cali or medelin

utopiacowboy says on Apr 15, 2005, 12:03:

It's all good. Make sure you take some large denomination Euros and paste them to your forehead. Are you looking for a long-term relationship or for some rumberas you can lay?

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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Cessi says on Apr 15, 2005, 12:15:

medellin! You should definetely go to Medellin. It`s a much nicer city and the people are much more frendly, (even though colombians are great everywhere). Medellin is just a much more vibrant city. It has soo much to offer in art, music, culture and the night life is assume. Also the surroundings are great.

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 15, 2005, 12:25:

Cali, of course there's no question about it. medellín is fine, Bogotá is wonderful but none of those cities has the MAGIC that Cali has. The climate is perfect, warm and pleasant during the day, cool and breezy during the night, the Valle with the sugar cane fields and guadua stands framed with the two cordilleras is a restful sight for the sore eyes, the shopping is good, the city vibrates with the easygoing joy de vivre the other cities lack.
The best part of Cali is its people. Beautiful women, handsome men, generosity and hospitality envelopes you in a sphere of warmth and welcome. Once you discover the pulsing, sheer beauty of Cali you'll be hooked, for life.
Cheers,
Desi

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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joser says on Apr 15, 2005, 12:32:

second that I agree with you Desi, just came back and had a great time. I also discovered Cali Viejo, great Restaurant

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utopiacowboy says on Apr 15, 2005, 12:38:

There are a lot more gringos in Cali so if you like to see your own kind, you may be better off there. A lot of the women there are professional students so they have a lot of time on their hands. One of main complaint about Medellin is that everyone is too busy working.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 15, 2005, 12:44:

joser that's my favorite restaurant in Cali. Great empanadas! For people that are so inclined, the restaurant Tierra Mestiza is wonderful. I like to sit there with my friends, listening to live music sipping my cabernet, talking and just relaxing in good company and great music.
Cheers,
Desi

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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Neonovo says on Apr 15, 2005, 13:24:

I vote for Cali... La rumba in Tardes Caleñas was out of this world, in salsa, vallenato, or rock.

Besides, I haven't had an excuse to show off my Cali-pics in a while. (I'm the guy in yellow)

Paz
Neonovo

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Colombian42 says on Apr 15, 2005, 13:38:

Medellin or Cali ? I am from Medellin. paisita ! Medellin is not as hot(temperature) as
Cali is. We have "Metro" the brand new public transportation system.
It Connects an extensive area of the Metropolitan Area of Medellin. It is a very nice ride. You we'll get to see the downtown area from the elevated part of the system. Among others things Medellin has
the nicest people men and women. Another nice ride is to the "Via a las Palmas". It runs along the mountains that is on the east side of the "Aburra Valley". The city has been upgradeting the road system.
There you get to see the entire Valley the views are beautiful.

More to come.....

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platano says on Apr 15, 2005, 13:43:

Neonovo, Thanks for the pics. And the memories... si no hay campo en la pista, entonces en el asiento. This describes years of nights 9 pm to 3 am in the Taberna Latina playing trumpet, piano, congas, etc. with my fingers... on the table top or on my thighs, while seated.... porque aún cuando no hay campo en la pista la rumba sigue... Viva Cali!

One other question. This may have been answered elsewhere but how do you change the colors, make hotlinks, upload photos, etc.

Plátano

plátano

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Colombian42 says on Apr 15, 2005, 13:46:

Medellin 2 thumbs up Cessi. Medellin is absolutely more vibrant...

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 15, 2005, 13:51:

Cali might not impress you on a short stay. Yes, the surroundingd are totally captivating, the horizon to the west with the Farallones de Cali turning misty purple and blue at the nightfall will keep you mesmerized, but under the negligence and bad administration in the past years there's decline and blemishes in the urban setting.
In the long run, it'll captivate you like no other city in Colombia could. It fills you with euphoria and longing when you're away.

Cheers,
Desi
(going back..again and again)

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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kernow62 says on Apr 15, 2005, 13:57:

Neonovo, your cook on Providencia looks like James Brown!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/neonovo/8852560/in/photostream/

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Neonovo says on Apr 15, 2005, 14:30:

I feeeellll gooooooooddddddddddd ! ! ! ! I knew that I would ! ! !

