Ban ANNCOL?

juancegomez says on Jan 21, 2006, 17:23:

So you mean this is old news? ...or care to elaborate? The Colombian government protesting about ANNCOL in some way or another is rather old news. In other words, it goes a few years back, even before the "OPROER" situation (not after). I think even in Pastrana's government the matter was raised. So it's unrelated to the T-shirt thing.

Btw, there was once an interview on the ANNCOL website which bluntly admitted that the FARC had contacted them in order to create ANNCOL, though they denied receiving any funding from them...would the Danish government allow a website that had been created upon the request of Osama bin Laden to operate, even if Al Qaeda was not funding them?

The content of the website speaks for itself though, as they don't even try to really hide the fact that they are grossly pro-FARC, to the point that to deny it is completely naive.

But well...I suppose that it's quite easy and acceptable for Denmark/Europe at large to protect the freedom of speech of people that, if they were in power in Colombia, wouldn't do the same with critical Danish/European journalists....

If it were up to me, I would act against ANNCOL, not going as far as closing the website, no, but at least monitoring all their activies more closely, in every way possible.

Btw, wasn't ANNCOL based somewhere else before, in the same "neighborhood" so to speak, in other words in one of the other Nordic countries? Not sure...

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valdemar says on Jan 21, 2006, 20:21:

Interpretation.... The web-server was based in Sweden until recently. Browsing the content of ANNCOL's website, leaves no doubt which side they are on in the conflict. However, technically speaking I do not think that even if the FARC suggested the people behind ANNCOL to open the website... and they decided to do that - it would qualify to ban the website. Especially, when neither fundings are given nor direct link to Las FARC on their website exists. In Denmark the interpretation of the anti-terror law is: "innocent until otherwise is proven".... instead of the opposite which seems to be normal practice for some countries in matters that involve the magic word "terror". Several radical Islamic web-sites have their servers located in Denmark. One of them was recently closed for its content encouraging to perform terrorist acts... not for its assumed relations to Al-Qaeda - which still has to be proven.

If the donations from the FARC logo T-shirts end up in Colombia, the vendor will have a real problem according to the anti-terror law. Otherwise, it could be difficult to juridical pursue. I guess the best weapon in this matter is information. Quite a lot of documentaries are being produced depicting Las FARC as a freedom movement (most recently “guerrilla girls�). I am sure several foreign film makers could put together documentaries depicting Las FARC less romantically… there should be enough cruelties to choose from.

saludos,
Valdemar

Chao - Jens

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Mr. Hollywood says on Jan 22, 2006, 22:52:

Ignore them The Colombian government should know better than to protest penny-ante bullshit like people selling T-shirts to raise money for the "Revolution". These people are clearly just doing it to get the reactions.

If Colombians say anything it should be, "T-shirt money is chump change next to the millions the FARC raises from kidnapping, extortion and drug trafficking. Go ahead, send them your 5 bucks, we don't care, we've got real problems to deal with."

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protocol13 says on Jan 23, 2006, 16:09:

Perhaps, Ignoring is not the answer. By Denmark allowing these terrorist supporters to continue, they are given them an air of legitimacy to kidnapping, violence, terrorism, drug trafficking and land mine usage.
In the US, all those Islamic charity groups that support the Middle East terrorist groups such Al-Qaida, HAMAS, Hezbollah, etc have been banned and several of the organizers are under arrest or are under investigation.

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cali373 says on Jan 24, 2006, 06:26:

CONFUSED I am confused. I checked out the Anncol website and found nothing relating to them selling T-shirts just the usual anti-imperialism news. So I searched in yahoo and found the following.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060120/od_uk_nm/oukoe_uk_colombia_denmark

http://eltiempo.terra.com.co/vidadehoy/2006-01-20/ARTICULO-WEB-_NOTA_INTERIOR-2702106.html

The article mentioned a site called "fightersandlovers.com", that
does sell FARC T-shirts. Not Anncol. I did not find any link to the Anncol and vice versa. Am I missing something? Any any case the problem with Anncol is that they are pro FARC, the other problem is that what they say about The Colombian government, paramilitaries, and injustice is true. Lets say they were not pro FARC but pro social justice, we all know they will still be labeled pro FARC. We also know that journalists that speak out against the AUC, Government and are pro union will end up six feet under. And people wonder why these sites pop up on foreign servers.

