Colombian artist Fernando Botero's fat ladies make a huge impression in Singapore

umm says on Jan 11, 2005, 19:41:

sure,
here at the boat key just in front of the UOB/PUB banks there is a statue of a fat bird displayed which is also made by Botero.

UMM

My Forum

Gomezman5 says on Jan 11, 2005, 21:08:

Botero's fat people are loved everywhere !! It was about 8-10 years ago....one of the happiest times of my life when Botero's stone exhibits lined Michigan ave in downtown Chicago.
I was out there almost everyday, telling both Chicagoans and tourist alike about the reknowned Botero and that he was COLOMBIAN !!! I was so happy !

Some people made me angry of course, because they could not believe Colombia had such culture. "The artist is from Colombia? Are you sure one tourist from Canada asked?" Well, you had to be patient and let people know that Colombia has a tremendous amount of culture. Some people in this country still don't believe Shakira is Colombiana.

Oh well.....

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Miguel says on Jan 11, 2005, 22:30:

Gomezman5 I hear you; fortunately, having two colombianos en the 2004 World Series was somewhat of an eye-opener, at least for people I know; many don't even think of the north coast of Colombia as an area that could produce two world class shortstops. I hope sooner or later, Juanes gets his due in the States.

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oldbongo says on Jan 12, 2005, 00:10:

always gives boteros' as presents, the cheap ceramicas are a perfect way
to show people why we go to colombia, ...por l'amor!!
he also likes to tell people that la commandante is the model.

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ColombianoX says on Jan 12, 2005, 10:39:

"I hope sooner or later, Juanes gets his due in the States."

Miguel,

Juanes has been doing very well in the States. His latest album was number one on Billboards latin charts for many weeks and is still doing well. His previous album was a smash which set a record in the US latin charts as the album with most weeks in the Top Ten on Billboard. He also won five Latin Grammys in one night a couple of years ago and has even appeared on the Tonight Show.


ColombianoX

'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

ColombianoX 'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 13, 2005, 10:01:

Juanes-- Can he even sing in English ? He will do well if he can sing in English. Look at Shakira.
All those years and all those albums, nobody here (apart from the Latin community) knew anything about her until she sang in English.

Maybe people in Miami did because of the fusion of culture. But here in Chicago, only the Mexican and Mexican American Spanish speaking community took to her. Even the Puerto Ricans did not know of her, because of the type Spanish music she sang. Once she started singing in English, she went to the top of the pop charts.

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ColombianoX says on Jan 13, 2005, 10:35:

Juanes has stated many times that he is not interested in singing in english. And why should he? That's not his language. Do you see Brittney Spears or Eminem singing in spanish?


ColombianoX

'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

ColombianoX 'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 13, 2005, 13:42:

I never said that he should....learn English The issue was will he ever "make it big" in the states. Well, making it big means learning English. I'll go a step further by saying if he learns English, he will make it big here, and in a hell of a lot of contries in the world where he is virtually unknown. The only people who know him here are Latinos. Being big in the Latino community is just that, big in the Latino community. But your recognition does up several fold when you can tap into those Gringo dollars. And then there is Canada, and Australiam and the UK,and on and on.

Do you really think Shakira wanted to learn English. She took all kinds of English immersion classes so she could come out with her first English CD (Laundry List). Of course painting herself to Look like a Gringa blond did not hurt either. As to Britany Spears and Eminem, they have a lot less to gain learning Spanish them Shakira did by learning English. It all about $$ my friend

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ColombianoX says on Jan 13, 2005, 14:12:

"he will make it big here, and in a hell of a lot of contries in the world where he is virtually unknown. The only people who know him here are Latinos."

You know Gomez, you make it sound as if by singing in spanish, Juanes isn't a "true star" and he wouldn't make it to the "big time" unless he sings in english. I suggest you overcome this inferiority complex. Juanes is a big enough star by singing in OUR language and if non-spanish speakers don't know who he is, that's their loss.

"And then there is Canada, and Australiam and the UK,and on and on"

Ooooh wow, just a few countries. There are plenty more countries that speak spanish here in our own hemisphere, America.

