5 liter water heater just fine.

miamimike says on May 1, 2008, 08:30:

Come to Miami! I could write a Book on the experiences I have had here in our Condo Building. Many of the Trades people we are in contact are Cubans and they are unbelieveable. I doubt they have ever heard of a Chalk line, straight-edge or Plumb Bob. We have to practically follow their every step or else we get shortchanged on the Job. We are in Court presently with two contractors over shoddy workmanship. Now we have a good old fashioned Italian Guy who does our electrical/plumbing/Tile work. What a relief he is and honest to boot. I understand your dilemma completely,,,

My Avatar-- Sarah Palin Says " "You know the difference between a pit bull and a hockey mom?? Lipstick!" Now on a Short Verbal Tether by the Honorable John McCain

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nine inch nails says on May 1, 2008, 08:48:

Cuban friend of mine that does like to work says that many (but not all) lower class Cubans do not like to work.

"They know nothing, they know nothing." J. Cramer

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nine inch nails says on May 1, 2008, 08:51:

And I can believe this esp. if they came from Cuba where I don't believe there is any real incentive to work hard and do a good job in a Communist society.

But hey same in our society too with all the other races.

I've had some good Cuban workers too.

"They know nothing, they know nothing." J. Cramer

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sloopskipper says on May 1, 2008, 08:54:

To me it seems that people who know nothing, taught by people who know even less is as much of a problem as the work ethic.

One tradesman said he would call, and then come do some electrical work on a Saturday. Of course no call and a "no show", which is par for the course.

But he appeared on my doorstep the following Monday and did a credible job removing a run of 12-2 wire from a long, multi-turn conduit, and installed #8 for new air-conditioning. Neither explanation nor apology. They do that, arrive unexpected, not even knowing if I am at home.

Most of the work that I have had done (and can't get much of it done) is sloppy and very poor quality workmanship.

However, I find the Gringo contractors in Panamá are as bad, if not worse, with not honoring commitments.

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Mononoke28 says on May 1, 2008, 08:54:

My ex-brother in-law is a contractor who's really into getting the job done well and on time, he's an American by the way. But he has a Colombian guy from Cali working for him who complaints all the freaking time at how strict he is and how he wants things done on time, and how he can't leave his tools laying around. I'm like... isn't that what you're supposed to do you lazy bastard? =\

Diana

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Frank Rizzo says on May 1, 2008, 09:17:

All of the above are sooooooooooo common in Colombia. They don't ever want to put a tape measure on anything. I've had them install 3 shower heads at 3 different levels, it's amazing.

Even some contract work....they would rather do it as they like, then rip it all the way out and rebuild..rather than do it right the first time.

There is not 1 drop of confidence you can put in their work, without checking every little thing.

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vicshere says on May 1, 2008, 09:21:

I had a short guy install one shower head and a tall guy install a shower head at different heights...I asked ...they both said they could fit under their installed shower head....and they were right....the problem was I didn't fit under either

listo

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Frank Rizzo says on May 1, 2008, 09:27:

jajajaaja Vic...that is funny !!

How 'bout when they want to install light switches on the wall down by your thigh...just above the knee !! WTF is that all about???

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vicshere says on May 1, 2008, 09:30:

well at least the baby can turn off the ilghts for me ......easier than me getting up off the couch

listo

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sloopskipper says on May 1, 2008, 09:35:

I replaced three ceiling light fixtures with fans (2 in living room, and another just outside on terrace). Each is a different distance from the wall, and that is from the building was built, 13 years ago.

I had a leak in the shower in Puerto Rico. They had to break out the solid concrete wall to replace the water line and shower faucet. The last day the Dominican workman was in there for hours, but when I looked in, all the concrete had been replaced, and I had a new show faucet at rakish, maybe 75 degree angle from the wall.

I bought a new Frigidaire, above the range, microwave at the Do-It Center, here in Panamá. They sent an installer, but he never looked at the installation instructions, or referred to the templates.

