"Colombia: the Genocidal Democracy"

juancegomez says on Mar 11, 2008, 13:47:

Several things to comment on here, beyond the details of individual cases which I am in no position to consider (much less investigate or verify), outside of their obvious barbarity and the emotions they should certainly provoke:

-Drug-related violence, as a general concept, shouldn't be restricted to the violence directly related to drug lords and traffickers in the context of their illegal business, but should also include other actions, many of them possibly classified as common crime, that are executed by their hit men and related gangs, drug-financed paramilitaries, or even by guerrillas who have financed themselves through the taxation of drug income. In other words, the drug trade served as a kind of violence multiplier, in several directions. Several books have discussed the subject in greater detail.

-That being the case, I think Father Giraldo considerably underestimates the effects of drugs on the conflict and on common crime, ostensibly because he wants to focus on crimes committed by state agents and paramilitaries and the strategy he finds behinds it all, which IMHO he too easily considers to be a mere case of paramilitary "auxiliaries" (part of them are or have been, no doubt, but that's not the entire equation), even if that means misrepresenting how the drug trade can affect or has affected Colombian society and the subsequent intensification of violence.

-On a similar note, I've noticed the absence of a description or even a clear acknowledgment of the increased guerrilla activities, including extortion, kidnappings and recruitment that preceded the rise in paramilitarism and several of the other mentioned abuses, during the 1980's. That's not a justification (it cannot even be), but it's part of the explanation and shouldn't be tossed aside so easily. The brutality of the UP assassinations and massacres also needs to be placed in that context.

-While making this comparison is unfair because it's anachronistic, I find that Gustavo Duncan has provided a better analysis of paramilitary behavior and development. It doesn't deny the state's or the military's role, but it doesn't stop there.

-Father Giraldo wrote this book around the early to mid 1990s, from what I can see. That being the case, some of his comments and opinions about certain circumstances and elements, including some judicial procedures, are outdated...whether that is for better or for worse.

-I find that his comments on impunity are somewhat narrowminded, considering that it extends to other areas that have nothing to do with opposition or human rights work. If those were the only situations suffering from impunity, his arguments would make more sense on a general scale. Since that's not the case...I find them to be incomplete.

-"Democra-tatorship", or taking everything else into account, the concepts of "genocide" or a "genocidal democracy" don't really successfully apply to the situation as a whole when one considers other aspects not mentioned by Father Giraldo or by Chomsky, other than as a partial characterization of a subset of events (and even then, for example in the case of the UP, the characterization of its being a genocide may apparently make common sense, but not necessarily in terms of international law).

-The existence of state crimes is undeniable, as is that of specific strategies serving the same. But I don't believe that everything can be explained through that model and its extrapolations, so to speak.

Desideria (Moderator) says on Mar 11, 2008, 14:04:

Thank you Juance, for the analysis. I just got this via e-mail and have not read the whole file myself, only scanned it and even if it looked a little outdated I thought it might provide some historical reference and background information in English for our non-Spanish speaking readers who are interested in the civil right issues in Colombia.

This is also the first time I read criticism directed towards the '91 Constitution.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

poco says on Mar 11, 2008, 14:42:

Quote: I just got this via e-mail and have not read the whole file myself, only scanned it and even if it looked a little outdated I thought it might provide some historical reference and background information in English for our non-Spanish speaking readers who are interested in the civil right issues in Colombia.

As an historical reference it's OK but many references were pre 1990. The article was written in 1994.

Anyway,, thank you JuanG for the review comments. I really don't see where you get the time.

I could be wrong and haven't looked this up but I believe that many (all?) of the Union Members (and maybe others) have had special police / military protection for what, two or three years? I'm not sure what this means,, if anything, but there is some effort towards reducting violations on the national level.

"Violence is the first refuge of the incompetent" - Isaac Asimov

billyb says on Mar 11, 2008, 14:44:

Something a bit more up to date:


eltiempo.com / internacional / euycanada

Derechos humanos han avanzado en Colombia y se han deteriorado en Cuba y Venezuela: E.U.

El informe anual del Departamento de Estado de E.U. también critica la corrupción en Rusia, la violencia sectaria en Irak, la opresión en Irán y la represión de las libertades en Corea del Norte.

Sin desconocer que persisten problemas, el Departamento de Estado de E.U. presentó hoy una visión mucho más favorable sobre la situación de los derechos humanos en Colombia y el compromiso del Gobierno por defenderlos.

De hecho, es quizá la evaluación más benigna que recibe el país en la última década.

"Aunque aún persisten serios problemas, el respeto del Gobierno por los DD.HH. continuó mejorando, hecho particularmente evidente por los progresos en la implementación de la Ley de Justicia y Paz", dice en su introducción el reporte anual que prepara el departamento de Estado sobre la situación de los derechos humanos en el mundo, y que en esta ocasión dedica 49 páginas a la situación colombiana.

Según el informe, "los pasos tomados por el Gobierno colombiano para mejorar la seguridad y los DD.HH. generaron resultados demostrables".

Y luego cita estadísticas oficiales que dan cuenta de una reducción del 34 por ciento en el número de masacres y del 29 por ciento frente al secuestro.

De acuerdo con el texto, la Ley de Justicia y Paz ayudó a clarificar más de 3.000 crímenes y permitió la exhumación de 1.196 cadáveres ubicados en fosas comunes.

Menciona, también, como las investigaciones de la Corte Suprema de Justicia y la Fiscalía permitieron implicar a 52 políticos y 11 gobernadores con grupos paramilitares y que la mayoría de ellos se encontraba en la cárcel a finales del año pasado.

El reporte insiste en que la impunidad y la intimidación de jueces sigue siendo un serio problema pero destaca como, a diferencia del año 2006, no se presentaron asesinatos o exilios de funcionarios de la rama judicial.

Destaca, a su vez, progresos en algunos casos de alto relieve como las masacres de la Gabarra o el bombardeo de Santo Domingo, por los cuales se condenó a miembros de la Fuerza Pública.

Pese a los avances, el reporte estadounidense mostró especial preocupación por dos tendencias concretas: el resurgimiento de grupos criminales -que identifica como paramilitares que nunca se desmovilizaron o que abandonaron el proceso de paz- y el denuncio de aumentos en las ejecuciones extrajudiciales que se atribuyen al Estado.

De acuerdo con el informe, pese a no tener ni el alcance ni la logística que alguna vez tuvieron las Autodefensas Unidas de Colombia (AUC), los grupos perpetraron numerosos crímenes, entre ellos, asesinatos, secuestros y, especialmente, narcotráfico.

Según el Departamento de Estado, algunos miembros de las fuerzas de seguridad terminaron "colaborando o tolerando a estos nuevos grupos" e incluso "podrían haber participado directamente en sus atrocidades".

Algunas investigaciones sugieren -dice E.U.- que existen pactos tácitos de no-agresión entre estos grupos y militares en el este de Antioquia, Choco, Meta y Nariño. "La impunidad frente a este personal, sigue siendo un problema", dice el informe.

El reporte cita estadísticas del Centro de Investigación y Educación Popular (CINEP) en las cuales se reportan 128 asesinatos extrajudiciales atribuibles a la fuerza pública en los primeros seis meses del 2007. Un incremento, dice, frente a los 92 del 2006.

También menciona 170 investigaciones activas desde el 2001 por asesinatos extrajudiciales de las cuales solo seis se resolvieron el año pasado con la condena de ocho militares y un policía.

Dice, a su vez, que la mayoría de los casos compromete a las Brigadas Móviles XII y XV donde se investiga a seis coroneles, siete mayores y 15 capitanes.

El Departamento de Estado da crédito a reportes del CINEP y la Oficina de Derechos Humanos de la ONU según los cuales miembros del Ejército habían asesinado a civiles para luego hacerlos pasar como guerrilleros muertos en combate.

Y cita varios casos, entre ellos, el de "Fidelino Mahecha, cuyo carro fue detenido por la Xll Brigada Móvil en Vista Hermosa, Meta, y luego asesinado. El Ejército lo reportó como un guerrillero muerto en un operativo y no se realizó investigación posterior".