"It all about $$ my friend"

Well, maybe to Juanes it isn't just all about the money.


ColombianoX

'Defensor de la Hispanidad'

ColombianoX 'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

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caslug says on Jan 13, 2005, 14:48:

Gotta agree w/ gomez.. Sure the latino music scene is getting popular in the US, especially in major cities. Latino singers and actors are making headway into US market, BUT until they can speak/sing in English, they'll only get niche role. Look at Salma Hayek(big star in Mexico), came to US from Mexico couldn't get good roles until she learn English, now's she's producing and staring in alot more roles. Penolope Cruz, was great in spanish films but until she learn English, her roles were limit. What about Antoino Bandaras, look at his roles now compare to when he couldn't speak english.

Yesterday, i was driving home listening to the KISS FM, mainstream radio in LA. They played that spanish rock song, don't ask me the name, during regular hour. I was a little suprise, because socal has a large population of hispanic. BUT even the singer busted out in English for the half the song. Do you think they would have done it if they didn't care about their english only listener.

IF a singer/actor DONT care about making BIG in america, then they don't have to learn english. This is not just with entertainment industry either. I work in the software industry and ANY software developer that wants the BIG BUCKS, must convert their software to English. Otherwise, they'll be a big fish in a small pond in their country. On other hand, we sell software that is English ONlY overseas OK, because the high end user that use our software know ENGLISH. WHY? Because english is STILL the NUMBER ONE business langauge.

I'm not putting spanish down, heck i'm trying very hard TO LEARN spanish so i can get more business opportunity.

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 13, 2005, 15:00:

Caslug--I could not have said it better myself ! ColombianoX might want to be remidnded that even Carlos Vives is starting to join the bandwagon. Only recently, he made at least one song where he has a line or two in English. Same thing. Does anyone think that he is doing this because of his new sudden found interst in the English language.

Enrique Iglesias, did it, Ricky Martin did it. Even Los Tigres del Norte, which is know the world over, has just cut a couple songs recently in English in their newest release, "Pacto de Sngre"

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Lionheart says on Jan 13, 2005, 15:20:

also Spanish Rock is becoming known I regularly play two major bands who sing most in Spanish:

Mägo de Oz from Spain
Rata Blanca from Argentina

These two bands are big players in Europe already, I hope they break through in the USA.

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ColombianoX says on Jan 13, 2005, 15:43:

"Look at Salma Hayek(big star in Mexico), "

Caslug,

Salma Hayek was not a big star in Mexico before she came to Hollywood, she was a struggling actress who only appeared in a couple of cheesy soap operas. It was in the US where she made it big.

"ColombianoX might want to be remidnded that even Carlos Vives is starting to join the bandwagon. Only recently, he made at least one song where he has a line or two in English. "

Gomezman,

The reason those one or two lines are in english in the song "Carito" is because the song is about an english teacher he had a crush on when he was a boy, and those lines were what he would say to her. It has nothing to do with making a cross-over.

"Even Los Tigres del Norte, which is know the world over, "

Yeah right! Do you think people in Argentina or Chile actually listen to that crap? Give me a break, you need to stop watching so much Univision.


ColombianoX

'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

ColombianoX 'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

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caslug says on Jan 13, 2005, 16:12:

COLX u r right, forget about learning english.. Like tinto said, english is only 2/3rd largest market. I say go for the two biggest market. Learn Chinese(manderin) and Indian, between them you got 2.1-2.3 BILLIONS people you can sell to! And you know those third world people are multiplying like crazy, the market will be alot more in a few years! LOL.

Only problem, is the latino artist will not make as much money in those markets, because of all the video/music piracy problem. But hey, don't worry about that because English speaking lawyers/companies from US&Europe are fighting that battle for ya!

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 13, 2005, 17:03:

Los Tigres de Norte --crap?? While I will admit Nortena is not exactly one of my favorite musics. You are wrong as to their popularity. It is astonishing how many people they can draw. I had to tell you, but they perform in Colombian a few times a year to sell out crowds. And get ready....one of the places that they sold out was in Colombia's salsa capital, Cali. Now how about that? One of the reasons for their fame is the messages that they sing in their songs. Which by the way is more than messages I hear in Salsa. Don't get me wrong, I have over 1200 CD's a majority of which is Salsa and salsa clasica (fania) etc.. But I too have Los tigres, because they sing about how a two countris abuse a group of people that both countries benefit from.
You really are misinformed if you don't know about their fame.

