying to get him into a taxi. However, the doorman of a hotel across the street came to his rescue. The doorman made sure he went to a hospital. He was in the hospital until the next day. He swears he was drugged. And, he swears this taxi driver and other person was trying to rob him. Apparently, this guy who was trying to get him a taxi is well known by the bar staff and they have concerns about him. No telling what would have happened if he had gotten into that taxi. Yes GIB I love the story about this drug being on the breast or nipples of pre-pagos. How about this, I heard that some Colombian fathers make their virgin daughters put this drug on their breasts. They won't allow them to date otherwise! LOL

Your Home Away from Home www.welovebogota.com and www.apartmentinbogota.com "Luxury apartments and rooms Cheap" Only 2 blocks from the American Embassy! 24/7 hour security.

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Robert Jorge says on Jul 30, 2007, 23:50:

The apparent urban legend of the scop drug on the nipple must be pretty wide spread. I asked my wife about the drug, and she mentioned, without me prompting, about how prostitutes put it on their nipples. I asked her why the prostitutes were not also affected by the drug? ... because it is so strong and can be absorbed through the skin, and she didn't have an answer.

BEWARE of gold diggers.

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goin_south says on Jul 31, 2007, 01:07:

she didn't have an answer.

smart girl, Rob. I mean.. you didn't think she wanted to incriminate herself, did ya? jejjjje








Kiddin you.... go to bed!

Where do we go from here?

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panthdave says on Jul 31, 2007, 04:57:

Okay everybody we need somebody to test this out...and make a video..so we can get live action on this drug..

panthdave Miami

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LA_MONA says on Jul 31, 2007, 05:09:

I think all the prepago's should use it, shave the guys eyebrows and head, put lots of make up on him, rip his trousers to shreds, leave him shirtless and shoeless and write on his chest "My prepago,,,,"
and then on his back "Did this to me!" and then leave him to wander the streets in a daze....

Of course take all his money and cards first and foremost,

Para volar, es preciso tener resistencia. -M.Lin

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panthdave says on Jul 31, 2007, 05:29:

SO MEAN LA MONA DIDN'T THINK YOU HAD THAT IN YOU..


Would be funny though...

JAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJ

panthdave Miami

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podborski says on Jul 31, 2007, 05:55:

I dunno mona, that sounds kind of fun actually...

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LA_MONA says on Jul 31, 2007, 07:43:

I have a tip for the girls as well, sometimes you are faced with a situation like this: Hey have this drink or we'll pour it onto your head..." all done in a very happy, jokey way and you know you shouldn't but you will look like a party pooper if you don't...well take the drink and act like you knocked it back, then take your agua or whatever you are using "para pasar" and take some, then just spit the drink you had into the water, I know it's digusting but you know you have to protect yourself, I used to do that in Colombia as I don't like getting too tipsy .....but you could use it in this type of situation as well....

Just make sure no one else picks up your water by mistake...

Para volar, es preciso tener resistencia. -M.Lin

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Miguel_Clavo says on Jul 31, 2007, 21:45:

i was told at a training class at my **prior** work, that some hookers would put Chapstick type stuff on their lips and "other body parts" to prevent the absorption of the drug into their bodies..this allowed them to conduct business as usual......we were told to look for tissues with lipstick marks etc as evidence in the rooms of the Potatohead Johns.....

"I would rather die living life, than to live a dying life."........ Oh, and my PM is always ON. Great Bumper Sticker: "Home of the Free, Because of the Brave"

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goin_south says on Jul 31, 2007, 22:53:

"have a tip for the girls".... no, nooo..
Mona, it's the Girls.... that have a Tip.... for us!
Loaded, of course. with de drug.

Where do we go from here?

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