El 'dossier' de crímenes atribuidos a las Farc y al Eln en el reporte es muy extenso. Asesinatos, torturas, reclutamiento de menores, uso de minas antipersonales y secuestros, entre muchos otros.

De acuerdo con el documento, que usa estadísticas de Fondelibertad, las guerrillas secuestraron a 149 personas en el 2007 (Farc 121 y Eln, 28).

Las Farc, en particular, "siguieron usando a muchos de sus secuestrados como peones", para obtener ganancias políticas del Gobierno de cara a un eventual intercambio humanitario.

Dice, además, que durante el 2007 continuó el declive de las Farc y recuerda ques, sumados, más de 4.500 guerilleros desertaron o se desmovilizaron a lo largo del año pasado.

China salió de la lista negra

Entre los países de América Latina, el informe destacó que Cuba permanece bajo "control totalitario" con el gobierno de Raúl Castro, y denuncia que el régimen cubano perpetra "numerosas y serias" violaciones de los derechos humanos de sus ciudadanos, incluido "el derecho a cambiar de Gobierno".

En Venezuela, una "vigorosa resistencia" impidió que el presidente Hugo Chávez, elegido democráticamente, intentara minar las instituciones democráticas e intimidar a la sociedad civil, según el análisis.

Chávez intentó consolidar su poder y debilitar las instituciones democráticas, los medios de comunicación independientes, y la sociedad civil, además de que propuso infructuosamente cambios constitucionales que le hubieran permitido extender el mandato presidencial, señaló el estudio.

Los esfuerzos del gobierno de Caracas suscitaron violentas manifestaciones, tanto a favor como en contra de esas reformas, pero, finalmente, esas reformas fueron rechazadas por estrecho margen durante un referendo en diciembre pasado, destacó el informe gubernamental.

En cuanto a Haití, destaca que el país no realizó elecciones en el Senado pese a que en el 2006 sí realizó tres rondas de elecciones para la Presidencia y el Parlamento.

El Departamento de Estado también criticó severamente la situación en Rusia, en particular la centralización del poder del Ejecutivo, la corrupción y la forma "selectiva" en la que el Gobierno hace cumplir las leyes.

El informe destacó asimismo el acoso hacia las organizaciones no gubernamentales, las restricciones a los grupos de oposición y a los medios de comunicación y la falta de resolución de varios asesinatos de periodistas, entre otros casos.

Estados Unidos sacó a China de su lista de los países que más violan de los derechos humanos, pero incluyó en ella a Siria, Uzbekistán y Sudán, según su informe anual sobre el tema..

El reporte afirma que China, que organizará los Juegos Olímpicos de este año en Pekín, fue eliminada de la lista negra en la que se encuentran Corea del Norte, Birmania e Irán. Sin embargo, no suministra razón alguna para la eliminación de China -un socio clave de Washington en las negociaciones para la desnuclearización de Corea del Norte- de la lista de los violadores sistemáticos de los derechos humanos.

El documento subraya, no obstante, que el balance del régimen chino en el 2007 siguió siendo "malo", y da cuenta de casos de tortura y de controles abusivos de la natalidad, aunque asegura que el Gobierno realizó "varias reformas importantes", entre ellas el análisis por el Parlamento chino de algunos aspectos de la legislación sobre la pena de muerte.

"El gobierno continuó vigilando, acosando, deteniendo y encarcelando a periodistas, escritores, activistas y abogados, así como a sus familias, quienes en su mayoría sólo buscaban ejercer sus derechos previstos en la ley", agrega.

China, que figuraba el año pasado y en el 2005 en la lista de "los violadores sistemáticos de los derechos humanos", es incluida ahora en la de "países autoritarios en plena reforma económica, que experimentaron rápidos cambios sociales pero no realizaron reformas políticas y continúan negando a sus ciudadanos los derechos humanos y las libertades fundamentales básicas".

En esta segunda lista se incluyen además Venezuela, Nigeria, Tailandia, Kenia y Egipto.

Sobre Irak, el análisis reconoció que, pese al establecimiento de un marco legal y constitucional para el respeto de los derechos humanos, la violencia sectaria y étnica, sumada a la débil gestión del Gobierno, han dado pie a una extendida violación de los derechos humanos y un alto número de refugiados y desplazados internos.

De Irán, el informe dijo que el régimen de Teherán violó los derechos de la libertad de expresión, e incrementó la represión de disidentes, periodistas y activistas laborales y defensores de los derechos de la mujer en ese país.

Las fuerzas del orden recurrieron a arrestos arbitrarios, la tortura, el secuestro, el uso excesivo de la fuerza y la privación del derecho a un juicio, en contra de los detractores del Gobierno, según el Departamento de Estado.

Por otra parte, el análisis destacó el papel de organismos regionales como la Organización de Estados Americanos (OEA) en la defensa de los derechos humanos y el fortalecimiento institucional para hacer cumplir esos derechos.

En concreto, el informe señaló que la OEA puso en marcha, en el 2007, una red de un centenar de expertos en asuntos legales, jurídicos y electorales, así como en la reforma de la participación cívica.

A juicio del Gobierno de E.U., esa red "ayudará a los Gobiernos elegidos en la región a responder a los retos de gobernabilidad democrática" en la zona.

SERGIO GÓMEZ MASERI*
Corresponsal de EL TIEMPO
Washington

*Con AFP

buggy says on Mar 11, 2008, 14:55:

"El informe anual del Departamento de Estado de E.U"
Jajaja, they are experts (Guantanamo, Iraq, ...).

"Artículo 20 de la Constitución Política. Se garantiza a toda persona la libertad de expresar y difundir su pensamiento y opiniones,...No habrá censura."

billyb says on Mar 11, 2008, 14:57:

Algeria, Vietnam, Haiti, Devil's Island, Africa.....

buggy says on Mar 11, 2008, 14:59:

Taken from the Amnesty International Report 2007

Serious human rights abuses remained at high levels, especially in rural areas, despite continued reductions in certain types of violence associated with Colombia's long-running internal armed conflict, in particular kidnappings and killings. All parties to the conflict - the security forces and army-backed paramilitaries as well as guerrilla groups, mainly the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (Fuerzas Armadas Revolucionarias de Colombia, FARC) and the smaller National Liberation Army (Ejército de Liberación Nacional, ELN) - continued to abuse human rights and breach international humanitarian law. They were responsible for war crimes and crimes against humanity. There was a fall in the number of people newly displaced by the conflict, but the large number of displaced people remained a concern. There were further attacks on trade unionists and human rights defenders, mainly by paramilitary groups. Extrajudicial executions by members of the security forces, and selective killings of civilians and kidnappings by guerrilla forces continued to be reported.
Background

President �lvaro Uribe Vélez won a second term of office in elections held in May. Congressional elections were held in March, with President Uribe's allies winning a majority of seats in both houses.

Speculation that the government and the FARC were about to agree an exchange of FARC prisoners for hostages held by the guerrilla group were dashed after President Uribe blamed the FARC for detonating an explosive device on 19 October inside the Nueva Granada Military University in Bogotá; at least 20 people were injured in the blast. The ELN and government representatives held a fourth round of preliminary peace talks in October in Cuba.

By the end of the year, the government reported that more than 30,000 paramilitaries had laid down their arms in a controversial government-sponsored demobilization process. In July, the Constitutional Court ruled that key parts of the Justice and Peace Law - designed to regulate the demobilization process and criticized by human rights organizations - were unconstitutional. In September, the government issued a decree to implement the Justice and Peace Law. Although it had been amended in the light of some of the criticisms levelled by the Court, concerns remained that the Law would exacerbate impunity and deny victims their right to truth, justice and reparation. Despite the supposed demobilization, there was strong evidence that paramilitary groups continued to operate and to commit human rights violations with the acquiescence of or in collusion with the security forces. In November, three legislators were arrested for their alleged links to paramilitaries. Several other legislators and political figures were also reportedly under investigation by the Supreme Court of Justice at the end of the year.
Abuses by paramilitary groups continue despite supposed demobilization

The Organization of American States Mission to Support the Peace Process in Colombia published a report in August. This stated that some demobilized paramilitaries had regrouped as criminal gangs, that others had failed to demobilize, and that new paramilitary groups had emerged. Paramilitaries continued to commit human rights violations in areas where they had supposedly demobilized. More than 3,000 killings and enforced disappearances of civilians were attributed to paramilitary groups since they declared a "ceasefire" in 2002.

