any relationship advice?

goin_south says on Dec 26, 2006, 15:15:

Well ladies... Gringas, Colombianas.... it's your turn. Buena Suerte! I'm confident you'll do better (than the guys.)

Colombia es

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Blondie says on Dec 26, 2006, 15:29:

I think... He sounds like a good guy!! Seems like you have tested him quite a bit and he keeps passing. But just be warned... im sure he can sense that you are constantly testing him... and if you keep it up.. he may decide that pursuing a relationship with someone who will never trust him just isnt worth it. I say back off a bit, if it is meant to be it will be... and if you never take any risks in life, you will never have anything worth having!! take it easy and see where it goes!!
Good luck to you!

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ColombiaBoard says on Dec 26, 2006, 16:25:

He's passed the test Believe me, from what I've heard from colombian girls, this one's a keeper. He's proven to you that he's independent, you lived with him so you were there all the time.
Yes, I think you're a bit paranoid but that's normal given your previous experiences.
Here's something else to feed your paranoia but actually something that most people don't do and you can do, think about the time you lived with him and his family, what was the "family dynamics" like? how did he behave toward his parents, siblings?, from that you can gather much more info and also you know what he'd be like when he becomes "daddy".

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SarahS says on Dec 26, 2006, 17:08:

thanks alt for your comments, ya I think youre right, I might be bit too paranoid..but trust me, from my last experience its hard not to be! But yeah, I need to trust more and I am aware that it might drive him away if I dont. Its just a matter of trying to keep a good balance between trusting and being naive which is quite hard!
About the family thing, its so different from in England cos the mother does ALL the cooking for everyone, even though all the kids are in the 20s, and the women are the ones who do all the work in the house which isnt how I like it so if does go any further we are gonna have to work on that! Its different to what im used to and he seems to take a lot for granted with his mum and not give her as much respect for what she does as I would like to see at times but at others he makes up for it so Im not sure. He is always respectful to me and never expects me to do anything for him but that might change later on! I think you are right about watching how people are with their family. I guess ill just have to let the relationship take its course and see what happens with time..just like any other relationship except the diferent country thing makes it a bit more complicated!

Thanks for your comments, it makes me feel better to have a positive outside oppinion to keep my paranoia in check!

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SarahS says on Dec 26, 2006, 17:11:

ta thanks blondie for your encouraging words!

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Giann says on Dec 26, 2006, 19:10:

We are spoiled Sarah coming from a Colombian male our mothers spoil us when we are younger and older.It is common for my mother to do all the cooking and cleaning around the house when I use to live with my mother.It is some thing you come to expect and not even say thank you at times because you are just so use to it.So don't mind it just make sure you set your boyfriend straight [like my Australian girlfriend did to me] and every thing will be great from then on out.Don't think you will be a house slave or any thing like that.Quite the contrary.Any way good luck sweety!

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SarahS says on Dec 26, 2006, 19:16:

thanks giann thats nice to know. Im glad its not just him! And I will be setting him strait on that matter! Im sure he'll get used to cooking for himself eventually...

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ksmmcg says on Dec 26, 2006, 19:41:

if you think he's wonderful - just trust it i fell in love with a colombian guy when he was in the US, he's absolutely wonderful, i know that and i don't question it, or at least i don't anymore. on this site people talk a lot about their experiences, some are great, some aren't so great, additionally i heard a lot from other people (my friends, my family) saying things like he just wants a visa and all that, but i know its not true. i know that he's perfect for me, and that i'm perfect for him - i'm going to meet his family tomorrow actually! i'm so excited....but anyway my point is don't let other people get in the way of something if you believe it to be right, trust your instincts. best of luck to both of you...

p.s. my rolo even cooks (not well :), but he's learning) and he cleans up after me all the time, i'm a total disaster!

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alleycat says on Dec 26, 2006, 20:02:

just remember that colombian men are well-known for machista. this could be a source of agony for you down the road. you're not going to be able to change someone despite believing this is possible. if these traits are present in his personality they're going to remain there. also, colombian people as well as other latins are generally more promiscuous than anglos. this may or may not be a problem as well at some later date. i would separate myself from him for some time so you can determine your true feelings. go home for a few months and think about it. if the two of you are genuine in your feelings, you will get back together.