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 13, 2005, 17:13:

ColombianoX FYI Colombia espera a Los Tigres del Norte



por: Agencia
Fuente: NOTIMEX



Los Tigres del Norte llevarán su música a Colombia, donde en un concierto muy esperado por el público y organizadores, interpretarán sus grandes éxitos






BOGOTÁ, Colombia, nov. 26, 2004.- El grupo mexicano Los Tigres del Norte, creadores de los éxitos "La puerta negra" y "La banda del carro rojo", ofrecerán dos conciertos en Colombia en la segunda semana de diciembre, informaron hoy los organizadores.
La exitosa agrupación mexicana, encabezada por Jorge Hernández, llegará a este país sudamericano para ofrecer una primera presentación el 10 de diciembre en la ciudad de Bucaramanga, al nororiente de esta capital.

La segunda actuación de los intérpretes de "La reina del sur" y "Contrabando y traición" tendrá lugar en la capital colombiana el 11 de diciembre, indicó la emisora Radio Recuerdos, organizadora de las presentaciones.

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Tinto (Moderator) says on Jan 13, 2005, 17:33:

Excellent point... ...Piracy is practically a state-sanctioned activity in China and some Latin American countries.



Whoever is keeping score, chalk one up for the English-speaking world and intellectual property rights. ;-)

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 13, 2005, 18:00:

Tinto...Well.....just for the record Are you in the recording industry?
I have to admit, in Mexcio, Colombia, Panama, and a few other places,I think I have bought some CD's of suspect origin.

But....who knows?

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juanalejo says on Jan 14, 2005, 11:44:

???? Who in the hell are Los Tigres del Norte????

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Mr. Hollywood says on Jan 14, 2005, 13:11:

Devil's advocate I'm a gringo, not a latino, nor "into the latin scene" and I knew who Shakira was LONG before she sang in English. In fact, I really dislike her English album.

On the other hand, I also once partied backstage with Los Tigres Del Norte (and, I may add, open act "La Sonora Dinamita" who, if I'm not mistaken, were Colombian) so I may not be the best gauge of gringo knowledge of latin music.

Personally, I like Juanes okay but don't think he'd make the translation into English. Vives, IMHO, could, but I hope he doesn't go down that road.

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 14, 2005, 13:40:

Come on !!!! Don't even tell me you never heard of Los Tigres Del Norte!!!

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Jan 14, 2005, 13:43:

gomezman I don't have the slightest idea who they could be either.
Cheers,
Desi

"When shall we three meet again? In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"(First Witch in Macbeth)

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 14, 2005, 14:02:

Oh Please.... This group is THE Most famous Mexican group of Nortena music from Mexico. When they go to an American city, their tickets sell out as fast as the computers can print them. In LA over 120,000 went to see them and almsot 1 MIllion stretched for several blocks to try to get a seat to see them.

While salsa and merengue are my music of choice, there is not a salsa group in the world that can attract as many fans as
"Los Tigre del Norte"

By the way, they have been aroung since the mid to late 70's and they have about 25-30 cd's.

Just Google them, and how suprised you will be

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 14, 2005, 14:06:

Maybe this will help ? LOS TIGRES DEL NORTE
Pacto de Sangre
(Fonovisa/Univision)
US release date: 30 March 2004
UK release date: Available as import
by Matt Cibula
:. e-mail this article
:. print this article
:. comment on this article


Life, Death, and What It Means to Be Mexican... With Accordions!

You don't know about Los Tigres del Norte? Or Los Tucanes del Tijuana, or Grupo Exterminador, or Beto Quintanilla? Oh, dude, hombre, seriously. Then you are getting left the hell behind como los dinosaurios. Norteño music is the most punk-rock thing going these days, norteño music is the key to understanding half of Mexican-American culture, norteño music is the naked truth.