• On 11 February, demobilized paramilitaries belonging to the Bloque Noroccidente allegedly killed six peasant farmers in Sabanalarga Municipality, Antioquia Department.
Application of the Justice and Peace Law

In September the government promulgated Decree 3391 which revived some of the more controversial elements of the Justice and Peace Law.

Of particular concern was the inclusion of "rural reinsertion" programmes by which the government will finance agro-industrial projects which bring together peasant farmers, displaced people and demobilized paramilitaries. This could result in peasant and displaced communities working alongside those who forced them off their lands and committed human rights violations against them and lead to the legalization of ownership of lands taken by paramilitaries by force. Decree 3391 also failed to adopt measures that would identify and bring to justice third parties, including members of the security forces and politicians, who have supported paramilitary groups, both logistically and financially.

The Justice and Peace Law, which still failed to meet international standards on truth, justice and reparation, was to be applied only to around 2,600 of the more than 30,000 paramilitaries who had reportedly demobilized. The vast majority of paramilitaries had benefited from de facto amnesties under Decree 128 of 2003. On 6 December, the paramilitaries announced they were withdrawing from the "peace process". This followed the government's decision, taken on 1 December, to transfer 59 supposedly demobilized paramilitary leaders from low-security accommodation in a former holiday camp in La Ceja, Antioquia Department, to the high-security prison of Itagüí in the same Department. The government claimed that the paramilitaries had ordered several killings from La Ceja. On 19 December, Salvatore Mancuso became the first high-ranking leader of the paramilitaries to testify before the Office of the Attorney General's Justice and Peace Unit. The Unit was set up under the Justice and Peace Law to investigate human rights abuses committed by those wishing to qualify for the procedural benefits granted by the Law.
Collusion between paramilitaries and state officials

Scandals involving links between paramilitaries and high-ranking members of state institutions threatened to further undermine confidence in the rule of law.

• In November, the Office of the Procurator General accused the former director of the Civilian Intelligence Department (Departamento de Administración de Seguridad, DAS) of having links with paramilitary groups. The allegations stemmed from claims, published in the media in April by another DAS official, that the DAS had provided a list of 24 trade union leaders to the paramilitary group Bloque Norte. Several individuals named on the list were killed, others were threatened, while some were reportedly the subject of arbitrary judicial proceedings.

• On 9 November, the Supreme Court of Justice ordered the arrest of three congressmen from Sucre Department, �lvaro García Romero, Jairo Merlano and Erik Morris Taboada, for their alleged links to paramilitary groups and, in the case of �lvaro García Romero, for allegedly ordering the massacre by paramilitaries of some 15 peasant farmers in Macayepo, Bolívar Department in 2000. Later in the month the Supreme Court ordered that a further six congressmen answer charges over their alleged links to paramilitary groups.

Press reports in November suggested that the Office of the Attorney General was reviewing more than 100 cases of alleged collusion between paramilitaries and state officials, including political figures, members of the public and judicial administration, and the security forces. In November, the Office of the Procurator General also announced the creation of a special unit to investigate alleged links between public employees and paramilitaries.

Paramilitary groups continued to commit human rights violations in collusion with, or with the acquiescence of, members of the security forces.

• On 4 February, community leader Alirio Sepúlveda Jaimes was killed close to a police station in Saravena Municipality, Arauca Department. The gunman, thought to be a paramilitary, was reportedly linked to the local army battalion. Alirio Sepúlveda was one of around 40 social and human rights activists detained by the authorities in Saravena in 2002.
Exhumations of mass graves

More than 80 mass graves were found containing the remains of some 200 people killed by paramilitary groups over the course of the conflict. The Justice and Peace Unit claimed the remains of some 3,000 victims of enforced disappearance were still to be located, although this was thought to be a substantial underestimate. Concerns were raised that some of the exhumations may have been undertaken in a manner which jeopardized forensic evidence and that remains in official custody were being stored in precarious conditions. There were also concerns regarding the lack of positive identification of remains and appropriate forensic analysis of the evidence. Paramilitaries had reportedly removed remains from some mass graves.
Impunity

Impunity remained a serious problem, and the military justice system continued to deal with human rights cases involving military personnel despite the 1997 ruling of the Constitutional Court that such cases must be investigated by the civilian justice system. However, some cases were transferred to the civilian justice system. Among them was the killing by soldiers of 10 members of the judicial police (the DIJIN), together with a police informer and a civilian, in Jamundí, Valle del Cauca Department, on 22 May. The Office of the Attorney General charged 15 members of the army for their alleged role in the killings, which were reported to have been carried out at the behest of drug traffickers with links to paramilitary groups. Judicial investigators involved in the case were reportedly threatened.

The Inter-American Court of Human Rights issued rulings on emblematic cases of impunity involving massacres carried out by paramilitary groups allegedly with the collusion or acquiescence of the security forces. These included the Pueblo Bello massacre of 1990 in which 43 civilians were killed or forcibly disappeared, and the La Granja and El Aro massacres of 1996 and 1997, in which 19 people were killed. In both cases, the Court held the Colombian state partly responsible and ordered it to make reparations to the victims and their families.
The security forces

There were continued allegations of extrajudicial executions carried out by the security forces.

• On 19 September, army soldiers reportedly killed community and labour activist Alejandro Uribe Chacón in Morales Municipality, Bolívar Department.

• On 14 April, peasant farmer Adrián Cárdenas Marín was reportedly detained by army troops in Argelia Municipality, Antioquia Department. On 15 April, the army reported that Adrián Cárdenas had been killed in combat a short distance from the town of Argelia.

A number of human rights cases involving the army received national media coverage.

• On 25 January, 21 soldiers were reportedly tortured, including sexually, by their superiors in an initiation ceremony at a military training facility in Piedras, Tolima Department. The case was being investigated by the civilian justice system at the end of the year.

• The Office of the Procurator General began an investigation into the alleged role of army personnel in a number of bomb plots in Bogotá in July and August, including a car bomb which killed one civilian and injured 19 soldiers on 31 July and which the authorities had attributed to the FARC.

The security forces, including the Mobile Anti-Riot Squad (Escuadrón Móvil Anti-Disturbios, ESMAD), were alleged to have used excessive force during mass demonstrations by peasant farmers and Afro-descendant and Indigenous protesters on 15 and 16 May in Cauca and Nariño Departments. At least one demonstrator died and 50 were injured, including several members of the security forces and a 12-year-old child.

• On 8 March, ESMAD agents reportedly injured several students at the National University in Bogotá when they dispersed a student demonstration. During the demonstration students threw stones at police.

One student, Oscar Leonardo Salas, reportedly died on 9 March after sustaining head injuries from a projectile allegedly fired by the ESMAD.
Guerrilla groups

The FARC and ELN continued to commit serious and repeated breaches of international humanitarian law, including hostage-taking and the killing of civilians.

• On 9 October, the bodies were found of four peasant farmers who had been kidnapped by the ELN in Fortul Municipality, Arauca Department. Between March and August, the FARC and ELN allegedly killed more than 20 civilians in Arauca Department.

• On 27 February, FARC guerrillas allegedly killed eight municipal councillors in Rivera Municipality, Huila Department, while they were attending a council meeting.

• On 25 February, the FARC allegedly attacked a bus in Caquetá Department in which at least nine civilians were killed, including two children.

The FARC also allegedly carried out disproportionate and indiscriminate attacks which resulted in the deaths of numerous civilians.

• On 6 March, an attack using explosive devices killed three civilians, including a 76-year-old woman and an eight-year-old boy in San Vicente del Caguán Municipality, Caquetá Department. The government attributed the attack to the FARC.

The FARC and ELN continued to forcibly recruit minors and landmines placed by guerrilla groups continued to kill and maim civilians.