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Blondie says on Dec 26, 2006, 20:03:

Good luck Ksmmcg with meeting your novios parents!!! do you speak spanish well??? will you be meeting them in the states or Colombia??

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goin_south says on Dec 26, 2006, 20:57:

interesting so far... the differences between the male and the female recommendations on relationship advice (on pbh).

I think the ladies are not quite as critical; a little softer on the one asking for help.... not nearly as loaded with the diarrhetic recommendations that the males on here are so full of. lol.

But, it looks like alleycat is trying to bring a little reality into the situation.
Remember Sarah: nothing risked, nothing gained. Get your aerobics in! Exercise your heart, and then listen to it. Stop being paranoid. It's gonna cause alot of continued 'resistance' in your life; Resistance to alot of potentially wonderful things.

God, there's got to be more ladies on here, to help give you more advice.

Colombia es

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ksmmcg says on Dec 26, 2006, 21:06:

thanks blondie! i'll be on a flight to bogota in less than 8 hours - craziness, it will be my first time there...my spanish is good though, so i'm not too worried - i'll let you know how things turn out...

and galecito - you're right the male/female difference is pretty dramatic, but i really do think that what matters most is knowing the issues that are out there and knowing yourself and trusting your intuition - only you can tell if someone makes you happy

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Lisa Zee says on Dec 26, 2006, 22:30:

Sarah When a Colombian man is educated, and has a good role model, it is very inportant. Think also if you are welling to live in another country or if he is. At first everything is sweet, but with time the cutures start to crash. The only thing that holds a good relationship is real L O V E! Good luck.

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Blondie says on Dec 26, 2006, 22:32:

The idea that Colombian men are more likely to cheat and be with multiple other women is very disconcerting... I have heard this before.. that latin men feel it is ok to go out and have other women.. that is just more accepted. I think that you should find out what his view on this is.. trust your gut instinct on whether he is telling the truth or not. Once a cheat... always a cheat.. no matter what anyone says, its true. Dont set yourself up for such a heart break unless its ok with you.

Also... I suggest that before you become more involved with him... and give your heart completely to him... you two should have a serious talk about where the two of you will live if you were to get married, where you would have children (is important what nationality they will be), what your roles will be in the relationship - will he expect you to be a slave to the house and him??? will you both work, will you save money... money issues are big relationship killers.

These are things that are very important... and if you dont agree on them... then you should get out of it now, before things get more involved and are harder to break off.

As far as trusting him... like i said before, he sounds like he has passed the trust part.. the other things are very important to!

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goin_south says on Dec 27, 2006, 00:01:

you're right, and good luck on your trip, ksmmcg! I hope you plan to share with pbh, how your trip turns out. Oh, yeah. It's okay to be so much in love that you forget where you're at, but....We want your take on Colombia! too.

This is interesting, for a refreshing change of pace on pbh.

Colombia es

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elchantajista says on Dec 27, 2006, 01:16:

I think They say once a man hits a women he will do again no matter what he says, maybe that can be said for borrowing money, biggest turn off for American women is when a man BORROWS her car ,i think it can be said that trends will start early in a relationship,like it or not part of your appeal is the dollars or eruos that u can get; i asked in a early thread who is the provider in a gringa /colombiano relation no one responeded i think u gave us a lil insight, u maybe the bell of the ball now but in the long run u may have the same pit fall as us gringos have had lol; i've seen gringas hearts get broken, becareful once u give your heart to some one and they are not who they seem to be u be ripe for the picking, just read some of these sad gringo threads i'm sure they thought they were person of thier dreams also give it a verylong time make sure he is the real thing, I think when it goes wrong ;gringas take it ALOT harder than gringos, but i think u just don't hear about it they suffer in silence also inquiry about the father is he a big cheat if he's still around; maybe a mirror in the future, u might ask your self what people think when a America or English man man asks his women for a loan ;go to the bank loser and get a loan
anda de parranda en Bogota
"Vicente"

anda de parranda en Bogota "Vicente"

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Dec 27, 2006, 01:17:

well, girls just look at his parents; these machismo things are a learned behaviour. If his dad is faithful towards his mum and his brothers are good husbands or boyfriends or whatever the chances are that your guy is fine too. Also, take a look at his best friends, what kind of relationships do they have with their girlftriends/boyfriends/whatever. It's not a totally foolproof rule of thumb but gives you some kind of indication what to expect later.