On the face of it, the norteño sound doesn't really grab hold of the first time listener: groups of dudes singing what sound like the nicest little inoffensive ditties in the world, silly music really, accordions on full blast and guys wearing big black ten-gallon hats singing in high tenor voices while their bands whoop and holler and go "ay yi yi" in the background. If you don't understand the español, or if you hear one song too quickly, or you misunderestimate the power of subtlety, you will dismiss an entire genre: what the hell is this silly crap?

But it's not silly. Norteño songs are very often about drug smuggling, or trying to sneak into an America that needs your labor but cannot officially admit it (or you), or about how your "American" children do not understand your foreign ways, or about lost love that burns you because your heart is alive. These songs sound completely unlike what they really are. These songs are about being a Mexican in America.

This year's best norteño album, Los Tigres del Norte's Pacto de Sangre, has sold millions of copies without you even hearing about it, both here and in Mexico, but also in Europe (they are huge in Spain) and Asia (they have toured Japan and Korea) and all over South America. They have been the target of controversy -- some cultural commentators view norteño the same way some people look at gangsta rap -- and their music has inspired Spanish highbrow writer Arturo Pérez-Reverte's novel La Reina del Sur. So this damned fine album is a pretty good way to start.

They start in full-scale narcocorrido mode with "No Tiene la Culpo el Indio." Los Tigres have been doing songs like this about the drug trade for more than three decades now, and when Jorge Hernández swaggers up to the mic and sings about going international, Madrid, how he's a "toro grande" who can contact the big wheels. I think it ends with a surprise, but I'm not sure -- it goes too fast. (I'm busy trying to translate the lyrics, which are thoughtfully included on the accompanying DVD.)

They do songs like this like some people breathe, but that is far from their only trick. "Amigo Juan" is a waltz to a dude whose woman is playing around, and "Cumbia Guajira" is a straight-up two-step boogie with funky drum breaks and lots of group shouting. When they are having fun, Los Tigres are about the funnest band in the world. "Liar Liar" is this way too, a little ditty about how it is more possible that the singer could breathe without oxygen or to grow flowers in the desert than believe someone's lies anymore, because "I'm not anymore the tonto I used to be". "La Manzanita" is bouncy rowdiness. These are party tunes for a multicultural society, and they go well with a few Coronas and/or tequilas. Trust me.

But they have a lot of tricks under their hats. "Las Mujeres de Juárez" is an impassioned cry for justice for the hundreds of serially-murdered women in Juárez. "El Niño de la Calle" is a monologue from the point of view of a street kid, abandoned by all, trying to find a better life. "El Santo de los Mojados" burns slowly to invoke St. Peter, "the saint of illegal immigrants," asking him to open the gates of heaven for all who lose their lives trying to get into America.

And the album's strongest song, probably one of the best songs of the whole year, is the story of one who did. "José Pérez León" finds a different sort of norteño groove, one I've never heard before, to tell the tale of one man trying to get into the U.S. illegally. He leaves his family, he leaves everything he's ever known, he trusts his life to the "coyotes" ... well, it doesn't end well. It's a tragedy that points to a higher tragedy, our failed and failing immigration policy. One can debate the issues all day, but this is a powerful piece of social reporting. Hail to José Cantoral, who wrote the song, and hail to accordionist/guitarist Eduardo Hernández, who steps in for lead vocal on this song and knocks it dead between the eyes. About two minutes in, his voice jumps an octave into outrage, and it never fails to hit me right in the solar plexus.

I am not Mexican. I have friends who are Mexican who hate this music. I know Mexican musicians who would rather die than ever even listen to norteño music. But I have been in the "Latin" sections of the big chain stores on the weekends and seen these families, watching first-generation families shop. The kids and moms are interested in Enrique Iglesias and Jennifer Peña and Paulina Rubio and Inspector, and they dig lots of other kinds of music -- from Morrissey to Linkin Park, from Jay-Z to Madonna -- but the dads in cowboy hats always gravitate towards the norteño acts.

There is a lot to be said for the wisdom of this.