When he finished the oven would bobble, as it was only suspended by a mounting plate on the wall. I told him that is not right, as I had installed two of them myself. He said he would return in the morning, of course that never happened. I finished it myself. He never screwed the oven to the overhead cabinets.

I also could go on and on.

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sloopskipper says on May 1, 2008, 09:42:

I have a nice large bedroom, 13X16' but the 13' side is all glass and there is another building nearby. I decided to install 4 Venetian blinds to get some privacy.

When I strung a level line I discovered that in 13', the ceiling rises almost 2".

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vicshere says on May 1, 2008, 09:50:

thats pretty good i have wall that has 2" belly in the middle...they said the brick wall had a belly too...the brick guy was long gone never to be seen again having recieved his money of course...go away for a day and the wall is done...i dint want to go back and build the wall again

listo

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sloopskipper says on May 1, 2008, 10:02:

1cm STEEL?

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Frank Rizzo says on May 1, 2008, 10:05:

Sloop....i know..i know....on the change in window height....jajajajaaa ..that totally kills me..they even put in windows in one place that left some windows flush with the inside wall ...and others flush with the outside wall.... we ripped out everything...squared up everything...

You know Vic...we never pay everything until the US cotractor is there with the measuring tape, square and level.....and if it ain't right....they gotta do it over...

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Frank Rizzo says on May 1, 2008, 10:08:

Rubito....good luck man...i'm sure it'll be fine..and new construction is a bit different...

we discussed your front door on a different thread.... i'll say this...and i'm not even kidding...get the bullet proof front door....for peace of mind...

Here's why...if you get a true hard wood door in granadillo or teak...highest quality , hand made...all solid...you're looking at probably 800k finished and installed...(including new ball bearing hinges a must for solid core doors)..

You can probably get a 1/4 inch thick steel door and have it covered with the thin wood to look like wood for about 1.2 - 1.8..for normal width doors...

You'll sleep much sounder...IMO..

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sloopskipper says on May 1, 2008, 10:13:

I really think they just don't know any better, and would do the same work for themselves.

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Frank Rizzo says on May 1, 2008, 10:22:

well Sloop...you're right about that they would do for themselves exactly the same way...

These guys come in and cut a granite slab that is 2 cm too short. They want to patch in a 2 cm piece on the edge....(fukn loco)....then he goes off into...well it HAS to be in 2 pieces....and i say fine...do it in 2 peices...but do the split in the middle of the cooktop...so there is just a few inches of cut in front and in back of the cooktop...(INSTEAD of a stupid 2 cm sliver at the edge....)....

Then this guy trys to convince me that "what's the difference??"...2 pieces is 2 pieces.....yeah.....just what i wanted a kitchen granite slab that has a 2cm sliver at the edge...can you imagine???

They finally went back and got it all cut in 1 piece....i knew they could do it...

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sloopskipper says on May 1, 2008, 10:28:

Yep, they JUST don't get it.

What does it matter if I got paint on the ceiling caps of all your ceiling fans?

I'll hang it any angle you like, just not level.

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vicshere says on May 1, 2008, 10:40:

get this the other day I was driving up to the school where I work and there were a bunch of guys painting the outside of the building...as I walked closer I could see that everything was painted walls window frames even the glass in the windows...I mean the glass was covered with paint from brushes and splatter....woow what a mess...the walls looked great...but the windows...they spent the next 5 days scraping all the glass panes ...it only took them 3 days to paint...freak me out

listo

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mranderson says on May 1, 2008, 11:01:

I'm convinced colombians don't know how to paint or just don't care. The walls were painted at the institute where I work in one of the classrooms and there is white paint splattered all over the blue carpet. The windows in my apartment also have white paint on them.

Well, I guess you get what you pay for. You can hire guys to do this work cheap but it's going to look like crap.

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Saltador says on May 1, 2008, 11:06:

I am constantly amazed at the paint jobs I see everywhere in colombia. Usually it looks like they just handed the paint and brushes to some people who had never painted before in their lives, and said "And make it fast!".

