Bus story from lonely planet (not by me)

helen says on Jul 1, 2005, 09:18:

not to mention the buses taking corners at high speeds with deadly precipices just feet away

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adrimm says on Jul 1, 2005, 10:00:

Well said Drivers there among the worst I have seen anywhere. I was involved in 2 car accidents (as a passenger) in a 2 month period on one of my trips to Colombia. One accident involved a buseta rear-ending us in a city, and the other was on the Chicamocha canyon. The Chicomocha one was particularly frightening. The guy behind us tried to pass the vehicle I was in on a ***blind curve***, of course someone was coming in the oncoming lane, so he (the passing guy) swerved back into our lane, but he had already begun to pass us so he swerved right into our car sending us crashing into the rock face.

There was damage on the back left side and passenger door of our car and the front right corner was severely crumpled, engine damaged.

Drivers behind had been travelling so closely that they all piled up behind us. Worst of all, only 2 out of all cars had insurance!

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helen says on Jul 1, 2005, 10:29:

right, i just came back from boyaca and i spent the entire travel time white knuckled. the fear factor took away from the beauty of the views wich annoyed the hell out of me. why do they want to overtake on corners too?

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miamimike says on Jul 1, 2005, 11:23:

Helen, this is my tale of a past Bus Trip... probably better if wake-up after the trip then you miss seeing
Submitted by miamimike on Mon, 06/20/2005 - 06:25.
all the close calls where the bus driver almost plunges the Bus over the cliffs.Happens a lot in Col.These guys passing on Blind Curves, bald Bus Tires, worn out brake pads down to the Rivets. The worst and most scary thing on my Bogota-Cartagena Bus Trip was when our Bus Lights went out. We were just a few hundred yards from a truck stop so the driver pulled-to get the lights repaired so we thought. What happened in reality was he waited until another Driver of the same bus co. pulled in with his bus and Headlights working. So our driver rationalized "why get the lights fixed, only 3 more hours to dawn", better to save the repair bill and the drivers made the deal that our Bus Driver would follow behind(I mean like real real close) the Bus with the Good Working HeadLights--so off we went. The drivers tore thru the Darkness at breakneck speeds down the winding mountain roads, our driver maybe 30 meters behind--Headlights darker then a witches soul. I remember at one point being so sick from eating some lousy spoiled food and having the Runs and coupled with the Oxygen sickness being in that little Bus Bathroom; I was that sick I was sitting on the crapper with the Runs and Vomiting and heaving my guts out all at the same time, Oh and holding onto a Handrail so I wouldn't fly into the wall or the Door. The Bus from Hell. God Never again will I be on a Bus like that! No way Jose! A week or two later, like 26 passengers were killed on the same route-a speeding bus lost his brakes down a hill and plunged the Bus down a valley a couple hundred meters below,Practically all were killed. Think the driver survived-as luck would have it!

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On Sept 17, 2008: Senator John McCain said, as he had many times before, that he believed the fundamentals of the economy were "strong."Hours later he backpedaled, explaining that he had meant that American workers were Strong.

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helen says on Jul 1, 2005, 11:46:

hell, sounds grim. i have often thought about doing colombia by bus and it's not the fear of crime etc that stops me. Embassy travel warnings should flag the dangers of bus travel since i'm sure one is more likely to be killed/injured on a bus than any of the usual dangers that are touted....

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Albatross says on Jul 1, 2005, 11:59:

Miami... sounds like quite an adventure. Yes it's true and if the FARC or a road accident doesn't get you, there are always fallen power lines, re-bar or angle iron poking out of the side of a building (or up from the sidewalk), potholes up to your knee, or concrete building pieces falling on your head...

“Democracy - a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H.L. Mencken

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miamimike says on Jul 1, 2005, 12:28:

Helen, save yourself the time, trouble and possibly your life Don't take the Bus. take a plane or if you have to go by road and I can't blame you because you miss the Beauty(and there is a lot of it)Esp. Crossing the Andes with the Clouds on the Road as you drive thru,ethreal experience, unforgetable. But the risk on these Buses....no way Jose

On Sept 17, 2008: Senator John McCain said, as he had many times before, that he believed the fundamentals of the economy were "strong."Hours later he backpedaled, explaining that he had meant that American workers were Strong.