— 22 November 2004

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 14, 2005, 14:10:

I shortened it--thank god! Anyway....like I said.....they are famous --- the world over.

Grupo Nich in their prime.....never could attract or sell as much music as Los Tigres del Norte/

In fact, Tigre, Fruko, and Joe Arroyllo togeether could never match the popularity of this group

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Tinto (Moderator) says on Jan 14, 2005, 14:14:

Be careful, ColX might accuse you of being a self-loathing Colombian. ;-)

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juanalejo says on Jan 14, 2005, 14:58:

well I guess I am "out" Sorry Mr Gomez, I do promise to try to find them and listen to them and see what they are all about. But you probably are aware I do travel a lot, except maybe to the US in the last few years, but I have never even heard of them or any of the others.

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ColombianoX says on Jan 14, 2005, 15:06:

Apparently Gomezman thinks that just because millions of illegal mexican immigrants in the US like this group, we colombians and other latinos are "supposed" to know or even care about who they are.

If this group is so popular then how come they are almost totally unknown in South America? Do you think people in Puerto Rico, Panama, or the Dominican Republic would rather attend a Tigres del Norte concert instead of a Grupo Niche, Fruko, or Joe Arroyo concert? Of course not! Gomezman, you obviously have been living around mexicans for too long. I live in south Florida and that norteño music gets no airplay at all around here (thank God)! Like I said before, stop watching so much Univision, and remember that latin america is a LOT more than just Mexico and it's mediocrity.


ColombianoX

'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

ColombianoX 'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

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ReinaDeLa Baile says on Jan 14, 2005, 16:06:

Good article - thanks! I used to hate Los Tigres, could nnbot unhderstand just WHAT all the fuss was about. After reading the above article (TYVM!) my bleeding heart liberal a$$ is thinking of even buying an album. It appeals to the cultural anthropologist in me. (That is also how I rationalize dating latinos young enough to be my son.) TATA for now. off to get my Cherry Red pedicure.

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 14, 2005, 16:24:

Sorry ColombianoX Sadly to say, you sir are dead wrong....You might want to read the ABOVE article again, and then read the anouncement below about Los Tigre coming to Colombia. Obviously you have not....they are one of the most famous Spanish speaking groups/artists in the world. And, they regularly have concerts in Argentina, Chile, and get ready for this......
COLOMBIA----check this out::::

Colombia espera a Los Tigres del Norte

por: Agencia
Fuente: NOTIMEX

Los Tigres del Norte llevarán su música a Colombia, donde en un concierto muy esperado por el público y organizadores, interpretarán sus grandes éxitos

BOGOTÁ, Colombia, nov. 26, 2004.- El grupo mexicano Los Tigres del Norte, creadores de los éxitos "La puerta negra" y "La banda del carro rojo", ofrecerán dos conciertos en Colombia en la segunda semana de diciembre, informaron hoy los organizadores.
La exitosa agrupación mexicana, encabezada por Jorge Hernández, llegará a este país sudamericano para ofrecer una primera presentación el 10 de diciembre en la ciudad de Bucaramanga, al nororiente de esta capital.

La segunda actuación de los intérpretes de "La reina del sur" y "Contrabando y traición" tendrá lugar en la capital colombiana el 11 de diciembre, indicó la emisora Radio Recuerdos, organizadora de las presentaciones.

ColombianoX.....you contrubute a lot here, but you should check your anti-Mexican sentiments at the door. They are, and always will be the dominant Latino force in the United States. And you sir, me as well, are benefiting from the their lobbying the state legislatures, and the Congress for a greater voice in this country.

For example, a few months ago, the Governor of Illinois signed into law, a bill passed by the general assembly, that prohibits employers from taking any punitive actions against employees for speaking any language in the workplace other than English. And who do you think is responsible for getting that law passed?? A few Colombians? A few extra Puerto Ricans? Try Mexican Americans. State by state, in all the state legislaures, and governors, and city councils, and the congress from which group comes the single largest latino group of elected officials?? I think you now know the answer...in case you were unaware of the answer before.

So that's my response to your misinformation about the popularity of Los Tigres, and the influence that the Mexican American population in this country. You should thank God that they are here in the US allowing Latinos like you and me to appreciate our culture, and our language.