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sloopskipper says on May 1, 2008, 11:54:

When I moved, in the particle board cabinet doors and drawer fronts were shot. The previous owner had installed a brand new, free standing, Hotpoint 6 burner, range, new (but very small) refrigerator and washing machine. It is a maid's kitchen (there are quarters and bath behind the kitchen). I decided to get rid of the small appliances and the freestanding stove and to get some more counter space

I hired this very pleasant Panamanian "carpenter", but typically, he charged into everything, doing the way he thought was right, or easy. He could not understand that this Italian drop in-gas oven was zero clearance, therefore it had an internal cooling fan that required ventilation, and an exhaust.

This was his solution (the raggedy assed holes at the bottom, [the rectangular hole above what was really needed, but you can not see this when standing]):



I read the direction (which were in Italian, French, Spanish, and English) and made scaled drawings, the size needed to provide the necessary square inches.

You can clearly see he is not a cabinet maker, or even finish carpenter. He made the cabinet to the right of the cook top and the over, but the finish is more like you’d use in you shop. He also installed the counter-tops.

But, over all, the job was sorta OK, and not expensive.

I installed the non-intrusive "hockey puck", under cabinet lights. But, a friend had to bring them from Puerto Rico because they are unknown here.

The finished project:





I never thought that he would get that angle cut correctly, but he actually didn't do badly.

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miamimike says on May 1, 2008, 12:57:

nine inch nails says on Thursday May 1st, 2008 8:51:

And I can believe this esp. if they came from Cuba where I don't believe there is any real incentive to work hard and do a good job in a Communist society.

But hey same in our society too with all the other races.

I've had some good Cuban workers too.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here in Miami whether the Cubans are here one day or 20 years, we have had the same bad luck with all of them. All Cheats, Crooks and lousy craftsmen. I don't think Communism has a thing to do with it! The Group we presently in court with Installed a 100 foot portion of our Security Fence 3 times in the wrong place. First Mistake-they dug the holes over a water main and Ruptered the Main line, TWICE in one day.The place looked like Old Faithful in Yellowstone park, water gushing up in a 20 foot stream. . LOL Second--they then re-dug the Holes and installed it 4 feet into the Neighbors Property line and had to move it. Thats what a Survey is for Fellows! Found out they had Cuban Surveyors also. LOL. 3rd Mistake--they removed the Fence and re-installed 2 feet into our Parking Lot causing 2 residents not to be able to open their Car Door as the fence took almost 2 feet of their alloted parking space. The Water line Break could have been avoided by using a competent company to come out prior to any excavation and Clearly Mark any Utility Lines. Maybe I could send them down to Colombia for good, they already have a branch company in Ecuador. Guess they aren't fussy in Ecuador either. LOL They wonder why why haven't paid them $17K for the Final payment yet! LOL. Thank God I was NOT on the Condo Board when this took place or by now, I would have went to a deserted place and put a Gun to my Head!

My Avatar-- Sarah Palin Says " "You know the difference between a pit bull and a hockey mom?? Lipstick!" Now on a Short Verbal Tether by the Honorable John McCain

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Frank Rizzo says on May 1, 2008, 13:25:

Actually Rubito...i've probably got over 1 million into each door in granadillo.(i though i'd shoot it low just to keep "gringo price" response low)...with frames and ball bearing hinges...

It's not gringo prices...all my workers are paid weekly.....i'm making an estimate...if you really get very high quality...you pay in any country....i'm talking quality, seams, done to the quality i would want in my homes here in the US....

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Mononoke28 says on May 1, 2008, 13:31:

sloopskipper where did you get the under the cabinet microwave? We tried to find one in Colombia when I was there and they just stared at me like a confused puppy. They have no idea what it is.