Paz
Neonovo

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dwmte says on Apr 15, 2005, 14:41:

maarit... would that you could show me your cali...for having been there, i never saw what you share.

now, take medello...let me show you the crown jewel of colombia, this is my city, my turf. where the paisa meets the dirt, and heaven touches earth. where the most beautiful merely grace a crown that sits atop the most incredible city on this earth.

come to my city, desi, and you'll NEVER go home. not after i show it to you. i know her from her ankle to her brow, from arm to arm. i know her charms and hidden powers...her deadly sirens and her living promise. she is the fairest and as such, the most desired. there is no place like her on earth.

dw

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Neonovo says on Apr 15, 2005, 14:53:

Cali es Cali, lo demás es loma... ¡Qué viva Cali, Chipichape y Yumbo...
La Cumbre, Viges, Jamundí y Yotoco...!!! (or something similar as best as I can remember)

Paz
Neonovo

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 15, 2005, 15:03:

yet my lovely lady of the valley shaking the morning mists off her slightly tattered gowns, waking up to a new day with the gentle breeze of the Pacific, the slow awakening of a new day in the Sultana del Valle is a an expression of poetry painted on the canvas of life.
Take a morning stroll inthe still slight chill of the early morning, look at the nevados del Tolima and Huila in the eastern horizon, the purpling dawn on the western. The great old ceibas guarding the driveway to your home, the chiminangos shaking a tender new leaf, the guayacanes in bloom littering the sidewalk in purple and yellow, the sounds and the smells of the new, fresh morning in the sucursal del cielo...
The morning filling up with sound and fragrance, the street vendors of aguacate, tierra para las matas, el pais, escobas y trapeadores...the maids and the ladies sweeping the front of the house, the night watchmen making their final rounds, chatting with the womenfolk, the tintos and freshly squeezed orande juices being passed around. Towards the midmorning the escalating heat feels so right, so good!

I've never been to Medellín but this all is so universally Colombian that what you've found in Medellín I've found in Cali and neither of us will ever be free of it

Cheers,
Desi
(maybe we should visit each other's cities this coming summer)

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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dwmte says on Apr 15, 2005, 15:14:

an addiction, dear lady.... i know we share with many...

for, as i know so personally, i have known that body and smelled that ambergris and known those charms, that no charlatan could lay aside and present as nothing. nay, for the truth is that what i have discovered in my colombia, was/is a rebirth on real life. where the moment is the now that never changes and is always everbecoming, the evernew....now.

peace,

dw

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 15, 2005, 15:28:

a funny thought douglas, that just I had was that the OP probably doesn't have the slightest idea what we're talking about...
Cheers,
Desi

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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mabel says on Apr 15, 2005, 16:11:

CALI OR MEDELLIN ARE TWO BEAUTIFUL AND IMPORTANT CITIES IN THE COUNTRY.
MEDELLIN IS IN THE INSIDE PART OC COUNTRY, THIS CITY IS FAMOUS FOR "FERIA DE LAS ROSAS" ON END OF JULY AND BEGINING OF AUGUST, I THINK IS BETTER GO IN THIS TIME TO SEE HOW LIVE PEOPLE AND ALSO YOU CAN SHARE WITH THEM DURING THE "FERIA".
CALI, CITY AT SOUTH IN THE PACIFIC COST. IS THE RUMBERA CITY IN COLOMBIA, YOU CAN LEARN TO DANCE "SALSA".
BOTH CITIES YOU CAN MOVE LIKE YOU DO IN WHATEVER PLACE IN THE WORLD BUT ALWAYS ASK FOR ADVISES ABOUT SITES AND SCHEDULES.
I WORK IN A TRAVEL AGENCY SO IF YOU NEED MORE INFORMATION YOU CAN CONTACT ME TO: mabelro at hotmail.com

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dwmte says on Apr 15, 2005, 17:26:

mabel... please type in lower case...

thank you,

dw

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jacobtafler says on Apr 15, 2005, 17:59:

cali or medelen hello iy is jacob that ask this question thanks alot for all the informtion in the end i will visit this 2 cities for 10 dayes each city is it any other smaler city save and nice like cali and medelin in colombia for stay for 1 month about as i have vaction 60 dayes about sorry for my bad english jacobtafler at colombia.com

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calipro says on Apr 16, 2005, 02:02:

Well that's easy.... Cali is the single guys choice of destinatoins for sure.

I spend almost two months out of the year in Colombia and 95% of my time is spent in Cali and the other 5% of my time is spent in Cartagena, Santa Marta and San Adreas with a caleña.

I have been in every major city in Colombia except for Medellin. I would consider going to Medellin if someone ever showed me a photo (not of buildings) that looked better than what I see in Cali everytime I go.