• On 2 August, landmines, allegedly placed by the FARC, killed six civilians working on a government coca eradication programme and five police officers, in La Macarena Municipality, Meta Department.
Trade unionists, human rights defenders and other activists

Human rights, social and community activists continued to be targeted, mainly by paramilitary groups and the security forces, but also by guerrilla groups. More than 70 trade union members were killed in 2006.

• In September, the FARC allegedly tortured and killed Fabián Trellez Moreno, a community leader and legal representative of the Boca de Bebará Local Community Council in Medio Atrato Municipality, Chocó Department.

• In May, in the run-up to the presidential elections, trade unionists, left-wing party activists, human rights and peace non-governmental organizations (NGOs) and university students and staff received e-mail death threats, reportedly from groups claiming to be new paramilitary structures.

• On 2 January, the body of trade unionist Carlos Arciniegas Niño was discovered in Puerto Wilches Municipality, Santander Department. He had been missing since 30 December 2005. His body reportedly showed signs of torture. The killing was attributed to the paramilitary Bloque Central Bolívar (BCB). On

31 August, the BCB allegedly sent a written death threat to the CUT trade union confederation (Central Unitaria de Trabajadores) in Bucaramanga, Santander Department, despite the fact that the BCB had supposedly demobilized by 1 March.
Civilian communities at risk

Afro-descendant, Indigenous and peasant farmer communities, as well as civilians living in areas of intense military conflict, continued to be at particular risk of attack by all parties to the conflict. More than 770 civilians were killed or forcibly disappeared during the first half of the year. More than 219,000 people were forcibly displaced in 2006, compared with 310,000 in 2005. More than 45 members of Indigenous communities were killed in the first half of 2006.

• On 9 August, unknown gunmen killed five members of the A'wa Indigenous community in Barbacoas Municipality, Nariño Department.

• On 5 and 6 March, the FARC allegedly killed Juan Ramírez Villamizar, the former Indigenous governor of the resguardo (reservation) of Makaguán de Caño Claro, Arauca Department, and his wife Luz Miriam Farías, a schoolteacher in the resguardo's school.

Members of "peace communities" and "humanitarian zones", and of other communities which continued to publicly assert their right not to be drawn into the conflict, were threatened and killed.

• On 16 August, paramilitaries reportedly approached inhabitants of the Curvaradó River Basin area of Chocó Department, and informed them that paramilitaries were planning to kill Enrique Petro, a member of the Afro-descendant Curvaradó Humanitarian Zone. In March, members of the armed forces had reportedly accused Enrique Petro of being linked with guerrillas. The paramilitaries also stated that they were preparing to kill other members of the Curvaradó Humanitarian Zone.

• The body of Nelly Johana Durango, a member of the Peace Community of San José de Apartadó, Antioquia Department, was identified on 15 March by a family member in Tierra Alta, Córdoba Department. Witnesses claimed that she had been taken from her home by the army on 4 March. The army claimed she was a guerrilla killed in combat. More than 160 peace community members have been killed since 1997, mostly by paramilitary groups and the security forces, but also by guerrilla groups.
Kidnappings

Kidnappings continued to fall, from 800 in 2005 to 687 in 2006. Guerrilla groups, mainly the FARC, were responsible for most conflict-related kidnappings, accounting for some 200 kidnappings. Ten were attributed to paramilitary groups and 267 to common criminals. About 200 kidnappings could not be attributed.

• On 26 June in Antioquia Department, the FARC allegedly kidnapped Camilo Mejía Restrepo, his wife Rosario Restrepo, their son and a nephew. In their efforts to flee from the authorities, the kidnappers were alleged to have killed Camilo Mejía and injured the nephew.

• On 7 June, the ELN allegedly kidnapped Javier Francisco Castro in Yondó Municipality, Antioquia Department. The ELN reportedly accused him of having links with the security forces. No information was received by the end of the year as to whether he had been released.

• On 27 April, armed men killed Liliana Gaviria Trujillo, sister of former President César Gaviria Trujillo, and her bodyguard, Fernando Vélez Rengifo, in Dosquebradas, Risaralda Department, in what appeared to be a botched kidnap attempt. The authorities claimed the kidnapping was ordered by the FARC.
Violence against women

Combatants continued to kill, sexually abuse, kidnap and threaten women and girls.

• On 22 October, 10 army soldiers allegedly entered the home of a woman in Puerto Lleras Municipality, Meta Department. Subsequently, four of the soldiers reportedly raped her in front of her three-year-old son. The woman was reportedly threatened after she reported the rape to the authorities.

• On 9 April, a guerrilla member allegedly raped a woman in Fortul Municipality, Arauca Department.

• On 21 March, paramilitaries reportedly raped and killed Yamile Agudelo Peñaloza of the Popular Women's Organization (Organización Femenina Popular), in Barrancabermeja, Santander Department. Her body was found the next day.
US military aid

In 2006, US assistance to Colombia amounted to an estimated US$728 million, approximately 80 per cent of which was military and police assistance. In June, the US Congress put a hold on US$29 million because of concerns with the US administration's failure to consult adequately with Congress regarding the certification process. Under the certification process, 25 per cent of aid is dependent on progress by the Colombian government and state authorities on certain human rights indicators. Despite Congress' decision, the funds were released by the State Department. However, the State Department subsequently agreed to meet with the Congress and representatives of the US human rights community to discuss concerns about the certification consultation process and recommendations for improving it. Some US$17 million went to support the demobilization process with some US$5 million going to the Justice and Peace Unit. Human rights conditions for the release of such funding were maintained.
Office of the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights

Despite reported efforts by the Colombian government to weaken the mandate of the Office in Colombia of the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights (UNHCHR), especially in relation to its monitoring role, the government and the UNHCHR announced in September that the full mandate would be extended for a further 12 months. The latest report on Colombia of the UNHCHR, published in January, urged the government to implement UN human rights recommendations and to adopt the long-promised national human rights action plan and increase protection for human rights defenders. It called on the parties to the conflict to respect the right to life and to refrain from indiscriminate attacks, kidnappings, recruitment of child soldiers, and sexual violence. The report also recommended that legislation on the demobilization of members of illegal armed groups be made consistent with human rights principles including the right of victims to truth, justice and reparation. The High Commissioner presented the report to the second regular session of the UN Human Rights Council on 28 September.
AI country visits/reports
Reports

• Colombia: Reporting, campaigning and serving without fear - The rights of journalists, election candidates and elected officials (AI Index: AMR 23/001/2006)

• Colombia: Open letter to the presidential candidates (AI Index: AMR 23/013/2006)

• Colombia: Fear and intimidation - The dangers of human rights work (AI Index: AMR 23/033/2006)
Visits

AI delegates visited the country in February, March and October.

"Artículo 20 de la Constitución Política. Se garantiza a toda persona la libertad de expresar y difundir su pensamiento y opiniones,...No habrá censura."

bopenyan says on Mar 11, 2008, 17:55:

Looks like the El Tiempo reporter was summarizing the DOS Human Rights Report 2007 that was released a day or two ago.

CatGirl says on Mar 11, 2008, 19:24:

Desi: Interesting paper...some historial perspectives from an author.

But on the Topic of Human Rights..I actually was assigned to do a lecture as a college class project years back titled BASIC HUMAN RIGHTS vs THE DARWINIAN THEORY

When a person with a conscience that possesses the ability to feel empathy reads stories such as these - (horrific acts of unnecessarily violence upon another person)

After shuddering...you might ask "How could anyone do that to another person?" Infact, there are some people that might think they would chose death before even doing such a thing....Or would they? You simply don't know, what you don't know..
What are humans capable of?