About his mum doing all the housework: this happens in a lot of families in Colombia, but it's changing too, slowly but surely. Many young men are raised up in these days to help around the house and even the ones raised up with a mum that does all the work don't mind helping around once they have a household of their own, In my experience Colombian men are pretty adaptable and flexible in that sense.

Best of luck,
Desi


"Soy el que anda de noche sé cuando ladra el perro cuando canta el gallo sé cuando estan dormidos los muchachos de mi barrio..." (From a llanero song "El pajarito")

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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aztec says on Dec 27, 2006, 04:16:

alleycat, you are so correct. "just remember, that colombian men are well-known for machista."

It shows up in their everyday activities not only in male female relationships. It is not necessarily a bad characteristic but one with which you should be prepared to live.

Desideria is giving you good advice. Lisa Lee also, "When a Colombian man is educated, and has a good role model, it is very inportant."

But my observation of the males in my wifes family, all of whom are college educated if you count MIT, leads me to believe nothing completely suppresses the machismo. Macho can sometimes mean courageous or valorous. As an attitude, machismo ranges from a personal sense of virility to a more extreme masculism.

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SarahS says on Dec 27, 2006, 06:22:

in reply well thanks everyone for your comments, someone said that i should go home for a bit and seperate myself from him. Well I actually left Colombia 4 months ago so we have been seperated for that long and are so far still together. I am realistic about these things though, I never actually thought it would get this far, and I am not for one minute thinking that we will DEFINATELY be together forever. I like to take things slowly and would really prefer to be in the same country to see how the relationship works out normally. But thats not possible at the moment.

About the promiscous thing, I am very aware of that. Thats what I thought about Latin men all along (no offence any latin men) but to be honest, ALL my other english boyfriends have cheated on me so I cant do any worse! We have talked about it alot and he says his view is that when you are with the righ person you dont cheat on them, he doesnt think its right, so he says. He has been very honest with me, he says that he has cheated on people in the past but they werent serious relationships, and even his family tells me that hes never had a really serious relationship with a girl like he is with me. BUT I dont take any of that as fact, I just have to wait and see really. But al I know is that he SAYS he wouldnt cheat on me so atleast i know he doesnt think its ok! But you just never know do you, wherever the guy or girl is from.

The fact that we are in different countries obviously makes it easier and more likely that he may sleep with someone else but I knew that from the beginning and I even said to him before I left that we could just be open to other things and if it works out together and we still love eachother after some time then we will be together. But he said he doesnt want anyone else and he doesnt want me to have anyone else so we should just stay together and be faithful. But like I said, Im am realistic, and Im just gonna wait and see how it turns out with more time.

The lending money thing, he didnt actually ask me for it. I offered it because I saw that he was trying every other avenue of getting the money and he was very close to not being able to do a certain project because he didnt have the travel expenses and I could see that he was really upset about it. i told him I couldnt help him at first because I didnt want lending him money to come into it but I felt guilty that i couldnt help him and was apologising. He told me not to worry and he understands that I cant help him and its not my problem. Anyway, in the end I decided to give it to him because i hated the fact that he couldnt do this concert that was really important when I actually did have the money to help him. Plus I thought, well its gonna be a test, if he does give it back then its one step closer to proving that he is genuine and I can trust him, and if he doesnt then I can forget it! So as you can imagine, I was really happy when he gave it all back.

The machismo thing does worry me sometimes but Ive told him that im not that kind of person and will not do everything for him. he says heknows that and we will share everything when (or if) we live together. Hes never asked me to do anything for him so far, and actually does stuff for me if I ask. But his dad does let his mum do everything which is not a good role model. But I told him straight that I would not ever live like his parents do in that respect so if thats what he wants then he should find someone else. he just laughs and says that he knows Im not like that and he wont be like that with me. He is really supportive of me with what I want to do career wise and all the things I do in my life. he knows Im very independant and he likes that. But, we'll see how it is later I guess!

Oh, and the friends thing...his friends actually seem to have really good attitudes to women for the most part. he has a few friends in really serious relationships and they are really respectful to their women. they are all really strong in the oppinion that they want intelligent women that are honest and faithful and sincere because they say there arnt alot of women like that around. (thats what they say, not me!)