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adrimm says on Jul 1, 2005, 12:38:

Primary reason why I prefer to fly For me, Colombia accident-hazards up higher on my deterents-to-overland travel than other incidents. Nothing like being nearly run off the Chicamocha to make flying seem a alot more attractive.

Unfortunately avoiding dangerous raods and ghastly drivers by not taking intercity bus as much, doesn't take care of paseos with relatives in private cars.

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adrimm says on Jul 1, 2005, 12:38:

.

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helen says on Jul 1, 2005, 13:10:

i won't take the bus again....not even keen on buses on the septima so i take taxis.....now that's another issue. i lived in argentina for 9 years before moving here and i thought argentine taxi drivers won the crazy premio. i was wrong...

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caslug says on Jul 1, 2005, 13:15:

Wait a minute.. I'm planning on busing between Cali, Armenia/Pereria, & MEdellin. I heard these were decent roads. I was told just pick more expensive bus to take versus the cheapest. Are people here saying that the route is dangerous?

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helen says on Jul 1, 2005, 13:22:

not sure about that particular route. in my experience it's not the route you necessarily have to be worried about but the drivers. doesn't really matter how good the roads are if you have anutter at the wheel.....i've travelled a fair bit by bus and after boyaca i won't do it again

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miamimike says on Jul 1, 2005, 13:50:

Bus Class doesn't seem to affect Safety for Better/Worse My Bus Trip from Hell was via Executive Class had Video, pretty clean ect but it ended there. I beleive the Brake Pads on our Bus were about down to the rivets because as we careened down some windy(capital W here)mountain Roads(barely wide enough for 2 cars-barely)the driver would practically stand on the Brakes and you could smell that metal to metal smell and hear the screeching metal as he tried to slow down. Lot of Rosary Beads being used by Old Colombian Ladies on the Bus(what does this tell you-Avianca on wheels?)Man those cliffs I saw out the window looked like way way down...

On Sept 17, 2008: Senator John McCain said, as he had many times before, that he believed the fundamentals of the economy were "strong."Hours later he backpedaled, explaining that he had meant that American workers were Strong.

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adrimm says on Jul 1, 2005, 14:12:

Caslug While a good or bad driver can make a difference, I think that road conditions can influence safety alot. The drivers can be crap, but if the road is shitty (lots of blind corners, narrow one in each direction etc.) then the risks an unsafe driver makes are worse.

Ie. I have always felt safer (from accidents) on the route between Bucaramanga and Cucucuta than the road from Bogota to Bucaramanga (which goes along the canyon).

Also, while one's driver may be safe, it just takes one moron in another car to cause an accident. That's where being on a bus is better since few cars will chance much if they know it mihgt but them up against a bus.

I don't the particular road or highway that you will be on, so I can't comment on it, but don't change your plans until you talk to people when you get there. I know that many of the highways leading out of Bogota are great ie. we went to Paruq Jaime Duque and Guatavita and drivers were ok, the highway wide etc.

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tomtom33 says on Jul 1, 2005, 14:38:

MDE-CLO Made that trip by bus in January with overnights in Armenia, Periera, and Manizales. The roads were good. Felt very safe until I got to Cali. At first the driving patterns were a little scary. Then you start to realize that everyone drives expecting another vehicle to be passing in their lane. They do slow and even pull over. The scenery was pretty amazing.

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miamimike says on Jul 1, 2005, 14:41:

Adrimm I was on that Bogota to Bucaramanga on my Bus Trip and it was anything but Boring. The canyon...like Way Down. I remember passing through Pamplona and for some unknown reason the Busdriver went down this real narrow street(like an Alley)and as he went down the alley he was ripping down all those illegal electrical pirated Hookups that were too low and the Bus caught them.All the people were running out of their houses and apts. cussing and angry so the Bus Driver started backing up the alley ripping more down-We got out of the Bus as the wires were sparkeling like the 4th of July and walked out of the Alley and got back on after he was clear of the wires -some Passengers stayed put-they were crazy for that-the Driver said "Its OK-No problema" Right...