Studies have been done to test this idea out....one such classical study was the Milgram study
Experiments in which individuals obeyed instructions to administer what they thought were severe electric shocks to their peers. If you are not familar with this study (old and taught in bone head Psych classes) here are the Wikipedia definitions (to make it simple)
Both English and Spanish versions

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milgram_experiment

http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Experimento_de_Milgram

There was another Fairly famous and classic study in human behavior by Dr Zumbardo
called the Stanford Prison Experiment. Where he asked "can good people become bad when placed in a bad environment?" His findings were (although a small sample size) that "Yes" the Prison Guards can become the Innmates

He deemed this the "Lucifer Effect"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_Zimbardo

http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_Zimbardo

Sad...but true. Sometimes the only difference between the Inmates and the Guards are the Keys to the Gates. No different than the distrust that can occur between the people and it's govt.
But then again....another question based on the "Lucifer Effect" - is the Govt an extension of the people?
Only a thought..

ooops! ....Did I say that?

capt_j says on Mar 11, 2008, 20:10:

Puke. "Interested in civil rights in Colombia" = "hopes to see a Marxist-Leninist dictatorship established." The Catholic Church, the original totalitarian organization, is hardly in a position to criticize anyone over anything. And there *is* a difference between the guards and the inmates- the inmates committed serious crimes, for which they were tried and convicted, which is why they are confined, and the guards are there to keep them from hurting others.

CatGirl says on Mar 11, 2008, 20:26:

Really? Have you ever been incarcerated? Do you know someone close to you that has?...You are funny, jjaja

Are you borrowing your parent's computer? tisk, tisk

ooops! ....Did I say that?

Rubito says on Mar 11, 2008, 22:02:

Looks to me like they are using a WAY harsher yardstick to judge Colombia than any other country in the hemisphere. Can't say that I'm surprised either.

---Violence is the price of freedom.---

CatGirl says on Mar 11, 2008, 22:13:

Rubito: Well....after reading it, I was aware it was one person's perspective of another's writings. It did point out the issue of Human Rights and the people not feeling comfortable or trusting to go to the "Authorities". Even if only 50% of the information in that peice is true....I could understand why people would not go to the authorites - when they had been tricked over and over again.

You see this idea posted all over the site. Distrust in authorities, corruption, terror etc...

It also touched a bit on history....I am sure it could not be 100% accurate, not even history books are. But many countries in the world have this type of "history"
I kept that in perspective when I read it. Pretty gory stories though - ick - made me sick
If anything, maybe this could be considered the "Pheonix Flying from the Ashes" in regards to Colombia....

Yes, and Desi did pick quite an alarming title for the post..

ooops! ....Did I say that?

Rubito says on Mar 11, 2008, 22:29:

I'm just as distrustful of USA authorities or Canadian ones as I am of Colombian ones.

---Violence is the price of freedom.---

CatGirl says on Mar 11, 2008, 22:34:

Yes.....same issues - just packaged and advertised differently

People, when given power, unfortunately have a tendency to abuse it. Especially when they think they can get away with it
Please note I said "tendency" - not applicable to all

ooops! ....Did I say that?

Desideria (Moderator) says on Mar 11, 2008, 22:40:

http://www.intellnet.org/resources/american_terrorism/ColombiaGenocide...
That's the name of Father Giraldo's book.
I didn't invent it.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

CatGirl says on Mar 11, 2008, 22:41:

Good morning Desi!

Whew!...OK - cleared that one up really quick. I know, quite a title.

ooops! ....Did I say that?

Desideria (Moderator) says on Mar 11, 2008, 22:45:

Good morning, CatGirl.
Gotta run now....we've got a time machine booked today...back to the 18th century peasant community in Sweden.

Cheers,
Des

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

CatGirl says on Mar 11, 2008, 23:10:

What? Is this like a Renaissance Fair para Sweden?

ooops! ....Did I say that?

Monpirri says on Mar 12, 2008, 05:50:

"Colombia: the Genocidal Democracy" it's indeed, a title with sinister purposes.

Annette Taddeo for US Congress 2008

billyb says on Mar 12, 2008, 07:00:

Monpi, it seems the anti-Colombia left is still alive and kicking.

Monpirri says on Mar 12, 2008, 07:09:

I hear ya!

Annette Taddeo for US Congress 2008

Desideria (Moderator) says on Mar 12, 2008, 08:51:

CatGirl, it's work-related.

"anti-Colombia left is still alive and kicking."
If you meant me that's slander. Neither anti-Colombia nor left. Besides, I believe Father Giraldo is very much Colombian and loves Colombia....I have no idea of his political affiliation.

Besides, who are you to say that people who are not in love with the arrogant little paisa or don't agree with the para pals of the oligarchy are ANTI Colombian? I would have to say it's pretty much the opposite: people who worry about the human rights issues in Colombia, who work for negotiated peace, humanitarian exchange are the people who are most PRO Colombia, because they risk their lives and reputations trying to make Colombia abetter place, a better society for ALL Colombians.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

billyb says on Mar 12, 2008, 09:44:

I just find it interesting that you say you didn't read the whole article, but seemed to like the title enough to use it as the title for your thread.

CatGirl says on Mar 12, 2008, 10:05:

Desi: "CatGirl, it's work-related"
Clarification....
I did not take your post as your own personal opinion. Maybe something to balance the scales? But I can't assume the intent.With so many posters here that have on their profiles (world travel) we have an opportunity to think "Globally".

The first part of the title clearly draws attention - but if the introduction is read further - it states "Behind the Stereotype" and one authors way of attempting to delve further into this issue, as he states "...Although I think the problem has been somewhat blown out of porportion.......False conclusions..." Only to find that the stereo-typing of Drug Trafficking and Violence to be the result of abuse of power by the minority against the majority.
As I interpreted it...
It gives some perspective of the results this type of abuse Locally/Internally (as some go outside their country and inflict horrific acts against human rights) can have on a generation of people raised in an environment of fear and abuse of power.
Much of this history is fairly recent. How long did it take Victims of the Holocaust to speak up? Addtionally, I can see where this might be considered offensive, as far as I know German Natives are or were particularly sensitive to the Stereotyping.

Again, I am sure there are different interpretations of what this is all about. I think the title of the peice (meant to grab attention) created a salt to the wound response?
I might have titled it "Behind the Sterotype" - But then again...what do I know.

ooops! ....Did I say that?

Simon says on Mar 12, 2008, 10:23:

"who are you to say that people who are not in love with the arrogant little paisa"


Why is he arrogant? Because he refuses to hand over half of Colombia to the narco-terrorists?

If you ask me, it's the FARC who are arrogant by acting as if they owned the people they kidnap.

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

poco says on Mar 12, 2008, 10:51:

The Colombian situation prior to 1994 (many in the 1980') as described in the referenced document shows an enormous improvement.

In particular, gains made since Uribe implemented the current policies toward terrorists.

This is the latest,, ie: TODAYS report from the U.S. Department of state.

Quote:

From Near Failing State to Strategic Partner

Eight years ago, Colombia was a near failing state. Violence was rampant, citizens were fleeing the country, and economic activity was plummeting. Since then, the United States and Colombia have worked together to combat violence and instability.

http://www.state.gov/r/pa/scp/2008/99858.htm

"Violence is the first refuge of the incompetent" - Isaac Asimov

Desideria (Moderator) says on Mar 12, 2008, 13:45:

Billy, I read more than just the title. I read enough to see that it provided a short-term historical perspective and much needed information about an issue that has not received enough attention or rather has received more attention out of Colombia than inside it due to "the hallelujah we have our saviour-mentality" that obstructs the sound judgment of so many Colombians I know. I can understand that a nation tired of so much violence, insecurity, blood-letting and social turmoi needs desperately a Messiah; it's just Uribe's second term has been much worse than his first, and he may not be the answer, the miracle that Colombian have been waiting for.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

cali373 says on Mar 12, 2008, 14:05:

I dont know if I would call it Genocidal but violent at the hand of the state and illegal armed groups , YES.

Smile if you are a thinker!

billyb says on Mar 12, 2008, 14:13:

Not only has his second term been better than his first (maybe not for the FARC sympathizers and their foreign supporters), but his third will be even better than his second.

Desideria (Moderator) says on Mar 12, 2008, 14:27:

His international reputation has never been worse. He's made Colombia into a rogue state with practically no friends except the US.You can stop that BS implying that people who don't support Uribe are FARC symphatizers.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

DodgerDogs says on Mar 12, 2008, 14:35:

Colombia does not need Uribe for a 3rd term , there is only so much land he can steal.
www.signonsandiego.com/news/world/20070127-1020-colombia-landgrab.html

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.Martin Luther King:

Monpirri says on Mar 12, 2008, 14:38:

Desi, would you share with us another educational farc video? We would like to learn more about the dental program.