But then he tells me that in the past most of them, including him, were real slappers (slept with a lot of girls) and didnt really take girls very seriously, basically dogs. He told me that but said that it was because he was young and hes not interested in that anymore (hes 27 now), now he wants a proper relationship. But like you said, once a cheater always a cheater so yeah, that does worry me. But then, alot of guys go through a stage of playing around then wanna settle down, dont they?? His friends are really good to me and tell me that Im the best girl hes ever had and that they can tell he really loves me. The friends he has that are in relationships are really lovely with thier girlfriends, i have actually never seen such respectful men in this country! And they really take their relationships seriously which is really encouraging. they are all really supportive of their friends with girlfriends and think its great, rather than trying to get them to pick up other girls!

But really, I just never know...I have been fooled by people enough now to know that you can never tell the trth from what people say, you just have to wait and see with more time how they really turn out. So thats all can do I supose. it is dificult with future plans...but I love Colombia and wouldnt mind living there one day...also he says he will come here to live with me if I want him to.

ksmmcg...good luck in Bogota...youre gonna love Colombia, and Im sure his parents will love you and treat you like family like my boyfriends did to me. Thanks for your advice and its really nice to see a relationship like this thats worked out so well

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SarahS says on Dec 27, 2006, 06:35:

elchantajista I see where your coming from...this is why i said to him that he has to pay for his ticket over here and Im not going over there again until he comes here. Because I dont want to be the one that pays for everything all the time.

Its just a fact that i have more money than him, and have the capabilty of making more because of where I live. for this reason when I was there i did pay for some things, but he never asked me for anything, it was only if i wanted to go out or do something, and he had no money, I would pay for the two of us. But the fact that his family had put me up in their house for 3 months rent free (because they didnt want me to have to pay for a hotel so I could enjoy my holiday more) after knowing me for a week, and even feeding me for free for the last 6 weeks, made me feel better about paying for some things. When he did have money though, he did pay for me, and his sisters never let me pay for too much. It is difficult when you have more money than them...especially when its the guy who has less money. for me its difficult because i dont want to be used for money, and for him he says it was difficult cos he wanted to provide for me and buy me things but couldnt at the time.

His dad...he is still around but I dont know if he was ever a big cheat. maybe...Ill have to ask his mum! Im pretty sure hes not now cos all he does is sit next door and play dominoes all day. Pus hes about 70 so hes probably a bit old for that! He good with all the kids though, and although he does nothing around the house except go fishing once a fortnight and get a weeks worth of fish, he is always around which is nice I suppose.

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SarahS says on Dec 27, 2006, 09:15:

DonGringo Thanks so much for your message, I really appreciate all the things you said. I think youre right about trusting and to stop doubting all the time. Trust me to get into a relationship where there are so many possible reasons to not trust so soon after being totally decieved by somenone! Its really hard to try to draw theline between being paranoid and being aware. but i guess ill get there. he knows all about what happened before and understands the way i am now...although it does get to him at times so i do need to work on it.

Its nice to have advice from people who know something about what Im talking about, my friends support me but dont really know how the situation is. And they dont know anything about Colombia as theyve never been there.

What you said, thats one thing I love about Colombia and Colombian people, everyone is so open! Maybe its just my boyfriends family but they all knew pretty much everything about our relationship because any discussion or arguement we had would always end up being discussed infront of and with them. It was a bit weird at first but I love it now, its really nice to be part of a family like that. He would always send his sisters and mum to comfort me when he wasnt there and i was upset and I would have to end up telling them everything. but I got really close to them through that and we ended up getting really close. So thats another good thing I suppose, I like to think that his family would let me know if he was openly playing me.

Anyway, thanks so much, Ill just have to trust but not be stupid about it and lets see how it goes!

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Blondie says on Dec 27, 2006, 10:04:

You are right with one thing... its not just the Colombians that are cheaters.. I have been cheated on by every American man I've been with and the Czech husband i was with. So, I guess being a Colombian is not a reason to distrust him... but being a MAN is.. (hee hee..ok.. just kidding guys) seriously though... i think it is about his character.. who he is, what he thinks and believes, how he acts that is important. To me, it sounds like you have a great guy there!!! I hope you keep us updated on how it goes... Its so nice to hear happy endings... (or middles... )!!!