I personally find the women of Barranquilla a close second to caleñas in beauty and personality. I'm seriously considering putting it on my June itinery and no it didn't have anything to do with Elmo's story about being locked in a room with a 17 year old. hehehe !!

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 16, 2005, 04:10:

there's one slight problem with Cali, however, and that'd be a bunch of middle-aged, pasty gringos with benfranklins glued on their foreheads ogling at young silicone princesses at "Chippy Chappy" Mall at the sunset hour, but since you are a young, good-looking German(?) you should be able to handle the competition.

Cheers,
Desi

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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Gomezman5 says on Apr 16, 2005, 06:43:

Go to Medellin Cali is hot and humid. From a cultural perspective, Cali is nothing special but then again Medellin does not have that much either. After living in a major American city with world class museums of all types, nothing in Colombia impresses me in for that matter.

From a geogrpahical perspective, Cali does not hold a candle to Medellen or any American city. When you land in Rio Negro, (a mcuh more modern airport than Cali's), the view you have riding down the mountain side to the city is of Medellin is breath taking. The horizon is incredibel by day or night...with all the light in the mountains and the view of Medellin which is literally a city in a valley surrounded by mountains. Publito Paisa in Medellin is a must see.

As far as lookinf for the type "natural beauty" that a single man might be looking for, you cannot go wrong in either city. Both cities have their share. On the other hand, the night life and party life is somewhat more active, especially in midweek in Cali. But, trust me, you will find plenty of what you are looking for in Medellin. Also, Paisas are beatuful women, and they come from Medellin. Medellin also has a lot of women from Cali who go there to find more employment opportunities.

Don't under estimate the importance of climate. IF you are going as a tourist, you are going to want to explore and be outside a lot. That being said, there is not anyone on this site than can tell you that 10 or 12 hours in the streets of Medellin, is not much more comfortable than 10-12 hours in the steamy and humid enviornment of Medellin.

On the other hand, since you are touring, Cali is a close and cheap plane ride from Medellin. Since you have 30 days, you should visit there and at least check out Cali.

In closing, I am Colombian American who came from Bogota as a toddler.
Therefore, I have no bias toward either city. Most of the people who have already given you their views favor the cities that they come from, or the city where they have married a person from, so of course they have their own biases. I don't have a connection with either city. These are just my sentiments based on personal knowledge.

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platano says on Apr 16, 2005, 07:00:

Both have things to offer.... I have lived in both cities. I like Medellín better because it is cleaner, more organized, the "paisas" are very special, and disagreeing a bit with G5 Medellin has culture, it just doesn't take the form of large well-maintained museums. There is a thriving popular culture. The weather is unbeatable.

Cali is the hands down winner for night life and if you love salsa... it's Cali. Cali also has certain things Medellin doesn't have, such as the smell of the camias. But I found it less well maintained and the people less unified in terms of civic involvement (though the ciclo-via was great!)

The women are great in both cities. My personal preference is for paisas for their inner beauty and intelligence. (I am not attracted to "lobas caleñas" no matter what their physical shape is, but that's just me)

The heat in Cali was sometimes so much I could not sleep at night. (I didn't have air conditioning) I would get up, pick up a bed sheet, take the sheet into the shower with me, take a shower, then go back to bed covered with a damp bed sheet. Worked every time!

Medellin is the city of perpetual springtime and has no such problems.

Plátano

plátano

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ColombianoX says on Apr 16, 2005, 07:16:

"After living in a major Amer "From a cultural perspective, Cali is nothing special but then again Medellin does not have that much either. After living in a major American city with world class museums of all types, nothing in Colombia impresses me in for that matter."

"In closing, I am Colombian American who came from Bogota as a toddler."

Well, I'm a colombian-(north)american who was actually born in the USA, and I do happen to be very impressed by many things in Colombia from a "cultural perspective".


"From a geogrpahical perspective, Cali does not hold a candle to Medellen or any American city"

Yeah right, I guess all those "mountains" here in Florida or in Chicago are just so much prettier than the Farallones in Cali!

BTW, Gomezman, I thought you loved the Botero museum in Medellin, hahaha!

ColombianoX

'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

ColombianoX 'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

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go2pr says on Apr 16, 2005, 09:25:

I've been liking Medellin enough to have the desire to visit the country, and Cali is on my list, with Manizales, Pereira, Bucamaranga, Barranquilla, and all the colonial cities in-between, but without waiting too much from what I will find.

Yet let's face it, and Gomezman already judiciously said it : what can impresse in Colombia a guy who've travelled the World ?

Culture, surroundings, food, people, life ?