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ColombianoX says on Jan 14, 2005, 16:53:

"They are, and always will be the dominant Latino force in the United States."

That might be true for the nation as a whole and where you live, but they are very far from being the "dominant Latino force" in my neck of the woods! I actually think the cuban-americans have made greater inroads in US politics than the mexican-americans in much lesser time. The cubans now dominate Miami politics and are also a growing force in congress, whereas the mexican-americans couldn't even elect one of their own as mayor of Los Angeles, a city where they make up almost half of the population, how emabarrassing!

As for "thanking them for allowing us to appreciate our culture and language", notice how almost all the cuban-american politicans are completely bilingual, but the mexican-americans politicians' lack of spanish proficiency shows just how much they "appreciate our language". Just look at the new attorney general, Alberto Gonzales, another typical mexican coconut (brown on the outside, white on the inside).


ColombianoX

ColombianoX 'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

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Lionheart says on Jan 14, 2005, 17:19:

another racist First we had racist comments about blacks in Miami, now we have racist comments from Miami about other fellow Latinos.

I have very often heard very rude comments about Mexicans, Central Americans, Cubans, Dominicans from other Latin American countries. It makes me wonder what the unwritten thoughts are about gringos and gringas.

Can we please be more respectfull and drop racist comments?

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 14, 2005, 19:14:

ColombinoX enough already ! Lionheart you are correct The Cuban American community ?-- You are honestly comparing them with the Mexican community? Are you serious? You really don't know what you are saying...I am a lawyer in the Latino American Bar Association, a member of MALDEF, and the Chicago Latino bar Association and serve on the committee of Hispanic Affairs of the American Bar Association. Give me credit for being --- just a little more knowelegeble than you regarding which Latino group has the most influence.

At the same time, I did not know that Miami was representative of the interests of the Latino community in this country. There are hardly even represented in the above mentioned bar associations--which are the Latino communitie's ---most influential voice in this country.

Lastly, I'm on the same page of as Lionheart, I am not intersted in hearing your anti Mexican comments that you spew so often. You should be ashamed of yourself. We as Colombian Americans face all kinds of anti Colombian stereotypes all the tme. You only make matters worse with your horrbible and pathetic anti Mexican comments.
In doing so, you not only discredit yourself, but yo discredit the Colombian community as well.

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ColombianoX says on Jan 14, 2005, 19:49:

Gomezman,

So just because I don't like los Tigres del Norte, I'm anti-mexican all of a sudden? Don't be ridiculous. I'm not anti anything, I'm just PRO COLOMBIAN, period.

Now you say you're a lawyer? Didn't you say before you were an accountant? Make up your mind!

CX

ColombianoX 'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

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ColombianoX says on Jan 14, 2005, 20:06:

"You only make matters worse with your horrbible and pathetic anti Mexican comments.
In doing so, you not only discredit yourself, but yo discredit the Colombian community as well."

You talk about "discrediting the colombian community" when your initial posts on this board were nothing but anti-colombian drivel? Talk about hypocrisy! You sir sure are one heck of a "credit to our community", adamantly telling everyone and their mother to avoid our country at all costs and to visit any other place but Colombia. Now tell me, who should be ashamed?

ColombianoX

'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

ColombianoX 'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

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Lionheart says on Jan 14, 2005, 20:41:

cx you don't even read what other people write, you are so self-absorbed with your Colombia obsession that you have lost all control about what you write about non-Colombian issues. And you don't even live in Colombia. Stop putting other people down and stop making racist remarks - look in the mirror and give yourself an honest answer of who you are to be able redicule others.

You are not the defender of Colombia, you are the shame of Colombia.

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 14, 2005, 21:08:

colX you are something else..lionheart-what's with this guy? Attorney and CPA----by the way. That's lawyer and accountant.
By the way, and your education???? and profession?
You must have forgotten.

And, you will not challenge me to go back and find the anti Mexican threads you contributed....stop now before I make a fool out of you.
Shall I start with the one you made against Univsion when you claimed ............do you remember?????