Smile if you are a thinker!

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juancegomez says on Jan 24, 2006, 10:07:

Clearing up your confusion It's been completely clear that ANNCOL does not sell the T-Shirts. Never claimed that. I believe you misunderstood part of the discussion.

cali373, I believe you made some decent points, but again they are incomplete. There are plenty of people that speak out against the AUC or the government, or in favor or unions or social justice, and the majority of them are not six feet under. This doesn't deny that too many people have historically been killed or persecuted for that, but that hasn't stopped many other people from continuing to do such work.

Obviously doing all those things is risky, because there are intolerant and violent people that don't want such things to be communicated.

But that is not all. It's also risky to speak out against the FARC and their guerrilla violence, not to mention speaking out against corrupt individuals or generic criminal organizations of all kinds. So such risks are not an "exclusive" characteristic.

As for ANNCOL...

The ANNCOl website does contain some partial truths, but that hardly helps.

Those truths are told in such a biased, opinionated and out of context manner, together with many lies and exaggerations, that their worth is substantially reduced.

Pro-Al Qaeda websites (which also pop up on foreign servers) also contain some truths, yet they also do so in a very questionable manner and in order to favor some questionable goals and methods.

Pro-Neonazi websites (which also pop up on foreign servers) also contain some truths, yet they also do so in a a very questionable manner and in order to favor some questionable goals and methods. And so on.

Do you understand what I mean by this?

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Tinto (Moderator) says on Jan 24, 2006, 10:14:

Maybe PoorButHappy is run from a server in Belgium? It could also be said that this website "contains some truths, yet they also do so in a a very questionable manner and in order to favor some questionable goals and methods"



;-)

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Mr. Hollywood says on Jan 24, 2006, 10:33:

Valdemar, do you have any pointer to the Colombian government actually asking Denmark do do that? Or is it supposition?

I don't really care if anncol is allowed to continue publishing but I think they really need to admit who they are and who they're working for. It's transparent BS to claim to be an independent news organization when they purely spout the FARC line.

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Mr. Hollywood says on Jan 24, 2006, 10:44:

Funny Hasn't Jacobo Arenas been "permanently out of style" ie. dead, for a long time? And wasn't he possibly offed by his own "comrades"?

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juancegomez says on Jan 24, 2006, 15:31:

Yeah... The guy died back in 1990, I believe. Not sure about the part of his being offed by his own comrades though.

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valdemar says on Jan 24, 2006, 17:59:

Yep.. Denmark was asked to close the ANNCOL server. After pressure from the colombian government, Sweden decided to ban the ANNCOL server in Sweden. When the server popped up in Denmark, the colombian ambassador in sweden (Colombia has no representation in Denmark) contacted the danish foreign minister as well as the danish conservative newsmedia "berlingske". The embassador expressed great concerns about ANNCOL and asked specifically for the danish server to be closed. The danish security intelligence service (PET) looked into the matter, but found no legal reasons to close ANNCOL, except for being left-wing....which not yet is illegal.

check out these links :

http://www.adital.org.br/site/noticia.asp?lang=ES&cod=8753
http://www.internationaltforum.dk/side/217 (in danish)

I translate some of the content from the last link:

"The colombian terror organisation FARC uses Denmark as base for their news media", writes "Berlinske". In reaction, foreign minister Per Stig Moeller among others demand the danish security intelligence service involved. At first it was the colombian embassador in Sweden who contacted Per Stig Moeller, demanding the server closed. �FARC and therefore also ANNCOL is a great problem�, colombian embassador told "Berlingske".....

Chao - Jens

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juancegomez says on Jan 24, 2006, 18:10:

Well... That they found no legal reason for closing ANNCOL doesn't mean that they shouldn't keep looking elsewhere for signs of FARC financing or other activities that surely *are* illegal.

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