Let's take just South East Asia ..... have the most subjective posters here ever heard of the millenaires and refined Kmers, Javaneses or Thai cultures and of Borobudur, Bagan, Angkor Vat or Sukhothai ...... never saw the rices terrasses of Java, the volcanoes of Sumatra, the beautiful bay of Halong, the always buzzy Mekong Delta, the hills of Mandalay and the deep blue of the Gulf of Siam, of the sea of Andaman or of the detroit of Malacca ..... never degustated a soup Pho on the sidewalks of the buzzy streets of Hanoi, a Tom Yam Kung in a open-air teck restaurant overlooking the fascinating Chao Praya river in Bangkok, a Nasi Goreng in a magnificent Balinese warung in Jakarta or a Laab Dip at sunset in a popular food stand over the Mekong in Vientiane ...... never took a local bajak to go through the streets of Surabaya, a tuk-tuk through Chiang Mai or a cyclo through Dalat, Phnom Penh or Rangoon ..... never experienced the deep and genuine kindness of the Cambodian, Birman, Laosian, Thai or Indonesian people and the stunning exotic beauty of their women .....

World is beautiful .... IMO many posters here need to nuance their views, or to travel a bit. If Asia is too far, just to Brasil maybe, where they'll have 9 millions km2 of culture to discover.

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platano says on Apr 16, 2005, 10:35:

go2pr, The topic was: Medellin or Cali. It is impossible to compare every other place on earth, the limited focus works better. (It is not necessary to describe the smell of fresh cut hay in the midwest USA or the smells of Spanish Harlem in NYC.)

I'm not a big world traveler but I have been to 17 countries between Asia, Europe, and the Americas. And Colombia still impresses.

What I experienced in San Antonio del Chami could not be experienced in India or Germany. Other parts of the world do have wonderful things to experience. In this forum the focus seems to be on Colombia.

Platano, defensor de la Colombianidad :)

plátano

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 16, 2005, 10:44:

nuances and personal experience I haven't been in Asia, but many people I know keep going back there time after time. After you've been living somewhere or visited a place for extensive periods over a longer time you tend to bond with the place. I know I do. I can still admire the beauty and magnificence of great European cathedrals, visit wonderful museums both Europe and US, shop in the greatest department stores and shops in the world capitals, yet love and appreciate that specific spot that you think of as your own. It might not compete in style or richness with the things you've seen elsewhere, it might not be the greatest place you've been, but do you need to live the city or country with the biggest churches, largest museums, best clubs, most beautiful women/men, best shopping, most sunshine in the world to make you happy?
Traveling all around the world is not what makes you or breaks you. Seeing the beauty in simple things, in everyday life is even more important, because bedazzled by too many perceptions you tend to crave more and more, bigger and better, richer and more luxurious things all the time until there's no place, no person, no climate that is good enough for you any longer.

Cheers,
Desi

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 16, 2005, 10:47:

platano, I can't remember ever being that uncomfortable in Cali because of the heat at night. It must've been during one of the hot spells that they sometimes have there. Most of the time the temps drop well below 20 during the night and the mornings can feel a bit chilly.
Cheers,
Desi

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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dwmte says on Apr 16, 2005, 10:53:

the mountains in florida??? are you referencing the florida alps, colomibano. they're incredible, aren't they. all 170 ft high of them.

and of course they shame the beautiful mountains that encompass medellin... i don't know about cali and the farralones (sp) but could they even compare to our florida ranges?

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 16, 2005, 11:02:

Florida ranges aren't they the garbage heaps covered with grass?
When I was living in Florida the thing that I missed most was waking up in the morning with the sight of the Farallones clearing out from their early morning shroud of mists...the flatness was almost painful to look.

Cheers,
Desi

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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go2pr says on Apr 16, 2005, 11:03:

Desideria Good post. Yet I think the beauty of Colombia doesn't lay in its cities, but in its people, this being, you're right, largely enough to make of this country an inviting place to travel and maybe live.

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platano says on Apr 16, 2005, 11:38:

Desi, It could be because I was living in a small one-bedroom apartment near San Fernando and I was on the third floor (heat rises) in an area surrounded by other buildings, so there wasn't any chance at all for the breezes from the Farrallones to reach me. :(

Your post re: nuances, reminded me of how appreciating the everyday miracles and being present to enjoy them is so important.

Platano

plátano

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British Paisa says on Apr 16, 2005, 12:55:

30 days is along time so why not just visit both and make your own mind up!...