Lionheart....is right and every knows how you are so self absorbed with defending Colombia, (which is not MY motherland) you can't seem to think reasonably in any other context. Lionheart sees you for what you are and so have others. Don't you think it's time you might do a little self examination as opposed to running around taking personal pot shots at people?

As to Colombia, while I and my family are from there and I have warm sentiments as to our Colombian heritage, I don't lie about her sad state,and I will continue to warn unsuspecting travelers of the need to avoid Colombia UNLESS it is clear to me that they only will venture into areas that are safe (large cities and no where else) and make sure that they are accompanied by people familiar with the areas withing the cities that an unsuspecting traveler may venture. What's better? A person like you and can't seem to understand what the concept of danger is.

Like GIB and Lionheart said, you don;t even live there. If it's really your motherland, why don't you go back to mommy?

Anyway, you will get the last word, because I know your going to fire back, but I will not waste my words.

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ColombianoX says on Jan 14, 2005, 21:15:

Lionheart,

I don't know the reason for your aggressive attitude towards me since I've never had any altercations with you, but it's disappointing. When have I ever attacked you? I certaintly read what others write and what I told Gomezman about his debut on this board is true. If you want, you can go and check for yourself! And it is you who should look in the mirror and ask yourself why you are attacking another poster who has never offended you.

And what does my place of residence have to do with anything? What's your point? The great majority of people who participate in this board don't live in Colombia!


ColombianoX

ColombianoX 'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

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ColombianoX says on Jan 14, 2005, 21:28:

"And, you will not challenge me to go back and find the anti Mexican threads you contributed....stop now before I make a fool out of you.
Shall I start with the one you made against Univsion when you claimed ............do you remember?????"

Gomez,

You'd be making a fool out of both of us, because as I remember, we were both in total agreement about Univision's negatively biased reporting on Colombia. Does that make us both anti-mexican? Give me a break! Careful Gomezman, you might be kicked out of those latino bar associations for that!

If I am "self-absorbed" about Colombia, what business is that of yours? What do you care about how I feel about Colombia? If my defending Colombia bothers you so much, then the answer is simple, don't read my posts!!

Oh, and I do plan on moving to Colombia in the near future.


ColombianoX

ColombianoX 'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 14, 2005, 21:35:

Bon Voyage ! Tenga buen viaje

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ColombianoX says on Jan 14, 2005, 21:42:

Look Gomezman, I don't like fighting with my fellow colombians, I am a proponent of colombian unity and I hope we can resolve this quarrel. It's getting late here so this will be my last message tonight. I hope we can put this behind us. Good night.

CX

ColombianoX 'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

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Gomezman5 says on Jan 14, 2005, 21:57:

I agree !!! Our hearts are in the right place.....We have fought and we're both men...so we make up fast. No grudges!!!

God Bless and Good Night!

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Mr. Hollywood says on Jan 15, 2005, 08:25:

ColombianoX Hey, ColombianoX, not trying to pick a fight but your comments about Mexico's "mediocrity" and millions of "illegal immigrants" in the US sure struck me as anti-Mexican, as well.

I notice a lot of anti-Mexican sentiments here in Colombia and I'm not sure what is behind it. If anyone actually had a axe to grind about one of the countries harming the other, I think there'd be a better arguement for Mexico hating Colombia (and the US) for all the damage the cocaine industry has done there. Yet, in my personal experience, Mexicans have little bad to say about most of their fellow latin American countries.

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ColombianoX says on Jan 15, 2005, 09:08:

Mr. Hollywood,

You must have never visited Univision.com and seen how much "love" they have towards "their fellow latin american countries". I've never seen so much hatred towards colombians and other non-mexican latinos as I've seen on that website.