Diana

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Frank Rizzo says on May 1, 2008, 13:33:

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ColombianoGringo says on May 1, 2008, 13:38:

Lowell,

My grandmother in Bogota has one of those Bosch water heaters. That thing heats very well and it seems like it would be a lot more efficient than the big tank models that most homes in the US have. Whenever I build another home, I am going to try to get one of the Bosch units instead.

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Frank Rizzo says on May 1, 2008, 13:39:

Sloop...your kitchen looks great !! I know what you mean about under cabinet lights...we had to ship all that stuff down.......when i told them i wanted under and over cabinet fluros...they thought i was loco....

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sloopskipper says on May 1, 2008, 13:53:

Sorry, Mononoke28, but I am in Panamá, and they are common here, from a couple manufacturers. I bought it at a Do-It Center, but that is a Gringo company. I tried to find if they are in Colombia, but came up dry.

At least you can print and show them that foto, and tell them also has an exhaust fan (recirculate or external), and lights on the bottom that shine on the cooking surface.

We had them for years at home (finally wore out a Litton, then bought a Panasonic, much like this one), and they are great. I brought a counter top model from San Juan, but quickly bought this one. This Frigidaire was about $300US here.

Be hard to imagine you can't find them there. But, then again, I couldn't find those hockey puck lights here, anywhere! I can't imagine losing all the lower cabinet shelves because of intrusive light sockets.

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sloopskipper says on May 1, 2008, 14:00:

JAJA, yeah Frank. And there are several really large lighting places here. Seems even K-Mart & Wally-World have these in the U.S.

But the ones my friend brought are 110V (20W?), so no transformer, BUT, the lamps are also not to be found here. I spent quite some time to find/order a half dozen on-line. Oh, the challenges living away from Bushlandia

GREAT fotos!

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sloopskipper says on May 1, 2008, 14:16:

Frank, my kitchen is nothing like yours, but I did it mostly on the cheap.

But come to think, I did spend some bucks on sink/faucet, and cooktop/oven, more than $2000 on those four things, plus a pretty nice Samsung fridge. I didn't buy with ice-maker, but discovered a cold water stub when we move the other fridge out, damn!

But probably total was less than 5 grand, including more than $300 for all the new door/drawer pulls.

But I sold the stove & other fridge for $500. It was a deal for the guy because they were only a few months old, and that stove sold for nearly 900 bucks.

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sloopskipper says on May 1, 2008, 14:26:

mranderson says on Thursday May 1st, 2008 11:01:

"I'm convinced colombians don't know how to paint or just don't care. The walls were painted at the institute where I work in one of the classrooms and there is white paint splattered all over the blue carpet. The windows in my apartment also have white paint on them."

Don't think that is only in Latin America.

Juan Sebastian de Elcano, the beautiful sailing ship, and pride of the Spanish Navy, visited Puerto Rico a couple years ago, for a ceremonial presentation of a flag to the Governor. From the pier I noticed that when they painted her, they slopped paint all over the most all the port holes, and was VERY noticeable.

You'd be keelhauled in the U.S. Navy for that.

But what the hell, the idiots flew a Puerto Rican courtesy flag, although they were in U.S. territorial waters. Guess they still think is still theirs. jaja

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Frank Rizzo says on May 1, 2008, 14:38:

i know..i know...things cost so much for kitchens these days....... like you said.....i like the fridge too...nothing like stainless...and thhose samsungs have the silver in them...(silvernano) that fights off bacteria....got one too..

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Tinto (Moderator) says on May 1, 2008, 14:39:

When I was a kid, a non-politically correct, but all-purpose insult was: Who cut your hair? Helen Keller? Who picked out your clothes? Helen Keller? etc, etc...

Sounds like Helen has moved South and is now in the painting business in Colombia.

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sloopskipper says on May 1, 2008, 14:46:

But the face of that is not stainless, but is plasticized, which I prefer.

The stainless that use on those things will rust if in contact with carbon, and I get a lot of Diesel exhaust dirt, and of course the salt air as well. I had the same problem in San Juan with all the soot from the Cruise Ships, which steamed past about 100 meters away.