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chillwill says on Apr 16, 2005, 13:53:

Single guy in Cali Great thread. This gringo will be heading to Cali in July and I have some follow-up questions related to this thread:

About the Cali nightlife, where is the best place(s) to go? Is there a certain section in town? And, how is the nightlife Sunday - Thursday? Where can I find all these beautiful women you guys have been talking about?

Doing a little Cali Google-ing, I've noticed there are a good handful of introduction/marriage agencies in Cali. What do you all think of them?

Thanks.

- Chill

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 16, 2005, 14:49:

gee wish I wouldn'a know but what I've heard there's this place at Chippe Chappe Mall where you can see good-lookin' caleñas stroll by aroun' six o'clock struttin' their stuff....
Cheers,
Desi
(being very helpful)

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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Gomezman5 says on Apr 16, 2005, 16:03:

Desi.....Hi there..... You must like that heat and humidity in Cali 24/7. Yes it is lower at night, but it's hard to believe a scandinavian like yourself can still live with 78-80 degree with %80 humidity and sleep well without AC.

I remember when I stayed at the one of Cali's oldest and one time most luxurious hotels (not now...but for some reason I still like the big rooms and bathroom)--the Aristi, and these fools turned off the AC in the middle of the night to save energy. I remember waking up in a sweat
and calling to find out what happened to the AC. They told me there were only a few people on the floor so they cut the AC's. Typical Colombian mentality...if I must say. Always trying to be bibo.

Everyone knows that the all around climate in Medellin is better than Cali's. For me, I love the climate of Bogota'. Being a Chicagoan, I know as well as anyone what "Cold" is. Colombians that call Bogota cold do not. For me, Bogota' is very refreshing. The rain can be annoying at times though. However it never really gets too cold.

And Desi...why is it that those girls only stroll by at "around 6 o'clock"? Chipichape has many "fine" ladies strolling around there all day. Is there something there at about 6 PM that is better than at other times? If so, I need to check it out........If you don't want to be to specific, email me the info. I would like to be enlightened as to that issue

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ColombianoX says on Apr 16, 2005, 16:12:

"And Desi...why is it that those girls only stroll by at "around 6 o'clock"? "

Gomez,

I don't mean to be a 'metiche', but maybe it's because that's the time when they're off work. I remember that my head would spin so many times at Chipichape from checking out the babes, that my cousin said I looked like 'un ventilador' (a fan)! Man, does Chipichape bring back great memories, and that two-story McDonald is the nicest one I've ever seen, seriously!

BTW, How was your trip to Florida?

Saludes,

CX
(ColombianoX nostalgic and wishing he was in Chipichape right now!)

ColombianoX 'Defensor de la Colombianidad'

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Principe says on Apr 16, 2005, 16:25:

I've heard... an awful lot of great things about Medellin

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calipro says on Apr 16, 2005, 16:44:

Gomez And Desi...why is it that those girls only stroll by at "around 6 o'clock"? Chipichape has many "fine" ladies strolling around there all day. Is there something there at about 6 PM that is better than at other times? If so, I need to check it out........If you don't want to be to specific, email me the info. I would like to be enlightened as to that issue

There aren't necessarily more beautiful women around after 6 but that is when the shops start to close and it becomes much easier to tell who is really shoping and who would like to meet someone. It can become quite a social event just after the sun goes down.

My usual spot is at Reggie Y Pop. It is a great place to meet up with your friends before you go out dancing and if you meet someone new, you can invite them along. I think that's what they are there for.

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pablobeluci says on Apr 16, 2005, 22:03:

medellin! I think Medellin is better. I just didnt like Cali.
And about : Cali es cali y lo demas es loma..., well, I live in a Medellin loma and Im happy...!

Ciao.

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Gomezman5 says on Apr 16, 2005, 23:54:

Thanks ColX and Calipro I just wanted to know what I was missing. It makes sense....the shops close and the hotties who work in them come out. I will have to keep that in mind the next time I go to Cali. I have to make sure I get there around (slightly earlier) that hour.

ColX, South Florida was great....more and more high end construction on Collins....especially in Sunny Isles. Unbelievably beautiful high end condo complexes. Who has the this kind of $$. Starting prices at 700,000 with larger units going for 2 million....unbelievable!!! Anyway, I thought about you when I was there. I went to Aventura mall and I saw a guy and I said to my cousin..."Hey that looks like Colombiano X" and she said "Who? an ex Colombiano??....how is he an ex Colombiano?" That was funny. I said forget it....just a joke about some guy I thought I knew from Colombia.......Funny huh?