Annette Taddeo for US Congress 2008

Simon says on Mar 12, 2008, 14:41:

Uribe's made Colombia into a rogue state? Silly me, and all along I thought it was the FARC who ravage villages, traffic tons of cocaine, and kidnap hundreds of people!

BTW, where do I sign for Uribe to get a third term?

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

Desideria (Moderator) says on Mar 12, 2008, 14:42:

We? Who's we? Monpirri and Mac?

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

SiV says on Mar 12, 2008, 14:43:

Unfortunately, Billy Bob's primary counter to people who question his views is attacking and slurring them with being guerrilla supporters. I don't know if such monochromatic perception is genuine, or its simply a divisive tactic for his arguments. Either way, it stinks and it verges on being slanderous.

An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind. Mahatma Gandhi

Monpirri says on Mar 12, 2008, 14:43:

Oh shit, don't tell you are the traffic cop now, lol

Annette Taddeo for US Congress 2008

Monpirri says on Mar 12, 2008, 14:45:

We the people from co.blog

Annette Taddeo for US Congress 2008

dwr says on Mar 12, 2008, 14:58:

"His international reputation has never been worse. He's made Colombia into a rogue state with practically no friends except the US."

Once again, the left speaks up. Fair and Balanced! When is the last time you were in Colombia Desideria? This is a very different country from when I arrived here 20 years ago and I don't believe the European Union has had much of a hand in the improved security in this country.

billyb says on Mar 12, 2008, 15:22:

Who cares about his international reputation, all that matters are what Colombians think of him. We already know how useless the "international community" is when it comes to Colombia. And who hates Uribe? Well let's see, for starters we have those three FARC supporting dogs, Chavez, Correa and Ortega, not to mention those other SA leaders that Chavez has bought and has in his pocket like Fernandez. If those are the "international leaders" who despice Uribe, then he must be doing a hell of a job. Desi, I know you have been somewhat despondent lately and are in mourning over a couple of recent deaths, but the overwhelming majority of Colombians have never been happier, and in the end that is all that counts. SIV, quit whining about slander all the time. Have your cyber persona sue my cyber persona.

CatGirl says on Mar 12, 2008, 16:47:

Wooah!...Maybe I need to retract...reboot and defrag....my last comment. Looks like there are some undercurrents of historical Cyber dynamics that I unknowingly stepped in.
I am newer here....it feels like there's more behind this discussion than the posting itself.

Scuze' me whilst I step outside and scrape off my boots......

ooops! ....Did I say that?

SiV says on Mar 12, 2008, 18:15:

Play nicely then, and quit the Little Hitler tactics, Billy Bob.

An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind. Mahatma Gandhi

billyb says on Mar 12, 2008, 18:31:

Have I ever accused you of being a FARC supporter SIV? I made a generic statement about FARC supporters and their foreign sympathizers. And I have not mentioned anybody by name, but if you and Desi feel that it describes you, then it what can I say?

DodgerDogs says on Mar 12, 2008, 18:37:

Billy Bob ????

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.Martin Luther King:

SiV says on Mar 12, 2008, 18:37:

I don't feel it describes me, thankyou (though I think you may well have aimed it in my general direction in the past), I just dislike the tactic.

Now let's get over these tiresome asides, and keep to the topic, why don't we?

An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind. Mahatma Gandhi

romy says on Mar 12, 2008, 18:38:

Simon, it's also Uribe's buddies that ravage villages and traffic tons of cocaine.
dwr, sure the country has changed. Now the rich can travel freely throughout (most) of the country while there are now more poor and they are even more miserable.
billyb, make a coherent post without resorting to insult and you might be taken seriously.

billyb says on Mar 12, 2008, 18:57:

Jajaja, good one DD. Romy, your suggestion presupposes that I care whether the likes of you take me seriously, but that aside, can you show us documentation that there is more poverty now? And ANNCOL is no accepted as valid source. And while you are at it, can you name and show documentation of a para being Uribe's buddy? You can't, you say? How do you expect anybody to take you seriously?

romy says on Mar 12, 2008, 19:20:

1. http://ipsnews.net/news.asp?idnews=35118
2. http://www.democracynow.org/2006/6/1/colombia_re_elects_bush_ally_alva...

btw, did you not know it was Uribe's dad that started the paramilitaries? someone with such a limited scope at the issues should be careful of what he says. Then again that's assuming you actually care about your intellectual integrity.

DodgerDogs says on Mar 12, 2008, 19:28:

If Uribe is guilty of Para crimes( which I believe he has commited) . Then time will tell, but tell
he is tried and convicted , he is still the President of Colombia , and you have to respect that.

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.Martin Luther King:

romy says on Mar 12, 2008, 19:31:

dodgerdogs, I'm not sure why I 'have to'?

Simon says on Mar 12, 2008, 19:32:

romy,

Do you also think Raul Reyes was a "good revolutionary"?

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

romy says on Mar 12, 2008, 19:33:

no

DodgerDogs says on Mar 12, 2008, 19:37:

Romy, If your in Colombia it is always better to respect than offend.
People have their reason's on both sides to hate or like Uribe, but till his term expires he is
the top dog in Colombia.

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.Martin Luther King:

Monpirri says on Mar 12, 2008, 19:38:

Thanks to the present Government Colombia is safer today that it was in 2003

Annette Taddeo for US Congress 2008

romy says on Mar 12, 2008, 19:43:

dodger, I think you have a point. I might not like the man but he's the president of my country and that merits some respect.

Simon says on Mar 12, 2008, 19:43:

Yeah Monpirri, kidnappings have only decreased by 75% since 2002, but some people miss the good old days.

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

DodgerDogs says on Mar 12, 2008, 19:48:

I remember 2 different times being road blocked by Farc, and one time we all got left in our
underwear between Bosconia and Plato in the rain.

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.Martin Luther King:

SiV says on Mar 12, 2008, 20:26:

Yeah Simon, last year there were over 2,000 new internally displaced people (desplazados), but we're not one of them, so who cares!

An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind. Mahatma Gandhi

Simon says on Mar 12, 2008, 20:42:

Oh, and Uribe displaced them?

And I thought it was those "good revolutionaries" from the FARC.

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

poco says on Mar 12, 2008, 21:22:

Romy Quote: btw, did you not know it was Uribe's dad that started the paramilitaries? someone with such a limited scope at the issues should be careful of what he says. Then again that's assuming you actually care about your intellectual integrity.

I read the links hoping to improve my intellectual integrity. It was a disappointment there was no information about Uribes father starting the Paramilitary. The links were slightly old and the first link about poverty in Colombia has been a topic of discussion on quite a few occasions.

All was not a waste because the June 1. 2006 link had this to say:
http://www.democracynow.org/2006/6/1/colombia_re_elects_bush_ally_alva...

The other very general myth that’s been very successful is that the guerrillas have been defeated, that the guerillas have been set back, have been pushed back in their war against the state. And the fact of the matter is, and I point this out in my book—and, you know, I’m not the only one who said it, but it’s nice to say “I told you so�—but basically the guerrillas have been kind of, not in retreat, but they’ve been kind of chilling out, if you will, kind of staying back and waiting and watching this unfold, and carrying out direct military attacks, not carrying out the kind of sweeping attacks that they were doing before Uribe, but kind of standing by and waiting to see what happens.

Humm,, standing around to see what happens? In light of events over the last two years I don’t think I’ll be buying the book.

History looks to be your strong point so just were can I get up to speed on Uribes father founding of the paramilitary?

"Violence is the first refuge of the incompetent" - Isaac Asimov

romy says on Mar 12, 2008, 21:43:

Poco, the links were strictly in response to billyb's request. Sorry I couldn't read your mind and couldn't provide you with links for the material you were interested in. Now I'm not saying Alberto deserves all the credit because the entire oligarchy is responsible, but who do you suspect created the paramilitaries? hey, I'm willing to learn if you are willing to teach.

poco says on Mar 12, 2008, 21:54:

romy Quote: but who do you suspect created the paramilitaries?