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SarahS says on Dec 27, 2006, 16:19:

Its worrying to think that all men cheat. My friends theory is that all guys are gonna cheat eventually so you just have to get used to it. Dont know about that, but maybe its right!! We could be just kidding ourselves that we might have a faithful man, ever. Nice thought eh?

Thanks for your comments blondie, Ill let you know how it goes!

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Giann says on Dec 27, 2006, 16:38:

We are not cheaters My Australian Girlfriend and me have been together for around 4 months know.I haven't even thought about cheating.She treats me right in the sack so lets just leave it at that =-]

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Blondie says on Dec 27, 2006, 17:03:

How did you meet your aussie girl Giann? Is she in the states with you? I like Aussies... they seem to be cool people!! I have been to Australia and loved it!!!

Sometimes its not a matter of "treating him right in the sack" its a matter of men liking the excitement of the chase and conquering their "prey"! or fresh meat, if you will. I know of people who are extremely happy and who cheat... just to "find out"... or cuz they are bored... sad but true. All we can do is threaten them with servere bodily harm and loss of body parts if they do.. (ha ha.. jk).

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Crazy4Cali says on Dec 27, 2006, 18:12:

You can't really believe anything that starts with "ALL" All men, Colombian or otherwise, don't do anything (other than be male, perhaps). Some men cheat. Some women cheat.

Some like the hunt, more than the feast. The best you can do (assuming you don't want that lifestyle) is avoid, or at least not get too close to, those kind of people. Unfortunately, it can be quite a rush to hunt and it can be quite flattering to be hunted.

But that's where the heartache comes in. Some women think (i.e. believe with all their heart) that once they are hunted, their superior attractiveness will be enough to change the man's ways. It won't, at least not for any period of time. Look at Hollywood where you have the most attractive of the most attractive. Those relationships don't last a TV season.

So women get into a serious relationship with these hunters, they think they've changed him (heck some even marry them!) and then, suffer the shock and dismay that he's still the same hunter, out looking for another. Wake up and smell the coffee, girls!

On the other hand, if you can give them what they want, which is usually not a whole lot, they'll stick around and give you what you want in the relationship. Men really are like dogs and, like dogs, it doesn't take much to keep one, but it does take the right ingredients and you can't skimp.

What many women don't understand (or like to admit) is that men REALLY are as simple as they look and nowhere near as complicated as women. For many, if they have some food, some time to themselves, some time to be guys (e.g. watch football, make model airplanes, or whatever they do to be a guy), some space to show you they love you (in whatever way they feel comfortable) and most importantly, some reason to feel important and needed (i.e. keep their ego fed). Most will stick around and be happy to be there.

If you take any of those away, then you're looking for trouble but you probably won't ever see it coming and he probably won't know enough to tell you...except to tell you he's leaving.

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Giann says on Dec 27, 2006, 18:40:

Well to make a long story short I was recently discharged from the Colombian Army.So I went out with some friends and family for a night out in Barranquilla.I saw her with some of her Aussie friends I could totally tell they were tourist. I have a thing for blondes.So I offered them a chance to hang out with me and my friends/family for the night we had a great time vibes were flowing and totally connected.After that I felt like I knew her my whole life.I met her family and the whole 9.She has family in the tri-state Area and I work for a Security contractor in the US.


She wants to go to Australia we will see what happens.We have been only going out for around 3-4 months.Yet we connect in every way! It's crazy I know.

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big kugz says on Dec 27, 2006, 18:45:

weirdo You shouldn't be with anyone that you don't trust and not trusting someone because of whatever lame stories you heard is pretty shallow. There are people that will take advantage of others in every county/culture in the world. I would say that even more so here in the US, maybe not, just my personal experience. So, are you shallow, too insecure, or do you actually have a ligitimate reason not to trust him? Best of luck.

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Blondie says on Dec 27, 2006, 18:56:

I dont think her question makes her a weirdo. When you are not familiar with all the ins and outs of a culture.. how are you supposed to know what is considered "normal" or not if you dont ask? Plus... It is a lot easier for someone outside of the situation to see things clearly.. and a lot of us know that... and know that when we are IN the situation our heads can be all cloudy ... so why not ask others who can look at the situation from an outsiders perspective for a little help to see things clearly??? i do it all of the time.. helps me to not make decisions so hastily.