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 17, 2005, 01:28:

after work shopping Most people in Cali shop on their way home from work. Schoolkids and college/university students tend to be out a bit earlier, especially the younger crowd; and as the offices and stores start closing for the day many people stop by the malls to pick up a thing or two that they need. It's a common pattern of behaviour, even here in Sweden.

Gomezman, it takes me about 3 weeks to get adjusted to Cali climate, which I do not find opressively hot and humid. The humidity is considerably less than that of Florida, for example. I have to admit that there are those five-six hours in the middle of the day that can be too hot for me, but that's when I do my shopping in the malls and eat lunch followed by a siesta. In midafternoon the temps have dropped to mid 20's and the breeze comes down from the Farallones and makes the living easy. I think 17-19 night temps (the most common ones in Cali) are just about perfect for a good night's sleep and airconditioning is totally unnecessary. I can't stand A/C cranked to cold, get all kind of sinus trouble from it, sore throat etc.

Cheers,
Desi

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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Gomezman5 says on Apr 17, 2005, 12:51:

I love the cold!!!!!!!!!! There is no such thing as too cold for me. The only thing good about the warm weather in Chgo is the fact that I get to see the women dressed
(these days perhaps less dressed) in a more.......appealing fashion.

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 17, 2005, 13:06:

gomez (why do I think about the Addams family every time I write that!),

I have no problem withe real, natural cold weather. I love the really cold, dry winters in my native Finland and think that snow is just plain wonderful. What I can't stand is the airconditioning.

Cheers,
Desi

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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Gomezman5 says on Apr 17, 2005, 13:40:

Desi, You are funny Actually, I will take that as a compliment. Gomez is actually a pretty cool guy. I think I have a lot in common with the guy too---all the way down to the cigar. Having a wife that looks like Morticia would not be such a bad proposition either for that matter. Except there is nothing Colombian looking about her.

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Lionheart says on Apr 17, 2005, 15:27:

Gomez ... about lawyers You want their kids as well? I like Festus most ... even tho I look more like It ...

btw ... I beat a lawyer with her own weapons last night, my novia in Cali ...

She insists when I come to Cali she will watch out for me, so I don't wind up in dangerous areas, I told her if an area is too dangerous for me then she can't go there either. Reason? Because of her own contradicting statements:

- I am a lawyer, the guerrillera can use me to work for them
- I am a poor honest lawyer, they research and only kidnap the rich ones

- I am from Colombia, I know where I can go and be safe, nothing has happened in the past 3 years
- My doctor friends got kidnapped on their finca in the Easter week, where they had been going for 10 years

- when I was married my ex-husband who is from a weathy family had to hide me for many months; his company was victim of extortion and they had threatend to kidnap me and my children, they demolished his company when he refused to pay
- I am india, they won't do anything to me, they never have

- I am safe because I am poor, therefore my kids are safe
- my kids have learned how to see and run from kidnappers, and other ways of protection, they learn that in school

And this was last night, she is visiting a finca with her children today with the school:

- my mother is worry coz...I go to farm tomorrow...is in Buitrera...this place is guerrillera... but...I go with kids and familys school...I think not happend nothing...
[me] isn't that especially dangerous for kidnapping? I would think guerrillera then get a lot of money, ransom ...
- I not have money...guerrilla search money...people money...they investigue people first...
[me] hmmm ... but many children are a good chance, families will pay much fast for the children
- yesss......I worry for my daugthers...coz...family my ex...have money...this is dangerous for my kids..
... (telling her not to go)
- tomorrow not danger.... no please...not worry ... The Army to watch over this place...not problem..
... (more discussion)
- I never permit you go to place danger ...
- ohhh no...something..you can´t go with me...
- I know my city...my country...
- ohh my love...I live all my life here...I know danger...I live in danger everyday...
[me] yesterday you say you are lawyer=danger ... today you say you are poor=safe ... in court you have no chance
- jajajaja...
[me] in court you have no chance ... I think I am better lawyer

... on and on ... (I chopped the convo down to important parts)

I can't imagine a Colombian court with how Colombians are used to living a life of contradictions.

I insist everytime, if you can go someplace, I will go with you, just because I am a gringo it doesn't mean I am more in danger than you. They make no difference between either ... their motives work different.

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Gomezman5 says on Apr 17, 2005, 22:10:

Lionheart.............. You have really examined this situation rather closely. It looks like you are prepared for all variables that come your way. I admire your insight. Except, no matter how you look at it......when you go to Cali, you will be venturing into some dangerous territory.