CX

ColombianoX 'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

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juanalejo says on Jan 15, 2005, 09:51:

My grain of salt I definitelly do not agree what so ever with any racist remarks I have seen on this thread, while I lived in the US I had lots of friends from all over Latinamerica and we hanged out together all the time. Same happens in most places I travel, we Latinamericans tend to stick together regardless of nationality with maybe the exception of Brazilians but that has to do with language. On the other hand I do tend to notice that a lot of the commentaries of Mr Gomez and a few others are completely far fetched as they seem to me as a compilation of Univision, Telemundo and the US State Department. I live in Colombia, travel around a lot due to my job, both within Colombia and abroad, and most of the warnings posted here are completely out of any real context in today´s Colombia, even far fetched for Colombia in 1999. I have always got the impression that American media tends to portray the US as the center of the world, and what happens in the US is therefore to bea way the world follows. I beg to differ as it seems that if there is a country that has isolated itself culturally is the US and although many of the US culture has been exported the US keeps to itself ignoring the tendencies of the rest of the world. The more I have travelled the world the more I realize that while most of the world is looking more at each other, the US only recieves what is catered to them as they have no interest in looking beyond that. I assited to a meeting about tourism movements in the world, and while the US-rest of the world relation is expected to hardly grow, the intraregional between the rest of the world will grow at double digit percentage wise. That only says the US needs to look into the world, because day by day the world is looking less into the US. And to prove the point in Los Tigres del Norte, they may sell as much as you want, but the truth is I have never ever heard of them and I travel a lot around the world on a permanent basis. They may give concerts in many places, but most people do not talk about them.

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ColombianoX says on Jan 15, 2005, 10:34:

Thank you, Tinto! What scares me is that white americans who have seen this channel might think that this is representaive of all latin americans, which is very far from the truth. If you have DirecTV, check out Caracol International on channel 417.

CX

ColombianoX 'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

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caslug says on Jan 15, 2005, 12:43:

COLX u may be right aout univision, but.. it's not correct to based your views of one particular culture(ie, Mexican) from what you seen on Unvision TV or website. That's like some saying that American is wacky because of Fox News! Fox/Univision are businesses, sure there are some viewers that buy into what ever they say, but there's are alot more that don't just watch Univision/Fox for ALL their info. You don't like when people generalize bad things about COL from a few reports or sensational stories, BUT you're doing the same thing.

BTW, u can love something/someone(COL) W/O putting another down(Mexico). I like COL, but i don't say,"i like COL BECAUSE it is better than Mexico", Mexico has nothing to do with my likes or dislike about COL.

Middle American DO NOT think that Univision is representive of latin america, I would suspect that MOST non-latino americans don't even bother to watch latino station regularly, BECAUSE we CANT understand the langauge. So if non-latinos think that latinos are mexicans, that's because mexicans make up most the latinos population in the US. Mexico is the ONLY latin country that can WALK into the US, not go by boat or plane.

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ColombianoX says on Jan 15, 2005, 12:56:

caslug,

I agree with everything you said. Thanks for your post.

Saludes,

CX

ColombianoX 'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

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Mr. Hollywood says on Jan 15, 2005, 12:59:

About Univision accidentally posted twice. Please see below

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Mr. Hollywood says on Jan 15, 2005, 13:01:

I can't really help you if your decisions about whether you like or dislike a culture is based on TV. But by the way, Univision is a US, not Mexican, company and its CEO and majority owner Jerry Perenchio is not a latino, doesn't speak Spanish and lives on the beach in Malibu, California.

If you're gonna pick on Mexico, at least do it for something that belongs to them.

Here's the corporate statement from Univision:

Univision Communications Inc. ("Univision") is the leading Spanish-language media company in the United States.  Our powerhouse portfolio includes Television, Radio, Music and Internet offerings that entertain and inform more Hispanics each day than any other media company in the country.   Our television operations include the Univision Network, TeleFutura Network, Galavisión and Univision and TeleFutura Television Groups.  Univision also owns and operates Univision Radio, Univision Music Group and Univision Online.  Univision holds a 50% interest in Mexico-based Disa Records, a company specializing in regional Mexican music, a 50% interest in TuTv, a joint venture formed to broadcast Televisa's pay television channels in the U.S., and a non-voting minority interest in Entravision Communications Corporation, a public Spanish-language media company.  Headquartered in Los Angeles, California, Univision was incorporated in Delaware in 1992 and its stock is traded on the New York Stock Exchange (UVN).  In February 2001, Univision's stock was included in the S&P 500 index.

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