Giann... I am confused... (i am blonde.. so comes with the territory.. right? heehee) you are a colombiano who was in the Colombian army and now recently moved to the states? (i am not sure what you are considering teh tri-state area..) and IS she in the states as well.. or you are having a long distance relationship from US-Australia?

Sorry if im being nosy... but its interesting to me :)

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Giann says on Dec 27, 2006, 20:51:

Blondie blondie blondie Darling yes I'm in the States with my Aussie gal.Correct I was discharged from the Colombian Army.I have lived in Colombia all of my life till recently I was offered a job by a Security Contractor located in the United States.I get to use my skills and the money is crazy.My Aussie gal went back to Australia for a few weeks as I got my papers and such to go the US.With the money I was making I bought a nice kozy little apartment and I offered her a chance to come on up the the US and spend some time with me.She agreed and before you know it we are living together.She is thinking of going to classes for some home decorator thingy that us guys dont understand.We will most likely head to Australia to visit her parents.In the Tri-State area she has some cousins from Aussie land aswell not to mention alot of my relatives are in New York.So we are just having a ball.

Your not being noisy it is human nature to be observant and wanting to know more ;)

Ciao Blondie

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Blondie says on Dec 27, 2006, 20:56:

awww... sounds like a fairy tale of a story!! ahhh... im jealous! :) Are there any more of you under your pillow or something?

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Giann says on Dec 27, 2006, 22:22:

You sound great Some lucky guy is missing out! Blondie you sound like a great girl.You will get yours soon enough.

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alleycat says on Dec 28, 2006, 07:15:

it may be more correct to say that all men are potential cheaters rather than all men will eventually cheat. this goes for women as well. very few species have been observed to be consistently monogamous. there's really only a handful out of many thousands of species with links to us, humans. moreover, simply because we have a highly-developed brain doesn't remove us from our biological evolutionary past. we were probably at some point far more promiscuous as a species than is now observed. i know guys often use this as an excuse to try to explain conduct considered inappropriate. and it doesn't act as a salve for hurt feelings but it does give some context to our behavior which oftentimes seems disgusting. "biology is destiny" i guess lol

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robi666 says on Dec 28, 2006, 07:18:

DonGringo, if you want to say a number, I know that is not easy, what is the percent of Colombian boyfriends who cheat vs. faithfull ones? Just curious, because my perception is 90%. In Italy, the other way around, 10%. But if they had the chances they would have in Colombia, that would be much much higher.
Recently, a friend of mine was visiting me in Colombia. He's a very very faithfull person and infact, kept being faithfull to his fiancee who remained in Italy. But, one night, at a party in Cartagena, he met the eyes of a beautifull morena. Well... if she had make the first move, I am pretty sure that he would have gone with her. So, it's not being faithfull or not, it is just that, as Fromm wrote, our early choices and environment lower the possibility to decide for WELL. In his case, going to the party was going to be his wrong choice. Being born in Colombia or living here is the environment that lowers that possibility. Males are the same males everywhere.
Am I just knowing the wrong persons or...?
Better to burn out than to fade away.

"I am a citizen of the most beautiful nation on earth. A nation whose laws are harsh yet simple, a nation that never cheats, which is immense and without borders, where life is lived in the present."

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Blondie says on Dec 28, 2006, 11:55:

DonGringo... I dont go after men with girlfriends.. why would i? its pointless and if they are willing to cheat with you.. they will cheat on you... doesnt take a rocket scientist to figure that out. :)

Why would i want another cheater? to continue my stellar solid gold record? no thanks! I'd rather be alone than go thru that again!

And to answer your question... NO.. i have never cheated.. and never will!!!

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alleycat says on Dec 28, 2006, 13:29:

dongringo i'm not sure what you base this statement on: "Darwanism is dead. Still some old tired dried up old Darwin thinkers in the Universities but they are not going to last long". i saw something recently indicating that roughly 90% of the members of the national academy of sciences believe darwin was correct in his observations and theories. they similarly reject by the same numbers the notion of "intelligent design". these are the university people you refer to. btw: belief in evolution is not mutually exclusive with a belief in a deity. but obviously intelligent design proponets reject major darwinian concepts. it appears highly unlikely that intelligent design will ever compete as a "scientific" explanation for our existence. it's a religious explanation and nothing more.