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Jack Smith says on Apr 20, 2005, 17:57:

Why not Bogota? If you are a single guy thinking of using the marriage agencies my advice is to try Bogota first.........all roads lead to Bogota and the US Embassy...if you are American anyway...if you have 30 days that should be enough time to visit all 3 if your budget allows for it?

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Lionheart says on Apr 20, 2005, 19:22:

Gomez and dangers Dangers are everywhere ... I know the risks in Cali and in Colombia, and I am willing to take them. It is too boring sitting behind the computer all the time just reading and writing about the dangers of the world, I want to experience more of them. I already collected some in other parts of the world, so why not in Colombia as well? The price is right!

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Bruklinero says on Apr 20, 2005, 22:00:

How dangerous is Cali? I have scheduled a trip to Cali for late May. A lot of folks are advising me not to go as Cali is very unsafe these days. Coming from Brooklyn, NY, I have a hard time believing that I could face any greater danger in Cali than what I did in Bklyn (cerca 1985-1990). What are the things not to do and places not to go to in Cali? Will my Brooklyn street sense help me at all over there?

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platano says on Apr 20, 2005, 22:19:

Brooklyn street sense will definitely help... I was once walking in Cali with a friend who is a fellow "salsero" (lover of salsa music) who is also a "traqueto" (someone involved with the drug trade) down Avenida Quinta near Holguines Trade Center (but on the Unicentro side).

Suddenly he pointed out a car that was passing slowly and said something that roughly translates to "ah, shit, that's the second time they've passed by us" as he reached around ....to pull out a 9mm from the small of his back.

Then he commented, "That's the problem with walking around in public."

As Rubén Blades sings in his song "Te Estan Buscando" (They are Looking for You)

Cuida'o en el barrio,
Cuida'o en la acera,
Cuida'o en la calle,
Cuida'o donde queira
Que te andan buscando.

Platano, quien no tiene ni ha tenido vínculos con los narcos, pero sí ha tenido amigos que se untaron (cosa suya)

Disclaimer: I don't have and have never had any connection with the drug trade, but I have had friends who, like me, love salsa and they were involved. I never let it interfere with the friendship. It was their business.

plátano

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Lionheart says on Apr 21, 2005, 01:24:

concerning cali = bruklinero In general I would say Brooklin street smarts will help you in Cali, as in many other major cities of the world. All have areas where you shouldn't go at all, not alone, not at night, etc.

If you have specific questions about areas/addresses feel free to PM me here or just post it in public here (assuming you're ready to take the risk of Cali killers/kidnappers reading this forum to await you gleefully). I am being sarcastic now due to the friendly posts of others here.

My novia is defense lawyer in Cali and has very up-to-date information about the area in and around Cali. For example she warned Platano here not to visit Silvia over the Easter holidays. After the holidays she told me about her doctor friends getting kidnapped there on their finca they have been visiting for 10 years with no earlier dangers.

I will be moving to Cali to live and work there. Gomez thinks I am insane, maybe I am, but life is too short to live boring and dreaming of a better life in front of a computer screen. If you are going to Cali on business I would apply common sense and not look like a business man in public ... but since the Colombian companies are very conservative you might need to wear your 3-piece suit for meetings. In that case tell the company to pick you up at the hotel with a chauffeur and body-guard. This is a serious recommendation and not being sarcastic. This belongs to the area of common sense and general precautions.

There are a few others here in the forum who can also give you sound advice, like GringoInBogota. His cautions are often dramatic, but as I he has become sarcastic.

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platano says on Apr 21, 2005, 05:24:

Lionheart,

I want to thank you girl friend for saving me from a possible kidnapping. As I think I said before, you are very lucky to have a lawyer with heart and intelligence who loves you.

I envy your return to Cali. You aren't crazy and will have no problem when you move to Cali to live and work there. I lived there six years.

Platano

plátano

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calipro says on Apr 21, 2005, 06:15:

Damn! platano The area around Holguines Trade Center and Unicentro is a pretty nice area of town. I don't normally stay in the south but when I do I usually stay in that Radison Hotel right next door to Holguines. If I want to go to Unicentro from the Hotel I just walk through Holguines Trade Center and cross the street to Unicentro. I have never had a problem in that neigborhood what so ever but then again I never walked around with a guy ready to whip out his gun because a car passed him twice. hehehe!!

Sounds like your friend was the most dangerous guy in the hood;-)

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Jack Smith says on Apr 21, 2005, 12:24:

Dime con quien andas y te dire quien eres.......? To the fellow who was walking around in Cali and your friend pulled out a 9 MM......you sure keep some interesting friends........