On Sept 17, 2008: Senator John McCain said, as he had many times before, that he believed the fundamentals of the economy were "strong."Hours later he backpedaled, explaining that he had meant that American workers were Strong.

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adrimm says on Jul 1, 2005, 14:48:

Miamimike My incident was a few years back but there were no guard rails, and those there would not have stopped a bus. It is *huge* canyon, very scary to look down see the river (and how small it looks) then see the river up close (near Florida Blanca) and get some idea of how big it actually is, ergo how high the canyon road is.

Pamplona. Thankfully the only part of Pamplona that I have seen is the main plaza, oh and about 3 hrs of the "border" crossing hut above Pamplona (I was detained there once on my way to Bucaramanga from Cucuta). The Buc-Cucuta route is gorgeous did you notice the " A Frame" chalets on the plateau?

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caslug says on Jul 1, 2005, 15:02:

MDE to Cali.. TOM, that is the exact trip i want to make. Sounds like it's OK. I've been to Cali before i understand what you mean about "scary"..Thanks for the observation.

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miamimike says on Jul 1, 2005, 15:05:

This was back in 95-96 and I beleive I remember seeing European style homes thinking how odd they were at the time. That River was really way Down-I could see that Bus Cartwheeling end over end 'til it hit bottom or went in a ball of Flames. For me Pamplona was really nice and interesting. We went and visiyed the University there also. It was quie a Bus Trip! Scenic and Scary at the same time!

On Sept 17, 2008: Senator John McCain said, as he had many times before, that he believed the fundamentals of the economy were "strong."Hours later he backpedaled, explaining that he had meant that American workers were Strong.

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Mr. Hollywood says on Jul 1, 2005, 16:27:

In another latin American country I once was on an all night bus with an unruly drunk. The driver warned him a couple times and then stopped in the middle of the jungle and threw the guy out. As we pulled away the drunk insulted the driver's mother and, gasp, punched the side of the bus. I don't which it was that really pissed him off, but the driver stopped the bus, stepped outside, kicked the drunk guy's ass, then casually got on the bus and drove away. Needless to say, nobody else acted up that night.

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carter says on Jul 1, 2005, 17:14:

caslug After all my travels Ive actually found the driving here not that bad. maybe I have just got used to it.

Definatly in India, Nepal, Thailand, Laos, Bolivia and Peru I felt less safe on busses but being better than these countries is nothing to be proud of.

You don't hear to often about major bus accidents here though, or not as much as I hear of those in the countries listed above.

CASLUG: I travelled that road last week. You would be safer taking one of the better companies Copetran, Berlinas or Brasilia they seem to employ better drivers but as others mentioned it only takes another idiot in a car to cause an accident.

Chicamocha is not the road you´dwant an accident on.

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adrimm says on Jul 1, 2005, 17:59:

I like Pamplona (and fear the Chicamocha) But I didn't visit the back alleys in a crazy-bus! My visit aside (where we didn't get too far past the central plaza), I formed a fairly high opinion of the place (but I was coming from Cucuta, so I think the contrast made it seem all the more better).

Carter - if you see me reccomending people fly to Bucara from Bog, you now know why, stupid Chicamocha accident freaked me right out.

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quindioman says on Jul 3, 2005, 16:21:

caslug i'm pretty familiar with the cali armenia route as cali has been our second city (we have some family there).
I lost count of the amount of times i bussed that route in the space of a month....the worst that happened was that some poor dog got run over just as we were approaching Buga...i used s26 (the one with the yellow and green buses) and stuck with them all along
Cali Armenia takes on average 3 hours and Armenia Pereira 45 minutes and again no probs and very scenic....north of Pereira i'm not your person...maybe colombiche

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Tinto (Moderator) says on Jul 4, 2005, 10:49:

This was the 1st of 2 fatal bus accidents on Saturday DOW JONES NEWSWIRES

July 2, 2005 4:23 p.m.



BOGOTA (AP)--A passenger bus in Colombia plunged off a mountain highway Saturday morning, killing at least nine people and injuring 15, police said.