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SarahS says on Dec 28, 2006, 16:49:

don gringo Just to let you know, in answer to your question about the lung system thing. I did zoology at university and we learned in the evolution courses that there is fossil evidence of a group of fish called the lung fish (and I think theyve also found a live specimen) which have both lungs and gills and this is the fish from which the land mammals were supposed to have evolved and subsequently lost thier gills. thats (apparently) why some land lizards still have traces of gills even though they have lungs aswell.

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alleycat says on Dec 28, 2006, 20:01:

well it turns out that sarah is the science expert. that's interesting! i'm a trained psychologist(psy.d) but gave it up several years ago to become a freelance writer. if dg wants to debate he can do so with sarah as my expertise in the subject doesn't extend beyond my previous post. lol no doubt an interesting topic.

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utopiacowboy says on Dec 29, 2006, 15:11:

Good luck with the cooking project. These guys can't boil water. If their mommies aren't there to wait on them hand and foot they'd starve to death.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Dec 29, 2006, 15:24:

You'd be surprised UC how fast they learn once their mums are not around.

Cheers,
Desi

"Soy el que anda de noche en el vecindario, sé cuando ladra el perro, sé cuando canta el gallo sé cuando estan dormidos los muchachos de mi barrio..." (From a llanero song "El pajarito")

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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utopiacowboy says on Dec 29, 2006, 15:29:

I guess every so often a guy has some bad luck and has to learn to cook. Two of my brothers-in-law are pushing 40 and still live with their mother so they continue to enjoy her cooking and cleaning. She is basically their slave as far as I can tell although she seems to think it is her role in life. My wife on the other hand is a terrible cook and I have to do any serious cooking in our house.

Disclaimer: any comment I make is inane and is not to be taken seriously, and is so patently ridiculous that no one should take it seriously, even as an insult.

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Strobers says on Dec 29, 2006, 15:37:

I Think That Too Many people want to make sense out of something that dosen't and that is human emotions and conduct. Why do people act they way they do, including cheating? It's because people are human and driven to do things for the sheer pleasure of doing them. Put in blunter terms, why do dogs lick their balls? Because they can.

Instead of asking why do guys cheat or why do women cheat, ask yourself why do I keep following these destructive patterns in my life? I have found that the people who get involved in co-dendendent relationships, relationships where they are treated like dirt, relationships were they are always "victimized" is some way is an inherent flaw in them as a person that street smart people know how to manpulate to their advantage. Their issues are as easy to see as the sun in the middle of the night time sky.

I have seen over and over again, single friends who meet the same kind of person with nary a variance, yet when the person burns them in some way, it's the fault of the perpetrator and they become the "unwilling victim." Although there are some expceptions, people, men and women, seem to attract those very same people that they claim they don't want to be with.

I think men and women would both avoid problems if they could see far enough in advance to see how the pattern is developing and once they see they are again falling for the punch line, they get out. However, they don't. They want to stay because they have no self-esteem or sense of self, they like the drama, they like to be a victim. It's fun in a warped, neurotic kind of way. This kind of remiinds me of a guy I met in Colombia who had a string of crappy relationships under his belt where he was hurt and "taken advantaged of." In all three instances the women were very attractive, Strata 6 women, who had a lot of baggage and a lot of expectations. Nobody was every enough for them and there was enough drama in the relationship to make it worthwhile for a bit. When they got bored, they moved on to their next "victim." These aren't relationships. They are two psychologically sick people who use each other to create dysfunction and they wonder why they aren't happy.

Look into yourself before you look into someone else.

"Life is too serious to be taken seriously"

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goin_south says on Dec 29, 2006, 19:20:

I would be willing to teach a cooking class Pero..solamente para ColombianAs.
Arthur B., can we get a class together my next time in Cali?

"Comidas Rapidas para Calenas Calientes", or
"Comidas Calientes para Calenas Rapidas"

('tengo no mas compasion para su loro')

Colombia es

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