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platano says on Apr 21, 2005, 12:31:

Our interest was salsa. We hung out listening to salsa. What he did with the rest of his life really didn't interest me, nor did I judge him.

I have shared with narcos, guerrillas (active, reinsertados, and desertors), politicos, academics, gente que vive en tugurios, paras, Army generals, bureaucrats, gypsies, etc. etc. All Colombians. All beautiful people (especially the FARC guerrilleras). All worth knowing. All taught me things. I love them all.

The Holguines Trade Center/Unicentro area is one of the safest places in Cali. Don't let this one experience color your perception of Cali. Cali is a wonderful city. I recommend traveling to Cali without any hesitation.



Platano

plátano

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Bruklinero says on Apr 21, 2005, 16:46:

How safe is Cali? Thanks for all the info. I will be in Cali on vacation. My goal is to take advantage of the salsa scene while finally getting introduced "up close" to the famous calenas. Any recommendations in terms of salsa clubs, nightclubs/bars (to meet calenas) would be much appreciated. I am staying at the Intercontinental. Is this hotel located in a safe area near the center of the action. If not, hotel recommendations would be welcome.

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calipro says on Apr 21, 2005, 17:23:

Bruklinero I recommend chango in juanchito, and tienda vieja for salsa dancing on Sundays because on Friday and Saturday night there are million other places to go dancing.

It's posible to pick up women at tienda vieja if you like to play the game wait until everybody is on the dance floor and then ask the ones that aren't with someone if they would like to dance. Personally I don't like to play that game. I always take a date to a disco because it is just not as easy as you would like it to be to pick someone up.

I don't recommend that you even try to meet a woman in changos. I have seen them play hit the other guy over the head with the wiskey bottle and then try and stab the other guy with the sharp end before.

I don't know how good your spanish is but night club has a little bit of a different meaning in Cali then the U.S. If you ask a taxi driver to take you to a night club he will most likely take you to a seedy bar that has prostitutes. If you want a bar to go and have a drink I would suggest Avenida Sexta.

Try and get a table as close to the street as posible so you can catch someone's eye. But, keep in mind the women that are walking around unattended on Ave. Sexta at night are problably not the kind of girl that you would bring home to meet your mom. Personally I stay away for Ave. Sexta anymore. I prefer to hang out at Reggie and Pop in Chipichape and pick up chicks at the mall.

If you don't know anyone in Cali and aren't interested in marriage agency women then I think you might have a tough time of it at first in Cali.

The intercontinental is the best place to stay in the best location. I'll be in Cali in June. If you are going to be there the same time then PM me and I can send you my phone number in Cali.

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 22, 2005, 09:48:

calipro how long will you be staying in Cali in June?

Cheers,
Desi

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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calipro says on Apr 22, 2005, 10:34:

Desi As it stands now, I will be in Cali from June 18th - July 25th.

It is posible I will cut my trip short if I don't get my business visa before I leave, I run out of models to shoot (I doubt if that will happen) or demands are made on me to return before Christmas (most likely scenario).

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 22, 2005, 10:36:

ok calip good to know about your travel plans so that they won't collide with mine:)
Cheers,
Desi

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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calipro says on Apr 22, 2005, 19:03:

Dezi And here I thought you wanted to hang out with me!

Listen, nobody that I know of takes anything you say personally.

There will probably be some kind of get together in Cali on the 4th of July for american guys and their girls. Consider yourself invited. Hell we can tell everybody that you are a gringa that got sick of americanos and so you married a colombiano for a good laugh.

I'm sure that even HEAT would be very nice to you. The guys that live in and go to Cali are a pretty happy bunch all in all. In fact I would call them content. Kind of like the cat that just ate the bird. Damn happy and many just a little bit guilty;-)

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Apr 23, 2005, 09:23:

quite the opposite, calip I wasn't planning to get together with you or your friends. With me is quite the contrary, I take everything said to me personally. If I happened to share, say a mealtime with your big idol Heat I'd probably slip some rat poison in his food.

Cheers,
Desi

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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perromero says on Apr 23, 2005, 11:48:

Cali, Medellin y las demas I agree, both cities, Medellin and Cali are worth a visit. I will also recommend Manizales, quite smaller, in between Cali and Medellin, but as nice as the others. Full of beautiful women, mainly students from different regions of the western side of Colombia. The only problem is that most of the students go back to their home cities for vacation, this is from early June to late July...

P. Romero

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