Two people remained missing as authorities searched the crash site, located between the cities of Pasto and Mocoa, 315 miles southwest of Bogota, highway police spokesman Javier Baquero said.



Baquero said the bus plummeted 130 feet into a mountain gorge. No other vehicles were involved and investigators were unsure what caused the bus to veer off the highway, he said. Baquero did not know if the driver was among the dead.

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DonkeyDust says on Jul 4, 2005, 17:53:

Why double the chance of ending up in a Colombian morgue? I did 3,000 miles - central pacifc coast Mexico Jan/Feb 2005. I will never travel (I hope!!!) on another bus that is not total luxury. The drivers are better, the bus is in good repair, your comfort is at times unsurpassed, the movies are even better. There were times I did not want to get out of the bus at my destination!

The cost was usually 10% more and they gave you a drink and a snak which often made up the difference (Primera Plus buse lines among others).
The seats were plush with no hunks of unrepaired metal ready to impale your knee, LCD screens & individual controled sound.
I had a choice of 2nd class (leaving right away 19:00) and 1st class plus (lv 23:30) Puerto Vallarta to Manzanillo (6 hrs 2nd class 4 1st class). I bought the 2nd class ticket, sat in the bus for maybe 30 seconds, every thing was hoprrible and no one was even on the bus yet etc etc. and went back in and begged to have my ticket changed to the 23:30 bus. They did. I messed around and drank a bit of tequilla for 4 and a half hours then got on the first class bus. I think I fell asleep before the bus left the yard and the next thing the driver was shaking me saying we were in manzanillo. I had a big smile on my face and never took a second class bus again.
If there are no premium 1st class buses in colombia I wont go even an hour if I can help it by bus. Life is too short.

AND Another bus ride from hell story: I was at the back behind the drivers side. Horns were honking (I found out later cause the stupid driver was passing in the extra lane meant for the uphill vehicles and around corners.
I kept thinking well noone else is worried so I should relax. Then I put my head out in the isle to try to see what was going on out the front window. Well it was olamost funny. Nearly everyone on the bus had thier heads out in the aisle also trying to ease thier fears.
Then to top it off after the breakneak deathdefying driving the stupid driver pulled into the dirties little town and we sat in some unrine smelling cafe for 30 minutes. Things that make you hmmm???

I say, travel in saftey and comfort or be happy where I am.

If you don't know where your going you might not get there. You don't own your possessions, Your possessions own you.

Latitudes attitudes & platitudes.

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caslug says on Jul 4, 2005, 18:01:

Thanks for the positive(& negative).. experience w/ bus. I feel better taking bus from Medellin, Peirera, & cali now. It seems that stretch of road is pretty safe. I'll be avoiding the other "problem" areas, LOL!.. I'm looking forward to a month in COL mostly exploring by bus.

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Gator says on Jul 4, 2005, 18:32:

Just to Put Things Into Perspective... In the USA:

The Arrowhead Coach USA bus crashed Sunday on the New York State Thruway, 16 miles south of Rochester in the western part of the state.
The bus slammed into a guardrail and plunged down a 75-foot embankment before coming to a stop, state police Maj. Mark Fischer said at a news conference Monday. Six killed.

Bus accident at Carrollton, Kentucky was one of the most disastrous bus accidents in United States history. A drunk driver collided with a church bus, killing 27 people and injuring 34 of 66 on board. The initial crash was exacerbated by the bus catching fire.

At 2:56 p.m. on June 23, 2002, a 1998 Motor Coach Industries, 55-passenger motorcoach, operated by Arrow Line, Inc., crashed near Victor, New York. The motorcoach, carrying 47 passengers, was en route from Niagara Falls, Ontario, Canada, to Waterbury, Connecticut.
Of the 48 people on the motorcoach, 5 passengers were killed; the driver and 41 passengers sustained injuries.

I agree wth Donkeydust, take the bus like the S26's on Expreso Palmira or Gacelas on Magdalena. Best drivers, TV, bathrooms, reclining seats and EXPRESS.

"Credidi pretio parvo emere et magno vendere tibi in animo fuisse!" .

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