Based on your input it was Uribe's Father. If true then please back up your claim with some data.

"Violence is the first refuge of the incompetent" - Isaac Asimov

Rubito says on Mar 12, 2008, 22:06:

I strongly suspect Uribe's involvment with the paras too, but it's a new era now, and the more extreme side of him is nicely kept in check by the other branches of the Colombian state.

Billy makes an excellent point: why would Colombia give a rat's ass what Europe thinks of them? Europe is gonna look down their noses at them no matter WHAT happens.

Even if nobody on the planet could deny that Chavez and Correa were aiding and abetting the FARC (I don't see how anybody could deny it ALREADY anyways), you think any of the Eurofags would come to Colombia's help? HELL NO! They'd sit there and watch and sit on their thumbs. Even if the other countries were the agressors and drew first blood they'd STILL sit there. I don't have much confidence in the US actually helping out either. Colombia's on it's own, which is why they are biding their time and didn't pursue the issue further with the OAS!

This whole "you don't solve problems with violence" line is just stupid silly fucking NONSENSE. Nobody who knows the first thing about Colombia or its history would say such a load of trash! The FARC will ONLY go away by shedding blood at this point. They've had too many opportunities to disarm peacefully.

Will the paras go away without the need for bloodshed? Too early to say, we will find out in a post-Uribe world IMO. But if they don't go peacefully they will need to be taken out the hard way too!

---Violence is the price of freedom.---

Desideria (Moderator) says on Mar 12, 2008, 22:34:

Yes, I've been despondent; I mourn a country and a society and the mental frame of mind that splashes the first page of the major daily with bloody corpses of slain guerrilleros and people celebrate. It has really nothing to do who the slain person is. It's not a political dilemma for me, but a moral one. I resent the interpretation BillyB is throwing at me that I'm a guerrilla symphatizer and mourn the death of a couple bad-ass fighters. It goes much, much deeper than that, but I guess it's worthless trying to explain it.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

Rubito says on Mar 12, 2008, 22:43:

I don't get how you could feel anything but joy that that piece of garbage is dead either. Sorry.

I never had an erection looking at a photo of a corpse before I saw that! I guess I'm gonna fit right in in Colombia :P

---Violence is the price of freedom.---

Desideria (Moderator) says on Mar 12, 2008, 22:54:

As I said, I'm wasting my time trying to explain my point.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

romy says on Mar 12, 2008, 23:00:

Poco, Alberto was one of the bigger cattleranchers, these guys were explicitly tied to the creation of paramilitaries. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paramilitarism_in_Colombia
But if you have contradicting information please let me know.

DodgerDogs says on Mar 12, 2008, 23:08:

www.semana.com/wf_InfoArticulo.aspx?idArt=102213

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.Martin Luther King:

DodgerDogs says on Mar 12, 2008, 23:41:

document.write(''); Read this doc on Scribd: Quién es ÿlvaro Uribe Vélez (presidente de Colombia) var scribd_doc = new scribd.Document(25621, 'clcwp9v1622r9'); scribd_doc.write('embedded_flash_25621_bp42n');

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.Martin Luther King:

poco says on Mar 12, 2008, 23:55:

Quote: Poco, Alberto was one of the bigger cattleranchers, these guys were explicitly tied to the creation of paramilitaries.

Did you read the article?
Quote: The decree was later developed into the Law 48 of 1968, which allowed the creation of self-defense militias by private citizens for the purposes of protecting their properties and lives, an activity which was thus recognized as a right, and was therefore eligible to receive aid and guidance from the Defense Ministry and the Colombian Military.
------------------------------------------

It's a big leap to assume a cattle rancher "invented" the para's.

I'm still waiting on an answer about your specific statement: "it was Uribe's dad that started the paramilitaries"

"Violence is the first refuge of the incompetent" - Isaac Asimov

poco says on Mar 12, 2008, 23:59:

Quote: Will the paras go away without the need for bloodshed?

Never, there will be bloodshed.

The only hope Colombia has is formation of a political alliance and concentrate on the sum of the pieces instead of the fragmentation as now prevails.

No FARC = Less liberal political power/money.
No Paras = Less conservative power/money.

Mafia = sum of the two when they are eliminated which would result in increased and continual turf battles. Oh,, I forgot gangs.

"Violence is the first refuge of the incompetent" - Isaac Asimov

DodgerDogs says on Mar 13, 2008, 00:00:

The original Paramilltaries were used to defend against the Rebel groups.
I hold no one to blame for trying to protect their land

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.Martin Luther King:

Aaron21 says on Mar 13, 2008, 00:02:

John F. Kennedy funded the first Colombian paramilitary - maybe he did not come up with the idea, but he (and the US) can be blamed for their creation. If you sympathize with either the paramilitary troops or their red counterparts then you are an extremist who will probably never realize that you have no ground on which to stand. Good luck!

DodgerDogs says on Mar 13, 2008, 00:09:

The pinkertons in the old west used paramiltary forces

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.Martin Luther King:

poco says on Mar 13, 2008, 00:11:

Quote: John F. Kennedy funded the first Colombian paramilitary

You mean it wasn't Uribe's father?

Thanks, I've been suffering from a reading deficit lately and the help is appreciated.

Quote:
Part of the earliest history of paramilitarism in Colombia goes back to the 1960s, when U.S. President John F. Kennedy and his government promoted a proxy war under regional security initiatives such as Plan LASO (Latin American Security Operation), ostensibly to counter the possible extension of Soviet influence in the region at the hands of guerrilla insurgents and local Communist Parties.

Oh, oh,, it still could have been Uribes father that invented them !!!!

"Violence is the first refuge of the incompetent" - Isaac Asimov

Aaron21 says on Mar 13, 2008, 00:15:

Classic.

poco says on Mar 13, 2008, 00:31:

There is this:

Quote: -----------------------
The Magdalena Medio region is rich in oil and minerals, as well as fertile land coveted by drug traffickers and ranchers. It is also the home of the powerful Unión Sindical Obrera (USO) trade union.

It was in that region that the first paramilitary group emerged in 1983, organised by members of the army. At that time, the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC), which took up arms in 1964, financed itself by kidnapping landowners and their family members, and charging farmers - even small farmers - "taxes".

I'm suspicious,, where do they mention Uribes father? Frankly, I don't think this is near Medellin? Maybe he travelled,,, but,, but,, OH MY GOSH,, he was killed during a recruitment trip and was setup by the UNIONS !!!!

"Violence is the first refuge of the incompetent" - Isaac Asimov

SiV says on Mar 13, 2008, 06:51:

Simon, most desplazados are a result of paramilitary activites to obtain land.

Billyb, I imagine the EU is important to Colombia as it is a large donator of international cooperation (much more so than the US in terms of social projects) and for trade.

An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind. Mahatma Gandhi

Monpirri says on Mar 13, 2008, 07:08:

So the guerrilleros are the only holy enterprise?

Annette Taddeo for US Congress 2008

billyb says on Mar 13, 2008, 07:08:

Getting back to Desi's comment about Uribe not having friends in the hood, well the OAS has concluded that Reyes' camp i Ecuador was a permanent camp, and that backs up the compters and means one of those "friends" (Correa) is an enemy of Colombia.. Are those the friends you are talking about Desi?

billyb says on Mar 13, 2008, 07:48:

Romy, ignoring the fact that the figures in the article you link are 3 years old and the fact that Colombia's economy has grown (compounded) close to 20% in that time (but hey, we don't expect you to understand basic economic principles), it doesn't state anywhere that poverty has grown, instead it basically states (and this is a shocker to anybody that's been there) that Colombia has poverty and that that poverty might be greater than classified, depending on what method you use to calculate it, but that would apply to previous years also. Nice attempt to cover up you lack of facts with nonsense, or maybe you just have trouble comprehending simple logic.

juancegomez says on Mar 13, 2008, 10:55:

If anything, Uribe's father apparently or allegedly had ties to drug trafficking, according to accusations and circumstantial details at least...but that's not quite equal to claiming he "started" paramilitarism or what have you.

Too many things get mixed up and you end up with such ridiculous claims.

billyb:

"Not only has his second term been better than his first (maybe not for the FARC sympathizers and their foreign supporters), but his third will be even better than his second."