I don't have a better foto of that Italian faucet handy, but the head can be detached, and be used as spray. OMG, I spent 300 bucks for it. But, I thought was cool.

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Frank Rizzo says on May 1, 2008, 14:51:

http://www.samsung.com/co/consumer/detail/detail.do?group=homeapplianc...

i know what you mean...just looks stainless......the silver nano thing may be just a gimmic..but it seems cool....

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sloopskipper says on May 1, 2008, 15:04:

Yeah, and dosen't show fingerprints.

The silver nano thing is supposed to be an antibactrerial thing inside, no?

It is cool though. I can NOT hear it run, unlike the expensive vibrating Amanas and others we owned. But, it must run because things stay cold, or frozen.

It's silent, almost like my Swedish gas fridge in my camper.

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GregYohn says on May 26, 2008, 09:20:

Hola!

We use 33 meters of pex tubing in our roof to give us 20 liters of water for our shower. It gets to 50C/120F. If before the sun comes out, we use the Fammy shower head water heater.

12VOIP.com gives free calls to Colombia.Greg

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Lowell says on May 27, 2008, 06:28:

My water heater is great! Lots of hot water, even with control set at a low level. Typical half ass instalation in which I had to follow behind and correct errors.

Alfred E. Newman. "What. Me Worry?"

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GregYohn says on Jun 23, 2008, 11:48:

Hola!

Your method is good for your washing machine as well as other uses. We found out our method would cost less than your choice, since our washing machine is not attached.

It is really laughable when you give a worker an instruction manual in Spanish and they still can not install it, yet you read the English version on the other side of the document and you can do it yourself!

12VOIP.com gives free calls to Colombia.Greg

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Lowell says on Jun 23, 2008, 17:08:

Only use it for bathing. Have the capacity to run a hot line to the washed on the occassion that I need hot water. I've had to nearly turn the temp dial to the coldest level to not have the shower too hot. Great for filling my daughters little pool with just the right water temp.

Many of the workers that I've used can't read things like instructions. And often, most of the pictures don't really help. What blows me away, is when you slowly explain something easy and there's no understanding or attempt of understanding whatsoever.

Alfred E. Newman. "What. Me Worry?"

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GregYohn says on Jun 23, 2008, 21:51:

Hola!

You should use a food thermometer to check the temperature. We like knowing our baby has 90F/30C bath for our baby's bath!

12VOIP.com gives free calls to Colombia.Greg

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Jun 23, 2008, 21:54:

To get the dirt out?
To use milder detergents?

"When shall we three meet again? In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"(First Witch in Macbeth)

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Jun 23, 2008, 22:36:

I wash my cottons in hot water.
Synthetics at 40C.
My clother are 100%clean.

"When shall we three meet again? In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"(First Witch in Macbeth)

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GregYohn says on Jun 23, 2008, 23:00:

Hola!

We have SOLAR hot water, so we are not needing to measure the cost of making hot water. It also cools off our room by taking the hot water from our water tubes located in our roof and replacing them with cool ground water!

12VOIP.com gives free calls to Colombia.Greg

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tomtom33 says on Jun 24, 2008, 02:36:

That's Ivory soap.

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Jun 24, 2008, 07:09:

Jabon de coco.

"When shall we three meet again? In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"(First Witch in Macbeth)

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Tinto (Moderator) says on Jun 24, 2008, 07:17:

100% purity or certainty...

The sun will rise tomorrow? Yep.

A child's innocence? Probably.

Hitler = evil? Yes, I think so.

God's love for his creation? According to the Bible, yes, but that's a whole 'nuther can of worms.

The love between an over-the-hill pasty white Gringo and his 19 year old mamacita from Colombia? Absolutely!

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Jun 24, 2008, 22:37:

My conscience is.

"When shall we three meet again? In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"(First Witch in Macbeth)

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vicshere says on Jun 25, 2008, 05:09:

my conscience....now thats funny

listo

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