One doesn't need to be a FARC sympathizer or "foreign supporter" in order to believe that, while Uribe may have indeed done some good things, his administration is far from ideal, has its own share of mistakes, irresponsibilities or crimes, that make it hard to expect any third term to be an improvement.

Not to mention that, even if Uribe was a perfect ruler on paper, holding too much power for too much time isn't exactly a good thing for democracy, especially without a proper adjustment of the necessary checks and balances. That has certainly NOT happened here.

Uribe isn't the only person who can manage the economy and/or enjoy positive economic circumstances, nor is he the only ruler who would keep up or increase the pressure on FARC.

billyb says on Mar 13, 2008, 11:06:

Juance, nobody is saying that Uribe is perfect (far from it), but he is the best we've had for generations. As i posted on another thread, i'm against more than two terms on principle, but I sense that Uribe has the FARC on the ropes and while this might not mean that they will be completely destroyed, they are being battered so much that if the trend continues, they will be more likely to come to the table and their demands will be more reasonable. This of course assumes that the FARC leadership is not completely delussional and unfortunately, so far, they haven't given much indication that they aren't. But in any case, I think Uribe should have a third term to finish the job. Having someone else in there (specially someone weak) will ruin all the progress that has been made towards gaining the upper hand against these terrorists and the economic and other benefits that have come along with it.

huskie says on Mar 13, 2008, 11:23:

I can't beleive the comments of some posters, and the article about Uribe's father being a big drug trafficer, who wrote that? probably, his enemies. Uribe's family is one of many who have owned land and business forever, they did not steal it from anybody, like many paisas, if you are not informed, are very hard working people and very driven, this is a well known fact by people who were born, who have lived, not for 10 or even 25 years, but for ages, in Colombia...so how is it that people give opinions of something they have no -clue of what they are talking about, yes, paramilitares were born out of people who were protecting what was theirs, land, business etc, at first it seem like a good thing, but unfortunately not everyone had the same ideas as the real protectors, instead, and like everything else in this world, people got greedy and the problems started, and I do not need to tell you what happened after that. Uribe was elected President, things began changing, for the better, like I said before, things do not change in eight years....so who are you say or even imply that things are worse now? Are you blind? don't you read? are you so out of touch of what is really happening? I would like to ask those who think Uribe is so bad for another term as President, WHO would be the next great one? Please feel free to nominate a good candidate other than that " oligarch arrogant little paisa" Who do you think will be Colombia's next saviour? I am serious, no joking will be much appreciated. Just name one person you are sure will do as good or better job than Uribe, who is the best leader you think will be able to handle the little problems Colombia have...
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

CatGirl says on Mar 13, 2008, 12:13:

Hello Boys..was hoping someone might be able to clarify the year this event (the bombing) occured

The Office of the Procurator General began an investigation into the alleged role of army personnel in a number of bomb plots in Bogotá in July and August, including a car bomb which killed one civilian and injured 19 soldiers on 31 July and which the authorities had attributed to the FARC

Much appreciated...

ooops! ....Did I say that?

juancegomez says on Mar 13, 2008, 12:18:

2006.

See here:

http://www.canalcaracol.com/noticia_interna.asp?hid_id_menu=13&hid_id=...

Desideria (Moderator) says on Mar 13, 2008, 12:27:

Huskie, I have not blamed Uribe's father of anything; I don't really think it's relevant in any way what his father did or didn't do; it's just that I have a rather bad impression of Uribe. His pompous and arrogant style just pushes my buttons. There's some really bad chemistry there. I don't believe in the type of leadership he represents; it's too authoritarian, too full of pride, too cocky and he loses his cool way too easily. He comes out scolding other politicians, blaming them for this and that in a rather paternalistic style that is totally anachronic in a modern society.

I can't give you any names of people who could have managed his job as well if not better than him when he first got elected, due to the reason that I do not follow Colombian politics that closely. Right now I have at least a couple of names in my mind who'd do an excellent job as president of Colombia; none of them is weak: Antanas Mockus and Carlos Gaviria. There are probably a couple more good, solid candidates, Juance would know better.

I do not believe neoliberalism, TCL or isolating yourself internationally are policies that favour Colombia at this point in the long run. War certainly doesn't.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

dwr says on Mar 13, 2008, 13:21:

Don't forget Piedad Desideria. She should be on your short list!

billyb says on Mar 13, 2008, 13:23:

Yes, dwr, she would make an excellent president........................
.....................................................................of venezuela;)

Desideria (Moderator) says on Mar 13, 2008, 13:33:

No. because of her double nationality. We could not have a president in Colombia with divided loyalties. She does not have a suitable personality either.

BTW, the candidate does not need to be part of any left-wing political party either. It's enough that he or she would make a good president for ALL Colombians.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

huskie says on Mar 13, 2008, 13:49:

Desi: You got to be kidding me....Mockus? Carlos Gaviria? Do a little research on Gaviria, you might just be a little surprised about his antics, but it is your opinion and I respect that.
BTW I was afraid you were going to mention those two. Regarding Ms Piedad, not in a million years, she has betrayed Colombia, she might just want to run for Venezuela.
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

Desideria (Moderator) says on Mar 13, 2008, 13:57:

I've listened to Gaviria and read quite a bit about him...he has an impeccable reputation. He's an academic, though, and in Colombia people have preferred the enterpreunerial type of leadership. Mockus would provide new, fresh ideas and enough personal charisma.

Ms. Cordoba was never on my list. She's to parrochial and flamboyant to represent and lead ALL Colombians.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." —Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

Mr. Hollywood says on Mar 13, 2008, 13:59:

Desi, how has Uribe turned Colombia into a "rogue state"?

With the exception of the temper tantrums thrown by its immediate neighbors, I sense that Colombia's standing in the larger international community is better than it ever was. I don't notice France or Austria or Great Britain pulling their ambassadors and calling Colombia dirty names, or a "rogue state". And remember, it wasn't that long ago that Colombia's esteemed president Samper was actually denied a US visa because of his criminal connections.

CatGirl says on Mar 13, 2008, 14:10:

JG: Thank you very much....I thought that was the year, but wanted to be 100% sure.

ooops! ....Did I say that?

Simon says on Mar 13, 2008, 15:12:

"His pompous and arrogant style just pushes my buttons."


Are we talking about the same person here? 'Arrogant' means feeling superior to others and I think if there's something that characterizes Uribe, it's his humility, demonstrated his austere methods and by how he always mingles with ordinary Colombians at town hall meetings, always making an effort to listen to them and shaking as many hands as possible.

BTW, Carlos Gaviria would probably have appeased his fellow lefties from the FARC with most of their outrageous demands, and we can't have a pusillanimous president who gives in to terrorist demands.

"You want to talk to God? Let's go see him together, I've got nothing better to do."---Indiana Jones (Raiders of the Lost Ark)

CatGirl says on Mar 13, 2008, 15:30:

This comment has nothing to do with Uribe BTW - I have not met him yet, he posts here on PBH. I am having tea and crumpets with him next week in an undisclosed place, I will let you know my impression of him then...but

It is amazing how fine the line is between how Self Confidence and Arrogance appears.
I always thought arrogance was a "false sense of confidence" - Nothing wrong with Carrying yourself with Confidence (or is there?) . Now Chavez might be a good example of Arrogrant at his best.

ooops! ....Did I say that?

billyb says on Mar 13, 2008, 15:37:

CG, it's simple, if you like the guy it's self-confidence, if you don't, it's arrogance. Chavez is beyond arrogance, his is more of a clownishness.

CatGirl says on Mar 13, 2008, 15:45:

BillyB: You are being so nice...;)) I thought he was a whack job. Maybe I need to go easier on him.

ooops! ....Did I say that?

billyb says on Mar 13, 2008, 15:48:

I don't know, I think a leader would rather come across as arrogant than as a clown.

poco says on Mar 13, 2008, 19:01:

Quote: I don't know, I think a leader would rather come across as arrogant than as clown.

With any luck Colombian could elect a truthful mime.

"Violence is the first refuge of the incompetent"